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Post by blb on Jan 24, 2022 11:22:06 GMT -6
There is a difference between needing "ASST." (which I assume in your borderline-illiterate way of communicating means "assistance") and having equal opportunities. You claim racism by defining it to fit a narrative(AND YOU AN ENGLISH MAJOR>>OK) Then cry racism by that group and your solution is to have the white people in congress, ownership, media, teachers to give them the equal opportunity…RACISM and both sides of it. AMAZING. And on top of top of that you openly suggest they are not capable of creating their opportunities i.e racist. ANd you are making assumption with all the information. How many people are applying for these job. Who is getting interviews, how did the interviews go. Which is bias. And as english teacher you should know your thesis statement is way to broad. Please quote ANY post on this thread (or anywhere) where I "claim(ed) racism." Seems like you are projecting your personal experience onto this thread. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2022 11:26:58 GMT -6
You claim racism by defining it to fit a narrative(AND YOU AN ENGLISH MAJOR>>OK) Then cry racism by that group and your solution is to have the white people in congress, ownership, media, teachers to give them the equal opportunity…RACISM and both sides of it. AMAZING. And on top of top of that you openly suggest they are not capable of creating their opportunities i.e racist. ANd you are making assumption with all the information. How many people are applying for these job. Who is getting interviews, how did the interviews go. Which is bias. And as english teacher you should know your thesis statement is way to broad. Please quote ANY post on this thread (or anywhere) where I "claim(ed) racism." Seems like you are projecting your personal experience onto this thread. Title of thread. Only black head coaches. Needing assistance, creating opportunity. All racist statements. You quoted d5085’s management vs labor…..RACIST. |
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Post by blb on Jan 24, 2022 11:33:54 GMT -6
Please quote ANY post on this thread (or anywhere) where I "claim(ed) racism." Seems like you are projecting your personal experience onto this thread. Title of thread. Only black head coaches. Needing assistance, creating opportunity. All racist statements. You quoted d5085’s management vs labor…..RACIST. You have no idea who you're talking to, what my background-personal philosophies ("politics" if you prefer) are. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2022 11:36:36 GMT -6
It isn’t about you.
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Post by blb on Jan 24, 2022 11:57:57 GMT -6
Nor you. We are all products of our own experiences. So I will give you a pass for calling me and others "RACIST." I will warn you though that the moderators who have the power to ban you may not be so forgiving. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2022 12:00:01 GMT -6
Nor you. We are all products of our own experiences. So I will give you a pass for calling me and others "RACIST." I will warn you though that the moderators who have the power to ban you may not be so forgiving. Rule d. Statements are racist. Not indy’s |
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Post by tog on Jan 24, 2022 12:44:28 GMT -6
Nor you. We are all products of our own experiences. So I will give you a pass for calling me and others "RACIST." I will warn you though that the moderators who have the power to ban you may not be so forgiving. Rule d. Statements are racist. Not indy’s just a heads up this poster deleted himself he was not banned just fyi to all involved try to be nice to each other |
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Post by blb on Jan 24, 2022 12:47:20 GMT -6
Rule d. Statements are racist. Not indy’s just a heads up this poster deleted himself he was not banned just fyi to all involved try to be nice to each other Yes, professionalism-collegiately should be a hallmark here. Reasonable minds can always agree to disagree. |
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Post by coachd5085 on Jan 24, 2022 13:27:35 GMT -6
The issue with pithy’s statements is that he seems to be think that others are claiming the issue is overtly racist owners/gms sitting in their offices adorned in confederate battleflag memorabilia, laughing as they shred the resumes of minority candidates.
If I may be bold enough to speak for others: that is not the case.
Also- bringing up the fact that management has a track record to hire minorities as labor is irrelevant when looking at HC hiring data.
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Post by bulldogsdc on Jan 24, 2022 13:34:03 GMT -6
Not trying to spark a political debate but think this is timely. In a league where ~70% of players are black there is currently only one black HC (Mike Tomlin). Two African-Americans who are former NFL coaches are having success at their current jobs - Todd Bowles (DC, Buccaneers) and Leslie Frazier (DC, Bills). Also there is Jim Caldwell, who took Colts to a Super Bowl, had a winning record with Lions and got them to two playoffs (the LIONS for chrissakes). Then there is Eric Bienemy, OC of the Chiefs, and Byron Leftwich, OC for the Bucs. Parenthetically - the latter played QB for the Jaguars who are in the market. Will be interesting to see if any of them get HC opportunities this hiring season. Thoughts? I believe the reason that there are so few black head football coaches is because of institutional and structural racism not interpersonal or individual racism. |
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Post by coachd5085 on Jan 30, 2022 15:02:15 GMT -6
A week later and after 4 hires no Leftwich, Bowles, Flores, or Frazier or Raheem Morris. Bieniemy etc. Bieniemy is still in the playoffs (as of this post).
We did just see Josh McDaniels get a quasi third chance at being a HC, but not Frazier, Flores, or Morris who all have similar if not better records as HC as McDaniels. Maybe they all interview poorly.
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Post by CS on Jan 30, 2022 15:21:58 GMT -6
Rule d. Statements are racist. Not indy’s just a heads up this poster deleted himself he was not banned just fyi to all involved try to be nice to each other We should start a pool for who spots pithy’s new user name |
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Post by tog on Jan 30, 2022 15:29:25 GMT -6
just a heads up this poster deleted himself he was not banned just fyi to all involved try to be nice to each other We should start a pool for who spots pithy’s new user name lol you see it let me know lol |
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Post by carookie on Jan 30, 2022 15:57:22 GMT -6
A week later and after 4 hires no Leftwich, Bowles, Flores, or Frazier or Raheem Morris. Bieniemy etc. Bieniemy is still in the playoffs (as of this post). We did just see Josh McDaniels get a quasi third chance at being a HC, but not Frazier, Flores, or Morris who all have similar if not better records as HC as McDaniels. Maybe they all interview poorly. Ummm, as a Rams fan Id like to point out Raheem Morris is still in it too. Dont try to short change us |
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Post by fantom on Jan 30, 2022 16:06:26 GMT -6
A week later and after 4 hires no Leftwich, Bowles, Flores, or Frazier or Raheem Morris. Bieniemy etc. Bieniemy is still in the playoffs (as of this post). We did just see Josh McDaniels get a quasi third chance at being a HC, but not Frazier, Flores, or Morris who all have similar if not better records as HC as McDaniels. Maybe they all interview poorly. Ummm, as a Rams fan Id like to point out Raheem Morris is still in it too. Dont try to short change us I think that it would help if they made a rule that you can't even interview until after the Super Bowl. What's the hurry? It's not college. There's no Signing Day. |
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Post by carookie on Jan 30, 2022 16:17:31 GMT -6
Ummm, as a Rams fan Id like to point out Raheem Morris is still in it too. Dont try to short change us I think that it would help if they made a rule that you can't even interview until after the Super Bowl. What's the hurry? It's not college. There's no Signing Day. Ive thought this too- i think Bienemy has been somewhat stymied by his own success (back to back superbowls). Moreover, look at most of the names listed in the first post i quoted, a week ago they too were still in it. |
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Post by blb on Jan 30, 2022 16:21:32 GMT -6
The real eyebrow-raiser will be if Leftwich doesn't get Jaguars' job.
He played QB for the franchise and his team just won a Super Bowl.
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Post by realdawg on Jan 30, 2022 17:53:58 GMT -6
Maybe some of those guys dont view the jobs they have had the opportunity to get as good jobs or the right fit for them after the interview?  ? I do think that Flores, Bieniemy, Morris, and Leftwich deserve to be hired if they want the job. |
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Post by larrymoe on Jan 30, 2022 18:27:23 GMT -6
I think that it would help if they made a rule that you can't even interview until after the Super Bowl. What's the hurry? It's not college. There's no Signing Day. Ive thought this too- i think Bienemy has been somewhat stymied by his own success (back to back superbowls). Moreover, look at most of the names listed in the first post i quoted, a week ago they too were still in it. I think Bieniemy has been stymied by his predecessor Matt Nagy. Guy was the OC for Andy Reid too and turned out he knew nothing about calling plays or running an offense. Reid's OC is like Bill Belichick's DC- pretty much a title only position. Throw in the past legal issues and there's probably a lot of the hesitation on him. |
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Post by larrymoe on Jan 30, 2022 18:28:44 GMT -6
The real eyebrow-raiser will be if Leftwich doesn't get Jaguars' job. He played QB for the franchise and his team just won a Super Bowl. I saw a report today that said if Leftwich doesn't get the job it was more of him not wanting to work with their GM. |
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Post by coachd5085 on Jan 30, 2022 18:53:54 GMT -6
The real eyebrow-raiser will be if Leftwich doesn't get Jaguars' job. He played QB for the franchise and his team just won a Super Bowl. I saw a report today that said if Leftwich doesn't get the job it was more of him not wanting to work with their GM. I have read this as well. |
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Post by 44dlcoach on Jan 30, 2022 18:56:28 GMT -6
Sounds like a smart move. If he gets his way he'll win the fan base over even more than I imagine he already did as a player.
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Post by blb on Feb 1, 2022 15:06:57 GMT -6
On first day of Black History Month Brian Flores announces he is suing NFL for racist hiring policies.
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Post by fantom on Feb 1, 2022 15:10:11 GMT -6
On first day of Black History Month Brian Flores announces he is suing NFL for racist hiring policies. Might not be a great career move. |
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Post by blb on Feb 1, 2022 15:26:01 GMT -6
On first day of Black History Month Brian Flores announces he is suing NFL for racist hiring policies. Might not be a great career move. Probably not but didn't look like he was getting another HC job this hiring cycle anyway. Also apparently this is a "class action" suit so may be joined by other coaches. |
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Post by tripsclosed on Feb 1, 2022 15:53:17 GMT -6
On first day of Black History Month Brian Flores announces he is suing NFL for racist hiring policies. Might not be a great career move. Flores stated on his twitter that basically he realizes this, but he considers this of higher importance. Without knowing all the ins and outs of this situation, i at least say kudos to him for that! |
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Post by bluedevil4 on Feb 1, 2022 16:25:17 GMT -6
The real eyebrow-raiser will be if Leftwich doesn't get Jaguars' job. He played QB for the franchise and his team just won a Super Bowl. I don't care at all for the Jaguars, but it's driving me nuts that they're giving Leftwich the runaround regarding Baalke. Everyone is calling for Baalke's head. Shad is out on a boat getting laid, not giving a darn. Baalke literally puts in a public statement "I guess I'll leave if people think I'm the problem," but won't...It's just absolutely infuriating down there. I feel for all Jaguars/Leftwich fans out there. |
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Post by carookie on Feb 1, 2022 18:03:36 GMT -6
This thread really got me looking at who (think more work experience and less identity group) gets hired for NFL coaching jobs compared with other sports.
In the NBA it seems to be consistent with guys moving up the ranks, but there have been instances with guys basically moving from the court to the HC chair with little experience. Steve Nash spent two seasons as a consultant before landing his HC gig, Chauncey Billups less than a year as an assistant. But the NBA is seen more as a player's league- less strategic, more about relationships. If your superstar is on board with you, then you are okay.
MLB, you can have an Aaron Boone move from the field, to the announcers booth, to the manager's spot because of his beliefs in analytics. Baseball is viewed as a game based on numbers, and analytics. If you understand the data, you can be the manager.
But what about football, specifically to this thread the NFL. What is the requirement to be a good HC in the NFL, at least as seen by those hiring. Could that play a part in why we are having this discussion?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2022 18:35:54 GMT -6
Well, the Flores lawsuit looks like it is about to drag a lot to the surface. This is going to make the league’s management look like the fraternity of spoiled @$$holes that everyone already assumed them to be.
One of the stats that’s being pointed out is that all the owners are “white” but 70% of the players are black. I do feel that the ownership makeup and culture within that group is one of the main reasons this has been such a frustrating conversation for years.
I expect the NFL to launch a big initiative soon to lure some black billionaires to buy franchises or even expand the league so they can get at least one token black owner, if for no other reasons than PR. I wonder if Jay Z or Magic Johnson wants to own the WFT…
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Post by coachd5085 on Feb 1, 2022 18:54:52 GMT -6
Regarding Flores's suit- I will be interested to see the legal side of this. I think it is painfully evident that the Bill B texts show what everyone assumed anyway- that organizations held interviews just to satisfy the policy and not with an open mind. However, is that grounds for a civil suit?
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