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Post by coachdoug on Apr 17, 2008 11:13:27 GMT -6
Hear me out - I am under the impression that most guys coaching youth ball are guys that are doing it as a 'hobby' or to help out some kids (maybe their own). I doubt many of these guys are trying to be ubber-youth coach. I would believe that if any youth coach was excited about the game and an ambitious coach, would be wanting to move up the food chain. The reason I say that is because, most folks aren't exhibiting "good coaching" mainly because they don't care (lol) to push themselves to be a good coach. Right or wrong, I don't think most youth coaches are going year-round trying to make themselves into super coaches (they may have bigger fish to fry). If a guy was ambitious, he might recognize a difference between being a coach for the Pee Wee City Champs and Varsity High State Champs. I agree that a lot of youth coaches are "hobbyists" or just want to help out their own kid. For a lot of those guys, who would really benefit from clinics, training, etc., they just aren't willing to put in the extra time or don't know it's available. However, there are quite a few youth coaches that just coach because they love the game and/or they hope to make a meaningful impact on young boys' lives - teaching them valuable life lessons that they can take with them even if they never play a down of football at the next level. In our program, I would estimate that 25-40% of the coaches do not have a child in the program. 50% of our head coaches last year did not have a kid playing. Throughout our league, I think the numbers are similar. Some of these guys are excellent coaches - some even have coached at the high school level, but only work with the youth level now (it seems that I'm always having to go up against them, too. LOL) There are several reasons why a coach (even a goal-oriented, ambitious coach) might choose to work with youth over HS (just as there are many valid reasons why a coach might choose HS over college, or college over professional): - Commitment Level - I put in about 25-30 hours per week during the season, and very little (just the time I spend on this board and a few meetings and some prep time) during the offseason. Most HS coaches I know put in 50-60 hours per week during the season and hardly slow down in the offseason when they attend regular meetings, strength training/conditioning sessions, spring practice, summer 7-on-7 passing leagues, clinics, etc. Coaching at the HS level is just a whole different level of commitment.
- Career - For those of us with jobs/careers that don't have a ton of flexibility, it is tough enough working a schedule around youth practices, but it would be impossible for many of us to be at practice at 2:30 in the afternoon every day, or at weight training at 6:30 am. This is why so many coaches are teachers. I am actually considered coaching at the HS level several times, but the only way I could make it work would be to switch careers to teaching, which I actually have considered. Talk about a life changing decision. I know there are ways around it for those that are really serious about it, but if you don't plan on making coaching your career (at 42 years old, I don't think I'll be doing that LOL), it's just not realistic for most of us.
- Preference in age group - some people just don't like to work with teenagers. They would rather work with a kid who is, perhaps, more impressionable and can be more easily molded into developing good habits and is unlikely to get into any of the problems that teenagers sometimes encounter (alcohol, drugs, irresponsible driving, girlfriends/sex, etc.) - not to mention that teenagers can just be surly and obnoxious. This last point doesn't really apply to me (the other two do, though), but I do know some other coaches that feel this way.
Sure, it would be great to not have to deal with minimum play headaches, and to be able to run more complex passing systems and multiple looks/coverages on defense, but there are plenty of benefits to working with youth. I still may go get a teaching credential one of these days, switch careers and try my hand at the HS level. But, for now, I am content to keep working with the youth program.
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Post by coachdoug on Apr 15, 2008 16:02:04 GMT -6
Your last years team didnt consistently execute the power or wedge very well, just think about how much better they have to get at that BEFORE you take time away from that to run your other stuff. IMHO you just run your AR stuff and live and die with it rather than be very mediocre or below at both. Just a point of clarification. Last year, Brophy had a team of all 1st year players and it was his first year coaching that age level as well as his 1st year with DW. This year he's talking about a completely different team - several years older with 3-5 years experience running DW already under their belts. That being said, I agree that it would be better to pick one system and run it all out, exclusively. In this case, given the player's age, the future system they will be going into and the expertise of their coach, I would counsel Brophy to run Spread/Air Raid from day 1. JMHO.
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Post by coachdoug on Apr 13, 2008 9:31:18 GMT -6
Few people in my league value screen passes, I preached their importance and was proven correct when we lost a scrimmage off a Piedmont kickscreen on scrimmage day. We ended up spending twice as much time practicing that out as I initially wanted when we could of had it sealed and taken care of. Ignore it, then commit beyond reason. Add a good screen to that early, just past your verts stage. You are running balanced 2x2 or trips? Using some good horizontal passing could probably accelerate your development even more, read the verts cushion and then a screen to compliment as another part of uncovered, now go with your concepts and tags on mesh, etc. I agree with you that screens are great plays and often undervalued by youth coaches. I have never heard of the "Piedmont Kickscreen" before, though. Could you describe it for me? Thanks.
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Post by coachdoug on Apr 13, 2008 0:47:11 GMT -6
You are not doing the kids any favors by "straddling the fence." They will be far better off to learn one system and learn it well than to dabble in two distinct and different systems and probably not do either one great. Is the board mandating that you run both DW & Air Raid? DW is very coaching intensive. I've never coached it, and I know it can be a great system - I've seen a handful of really good DW teams, but most DW teams I've come up against have struggled. It seems like the coaches thought they had discovered a "system" offense that would be easy to implement, and really didn't know what they were doing. Like most things, it takes a total commitment to be really good at DW, which is the main reason that I don't think it's such a good idea to split up time between DW & Air Raid. Is there any way they'll let you just drop DW and go exclusively Air Raid? It just seems to make the most sense to me - they'll be running Air Raid exclusively the next year in MS anyway; a half-hearted commitment to DW will likely produce mediocre results at best; the players will probably never play DW ever again. It seems to me that you should have some leverage even if the Board doesn't want to go along. It really has nothing to do with what you want to do - it's what is going to be in the kids' best interests. Consider the following: - You are a successful HS coach doing them a favor by helping out.
- All you want in return is to be able to start preparing the kids for the next level NOW.
- Besides, you want to give the kids the most benefit of your coaching ability and you know Air Raid, you don't know DW (at least not nearly as well).
I don't know - it sounds like a pretty compelling argument to me. Even if they won't give in, how are they going to dictate how much of each offense you run? Are they going to monitor your practices and force you to spend more time on DW? I doubt it. I assume the kids probably already have a decent background in DW since it sounds like they've had no choice but to run DW every year they've been in this program until now. That being the case, I would probably skew your practice much more heavily towards Air Raid- like maybe 75% Air Raid, 25% DW. Hell, once you have some success running Air Raid, they're probably not going to care. Truth is, that's really kind of a chicken-s@&* compromise. Stick to your guns and get them to agree to let you go 100% Air Raid from day 1. I really think it is in the kids' best interest, which should be everyone's #1 concern anyway. One last thing - start recruiting assistant coaches and get them organized NOW. This is one of the most underrated parts of being a successful youth coach. Bad assistants and/or bad management of your assistants can sink you before you get started. It never ceases to amaze me how many fathers with no coaching experience think they know more than guys that have been doing it for years. Former college or pro players are often the worst (because they "know" that they know better than the head coach, and constantly undermine him to make their point). Get your guys together and drill into them that your staff is not a democracy, that they will run your system and coach what you tell them to coach or they can watch from the stands. Obviously, you need to be diplomatic, but it's better to have the entire coaching staff together with a second rate scheme than to have a divided staff with the best scheme. Make sure they know that you are the law and that they know their roles clearly. If you can do that with your staff, it will make a huge difference. Just my 2 cents - feel free to take it for what it's worth.
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Post by coachdoug on Feb 13, 2008 2:44:17 GMT -6
One game we had one wing act like they were running off the field, but stopped 1 foot from the sideline. No one stepped out to cover and we threw the ball to the wing (we told the officials we were going to do it.) Anyone done any of this and is it "dirty pool?" Regardless of whether you told the officials you were going to do and they let you, it appears to be illegal under federation rules. Rule 9-6-4-e states that "It is illegal participation: ... To use a player, replaced player or substitute in a substitution or pretended substitution to deceive opponenents at or immediately before the snap or free kick." Post under the "Rules of the Game" section to get an opinion from some of the officials that frequent this site if you want an opinion from someone with better credentials, but I'm 99.9% certain that play is illegal.
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Post by coachdoug on Feb 20, 2008 11:48:51 GMT -6
Fantastic site. I've been around for a couple weeks now, and just realized that I forgot to introduce myself. I've been coaching for 15 years, all at the youth level in Southern California. I've coached every position except running back, and I've been DC, OC, and HC for several years each. Mostly, I've been a defensive guy, but it looks like I'll be OC this coming season. I took most of 2007 off as my wife and I had our first child.
Defensively, I've run mostly 5-3, but I've also used 6-2, 4-4, and even a modified GAM depending on our personnel from year to year. This year's team will be running a youth version of a 4-3. Offensively, I've mostly run multiple from I, pro, and spread formations. It looks like we'll be doing more spread jet stuff this year.
Love all the knowledge being shared here - a great place for young coaches to learn.
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Post by coachdoug on Mar 31, 2008 11:09:20 GMT -6
Certain weight limits apply to backs and quarterbacks on offense. Not a pure MPP league in terms of getting to start, etc. The games I was fortunate to be calling the plays everyone played in last year. We scored the most points for the regular season and our youngest or least repped played the 4th quarter on defense and ran plays in for offense to our backup HB and QB. The team we beat was undefeated coming into the game. The league doesn't consistently apply the weight or age rules. My first year as a HC two players had to leave my team that the prior coach was allowed to keep on his word they were playing age. One was technically old enough to play, they amended the rule to prevent him after we started 2-0 and the league still let a player off the team I now coach(and two other teams with kids old as him or older) play, for being relatives of other coaches. The oldest player was too old the year prior and allowed to play for the other coach's word on it and never hassled. He told me he was age, going off what the prior coach said, I told him he could not QB or be a RB or get handoffs on the weight rule. He played TE and OLB quite well and helped win a game against the defending league winners before leaving, by tackling their over aged star who went on to play at middle school to finish his season. That player was good too, he told me after a loss to us"I'm going on to the 8th grade team." He got my vote of confidence, ran with a lot of heart, I asked him to do so and he was mad about losing to us(we didn't have a win in two years until I took over). He was on the HS team last year, must have been older than the coaches and league commish would admit. Their team had a guy who went from the league to the HS team, so he skipped the middle school/Jr.High threshold for some reason, and was allowed to play in the league. My two players, one was old enough to play off the rules starting the season. Certain teams wanted a shot at the payment pool and changed the age threshold(half of the 50 to register a player is won by the winning coach). The other proved he could take a supporting role and be coachable, instead of being the team star. It's hard to hold a player's wanting a chance against him, that's what the league was for and every kid deserves that. Hard as he worked to apply himself to the less glamorous jobs that included springing our longest TD runs by blocking and handling the point on D, that's enough to show he can answer the challenge at the next level. The extent to which grades may play in, or other items, is up to him for a lot of it. The HS basketball assistant was a former CC head coach and he may be able to mentor the kid for his favorite sport of hoops, that's my hope for Pravis. It's not about stopping players from participating,it's about tackling them when they play, to me. The bigger they are, the harder they fall. Small players aren't every down guys for us, they usually start on special teams and situational defense first, though we lost the title game because of a score on a kickoff resulting from such. Our smallest player led the team in forced turnovers in the first year, AJ would just latch onto the football because it was eye level for him and that made him play larger. Our smallest player this year started and won a football as the "most improved player" at the year's end pizza party. Nobody's going to tell them at HS "they're too big, don't worry about tackling them." They'll likely say "that's a big player you had better stop." These other teams keep adding a ton of players for one year at the peak of the age curve. Mostly guys who didn't make the cut to start every down in middle school decide to try the entry league out after the fact. We'll see how it goes, my players could have won out last time but we had coaches getting too pretty with play selection in the major games. This year it's a returning OL(four or five starters) and we're looking to be about hoping the mid level kids have developed enough at skill. We're supposed to have mandatory age/grade and weight rules for certain skill tasks applied. Let's see how 'the Cardinal Rules' change this year. On the whole the league had to scale down its size in terms of teams, to four local teams, from six. We still has six teams overall, and faced some team twice instead for the regular season. The scale down fattened rosters so no teams had forfeits. Our practices ran so many reps on half lines. Three opposing teams had full squads. We prefer to play the smaller teams, their guys play both sides and have deeper chemistry. The bigger teams may be able to wear you down more, but they lose something with knowing one another less. We'll have the size this time, I'm hoping Freddie returns from moving to the college town(Olympic speed and he blocked two players at one on our 2 on 2 drills from the TE practice reps). Then we'd have two TE with the unique ability to outrun any foe, make tough crossing catches, and the ability to block a player long enough to get the runner free at point and still make a key block at the next level off the same play. Of course he'd probably move to halfback(or my preference for him at fullback if he goes to the backfield).... While it is difficult to figure out a lot of what you're saying in your post, one thing is crystal clear - YOU NEED TO FIND A NEW LEAGUE TO COACH IN RIGHT NOW. Holy smokes - rampant disregard for age and weight restrictions? Are you kidding? This is a major lawsuit waiting to happen. All you need is one kid to get badly hurt (think spinal cord injury) by an overage player. When the lawyers start asking quesitons and find out that rules about age and weight are routinely disregarded, EVERYONE (including league commissioners, administrators, and COACHES) is going to get sued and you are all going to lose. The judgment will be in the millions. It may not happen this year. It may not happen next year. Who knows, maybe it will never happen, but why would anyone in their right mind take that chance. Not to mention the chance your entire league is taking with these kids' safety (which is exactly why you should and will lose in court). From what you're saying it sounds like a corrupt league from top to bottom. Get out now.
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Post by coachdoug on Mar 30, 2008 13:06:15 GMT -6
Our league outlawed the older-lighter rule about 5 years because it was getting abused like this. One team from another city actually had 20 older-lighters on a team of 26. That doesn't happen by accident. Not having older-lighters really hurts us when we play out of conference in post season tournaments, but that's a small price to pay for not having to deal with the abuse of that rule.
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Post by coachdoug on Feb 19, 2008 17:17:13 GMT -6
As Steve pointed out, you need to have blocking rules. Try to make it as simple as possible for the kids. Depending on what you're running, SAB, GOD, OIL, etc can all be effective. Just keep in mind that no blocking rule is a catch all - different plays will have different rules for different players.
You mentioned that you will be running Beast and Wild Bunch. I know the Beast downloads on this site cover all the blocking rules and Ted Seay's Wild Bunch playbook goes over it's blocking rules (around page 17, I believe).
One way to simplify for younger kids is to start with one rule, say OIL or GOD, and tell them to always use that rule unless there is a different blocking tag in the play call. Then, they just always fall back on the rule unless they hear something different in the play call.
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Post by coachdoug on Apr 8, 2008 10:50:08 GMT -6
thanks coaches i have 13-15 yr olds with a 165lbs weight that goes up 1lb every week and no minimum play req.and im not doing true zone blocking i got the actual concept on what i wanna at a clinic last month in orlando Okay, that changes things a bit. I think most of what I wrote still applies, but here are a few adjustments for your situation: Implementing the Offense - You should be able to throw a bit more than with younger kids. I would assume that this would be your preference running from a spread set - not necessarily as spread is a great run formation, too. There are a bunch of threads on this site that discuss Cloverdale/Robinson & Airraid - you can use a bunch of those concepts depending on exacly what's in the playbook you been given to run. Certainly there are a bunch of drills (Settle & Noose, etc.) that you should probably run daily. You can probably also increase the total # of plays by about 20% - my original philosophy that less is better than more still applies, though. Play Calling - You can probably add a few audibles, hot reads & check-with-mes that I wouldn't advise with the younger kids. For instance, in your base (2x2) spread formation, any time the OLB doesn't respect the slot, your QB should automatically audible to either a bubble or tunnel screen. Substitutions - with no MPR, you can disregard most of my earlier comments. However, I assume that you still want to play everyone - I think Dave Cisar's philosophy of "anyone that practices, plays" is a good approach. So you should have some sort of substitution plan to make sure everyone gets in the game. Probably as important, though, since I'm assuming that one of your goals is to help develop your players for the next level, is to get as many players on the field in meaningful minutes (as opposed to just a few isolated plays). What I've usually done is worked a rotation. For instance, I usually run a 5-3, so I will rotated 4 LBs at the 3 positions. I'll have one Sam, one Mike and one Will and then one guy that is versatile enough to play all three positions, then I rotate him through those positions throughout the game. This way, I have 4 guys getting 75% of the defensive snaps instead of 3 getting 100% - they all get some rest to stay fresh during games and I have no dropoff if one gets hurt. Of course, you have to have 4 guys that can play, so this is less practical if you have little talent. If possible, I'll do this with DEs (3 for 2 positions) DT/NG (4 for 3), CB/S (4 for 3), OL (7 for 5), wideouts (3 for 2 or 4 for 3), TEs/Wings (3 for 2), and RBs (2 for 1 or 3 for 2).
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Post by coachdoug on Apr 6, 2008 23:24:16 GMT -6
im the new oc and i need help i have playbook to use which is a spread but how do i go about implementing the offense and call plays do subsitutions and other duties as a oc help me please my email is projectpat2@yahoo.com Wow - that's a pretty broad question, and a lot will depend the age group you are coaching, their talent level, what minimum play requirements, if any, you have, etc. I'll assume you have 11-12 yr olds, and about a 10-play minimum play req, so here are a few ideas: Implementing the OffenseFirst of all, as los suggested, pare down the playbook to something manageable like 2-3 run series with play action off each, and 1 or 2 pass series. By series, I mean a grouping a plays that have similar action, and play off each other (do a search on this subject if you want a better definition - it has been discussed at length in other threads). That should give you a maximum of about 15 plays. Of those, just start with about 5-6 (1 run series and a couple pass plays). You can add from there over the course of the season and maybe put in all 15 plays by the end of the regular season. You are far better off running fewer plays really well than a bunch of plays mediocre. Putting in too many plays is a classic first year coach mistake - don't do it. As ufpena said, start with a base play and build from there. You said you would be running spread, so let's assume you want to run zone read. Depending on your kids' age, experience level and talent, you may not want to actually run a zone blocking scheme or have the QB make real option reads - that's okay, you can still run the same basic series with simplied blocking and pre-called action for the QB. So, your first play is zone read (or something similar but simplified). Make sure all the kids know who to block and how to adjust depending on every variation of what the defense might do (i.e. alignment, stunts, blitzes, etc.) Then add, one at a time, Dart, Power-G, Counter-Trey, Sweep, and a play action pass off the same action. All these plays will look similar (at least in terms of backfield action). Another possble series from spread would be the fly sweep series, which has been discussed at lenght in other threads. Other plays in this series include Trap, G, Counter, and PA passes. With regard to passes, run mostly PA off your runs, but make sure you put in a bubble screen to your slot receiver and a tunnel screen to your wideouts. These are really easy to complete, and are highly effective, especially if you have some decent athletes. One other thing - spend the majority of your practice time in individual skills sessions. A common rookie coaching mistake is to practice team offense and scrimmage too much. Ten - fifteen minutes of scrimmage per night is more than enough. You'll get a lot more reps in and see a lot more improvement in skills if you work the line and backs separately for most of practice. Play CallingFirst of all, script your first 10 plays. Do this before your main offensive practice each week, so your players can practice the script in order, with substitutions. When scripting, keep a few things in mind: 1) Down & Distance - you can only really do this for the first 2-3 plays, then try to use plays that will be appropriate in any situation. Try to stay on script unless something really unusual comes up - like you have 1st and Goal on the 2 and the next play on the script is a deep fade. Have a few situational plays prepared for those unusual situations (backed up on our own goalline, inside their 10, 4th & short, etc.), but otherwise stay on script. 2) Horizontal Position. Try to have some idea of whether the ball will be on the right hash, the left hash or somewhere in the middle and script your play accordingly - for instance, don't script a rollout pass right immediately after a sweep right. 3) Put in enough variety to test most of their defense - run off-tackle to both sides, run wide to both sides, run up the middle, and test both corners with passes. The whole reason you are running series is to make play calling easier and more effective. Run your base play often as long as it is effective. Eventually the defense will adjust, and when they do watch for where they leave themselves vulerable and attack there. For instance, let's assume you are running zone read (or some youth modification of it). You are consistently getting 5-7 yards because your QB is making good reads on the DE, and everyone else in the box is blocked so either the OLB comes crashing in from the outside or the safety comes up to make the tackle. If the OLB starts cheating in, run the bubble (or tunnel) screen - if the wideout makes any block at all on the corner, the slot will have a lot of room to run. Burn 'em once or twice and that OLB will stay out on the slot. If the safety starts cheating up, you can run Dart or Sweep, which should catch the safety out of position, or PA with a deep post or fade to one of your slots - no OLB should be able to cover your slots without safety help anyway, and if the OLB is also cheating to help with the zone read - TD! SubstitutionsAgain, I'm assuming you have a minimum play rule (MPR). If you don't, take this with a grain of salt. Not taking the MPR seriously is a common rookie coach mistake. You must start running your minimum play players (MPPs) immediately (I start subbing on the second play of the game) and continue running as many as you can every play until they are done. The goal should be to have the MPR done by halftime. In our league, any players that don't have their plays done by the beginning of the 4th quarter must enter the game and stay in until their plays are done. I can't tell you how many games I've seen lost because some inexperienced coach had to put 5-6 MPPs in the game together at the beginning of the 4th quarter. This is one of the main reasons for scripting, as I described above. Look at each scripted play and sub for every non-essential position (for instance, on a sweep, you can probable sub the backside G & T and both backside receivers). When you practice the script during the week, practice with those subs coming in and going out so they know exactly when they'll be in and out of the game. Also, give the script to whatever parent is assigned to keep track of plays so he knows who to look for on each play. If you do this, you should be able to get 50-70% done with the MPR in the first 10 plays. If you don't remember anything else - just keep it simple!! I hope that helps. Good luck to you.
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Post by coachdoug on Jan 30, 2008 1:11:29 GMT -6
Good stuff.
I'll just add what a HS coach told me once: "Lifting weights prior to puberty is like putting braces on baby teeth."
Also, I agree with Coach Calande that exercises like squats and cleans should probably be avoided at first - too much chance of injury. Focus on building a strong core first.
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Post by coachdoug on Feb 7, 2008 12:26:50 GMT -6
I have no idea what would be enough in your league. Check with your program's president first, and then he can go to your league's commissioner if he doesn't know the answer. I'm sure the rules vary greatly from league to league.
What you're planning may be fine in your league, but you'd have to jump through some hoops in our league. I didn't mean to imply that you were doing anything wrong, just that you should check with the approriate authorities so you don't get yourself in trouble.
I hope it works out for you and you have a great camp. I think it sounds like fun.
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Post by coachdoug on Feb 7, 2008 12:04:27 GMT -6
On the surface, it sounds like a fine idea, but it I guess it really depends on what your real motives are and what your local rules are.
In our league, if a program put something like this together, it would be considered illegal practice, unless several criteria were met:
- The camp would have to be open to and advertised to kids from all over the geographical territory of the league. i.e. You couldn't have the camp just for your own players.
- The camp would have to carry its own liability insurance. This is probably the most important requirement, and the hardest to comply with, especially if you want to keep the cost down.
- The camp should not be run exclusively by coaches from your own program.
- The camp should not include installing your team's plays or anything like that - anything that looks, feels, or smells like your team's regular football practice.
A couple years ago, a coach in our program actually did something like this - he put together an offseason (June - July, I believe) conditioning camp, and the league initially opposed, but when he complied with the requirements I outlined above, he held his camp. I believe it was pretty successful.
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Post by coachdoug on Jan 31, 2008 9:36:09 GMT -6
The way you describe your cut block I can see as fine. When you get into teams that use the "shoeshine" block one example or a version where contact is between the waist and knee. The issue we run into is with gun teams and when the ball leaves the FBZ. I could be wrong but I was under the impression that cut blocks, clips and the such were legal in the FBZ as long as the ball remained in the FBZ but once it left the zone the FBZ disappeared. That is correct. Rule 2-17-5 states, "The free-blocking zone disintegrates and the exception for a player to block below the waist and/or the exception for an offensive lineman to clip and/or block in the back is not to continue after the ball has left the zone."
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Post by coachdoug on Jan 31, 2008 0:03:00 GMT -6
Quick question about that cut blocking. Right tackle crashes down below the waist on a defensive tackle at the same time as the right guard who is engaging the defensive tackle. Is that a legal block? Saw it in a youth game and the ref said it was ok if the two players were doing it at the same time on the defensive player at the snap. BTW I do know how to properly cut block but I keep getting mixed answers by people on whether it was a legal block. That's a really good question. The rule book says in Rule 9-3-6 that a simultaneous block where blocker 1 is high and blocker 2 is low is, in fact, legal. If the first block is high and the second is low, then it is an illegal chop block. So, I guess the real question is was the block really simultaneous. Based on your description - "right tackle crashes down" and "right guard who is engaging the defensive tackle," I would think not. If the def tackle is lined up over the guard and the guard engages him high first, even by a fraction of a second, and then the tackle comes in low, then it is clearly an illegal chop block. In any event, at the youth level I would hope the refs would err on the side of caution and throw a flag on any block like this that could clearly cause an injury. At the very least, I would hope that the refs would give the blocking team and its coaches a warning that any further borderline chop blocking will draw a flag. There is no reason that I can see why both blockers cannot and should not come in high on this block. JMHO.
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Post by coachdoug on Jan 30, 2008 20:53:51 GMT -6
Well cut blocking is legal within certain guidelines. This also comes down to league/conference/states in some cases. I know some crews will allow cut blocks while in the gun and some will not. now I have to disagree a little saying a cut block is perfectly safe. anything an offense or a defense is taught to do yet is not allowed to do to their own players in practice is not exactly safe. DW guys cut the snot out of people yet I have not heard one of them say they cut in practice without protection. While yes it is the NFL there is a reason why people hated Alex Gibbs Oline is because the cut on the backside. It is legal. Now the chop block is something people do screwup in that it is legal to engage low first then hit high but not the other way around I believe. Most places it does not matter because they are going to call it either way no matter what. Fair catch is something players screw up. Some do not realize when the ball hits the ground the fair catch is off. What I said is that a PROPERLY EXECUTED cut block is perfectly legal and perfectly safe, and I stand by that. I agree that it has to be within certain guidelines - the rules state that blocking below the waist is only legal within the box and by and on players that are on the LOS and in the box at the snap, so that much is a given. Now, maybe I teach it a little differently, but without going into too much detail, contact originates in the midsection with blocker simultaneously lowering one shoulder and rolling into the defender's legs. It is highly effective and in 15 years I've never seen an injury (even a minor one) related to this. And, yes, when we go fully live in practice, the players are free to use it on each other. If you have blockers that are blindsiding defenders with cut blocks where they lead with their shoulder or helmet directly into the defender's knee, obviously that's dangerous, but that's not what I'm talking about. On the fair catch, I would like to offer a clarification. If the ball hits the ground, perhaps the protection granted to the player making the fair catch signal ends (although I do not see any reference to this in the rules), but neither he nor any teammate can advance the ball. Rule 6-5-5 states, "No receiver may advance the ball after a valid or invalid fair-catch signal has been given by any member of the receiving team."
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Post by coachdoug on Jan 30, 2008 18:22:32 GMT -6
Just thought of another one - Cut Blocking vs. Chop Blocking. Most officials know the difference but a lot of youth coaches do not. A properly executed cut block is perfectly legal and perfectly safe. A chop block, which is when a defensive player is engaged high with an offensive player and a second offensive player hits the defensive player low, is illegal (15-yd penalty) and extremely dangerous. I'm always amused when I hear coaches screaming about chop blocks when it's really legal cut blocking going on.
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Post by coachdoug on Jan 30, 2008 12:25:36 GMT -6
Regarding the 12 men in the huddle, Morris is correct about the rationale for the rule. However, I have seen a substitute arrive at the huddle just as they are breaking the huddle and the resplaced player immediately begins to leave the field after the huddle breaks and that still drew a penalty. According to the rules that should not be a penalty - as long as the resplaced player leaves immediatley (which is not defined - although the NCAA rule book defines it as within 3 seconds, so I would think that would be a good guideline) there should be no penalty regardless of how many players are present at the instant the huddle breaks.
The penalty in question - if a replaced player does not leave the field immediately in an effort to confuse the other team - is illegal substition. It is a deadball foul prior to the snap and is a 5-yard penalty. In one of the more stupid rules, if the officials don't see that there are 12 men on the field until after the snap, then it is illegal participation and it is a 15-yard penalty.
The main difference between the two penalties (besides 10 yards) is that illegal substitution is a dead ball foul and illegal participation is a live ball foul.
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Post by coachdoug on Jan 30, 2008 12:16:18 GMT -6
To answer the question about getting the rule book, just call NFHS at 800–776–3462 or go to www.nfhs.org and click on "Online Publications" and then "Order Online." Better yet, join NFHS (click on "Sign Up" under the Members Only heading). For about $30, you will get their quarterly magazine and an insurance policy (I think it's $1 million, but they may have raised it to $2 million - I don't recall) to protect you from being sued by an injured player, and all of their publications (including rules books) are then available to you online.
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Post by coachdoug on Jan 29, 2008 21:15:57 GMT -6
I read the rule book cover-to-cover every single year (I've been coaching 15 years), so I know the rules pretty well at this point. I am amazed every year at how little many of my colleagues, and even officials, know of the rules. Here is a list of a few of my pet peeves regarding rules:
1. Pass Interference on passes thrown behind the LOS. There is no such thing. In order for there to be PI, the pass must cross the LOS. Last season we ran a smoke screen to the slot receiver (about 3 yds behind the LOS) and the X receiver took out the corner while the ball was in the air. The coaches on the other sideline were screaming for an illiegal pick. I tried to explain to them after the game that the play was perfectly legal b/c the pass was behind the LOS, and they just started to argue with me, so I walked away. Another time, a team tried to throw a screen pass against us, and one of my guys knocked the RB down while the ball was in the air. Perfectly legal, right? Not according to the official, who called PI. When I explained to him that you can't have PI behind the LOS, he said, "Oh, yeah, in that situation it's holding." No, it's not, but I lost that arguement.
2. Ineligible downfield on passes behind the LOS. Again, no such thing. The pass must cross the LOS for this penalty to be called.
3. 12 men in the huddle. Most officials do not seem to know this rule. There is no rule against 12 men in the huddle at the HS level - at the college and pro level there is, but not at this HS or youth level. Nonetheless, I have heard this penalty called at least 10 times at youth games over the years. For the record, all the NFHS rule book says on the subject (3-7-1) is that replaced players must "leave the field immediately."
4. Illegal motion. If you put a man in motion, all 11 players must be set for a full beat before than man goes in motion. If any player is still getting set or getting into his stance when the man goes in motion it should be illegal motion. Granted, most officials don't call it this closely at the youth level, but that's no excuse for the coaches to not know the rule.
5. Eligilbe Receivers. The only eligible receivers are the last man on the LOS on either side of the snapper and any players in the backfield. Just because someone who looks like a receiver is split out wide, if he's not the last man on the LOS, he is NOT eligible and cannot go downfield on a pass play. A coach once told that his covered up receiver was, in fact, eligible b/c he had a slot receiver between him and the last receiver on the LOS. What???
6. Advancing Onside Kicks. One time I was announcing a game, and the kicking team picked up an onside kick that they had recovered and advanced it to about the opponents 20. The officials held a conference and while they were discussing the play, I read the rule over the P.A. system, and they STILL allowed the play and gave the ball to the Kickers on the 20 instead of midfield. Unbelievable.
7. Maximum distance on any penalty is 1/2 the distance to the goalline. College and pros have different rules for PI and maybe some other penalties, but at the HS/youth level, the maximum distance for any penalty is 1/2 the distance to the goal. I can't tell how many times I've seen officials mark off 15 yards from the 22 to the 7 (or something similar). Just wrong.
8. Roughing the snapper. Very few coaches or officials know that in order for the snapper to be protected, the person lined up to catch the snap must be at least 7 yards behind the LOS. I've never had my guys go after the snapper for obvious safety reasons, but placing the tee on the 7 or 8 yard line instead of the 10 on PATs somehow just seems like cheating to me.
9. Clock rules. At the HS/Youth level, the clock stops until the next snap on incomplete passes, runs out of bounds, change of possesion, after any score, after the end of a period, and after a delay of game penalty. The clock stops until the ball is "chopped" if there was any other penalty or if there was an officials timeout (which include first downs, injuries, equipment issues, measurements, etc.). In one game, a ball carrier got pushed out of bounds, but was still going forward, and the official gave the signal to keep the clock running. I asked him what he was doing and he said that if the runner is touched in bounds, the clock keeps running. Wrong. Again, I lost the argument, but just can't believe that these officials really don't know the rules. I think they just want to get the games over with faster half the time. Maybe he was thinking that if the runner's progress is stopped in bounds (and, hence, the play ended in bounds), then you keep the clock running, but that was clearly not the case on that play.
10. All the NFL rules that do not apply to HS/Youth. Defensive encroachment w/o touching the offense, illegal contact by DBs after 5 yards, no intentional grounding if the QB is outside the tackles, no PI on non-catchable passes, etc.
Anyways, those are a few of my favorites. Can anybody add more?
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Post by coachdoug on Feb 16, 2008 14:02:00 GMT -6
Yesterday Los Angeles SWAT Officer Randall Simmons was laid to rest. He was killed in the line of duty last week when he jumped in front of another officer and took a bullet in the throat. He was the first SWAT officer to be killed in the 40+ year history of the SWAT program in Los Angeles.
No only was Officer Simmons a respected officer of the law, he was an excellent youth football coach in the El Segundo program, which is a part of our league, the Pacific Coast Conference. Randy was very involved wih youth - at his funeral, his wife and family reserved the area immediately behind the family for his former players and youths from a church youth fellowship group with which he was involved.
I did not know Coach Simmons personally. I met him and knew of him, though. He played cornerback at Washington State before joining the Los Angeles police force. He lived in Rancho Palos Verdes, which is a very exclusive, well-to-do community. Nonetheless, he always stayed close to the disadvantaged youth that he came in contact with through his police work and through his church groups.
When it came time for his sons to play youth ball, he could have simply signed them up in the Palos Verdes program, which is the winningest, most succesful program in our league. Instead, he took them to El Segundo, probably the least winning program in the entire league. He joined up with Dean Pliaconis, the president of the El Segundo program and head coach of his son's team. While El Segundo is something of a Mayberry RFD community itself, it is much closer to the ghetto areas of L.A., and Coach Simmons was able to bring in some youth from South-Central L.A. (which is an open territory in our league). Most of these kids would never have had a chance to play ball or be part of a team otherwise. I always admired Randy for helping these kids get a chance to learn about teamwork, sportsmanship, the value of hard work, and other life lessons that many of us take for granted.
Two years ago, Dean and Randy's team was in the Midget division (age 11-14 - mostly 8th graders). They played our program's Midget team (not the team I coach) in the conference finals, winning 40-26 on their way to a National Championship (AYF). It was truly a remarkable story.
In a sadly ironic twist on an already sad story, another coach from that championship game, (Redondo assistant coach, and my good friend) Mike Durden (who played collegiately with UCLA and in the NFL with San Francisco and the Jets) also died recently (last November) from complications related to diabetes.
Randy Simmons' funeral was attended by over 10,000 people, making it the largest funeral in Los Angeles history. Police officers from all over the nation and even several from foreign countires came to pay their respects.
The streets of heaven will be safer with you there, Randy. But, today, your death is a tremendous loss for those of us still here on earth. You wil be missed.
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Post by coachdoug on Jan 31, 2008 1:01:05 GMT -6
Personally, I am a big believer in gadget plays. I've never run a "get off the field" or "we have the wrong ball" play, and probably never will, but I think reverses, flea flickers, option passes, etc should be part of any team's aresenal. I generally run an average of one gadget play per game (probably a little less when we're dominant). Many of my teams over the years have been blessed with a precipitous lack of speed , which makes having a few home run plays absolutely essential. If you run a sweep, off-tackle, counter, etc. and do everything right and get your RB into the secondary, if you have a stud, fast RB, it's probably a TD (or at least a long gain), but if you have slow, non-athletic RBs, they get caught by DBs and LBs after a 5-10 yard gain. So, that means, in order to score you have to drive the ball down the field getting several first downs. Let me demonstrate statistically how difficult that is. I have charted stats on a couple hundred youth games over the years. Even in blowouts, it is rare for any team to get more than 10-12 first downs in a game. An average game is about 8 possessions per team. Turnovers and quick scores can mean a few more possesions, but overall that averages out to the best teams only getting first downs about 60-70% of the time. Even if you assume that a team is way above average and gets first downs 80% of the time, it will be very difficult for them to score without any big plays, what I call "X" plays (any play over 15 or so yards, thereby reducing the number of first downs needed to score). Let's say a drive begins on a team's own 30. If that team just barely gets first downs (10.5 to 11 yards per first down), they will need 6 first downs to score. If you do the math, you'll see that this team has only a 26% chance of scoring (and that assuming a 100% chance of scoring from 1st and goal). Now, if the team they are playing is decent, that first down rate is realistically going to be more like 50% at best, then the probability of scoring from that far out is only 1.6%. Therefore, if you want to score more than once in a while, you have to have some X plays. My experience bears this out - even the best youth teams typically only have one or two real sustained drives (by that I mean a 10+ play drive with 5+ first downs) in an entire season. Even in the NFL, the typical drive is like 65 yards in 8 plays. I don't have any stats on it, but I'll bet that the majority of NFL scoring drives of over 50 yards involve at least one play of over 15 yards and probably over 20 yards. Furthermore, if you are getting 3-5 yards per play and just barely getting first downs, you have to be almost perfect. Any mistake can derail a drive. A false start, hold, fumbled snap, botched assignment leading to a no gain or a loss, or even a stumble by the RB can all effectively kill a drive for a team like this. Even if your kids are perfect, we've all seen officials call penalties the wrong way - the defensive line encroaches into the neutral zone and then your offensive lineman flinches and the penalty gets called on the offense. Your guys did nothing wrong, but your drive is still dead. For speedy, athletic teams this is no big deal - you just run your regular plays and if your studs break a tackle or get a block and get into the secondary 4-5 times a game, you've got a good chance of scoring enough points to win. However, for less athletic teams, or when facing an equally or more athletic team even if your team is athletic, it helps to use deception or trickery, etc to manufacture some X plays. One of my best X plays I would not consider a gadget play at all. We run a roll right screen left that scores a TD probably about 50% of the times we've run it. You can only run it once or twice a game, and it gets more difficult as you get scouted, but once we run a few roll out plays succesfully, even if they know we run it, the whole defense will flow towards the roll out and then I get my best athlete the ball on the other side of the field with 3 lead blockers - even if the Will or the S or the DE reads it, usually one or more of the blockers will take him out and the RB has smooth sailing. Likewise, I've used double passes, halfback option passes, reverses, reverse passes, hook & ladders, etc. to create big plays - plays that are designed to score, or at least gain 25 or more yards if they are executed properly - not just 5 yards or so like most typical plays. I mostly run off-tackle, some counters, sweeps, traps, play-action passes, and short passes, but an occasional gadget play will loosen up the defense and allow you to "steal" a touchdown that you might never have gotten otherwise. One final benefit - the kids love these plays, so it keeps them engaged.
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Post by coachdoug on Feb 6, 2008 14:02:16 GMT -6
Welcome aboard coach. I'm pretty new here, too, but I can attest to the fact that this is a great site. Stick around and read everything that's here in the youth section and above in the "Rules of the Game" section and I'm sure you'll learn a lot. There are a bunch of very knowledgeable coaches here, so soak up what they are willing to share.
Good luck to you and your team.
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Post by coachdoug on Mar 19, 2008 10:20:07 GMT -6
One other thing you should probably be doing is background checks on your coaches and administrators. All coaches and board members (any position requiring an ID badge) in our conference are required to get live scanned. This keeps child molesters out of coaching and embezzlers off of boards - at least better than if you don't do the background checks.
There is one negative to this approach, though. If you go to the trouble to do background checks, you have to ensure that only coaches that have undergone the background checks interact with the kids. In practice, this means that our coaches have to wear their ID badges to every practice and if a conference commissioner comes by practice (and they do), if there are any unbadged coaches on the field, they will be asked to leave, the program gets fined and multilple offenses will lead to suspension of the head coach. What this means is no more having parents hold bags or fill in for absent coaches. Nor can you add a coach midseason. If you don't have your full staff in place (including guys that will just hold bags) by certification date (about the 3rd week in August), you are SOL.
Again, the standard for behavior needs to be set by the conference/league that your program is a part of - if they aren't willing to set down strong standards with substantial penalties for failing to adhere to the standards, move your program to another conference/league.
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Post by coachdoug on Mar 18, 2008 13:21:09 GMT -6
There is no reason to put up with that kind of behavior. Using illegal players should be an automatic lietime suspension. Lesser offenses should be probably be 1-2 game suspensions with multiple offenses leading to a lifetime suspension. It's great that your program is trying to clean things up, but it really needs to come from the top - from the conference or league that your program is a part of. If they don't permanently dismiss rouge coaches and programs, then the incentive to cheat will remain and you'll find that cheaters will keep cropping up. As Dave said, quality attracts quality, so if your conference/league makes it clear that cheating will not be tolerated, good coaches and programs will want to be part of it.
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Post by coachdoug on Feb 29, 2008 19:00:38 GMT -6
LOL I know what it is lol. I was trying to be sarcastic in that we don't have any because we are poor. LOL - sorry, I guess I'm not too bright sometimes. There is so much terminology and not everyone uses the same terms, so I try to never assume that anyone should know any term that someone else is using. BTW, I can totally relate to the lack of equipment due to poverty. I probably shouldn't complain because I think we have better equipment than a lot of other programs, but sometimes I see programs with blocking sleds, chutes, etc, and all I can think is, "Good God, where did they get the money for all that stuff!!" Anyway, I feel like a complete idiot now.
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Post by coachdoug on Feb 28, 2008 0:16:19 GMT -6
What's a hand shield? I'd like to have a chute, haven't seen one in years. This is a hand shield:
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Post by coachdoug on Feb 27, 2008 2:04:03 GMT -6
Coaches, Assuming you have all the personal equipment (helmet, Pads) that you need what would you go out and buy next? Right now we have 20 hand shields, and 6 tackling dummies. What should we look at gettin next? For you equipment managers, Would it be possible for you to send me a copy of what you have in your inventory so I can take a look at it and see what we should invest in? Thanks A Lot -CB 20 hand shields and 6 tackling dummies?!?!?! Holy cow, I wish I had your equipment manager. I'm lucky if I get 3 of each. We do get 3-4 balls and a full supply/repair box with all the extra parts and pads for helmets, shoulder pads, etc. (as well as tools, extra straps, mouthpieces, laces, tape and first aid kit). In addition to that, every year I buy out of my own pocket about 4-5 extra balls, scrimmage vests or skull caps, several rolls of athletic tape, extra tees, wrist coaches, cones, and 2-3 half-round dummies.
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Post by coachdoug on Feb 29, 2008 9:45:12 GMT -6
I think that is fantastic and I'd love to see more programs do this. My concern is, (just like the 'conditioning thread') is the herding cats aspect of youth ball. How do you watch 5-10 minutes of scout / game film without it turning into 30 minutes of transit, seating, discussion, keep your hands to yourself........away from physical practice? It's just like any other disciplinary issue, as KC said, you lay down the law early with something behind it (like 20 suicides) and you'll have their attention all season long. Similarly, I give them a lecture about will or will not be tolerated, and then I back it up with running or whatever if they don't meet my expectations. Another thing I do right at the beginning of August practice is explain to the kids that we need their full attention during practice - not just their attention, but the full commitment of their eyes, ears and minds. After I've explained that, I tell them that anytime I say, "Eyes," they are to immediately stop any other conversation or anything else they are doing (even if it is with another coach) and respond "Ears and Minds." Anyone who does not give coach their full attention including their eyes, ears and minds, starts running. We generally only have to enforce that once, and then for the rest of the season, anytime I need the kids' attention, all I have to do is say, "Eyes"
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