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Post by newhope on Sept 22, 2021 12:48:44 GMT -6
I'm not delving into the political side of this stuff, but I've been intrigued by how differing school districts handle the contact tracing and subsequent quarantining of students (and teams). In SC the Dept. of Health and Environmental (DHEC) has established 'guidelines'. We have had a significant number of teams shut down/quarantine for up to 2 weeks. But there have been some areas that haven't had as much closure. DHEC has put in place these 'guidelines'. A 'cohort' that has 3 positives COVID tests are recommended to to shut down/quarantine for 2 weeks. Now a 'cohort' is NOT defined in specific number nor as a ratio of people, but just as an association of grouped people. So, at my school the girls golf team of 9 girls is a cohort. The football program of 140+ is also a cohort. My classroom of 24 kids that are wall to wall is not a cohort. Nor is our cafeteria in a school that is close to 70% free and reduced lunch, plus the federal subsidized 'lunch for all' is not a cohort as well. I would say this is the norm, not the exception on the public school world. They are so afraid of looking bad over Covid numbers, or having to do anything other than have real 2019 school that they are coming up with these things. Nobody knows when the missing kids have Covid, nobody knows how many there are, the guidelines are as loose as they can be and sometimes it seems they make it up as they go along. We don't have a coach in our program who hasn't had to get tested---none have been positive, thank goodness---but they'll send us to test in a heartbeat. We've also had a bunch of kids the same way---get sent home, miss practice, test negative. We've been lucky---not always that way with others....but you're not seeing the same reaction to positive tests or symptoms that you saw last year. They made us miss two games in the spring because somebody on the other team tested positive. I'll guarantee you we don't have a kid on the team that hasn't been exposed to someone who is positive this fall but we keep on rolling (other than missing a game when our opponent was quarantined). |
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Post by dblwngr on Sept 22, 2021 13:41:32 GMT -6
Looks like a neighboring school in my area will be doing the same, they are around 400 |
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Post by coachklee on Sept 28, 2021 17:46:03 GMT -6
That sucks…it is so surreal having played at the turn of the century in football programs with 40+ from a school of about 300… |
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Post by Down 'n Out on Sept 30, 2021 3:49:12 GMT -6
That sucks…it is so surreal having played at the turn of the century Im gonna start using "at the turn of the century" lol I also attended high school at the turn of the century at a school with +/- 325 students and in our lean years we had 25 dedicated players, in our "up" years we would have 40-45 9-12. Crazy how things have changed |
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Post by coachjm on Sept 30, 2021 5:14:03 GMT -6
Due to the cancellations last night our HS of 256 kids in Division 8 (smallest division) played MS Football against a school in Division 2 and a school in Division 4.
Our 7th Grade squad played the Division 4 school we dressed 19 they had a combined 7th/8th of 40 or so
Our 8th Grade Squad played the Division 2 school we dressed 25 they had a combined 7th/8th of 40 or so
Both schools have excellent varsity coaches who been successful, both schools worked hard to make sure their kids could get a game (which not everyone does)....
We have some history of success and a strong community so we have some things going in our favor, however, my first year at this school 10 years ago we had to scrap to have 14 on our one middle school team and 2 years prior they didn't have a MS team.... We have worked REALLY hard to change our infrastructure and here are my conclusions...
1. Football must be age appropriate...
2. Kids come out to play, a. to actually play b. to play in games.... Make sure they can when they are young or they won't get better.
3. Coaches and dads care about lower level results more then kids! Football needs to be fun!
4. Flag football is Fun... The longer kids play it the more eager they will be for tackle it won't negatively influence how they tackle...
5. Spend time building numbers and recruiting/building interest with the MS-9th grade years if they haven't gotten excited about it by then you probably won't sway them....
6. Balance matters, although their are periods you have to grind, most of the year (year round program) the activities should be fun and the kids should look forward to it as should you as the coach! If you are as a coach are grinding in March make some changes....
I know a little off topic and there are so many variables everyone deals with that are out of our control.... However, there are some things we as Coaches could do much better to make the game more enjoyable for ourselves and the kids and our game would benefit and SOME of these schools cancelling would not be..
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Post by bird0660 on Sept 30, 2021 8:15:51 GMT -6
sadly it is a dying game too physical for mommies too manly for snowflakes the nwo infiltration has killed this country from within by killing football prove me wrong..... We’ve got great numbers for our size. Games not dying, but how it is played (and more importantly, how you interact with players) is different than even 20 years ago. This is a fantastic comment! Do I sometimes yearn to do bull in the ring and Oklahoma? Yes. But its different, and kids have changed, just like they have for the last 200 years. Its our job to figure out how to coach to that change. |
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Post by bird0660 on Sept 30, 2021 8:25:52 GMT -6
Several coaches have made reference to declining numbers on students enrolled overall. I know that often time rural areas shrink as the job base does. I'm sure also that 21st century options like virtual and school choice play a role as well. BUT NOT to turn this political I do wonder, from things I've read and people I've talked to, is there any type of 'blue' state exodus going on. Jersey, for the most part, is thriving football-wise |
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Post by fantom on Oct 1, 2021 11:17:47 GMT -6
I'm told that Denbigh HS (Classification 4 out of six, enrollment of about 1300) in Newport News, VA has just forfeited all of their remaining varsity games and will only play a JV schedule. They've been a mess this year, losing one game 52-0 when it was called AT HALFTIME, to avoid fights. I've heard that they have very few juniors and seniors and that most players are in 9th and 10th grades.
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Post by larrymoe on Oct 4, 2021 18:20:31 GMT -6
A school of 265 has went to a just JV schedule for the remainder of the year. Another school of 756 has canceled their Friday night game due to a combo of quarantine and low numbers. The frustrating thing is both played last Friday against the teams on their schedule they had the best chance of beating the rest of the way. The small school lost 47-0 and the bigger school lost to a 1-4 team. Which, in a vacuum just seems like random facts, but I've been noticing that all these issues seem to peek just as teams are supposed to play the best teams they'll play all year. The small school plays the 3 best teams in the conference the rest of the season and the big school plays a state ranked, undefeated juggernaut Friday. A local private school who is ranked #1 in their class has had 3 schools be "unable to play" against them this season. At least one was just out the week they were supposed to play them. It seems like the cool thing to do now is fold up the tent when facing a beating and claim it's for "health and safety". No one seemed to care about health and safety in 1991 when I was wrestling that 275lb future NFL lineman when I weighed 193.  |
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Post by coachd5085 on Oct 4, 2021 22:33:18 GMT -6
A school of 265 has went to a just JV schedule for the remainder of the year. Another school of 756 has canceled their Friday night game due to a combo of quarantine and low numbers. The frustrating thing is both played last Friday against the teams on their schedule they had the best chance of beating the rest of the way. The small school lost 47-0 and the bigger school lost to a 1-4 team. Which, in a vacuum just seems like random facts, but I've been noticing that all these issues seem to peek just as teams are supposed to play the best teams they'll play all year. The small school plays the 3 best teams in the conference the rest of the season and the big school plays a state ranked, undefeated juggernaut Friday. A local private school who is ranked #1 in their class has had 3 schools be "unable to play" against them this season. At least one was just out the week they were supposed to play them. It seems like the cool thing to do now is fold up the tent when facing a beating and claim it's for "health and safety". No one seemed to care about health and safety in 1991 when I was wrestling that 275lb future NFL lineman when I weighed 193. Louisiana saw that a great deal during the first fall with Covid issues. So it instituted a forfeit (not cancellation) policy this year, which is bringing with it unintended consequences. |
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Post by mrjvi on Oct 6, 2021 6:14:51 GMT -6
Our section in NY also went to a forfeit policy if you can't play your game by Monday. We are in the smallest class. We had a quarantine issue which caused a forfeit for our first game and then the team we played forfeited in the 2nd game. We were at a pretty healthy 27-28 kids in early season. With injuries and individual quarantines we are down to 18 this week. Grades come out on Friday. We may be done. 16 is the minimum.
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nndman
Freshmen Member
Posts: 27 
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Post by nndman on Oct 6, 2021 17:29:14 GMT -6
Two programs in Virginia folded up today. One is in the smallest classification (Class 1 Rye Cove) while the other is in the second smallest one (Class 2 John Marshall-Richmond).
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Post by tog on Oct 6, 2021 20:58:58 GMT -6
We’ve got great numbers for our size. Games not dying, but how it is played (and more importantly, how you interact with players) is different than even 20 years ago. This is a fantastic comment! Do I sometimes yearn to do bull in the ring and Oklahoma? Yes. But its different, and kids have changed, just like they have for the last 200 years. Its our job to figure out how to coach to that change. it has nothing to do with bull in the ring that has always been stupid the game has been under attack our society has been under attack it sucks sad that some don't see it, but whatever, maybe I am just being a get off my lawn guy but in reality yeah, get off my lawn for damn right |
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Post by 33coach on Oct 7, 2021 10:04:29 GMT -6
This is a fantastic comment! Do I sometimes yearn to do bull in the ring and Oklahoma? Yes. But its different, and kids have changed, just like they have for the last 200 years. Its our job to figure out how to coach to that change. it has nothing to do with bull in the ring that has always been stupid the game has been under attack our society has been under attack it sucks sad that some don't see it, but whatever, maybe I am just being a get off my lawn guy but in reality yeah, get off my lawn for damn right our game is under attack because our generation didnt take proper steps to protect it. everything football gets, it deserves because the caretakers of it didnt care about the players. plain and simple. anyone who yearns for drills that have a high injury rate, or the "no water" era....is insane and shouldnt be anywhere near kids. |
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Post by tog on Oct 7, 2021 10:42:37 GMT -6
it has nothing to do with bull in the ring that has always been stupid the game has been under attack our society has been under attack it sucks sad that some don't see it, but whatever, maybe I am just being a get off my lawn guy but in reality yeah, get off my lawn for damn right our game is under attack because our generation didnt take proper steps to protect it. everything football gets, it deserves because the caretakers of it didnt care about the players. plain and simple. anyone who yearns for drills that have a high injury rate, or the "no water" era....is insane and shouldnt be anywhere near kids. agree |
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Post by dblwngr on Oct 7, 2021 10:48:53 GMT -6
it has nothing to do with bull in the ring that has always been stupid the game has been under attack our society has been under attack it sucks sad that some don't see it, but whatever, maybe I am just being a get off my lawn guy but in reality yeah, get off my lawn for damn right our game is under attack because our generation didnt take proper steps to protect it. everything football gets, it deserves because the caretakers of it didnt care about the players. plain and simple. anyone who yearns for drills that have a high injury rate, or the "no water" era....is insane and shouldnt be anywhere near kids. I somewhat agree We haven't done any of the stupid drills talked about in the seven seasons I've been here and I've never heard of anyone ever refusing a kid water. I know most all the coaches in our area and I can more than likely say the same about they're programs. Yet numbers are down at every program. There's obviously a lot more to it. |
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Post by 33coach on Oct 7, 2021 10:56:41 GMT -6
our game is under attack because our generation didnt take proper steps to protect it. everything football gets, it deserves because the caretakers of it didnt care about the players. plain and simple. anyone who yearns for drills that have a high injury rate, or the "no water" era....is insane and shouldnt be anywhere near kids. I somewhat agree We haven't done any of the stupid drills talked about in the seven seasons I've been here and I've never heard of anyone ever refusing a kid water. I know most all the coaches in our area and I can more than likely say the same about they're programs. Yet numbers are down at every program. There's obviously a lot more to it. we are still rebounding from 50+ years of player safety neglect that suddenly became public knowledge.. we arent out of the woods yet, hell we arent even half way through.... |
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Post by 33coach on Oct 7, 2021 10:59:02 GMT -6
make no mistake, i love this game, its given me alot.
but the people who came before us...messed it up for the foreseeable future.
other contact sports made changes and football didnt.
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Post by fantom on Oct 7, 2021 12:18:03 GMT -6
our game is under attack because our generation didnt take proper steps to protect it. everything football gets, it deserves because the caretakers of it didnt care about the players. plain and simple. anyone who yearns for drills that have a high injury rate, or the "no water" era....is insane and shouldnt be anywhere near kids. I somewhat agree We haven't done any of the stupid drills talked about in the seven seasons I've been here and I've never heard of anyone ever refusing a kid water. I know most all the coaches in our area and I can more than likely say the same about they're programs. Yet numbers are down at every program. There's obviously a lot more to it. I agree with you. I haven't heard of anybody doing those drills in years (Decades, really). Same with water. |
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Post by coachks on Oct 7, 2021 12:46:52 GMT -6
A school of 265 has went to a just JV schedule for the remainder of the year. Another school of 756 has canceled their Friday night game due to a combo of quarantine and low numbers. The frustrating thing is both played last Friday against the teams on their schedule they had the best chance of beating the rest of the way. The small school lost 47-0 and the bigger school lost to a 1-4 team. Which, in a vacuum just seems like random facts, but I've been noticing that all these issues seem to peek just as teams are supposed to play the best teams they'll play all year. The small school plays the 3 best teams in the conference the rest of the season and the big school plays a state ranked, undefeated juggernaut Friday. A local private school who is ranked #1 in their class has had 3 schools be "unable to play" against them this season. At least one was just out the week they were supposed to play them. It seems like the cool thing to do now is fold up the tent when facing a beating and claim it's for "health and safety". No one seemed to care about health and safety in 1991 when I was wrestling that 275lb future NFL lineman when I weighed 193. Devils advocate here.... but at some point, isn't it actually a player safety issue? I think the divide between the top programs and the bottom programs is evolving rapidly - way more than when I graduated in 2005. To just give 4 examples.... Programs with college level facilities, college level S&C and dedicated athletes Programs with basic high school facilities and 25 year old programs and dedicated / semi dedicated athletes (multisport athletes in particular, who do not weight train enough for football). Programs with decent facilities and absolute dog {censored} S&C (programming wise) Programs with bare bones facilities that do not lift to any meaningful effect. When Program 1 plays Program 4, those kids on Program 4 are at a safety risk. It also happens to be that Program 1, also usually has better coaches. They have better technique and better scheme to go with their physical advantages. (This is not saying "Program 1" coach is better than 2 or 3, but generally good coaches don't deal with Program 4 for very long). |
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Post by nicku on Oct 7, 2021 12:47:25 GMT -6
I have never heard a coach yearn for the "no water" era, but I do coach with older coaches who remember when their coaches told them water was for sissies... It is weird to think, however, about how when I first started playing football in the 8th grade, we got ONE water break and it was one of those hose/pvc pipe with holes contraptions...and this was only 15 years ago! That would never happen now. |
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Post by blb on Oct 7, 2021 12:56:02 GMT -6
I somewhat agree We haven't done any of the stupid drills talked about in the seven seasons I've been here and I've never heard of anyone ever refusing a kid water. I know most all the coaches in our area and I can more than likely say the same about they're programs. Yet numbers are down at every program. There's obviously a lot more to it. I agree with you. I haven't heard of anybody doing those drills in years (Decades, really). Same with water. I got my first HC job in 1979. We never taught hitting with helmets-head, always corrected kids if it happened. Hell's Bells - even back then there were Warning stickers on helmets. Taught shoulder blocking and tackling. Had Water Breaks every 20 minutes or more often if necessary. Has always amazed me that all these years later these things might still be issues. |
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Post by fantom on Oct 7, 2021 13:39:12 GMT -6
I agree with you. I haven't heard of anybody doing those drills in years (Decades, really). Same with water. I got my first HC job in 1979. We never taught hitting with helmets-head, always corrected kids if it happened. Hell's Bells - even back then there were Warning stickers on helmets. Taught shoulder blocking and tackling. Had Water Breaks every 20 minutes or more often if necessary. Has always amazed me that all these years later these things might still be issues. A few years ago when the NFL started cracking don on ramming with the crown of the helmet you heard a lot of players and analysts complaining that players would have to completely re-learn how to paly the game. I wondered what the hell they were talking about. We've never taught that and didn't know anybody that did. It's been a penalty for decades. It wasn't taught when I played in the 60's and 70's. None of the many colleges where I watched practices taught that. So what were those NFL players having to relearn? |
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Post by larrymoe on Oct 7, 2021 14:37:41 GMT -6
A school of 265 has went to a just JV schedule for the remainder of the year. Another school of 756 has canceled their Friday night game due to a combo of quarantine and low numbers. The frustrating thing is both played last Friday against the teams on their schedule they had the best chance of beating the rest of the way. The small school lost 47-0 and the bigger school lost to a 1-4 team. Which, in a vacuum just seems like random facts, but I've been noticing that all these issues seem to peek just as teams are supposed to play the best teams they'll play all year. The small school plays the 3 best teams in the conference the rest of the season and the big school plays a state ranked, undefeated juggernaut Friday. A local private school who is ranked #1 in their class has had 3 schools be "unable to play" against them this season. At least one was just out the week they were supposed to play them. It seems like the cool thing to do now is fold up the tent when facing a beating and claim it's for "health and safety". No one seemed to care about health and safety in 1991 when I was wrestling that 275lb future NFL lineman when I weighed 193. Devils advocate here.... but at some point, isn't it actually a player safety issue? I think the divide between the top programs and the bottom programs is evolving rapidly - way more than when I graduated in 2005. To just give 4 examples.... Programs with college level facilities, college level S&C and dedicated athletes Programs with basic high school facilities and 25 year old programs and dedicated / semi dedicated athletes (multisport athletes in particular, who do not weight train enough for football). Programs with decent facilities and absolute dog {censored} S&C (programming wise) Programs with bare bones facilities that do not lift to any meaningful effect. When Program 1 plays Program 4, those kids on Program 4 are at a safety risk. It also happens to be that Program 1, also usually has better coaches. They have better technique and better scheme to go with their physical advantages. (This is not saying "Program 1" coach is better than 2 or 3, but generally good coaches don't deal with Program 4 for very long). That is not the case in these instances. The small school is the wealthiest school in their conference with the nicest facilities and a turf field. They also draw students from an apartment complex in a city of 60,000+ people where they have gotten multiple all state athletes from in the past. As recently as 3 years ago they were in the state semifinals. They're just down this year and don't want to take the beatings. |
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Post by coachd5085 on Oct 7, 2021 17:34:43 GMT -6
I somewhat agree We haven't done any of the stupid drills talked about in the seven seasons I've been here and I've never heard of anyone ever refusing a kid water. I know most all the coaches in our area and I can more than likely say the same about they're programs. Yet numbers are down at every program. There's obviously a lot more to it. we are still rebounding from 50+ years of player safety neglect that suddenly became public knowledge.. we arent out of the woods yet, hell we arent even half way through.... I don't think the decline is solely due to concerns over head trauma. |
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Post by larrymoe on Oct 7, 2021 20:08:42 GMT -6
make no mistake, i love this game, its given me alot. but the people who came before us...messed it up for the foreseeable future. other contact sports made changes and football didnt. And those other sports are experiencing low numbers too. If previous generations liked baseball more than football and boomers and Gen X made the transition to football being more popular, the last couple generations have made the transition to not participating in any sports. My daughter's school is looking at maybe losing girls soccer because no one wants to play. Last year they won regional and competed well in sectionals. They'll very possibly go from one of the 16 best teams in Illinois her soph year to not existing her Sr. |
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Post by morris on Oct 8, 2021 6:45:24 GMT -6
HS wise what appears to of happened here is kids started working during Covid. They started pretty much getting full time hours with full time money. So we lost some kids we were developing or maybe kids we were trying to recruit to the work force. Kids also got used to just staying at home and having free time. For a while we couldn’t have kids work with two sports so multi sport guys had to pick. It wasn’t as big of a factor but it was a little.
Now youth sports numbers appear to be up a little. Parents got tired of having the little ones around the house all the time. They wanted them out and to get a break. Until HS a lot of parents around here (especially no cut sports) are used as a babysitter.
Our numbers are lower right now. We pretty much don’t have a sophomore or junior class. I think we have around 8 total names. Freshman numbers are pretty good for us. If we get two more freshman classes like we did this year we’ll be ok. Football here is made up of cast offs in a lot of ways.
The other sports supplement their numbers by using MS kids. Our JV soccer teams are mainly MS kids with a few others sprinkled in. Basketball will pull up kids in the 7th grade.
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Post by nicku on Oct 8, 2021 8:59:53 GMT -6
the last couple generations have made the transition to not participating in any sports I am noticing that trend here, too. Our RBs coach calls them "NARP"s - Non Athletic Regular People. I coach at the high school I graduated from 11 years ago. Maybe I just had my head in the sand and was busy playing two sports and doing god knows what back then, but I notice an alarming amount of kids that just don't do anything - sports, band, choir, art, glee club, chess club, anything. Our softball team went 4 rounds in the playoff last year and couldn't field a JV team after just 2 girls failed the grade check. We have 1900 kids in our school! It sure seemed like 9/10 kids when I was in high school at least had something to belong to. I look around in my English classes that I teach, and especially the sophomores and juniors just aren't a part of anything. |
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Post by d3long on Oct 8, 2021 9:17:51 GMT -6
Hi all. First post here. Look forward to being active here.
Seattle public school program. School of 1,650 with turnout 9-12 graders of 75.
Have struggled to field a frosh team last few years with numbers of around 20. 20 turns to 15 some weeks. Etc.
We tend to get more 1st time players when kids are So or Jr.
I'd say our turnout is probably tops for public schools in Seattle.
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