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Post by chadbartlett on Jun 23, 2009 20:47:01 GMT -6
I was just thinking about last football season and thought of a story that I should tell you guys...
I play in a very competitive league with over 20 teams. Our league plays a 6 game season, with the final game being the "Bowl" game. The two teams with the best record at the end of the year (big tie breaker process with total points, head to head, etc) play in the final Bowl game.
Well, the head coordinator of our league was also the head coach of a team. He has a lot of responsibility as a head coach and coordinator so I give him respect for that. However, I will tell you how he abused his power.
His team finished 5-1. Great season...unfortunately, not quite good enough for the championship game. Two teams had gone 6-0. Well, when the bowl game schedule came out, his team was playing in the final bowl game rather than one of the 6-0 teams.
In this final bowl game, his team was down by 7 with about a minute to go. They ended up scoring a touchdown to put the game within one. In our league, a PAT is worth 2 while running a play and scoring from the 3 is only worth 1. So since it was the last game of the season, he decided to go for the win rather than the tie. They were going to kick a PAT for the one point win.
The kicker was a pretty good kicker for 10-11 year old standards. He made probably around 80% of his PATs and had been the kicker all season long. So obviously he is going to go out and kick the final kick of the season, right? WRONG!
This coach put his son, the star running back and middle linebacker, in to kick the PAT. He hadn't kicked in a game the entire season but was their "back-up" kicker. He was sent in to kick the PAT. He missed. The team lost the championship by 1. That is the prototypical dad trying to make his son the MVP story. This is why sometimes I feel dad's should not coach their son.
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Post by coachdoug on Jun 23, 2009 21:53:53 GMT -6
I hate hearing stories like that. I'm especially appalled that his team was even playing in the championship game - abusing power like that should result in his immediate removal - that's totally unfair to the kids on the team that deserved to be there. Unfortunately, in situations like this generally nothing happens. It's just wrong.
BTW, what part of the country are you in? With only a 6 game regular season and a single playoff game, y'all must be done in mid-October. I guess if the weather turns rough, it's tough to play any later. I just take our weather here in Southern California for granted sometimes. In our old conference (also 20+ teams) we played an 8 game regular season, then a 4 week playoff to determine our league champion - and then bowl games for teams that qualified. Last year we finished the first weekend of December - it was a chilly (for us anyway) 50 degrees or so. LOL.
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Post by mahonz on Jun 23, 2009 22:21:20 GMT -6
Coach
...is he still the head coordinator?
Coach Mike
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Post by casec11 on Jun 25, 2009 12:14:06 GMT -6
Our league is 11 games regular season then 2 rounds of playoffs and a superbowl = 14 games two seasons ago they had a state championship series where the winners went on for 3 more games to win the State championship. Way too many for kids if you ask me.... but the weather in FL sure is nice, and we love our football  And I have seen a few Dads who take it to far.... but many more who are good coaches, good for there sons and the team. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 27, 2009 20:21:02 GMT -6
Always bad, I can only think of 2 times I havent seen dad coaches playing favorites.
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Post by jhanawa on Jun 28, 2009 18:20:50 GMT -6
We've had 3 dad/coaches, all never directly coached their kids but other positions. Before it all started, it was made clear that there are no "fathers" on the team, only coaches/dads.....by that I mean we are equally a dad to all of our kids and care about them all equally......It can be tough but not unachievable, we've never had a problem with it, if we did we'd dismiss the parent immediately. In fact two of our dad coaches have stayed on after their kids have finished playing for us and are a HUGE asset to our staff! Can't express how much these guys mean to our program, they are very important to our success.
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Post by cyflcoach on Jun 28, 2009 18:27:23 GMT -6
My experience has been much the same as jhanawa's. Although I do know some fathers in our league who would not be coaches I'd like to work with, many of my best coaches were "Daddy" coaches and some stayed on after their sons went through, as I did many years ago. Somehow the concept of loving your son and being able to view his athletic ability objectively have become mutually exclusive ideas with far too many fathers. My son was by no means a great athlete and it would have been very unfair of me, not only to his team, but to himself, to put him in positions not suited to his ability level. I love my son dearly and just wanted him (and his teammates) to have a great time learning to play the game.
Dave Hartman
CYFL Coach
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Post by rgrmaverick on Jul 3, 2009 21:09:07 GMT -6
Story reminds me of Coach Homer Simpson who made his son Bart the starting QB after buying Tom Landry's hat.
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Post by outlawjoseywales on Jul 3, 2009 21:24:00 GMT -6
Thanks for posting the "dad" story.
This isn't just a problem for youth league, this is also a problem for small private schools too.
Because these schools don't have many teacher anyway, and usually will only have 1 staff member as a coach.
I have had a lot of trouble with coach "dads" for sure. I currently only have 1 "dad" on staff, and he is one of the finest "non-dad" acting guy I've ever been around.
Worst case was several years ago when I had 5 staff member as "dads."
Everything goes along fine until the pressure get high, or their kid gets hurt, or they think that their sons isn't treated right.
Bad news.
I had one "dad" send a kid on a mission to attempt to hurt an opposing player because his kid got hurt and he thought it was unjust. Great guy, just lost his mind.
He got fired quickly. Thankfully we didn't get sued, I don't know how, but we didn't. That was a rough year.
I fired one "dad" at halftime of a game because he was more concerned for his son than for the rest of the kids at the position he was coaching. He didn't show any of this at practice.
But first game-OK, by the 2nd game-he was gone.
But at a small school level, we take who we can get as coaches.
Things are better now though, got a great staff.
OJW
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Post by raiderpirates on Jul 23, 2009 19:09:37 GMT -6
Always bad, I can only think of 2 times I havent seen dad coaches playing favorites. Agreed. |
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binny
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Post by binny on Jul 24, 2009 8:11:19 GMT -6
Dads are dads first, as they should be. We try to avoid it as much as possible, but it happens here too. We don't have enough people banging down our door looking to coach to say no to them. We usually negotiate with them to stay on after their son moves on.
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Post by coachguy83 on Jul 30, 2009 21:55:48 GMT -6
I have one Dad Coach on my squad and he is excellent. He does not play favorites with his son, in fact I think he can be harder on his son sometimes.
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Post by coachdoug on Jul 30, 2009 23:52:22 GMT -6
I have one Dad Coach on my squad and he is excellent. He does not play favorites with his son, in fact I think he can be harder on his son sometimes. I'm not picking on you, coachguy83, but I get a little irritated when I hear Dad coaches saying that they're totally fair about their sons and don't play favorities because they are harder on their own sons than everyone else. Being harder on your own son IS playing favorites. If you're being harder on him, you're paying more attention to him, you're setting higher expectations, demanding more effort, and generally assuring that your son is getting better coaching than every other kid. Besides, I've seen a ton of Dad coaches claim that they're harder on their own sons because they yell at them more or make them run more, but you never see those same kids get their playing time reduced. Don't get me wrong - I've worked with some great Dad coaches (my current HC is our QB's dad, and I think he handles the whole thing better than just about anyone else I've coached with), but this line of thinking is a just a convenient excuse to not really make an honest attempt to treat the coach's kid the same as everyone else. Dad coaches that truly get it generally do the following things: - The coach doesn't coach his own son. If his son is a lineman, he works with the backs (or vice-versa), or if his son is the QB, he works primarily with the defense, etc.
- He doesn't let his kid call him Dad during practice - he's Coach Bill or Coach Jones just like he is to every other kid out there. Likewise, he doesn't address his kid any differently than he addresses any other kid.
- He doesn't yell at his kid any more or any less than any of the other kids (of course, in accorandance with what the kid actually deserves). The same holds true for any other disciplinary measures like running or pushups, etc.
- His kid gets the same playing time allotment (i.e. according to ability) as everyone else. If he hasn't earned it, he doesn't play more than necessary. If he is a gifted athlete and a hard worker, if the team gets way ahead, he sits the same time all the rest of the starters sit, etc.
Sorry to go on for so long. I'll get off my soapbox now - this is just one of my pet peeves, I guess. |
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Post by coachguy83 on Jul 31, 2009 0:02:40 GMT -6
It bothers me a little bit also. I would have him work with another position but he is honesty one of the best line coaches I have been around, especially at the youth level. I do have another line coach that is aware of the situation and does his best to try and defuse the situation. We are hard on all of our players and we push them all to the max, it just seems like that coach gets the loudest when his son is up. We as a staff have made it clear to that player and all of the players that when they are on the field he is not dad he is coach. The playing time issue is not a factor, I'm the head coach and I make the final decision when it comes to playing time.
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Post by coachdoug on Jul 31, 2009 16:08:02 GMT -6
I didn't mean to imply any of those things were happening on your team - it sounds like you have it well under control - I just have heard the excuse "Oh, I don't play favorites because I'm harder on my own son than anybody else" so many times that it gets under my skin.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2009 17:49:22 GMT -6
I didn't mean to imply any of those things were happening on your team - it sounds like you have it well under control - I just have heard the excuse "Oh, I don't play favorites because I'm harder on my own son than anybody else" so many times that it gets under my skin. Doug's right that seems to be the preferred excuse. My favorite was " I'm not playing favorites..I made my kid the starting QB, he has to worry about getting killed every play". And true to dad coach form...he cost his team the championship by trying to highlight his kid... Always bad |
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spurred
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Post by spurred on Aug 23, 2009 22:33:43 GMT -6
That is why I love coaching when I have no kids......I am out there for nothing other than to help these kids learn about football. I have honestly thought about it, and wonder if I would keep coaching if I had kids come up?
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Post by ampipebulldog on Nov 28, 2009 11:01:17 GMT -6
Let me tell you how I game planned in our playoffs and Super Bowl this season.
#1 - I found out who the son of the head coach or OC is.
In 5 years, one trend that I have ALWAYS seen is the coach or OC trying to give key reps in a game to their son to make them the MVP story. I see it over and over again. It is the greatest cheat code or tell in youth sports. I almost giggle when a key play comes up and I know who the ball is going to.
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Post by tiger46 on Dec 8, 2009 21:00:14 GMT -6
Late to a good discussion once again.... However, this topic crops up repeatedly. I don't think it will ever be resolved. It's true that some dads should not coach their sons. They can't focus on anyone else besides their son.
But, there are plenty of dad coaches that can be objective enough to coach their sons and any of the other players on their team.
You can never know until you give them a chance.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2009 19:17:09 GMT -6
Or in our case you have Exhibit "B", in which dad (coach) takes it upon himself to show up in full pads (vs 12 yo kids) because "If they can stop me...they can stop anyone"...which I must add, was a first.
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Post by coachmsl on Dec 14, 2009 21:08:43 GMT -6
Or in our case you have Exhibit "B", in which dad (coach) takes it upon himself to show up in full pads (vs 12 yo kids) because "If they can stop me...they can stop anyone"...which I must add, was a first. NO WAY?! That's Hilarious. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2009 7:09:43 GMT -6
Oh I'm not kidding...he quit because I refused to get him a helmet
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Post by daveinsarasota on Dec 15, 2009 12:37:27 GMT -6
I don't coach my son, although I have in the past. I am a much better Dad and Coach, when my son is not on my roster.
Also...it is better for your son! He will be a MUCH better football player under a good coach who is not you...
As a coach, you will have access to him all 365 days of the year. You can coach him up the right way during the off-season (if that is a concern....). But during the season...let him go make his way, and play for someone else. It is a good life lesson.
Next year, I am giving up my head coaching position at the Junior Midget level just so that I have nothing to do with coaching my son. It is so important to me AND him, that he makes his own way.
The cream always rises to the top, and if he is good, he will be just fine. Also, anything that he does...any position will make him a better player all around.
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Post by spos21ram on Jan 13, 2010 10:52:56 GMT -6
I'd like to hear how he was able to get his team in the finals. I'm curious to hear what the other 6-0 team did when they found out they weren't playing in the championship.
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CoachDP
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Post by CoachDP on Jan 13, 2010 18:37:16 GMT -6
"if he is good, he will be just fine. Also, anything that he does...any position will make him a better player all around."
Holy cow, Dave. What an approach! I wish every dad could view things that way.
--Dave
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Post by gameface on Jan 14, 2010 10:35:43 GMT -6
I agree with some of the posts here. I do have a little hesitation with this. I coach my son and grew up my father coaching me, He coached for 35 years HS ball. Where we live we have a draft system. I am sure most of you have the same. With that there are some real idiots out there that I don't really want my kid to play for. One coach in particular coaching 8-9 year olds lines the kids up has them run quick slant with him being the QB. I think he though he was Brett Favre? He was drilling the kids? I asked one of the parents I knew if this was typical he said yes. then they lined up and ran post routes same result he was throwing as hard as he could? Another coach this past year had a couple of kids that played previously for me. One was a total stud probably one of the best running back/ linebackers I have ever had play for me. I went to watch their game and he didn't even run the ball or play on defense?  The defense one baffles me the kid is a total ball hawk. I understand if he needed him on the line to block the kid will do what ever you ask but to not even play him on D is a joke. I guess it is a no brainer they didn't make the playoffs. But his kid and the other coaches kids got to play where they wanted. We have so many teams that the majority are dad coaches. if you are just a volunteer coach with no kids it is rare. What is better for my kid, to coach him and try to be fair to him and all the kids and at least know he is getting better and learning. Or have him play for that nightmare dad coach this post is aimed at? I know I am not perfect and try to be fair when it involves my kid and the kids I coach. This year I will be on both sides of this fence. I have two boys and won't be able to coach them both. I just hope we are lucky in the draft and get a coach that will love the boys and coach them up. |
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Post by daveinsarasota on Jan 18, 2010 10:34:53 GMT -6
"if he is good, he will be just fine. Also, anything that he does...any position will make him a better player all around." Holy cow, Dave. What an approach! I wish every dad could view things that way. --Dave I tell parents all the time...the high school coaches don't care one bit if your son scored 50 TDs per year in Pop Warner. When they show up for the summer workouts...they are looking at the fundamentals...not the kids youth football stats. A good player will benefit greatly from getting "stuck" on the offensive line. It is so convenient, however, to not have my kid on my team. If a player agent comes up to me about the way I am not utilizing their son, I can speak to them with pure objectivity, and they do not have a trump card to hold over my head. I always have the upper hand in that conversation, and as a head coach, that is huge. |
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CoachDP
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Post by CoachDP on Jan 19, 2010 0:07:23 GMT -6
I hear ya. I don't have any kids and my DC doesn't have any that play football. So we are immune from playing favorites. But I do the same as you: I tell the parents at the Parents Meeting that whether your kid scores everytime he touches the ball, or never starts a game all year will not impact one way or the other whether your son one day receives a college scholarship.
--Dave
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Post by coachdoug on Jan 19, 2010 0:50:12 GMT -6
Coachdp, I'm not trying to call you out, and my I'm sure my comments don't apply to you because I'm sure that you don't do this, so I'm only responding to you because you made the statement, but NO ONE is immune from playing favorites. I don't have any kids other than my two year old daughter and I've had the privelege of coaching with quite a few coaches that didn't have sons on the team, but I've known some of the players' parents personally every year (some years more than others) as have each of the other coaches. I've also gotten to know the kids over time. In a situation where I have two kids rated equally, but I know one of the two kids and his family, and I know that the kid is tough, smart, and has been raised properly by his parents, and I don't know anything about the other kid or his family - I'm probably going to go with the kid I know. Since I know the kid, it's a lower risk and the right decision, even though it may not work out the best every time. But, the problem comes from the fact that it's not a big stretch to go from that scenario, to thinking, "Well Billy has looked better and more athletic in practice, but I know Johnny, and I know Johnny's dad, and I know Johnny can do this if I just give him a chance." That's when we start making the same kinds of mistakes that "Daddy coaches" make. So long as we stay diligent about not allowing this to happen and question every decision we make and verify that our decisions are objective and unbiased, we should be fine. But, when we start thinking that "we are immune from playing favorites" - that's when we start getting into trouble.
Anyway, like I said, I'm sure this isn't an issue with you or your staff, but I felt that the comment needed to be addressed, because I've seen too many coaches that thought they were being objective when they clearly weren't.
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Post by daveinsarasota on Jan 19, 2010 6:53:25 GMT -6
I think most of us, at one time or another thought we were being objective, when in fact, we were playing favorites. That's human nature. The absence on your own kids on your roster, however, takes away a significant variable.
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The defense one baffles me the kid is a total ball hawk. I understand if he needed him on the line to block the kid will do what ever you ask but to not even play him on D is a joke. I guess it is a no brainer they didn't make the playoffs. But his kid and the other coaches kids got to play where they wanted.