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Post by coachnichols on Dec 9, 2007 12:29:07 GMT -6
Johnson will change his offense. I know a lot of you love the flexbone, but it's just not going to be successful week in and week out versus teams with great defensive personnel. (I don't mean to get anyone going, but I guess that probably will ;D) Not to get into a big argument with the flexbone people, but the teams that I have seen running it don't beat people with IT, they beat people with their personnel. It's already been said by insiders in the media and by coaches that he will adapt his offense and not run what he has in the past because he's smart enough to know he has to tweak to be successful. I know everyone would like to see it at a big time (GT? Big time?), but it's not going to happen. The upper level teams Johnson will see in the ACC will have better talent and they'll beat him 7-8 out of 10 times. His offense isn't going to change that until he gets better talent. Somebody's already said it on here: Jimmies and Joes! Johnson did well at Navy, but who do they play? I mean, didn't they lose to Duke? They beat teams like Army, and some MAC and Sun Belt schools, maybe a terrible ACC or Big East school. I think what he has done is great, but when it comes down to it, they beat some bad teams and out coach a decent team every year, while getting beat by better talent. That's not a knock, that probably goes for a lot of us on here too. (Okay, be gentle ![:o](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/shocked.png) )
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Post by kkennedy on Dec 9, 2007 13:23:13 GMT -6
What about the flexbone won't let it work week in and week out in the ACC??? I never buy the "x" won't work here argument. Execution is Execution wherever you are at.
Did'nt we hear the same thing about 3 years ago when Urban Meyer took the job in Florida? "Thats not going to work in the SEC week in and week out."
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Post by coachcb on Dec 9, 2007 13:38:03 GMT -6
I seriously doubt Paul Johnson is going to abandon the scheme that has been so good for him over the past decade. I'm willing to bet he'll build upon the flexbone the way Troy Calhoun has at Air Force, but he's not going to ditch it completely in favor of a new scheme.
Lets not forget; he averaged over 40 points a game this year with the flexbone. 40 points a game against defenses that outmanned them no matter how bad they were. It's an military academy folks; not exactly a hot bed for athletic talent.
Personally, I think we will see Paul Johnson do huge things at GT; he'll get the kids he needs to put up points. Most importantly, he'll actually have a decent defense out there.
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Post by beatdown on Dec 9, 2007 13:42:47 GMT -6
I will be shocked if he doesn't run the Flexbone at GT. If the school and alumni won't go for the Flexbone, why the heck would they have hired him? Don't you think that came up in his interview for the job....
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Post by coachcalande on Dec 9, 2007 15:49:23 GMT -6
What about the flexbone won't let it work week in and week out in the ACC??? I never buy the "x" won't work here argument. Execution is Execution wherever you are at. Did'nt we hear the same thing about 3 years ago when Urban Meyer took the job in Florida? "Thats not going to work in the SEC week in and week out." thank you
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Post by coachjaz on Dec 9, 2007 17:18:32 GMT -6
I dont know whip, if you are an alum you might be closer to the situation than I am, maybe you bought one of Fran's $1200 letters too PJ doesnt seem to be a guy that will get pushed around by alums. He just doesnt seem like that guy, and I believe he wants to show everyone that what he does CAN and will work in the BCS. I might be off, but this is really the only offense this guy has EVER been around.
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Post by kkennedy on Dec 9, 2007 18:46:00 GMT -6
www.meinekecarcarebowl.com/2006.htmBoston College is still in the ACC ar'nt they?? PJ took them right to the wire with a considerably less talented navy team last year. Just think what he could do with the same scheme and MORE talent.
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Post by midsfan on Dec 10, 2007 6:20:17 GMT -6
He has said 1000 times that he would adapt his personell to his scheme. I look for them to be Spread Flexbone. Keep in mind that the Spread set (Double Slot) is an old school Run and Shoot formation. Don't be surprised if PJ utilizes some run and shoot passing game. Another thing, I don't care what anyone says kids are kids. Most of them could care less about what scheme a school runs. Most HS players just want a chance to play college football. PJ is a no nonsense guy who will not waste his time with a HS kid that has the "You need me more than I need you attitude." He has always been like that. He know Georgia very well. A lot of fans in Georgia have po'ed since the spread option left, and now they are getting their hero back. I don't think he will miss a beat.
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Post by swroberts on Dec 10, 2007 9:42:50 GMT -6
They won't let him. What a load of crap, I don't believe it. A coach who listens to the alumni is guaranteed one thing... in 3 years he will be sitting next to them in the stands and will be out of coaching. He didn't need the Tech job or money bad enough. He had 3 job offers and would have 3 more the next year. If he does indeed run spread option it's because that's what he feels they need to run to win period. Why do you think we fired Gailey? He was a winner. Johnson knows coming in he couldn't run the flexbone. He knows this school is fickle. Remember he left a lot of money on the table from SMU and Duke to come here. He does want to run the spread. But trust me his offensive style wasn't optional You seem to be dialed in to the GA Tech situation better than I am. However, how smart is Tech to bring in a coach who has had success at every level running a certain style of offense and then when you hire him he has to change. I don't think the flexbone supporters on this board expect him to clone exactly what he did at Navy. He will have a totally different athlete to work with, but he should not stray too far from his roots. He has expertise in a certain offensive philosophy and he should stay within this structure , that's what he knows best and that's what will give GA Tech the best opportunity to win games. You can not argue the fact that Navy moved the ball against teams with superior athletes. Were they best D1 teams in the land, no, but they had better athletes. Take GA Tech's offensive system the past 2 years and move it to Navy and let PJ take Tech the past two years. Same players, different systems. At the end of 2 years who would have more wins. It's speculation but most coaches I think would put their money on GA Tech under PJ.
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Post by miami5 on Dec 10, 2007 13:39:47 GMT -6
Might as well add my thoughts also. many of the comments on the board are great. Like last year, they should have beat B.C.. And NAVY threw the football, many people think that this offense does not through, but it does. Air force took Tenn for all of it also.. I don't think he'll run exactly like he did there , but you never know, At navy he gave teams like Maryland, Stanford and other games right to the wire. It's his work ethic that he'll bring also. and one thing that many people forget the biggest deference he will have at GT over NAVY, which will help him win game's .....this cost him more than running his offense...
DEFENSE.....
with ability to recruit defense, watch out..
Greg
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Post by airman on Dec 10, 2007 14:10:22 GMT -6
I think this is a good situation. Lets face it, the players who attend Georgia Tech are a lot like Navy. I mean it is a great school to get a degree from. much like northwestern is.
so he now is running the option at a underdog type of school. make sense. the type of kid he is going to recruit is going to be smart.
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Post by midsfan on Dec 10, 2007 19:49:08 GMT -6
I'll say this and I am done with it guys (I know you probably don't care)...DON'T BE SURPRISED IF THIS THING HITS THE GROUND RUNNING AND PJ DOESN'T MISS A BEAT!!!
Call me a band wagon jumper but, GO GEORGIA TECH!!! Still a NAVY fan though!!!
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Post by wildcat on Dec 11, 2007 6:26:03 GMT -6
From collegefootballtalk.com:
POSTED 7:35 p.m. EST, December 10, 2007
YELLOW JACKETS LOSE QB RECRUIT The good news for Georgia Tech in its hiring of a new football coach is that Paul Johnson showed an ability at Navy to win games while holding his players to the highest standards in both academics and personal conduct.
The bad news is that Johnson runs the triple-option, and it's really, really hard to recruit players who want to play in the NFL some day when you run an offense that no NFL team runs.
The first sign that Johnson will have trouble recruiting: Quarterback Sean Renfree of Notre Dame Prep School in Scottsdale, Ariz., backed out of his commitment to the Yellow Jackets over the weekend, shortly after leading his team to a state championship.
“Sean thinks Paul Johnson is a very good coach, who has a very good record,” Renfree’s father Kevin told Jeff Hood of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution. “But Sean’s style is not suited to that offense. If Sean stays healthy, he hopes to play beyond college. And being an option quarterback is not going to help him prepare for that next level.”
That will be a common refrain among Georgia Tech recruits: If Johnson is going to have a successful tenure at Georgia Tech, he'll need to do it with quarterbacks who don't have their sights set on the NFL.
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Post by tog on Dec 11, 2007 6:28:13 GMT -6
That will be a common refrain among Georgia Tech recruits: If Johnson is going to have a successful tenure at Georgia Tech, he'll need to do it with quarterbacks who don't have their sights set on the NFL. [/i][/quote] if those qb's realize they won't be playing qb anyhow in the nfl there will be plenty of true option qb's to choose from
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Post by burtledog on Dec 11, 2007 8:54:39 GMT -6
Ditto. The spread/shotgun types that everyone is crazy about (say Tim Tebow) would make great under center option QB's. Remember that many great QB's of the 70's and 80's ran SBV and Wing T in college. Greg
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Post by airman on Dec 11, 2007 13:46:54 GMT -6
you know what I find interesting is that every one assumes just cause they are john b good stud qb they are going to the nfl cause they are playing d 1a football. I really think this mentality is the bad part of the self esteem movement. little johnny has been a told he was a super star since pee wee ball by mom and daddy, who are really just hoping their johnny will get a scholarship so they do not have to pay for college.
this notion of entitlement is driving me nuts. kids are entitled to have their parents pay for college. then they come to the work force expecting to make 50 grand there first year.
fact is there are less then 100 qbs in the nfl to start with and 5 to 6 who are superior with the rest being average.
even though I am not a big triple option guy I would like to see paul johnson run the flex bone. he did it at hawaii and they won a bowl game vs illinois several seasons ago. option football is really about every one working together.
I personally think it is time for the nfl to have a developmental league for players who thing they are nfl talent. this would restore colleges to institutions of higher learning.
I figure big time pro sports and college sports will crash with in the next 5 to 10 years when the cost of gas is 5 bucks a gallon.
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Post by coachcb on Dec 11, 2007 14:34:49 GMT -6
From collegefootballtalk.com: POSTED 7:35 p.m. EST, December 10, 2007
YELLOW JACKETS LOSE QB RECRUITThe good news for Georgia Tech in its hiring of a new football coach is that Paul Johnson showed an ability at Navy to win games while holding his players to the highest standards in both academics and personal conduct.
The bad news is that Johnson runs the triple-option, and it's really, really hard to recruit players who want to play in the NFL some day when you run an offense that no NFL team runs.
The first sign that Johnson will have trouble recruiting: Quarterback Sean Renfree of Notre Dame Prep School in Scottsdale, Ariz., backed out of his commitment to the Yellow Jackets over the weekend, shortly after leading his team to a state championship.
“Sean thinks Paul Johnson is a very good coach, who has a very good record,” Renfree’s father Kevin told Jeff Hood of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution. “But Sean’s style is not suited to that offense. If Sean stays healthy, he hopes to play beyond college. And being an option quarterback is not going to help him prepare for that next level.”
That will be a common refrain among Georgia Tech recruits: If Johnson is going to have a successful tenure at Georgia Tech, he'll need to do it with quarterbacks who don't have their sights set on the NFL. LOL, somehow I doubt Johnson really even cares that this kid bailed. Not because the kids isn't a good fit within his option system, but because his BULLSH*T ATTITUDE isn't a good fit for his program. People have to remember; a good under-center option attack is about execution, execution and MORE EXECUTION. It's not as much about getting the "right guys" as it is about teaching those guys to read the option and execute. Paul Johnson is very good at taking guys and turning them into nasty option QB. At Georgia Southern, several of his QBs were high school QBs turned WRs turned QBs. One thing to think about too; what about the FBs that Paul Johnson is going to be able to get at GT? Where is a good HS FB going to go school? the program that includes him on a 1/3 of the offensive plays and turns him into a glorified OG, or the school that's going to let him carry the ball all game long?
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Post by coachbdud on Dec 11, 2007 14:43:59 GMT -6
Eric Crouch's of the world UNITE!!
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Post by airman on Dec 11, 2007 14:47:47 GMT -6
From collegefootballtalk.com: POSTED 7:35 p.m. EST, December 10, 2007
YELLOW JACKETS LOSE QB RECRUITThe good news for Georgia Tech in its hiring of a new football coach is that Paul Johnson showed an ability at Navy to win games while holding his players to the highest standards in both academics and personal conduct.
The bad news is that Johnson runs the triple-option, and it's really, really hard to recruit players who want to play in the NFL some day when you run an offense that no NFL team runs.
The first sign that Johnson will have trouble recruiting: Quarterback Sean Renfree of Notre Dame Prep School in Scottsdale, Ariz., backed out of his commitment to the Yellow Jackets over the weekend, shortly after leading his team to a state championship.
“Sean thinks Paul Johnson is a very good coach, who has a very good record,” Renfree’s father Kevin told Jeff Hood of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution. “But Sean’s style is not suited to that offense. If Sean stays healthy, he hopes to play beyond college. And being an option quarterback is not going to help him prepare for that next level.”
That will be a common refrain among Georgia Tech recruits: If Johnson is going to have a successful tenure at Georgia Tech, he'll need to do it with quarterbacks who don't have their sights set on the NFL. LOL, somehow I doubt Johnson really even cares that this kid bailed. Not because the kids isn't a good fit within his option system, but because his BULLSH*T ATTITUDE isn't a good fit for his program. People have to remember; a good under-center option attack is about execution, execution and MORE EXECUTION. It's not as much about getting the "right guys" as it is about teaching those guys to read the option and execute. Paul Johnson is very good at taking guys and turning them into nasty option QB. At Georgia Southern, several of his QBs were high school QBs turned WRs turned QBs. One thing to think about too; what about the FBs that Paul Johnson is going to be able to get at GT? Where is a good HS FB going to go school? the program that includes him on a 1/3 of the offensive plays and turns him into a glorified OG, or the school that's going to let him carry the ball all game long? so many of your good high school fullbacks end up at lber. one fullback I can think of is own schmidt at west virgina. now that kid would be a wishbone fullback at geo. tech. if any thing I think he will change the attitude at geo tech.
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Post by spreadattack on Dec 11, 2007 14:57:43 GMT -6
Paul Johnson doesn't need Sean Renfree, he needs Brad Smith, Anquan Boldin, Antwan Randle El, etc etc.
If Johnson wants to "sell" his offense, all he has to do is put his QB in the pistol about eight times a game (and run the exact same plays) and he will suddenly be an "innovator" and a "genius."
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Post by miami5 on Dec 11, 2007 15:53:59 GMT -6
I think in the end , all that will matter is winning.. thats all colleges care about ( the higher ups ) win games and you could run " single wing " and they wouldn't care.. Option football has made a resurgence in many differnet forms..
might not make the NFL but i have even seem them use some college material, rocket sweeps etc. What a way to keep fast LB's at home.
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Post by coachburgess on Dec 12, 2007 13:51:25 GMT -6
The doubters only need to look at what Navy could do against "superior" talent running a really contrarian offense REALLY well. Steve's right...he'll attract the best option talent in the land and do even better at Tech.
Does anybody know a really good site/guru for the flexbone?
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Post by tripleoption61 on Dec 13, 2007 9:08:38 GMT -6
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Post by gregspahn on Dec 14, 2007 13:11:29 GMT -6
"so many of your good high school fullbacks end up at lber. one fullback I can think of is own schmidt at west virgina. now that kid would be a wishbone fullback at geo. tech.
if any thing I think he will change the attitude at geo tech"
Owen Schmidt was a Wishbone FB during his freshman year at the University of Wisconsin-River Falls. Very successful.
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Post by burtledog on Dec 14, 2007 14:08:07 GMT -6
Yeah, but to run as a Flexbone/Spread Option FB, you could be a quick Owen Schmidt or an Adrian Peterson (GaSo now with da' Bears) who was only 5"10 205 or so. Quickness and toughness is more important than being guard size but can run. Until Eckel, PJ's FB's (or B Backs in he and Stowers terminology) have been 195-215. Quick bowling balls. Greg
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Post by gregspahn on Dec 14, 2007 14:15:40 GMT -6
I Couldnt agree more. It's a quick, explosive offense, one that usually will take speed over a mammoth anyday. Schmidt is big, but he is extremly quick, as was Peterson while at GA Southern. Both brought a great mix of both size and speed/quickness. Peterson had the run of the year when Ga. So was pushing for the National Chamionship early in this decade.
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Post by coachcb on Dec 14, 2007 15:36:25 GMT -6
Honestly, I don't think it really matters what Johnson gets; he'll work with the players and plug them into his system. Now that he can recruit for the offense again (as he did at Georgia S.), he'll be able to do some incredible things with that offense.
Winning some ACC football games with the flexbone is going to be an pleasant sight to see.
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trojan
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Post by trojan on Jan 18, 2008 8:35:09 GMT -6
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Post by burtledog on Jan 18, 2008 18:28:56 GMT -6
Hoooyaaaaah!!!!! Good to see it in writing! Greg
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Post by swroberts on Nov 27, 2008 20:10:51 GMT -6
Coachwhip . I waited all year to check back on this thread. What happened to all your alumni strong arming PJ?
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