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Post by option1 on Dec 15, 2021 11:08:40 GMT -6
Who is full of **** and who is putting out relevant, real world material that coaches can really use. What are some of the best resources you have seen, use, or used? Any good pods I may have missed?
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Post by coachcb on Dec 15, 2021 14:20:55 GMT -6
Honestly, talk to blb and silkyice on here. I don't know if they're "culture coaches" but they've done a great job at their stops. I'm sure I'm leaving out many other great HCs on here; I apologize in advance. |
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Post by blb on Dec 15, 2021 15:00:13 GMT -6
Honestly, talk to blb and silkyice on here. I don't know if they're "culture coaches" but they've done a great job at their stops. I'm sure I'm leaving out many other great HCs on here; I apologize in advance. Thanks coachcb , but I never thought of myself as a "culture coach." I'm not even sure what that means. Let me put it this way: I knew why I got into coaching. I knew what I thought HS sports, football specifically, should be about. I had a vision of how to operate a consistently successful program. FWIW I would recommend coachjm . He's somebody that has it all together. |
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Post by coachcb on Dec 15, 2021 15:10:52 GMT -6
groundchuck is another HC on here who's accomplished a lot.
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Post by tripsclosed on Dec 15, 2021 15:38:45 GMT -6
Check out Coach Joe Salas on YouTube, he has a ton of episodes focusing on culture. He has had a crap ton of HS coaches on there, lot of good stuff. Nothing earth-shattering, just pieces you can put together, just like at clinics. He has even had Mike Leach and Hal Mumme on there.
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Post by blb on Dec 15, 2021 15:41:31 GMT -6
Check out Coach Joe Salas on YouTube, he has a ton of episodes focusing on culture. He has had a crap ton of HS coaches on there, lot of good stuff. Nothing earth-shattering, just pieces you can put together, just like at clinics. He has even had Mike Leach and Hal Mumme on there. How many is "a ton" of episodes? How many HS coaches in a "crap ton"? Sorry, being a former English teacher vague expressions like that are a pet peeve. |
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Post by tripsclosed on Dec 15, 2021 15:46:10 GMT -6
Something that slightly irks me is that before culture became a buzzword the last 5-10 years, people talked all the time about a program's culture. Now that it has became a buzzword, tons of coaches, especially older and more "grizzled " coaches, say "I don't even know what word means in this context." It's like come on, it means what people talked about all the time before it became a buzzword, it might be hard to define, but it's like people talk about "i cant define it but i know it when i see it." People knew what you meant when you said it talking about a football, or basketball, or baseball team.
I guess the best definition i can come up with is "The collective mindset of the group", and that mindset is manifested in different ways, such as expectations for each other, holding (or not holding) each other accountable, fairness or a lack thereof in coach's decisions and treatment of players, positive or negative attitudes, optimism or a lack thereof, etc.
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Post by tripsclosed on Dec 15, 2021 15:48:25 GMT -6
Check out Coach Joe Salas on YouTube, he has a ton of episodes focusing on culture. He has had a crap ton of HS coaches on there, lot of good stuff. Nothing earth-shattering, just pieces you can put together, just like at clinics. He has even had Mike Leach and Hal Mumme on there. How many is "a ton" of episodes? How many HS coaches in a "crap ton"? Sorry, being a former English teacher vague expressions like that are a pet peeve. 59 episodes, with the overwhelming majority of those being HS coaches. |
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Post by blb on Dec 15, 2021 15:54:07 GMT -6
Something that slightly irks me is that before culture became a buzzword the last 5-10 years, people talked all the time about a program's culture. Now that it has became a buzzword, tons of coaches, especially older and more "grizzled " coaches, say "I don't even know what word means in this context." It's like come on, it means what people talked about all the time before it became a buzzword, it might be hard to define, but it's like people talk about "i cant define it but i know it when i see it." People knew what you meant when you said it talking about a football, or basketball, or baseball team. I guess the best definition i can come up with is "The collective mindset of the group", and that mindset is manifested in different ways, such as expectations for each other, holding (or not holding) each other accountable, fairness or a lack thereof in coach's decisions and treatment of players, positive or negative attitudes, optimism or a lack thereof, etc. Why not just call it "expectations" then instead of trying to join the Educational Jargon Elite (those who are making money off school systems via 'consulting'-telling them how to teach) with "buzzwords" like "culture"? Just an older, more "grizzled" ex-coach. |
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Post by coachcb on Dec 15, 2021 16:18:35 GMT -6
Something that slightly irks me is that before culture became a buzzword the last 5-10 years, people talked all the time about a program's culture. Now that it has became a buzzword, tons of coaches, especially older and more "grizzled " coaches, say "I don't even know what word means in this context." It's like come on, it means what people talked about all the time before it became a buzzword, it might be hard to define, but it's like people talk about "i cant define it but i know it when i see it." People knew what you meant when you said it talking about a football, or basketball, or baseball team. I guess the best definition i can come up with is "The collective mindset of the group", and that mindset is manifested in different ways, such as expectations for each other, holding (or not holding) each other accountable, fairness or a lack thereof in coach's decisions and treatment of players, positive or negative attitudes, optimism or a lack thereof, etc. Why not just call it "expectations" then instead of trying to join the Educational Jargon Elite (those who are making money off school systems via 'consulting'-telling them how to teach) with "buzzwords" like "culture"? Just an older, more "grizzled" coach.
I don't see any issue with defining the school's athletic environment as a "culture" and then making it more productive and positive. I do take issue with a lot of the "warm n' fuzzies" that are overtaking it. You can do all the team and "culture building" under the sun; it won't amount to chit if the kids aren't playing other sports, hitting the weights, and showing up to practice in the fall.
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Post by wildcatslbcoach24 on Dec 15, 2021 17:41:48 GMT -6
FWIW, I would say Mac Stephens at Cleveland Heights in NEO is legit. Has an amazing, diverse coaching staff in the área. Does a ton of culture stuff and backs it up with well coached teams. His DB coach is probably the best in the state and is amazing at the culture stuff as well as Coach Stevens
If you want an anti Insta Culture Guy who has had awesome culture at his previous stops ranging from Maple Heights, to Beachwood , Euclid, and Newbury I would say to talk to Gilmour Academy’s OC Ryan Williams. As an HC or coordinator the guy has had some of the best OL/ DL unit culture and technical coaching in the state of Ohio; Williams is the best OL coach in the state in my opinión, and if you know how bad Newbury was before he got there you would understand how great he is ay building nonchalant high achievement culture. The dude has taken on struggling programs and won at urban schools, rich/ fancy suburban public and Catholic schools, and in the sticks.
Heard Coach Moore at Massillon is good at it, too
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Post by tripsclosed on Dec 15, 2021 17:47:31 GMT -6
Something that slightly irks me is that before culture became a buzzword the last 5-10 years, people talked all the time about a program's culture. Now that it has became a buzzword, tons of coaches, especially older and more "grizzled " coaches, say "I don't even know what word means in this context." It's like come on, it means what people talked about all the time before it became a buzzword, it might be hard to define, but it's like people talk about "i cant define it but i know it when i see it." People knew what you meant when you said it talking about a football, or basketball, or baseball team. I guess the best definition i can come up with is "The collective mindset of the group", and that mindset is manifested in different ways, such as expectations for each other, holding (or not holding) each other accountable, fairness or a lack thereof in coach's decisions and treatment of players, positive or negative attitudes, optimism or a lack thereof, etc. Why not just call it "expectations" then instead of trying to join the Educational Jargon Elite (those who are making money off school systems via 'consulting'-telling them how to teach) with "buzzwords" like "culture"? Just an older, more "grizzled" ex-coach. I personally like the word culture better because i think expectations are part of culture, but i hear ya on the guru stuff. The culture gurus drive me insane. I have never been much of a rah rah guy, so when all that came along and took it to level billion, aggravating. Im a good bit younger than you, but i can be a grizzled fellow sometimes myself, haha. |
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Post by coachd5085 on Dec 15, 2021 20:41:20 GMT -6
Something that slightly irks me is that before culture became a buzzword the last 5-10 years, people talked all the time about a program's culture. Now that it has became a buzzword, tons of coaches, especially older and more "grizzled " coaches, say "I don't even know what word means in this context." It's like come on, it means what people talked about all the time before it became a buzzword, it might be hard to define, but it's like people talk about "i cant define it but i know it when i see it." People knew what you meant when you said it talking about a football, or basketball, or baseball team. I guess the best definition i can come up with is "The collective mindset of the group", and that mindset is manifested in different ways, such as expectations for each other, holding (or not holding) each other accountable, fairness or a lack thereof in coach's decisions and treatment of players, positive or negative attitudes, optimism or a lack thereof, etc. Why not just call it "expectations" then instead of trying to join the Educational Jargon Elite (those who are making money off school systems via 'consulting'-telling them how to teach) with "buzzwords" like "culture"? Just an older, more "grizzled" ex-coach. I will be honest here though coach, I do think culture is more than just expectations. |
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Post by okiepadokie on Dec 16, 2021 6:58:35 GMT -6
I always believed that culture is a collective mindset. Not necessarily mottos and slogans and signage. I have always worked to get our guys to believe in each other and to be around each other so much that we eliminate the cliques and factions that tear apart a team in practice and during the year. Eliminate the eye rolls when a kid tries to hype up his teammates or gives a passionate speech. Making kids own their program and each other's beliefs is the hardest part about being successful and when I hear "culture" I tend to be wary of the buzz words and the slogans. Culture is time spent together as teammates and brothers on a year round basis and it starts off CORNY as hell, but when the right kids buy in to what you want it takes off. Culture should be replaced with T-I-M-E. Time. How do you get kids to stop pissing and moaning when they have to go set up an event for the Lions Club with grumpy ass old dudes who boss them around like peons? Time. How do you get kids to practice hard for each other and not because they don't want to run or get yelled at? Time. How do you get kids to actually want to hang out after practice? Time. To willingly offer rides to guys they don't know and go get a burger after practice? Time. It is all about logging the real and meaningful hours for kids to see you give a poo besides Ws, stats, and football.
Culture is time, and the only resource that heightens it is the willingness of the HBC to bring those guys together and to get to know them collectively and individually over time. No book or clinic or PowerPoint can make kids think you actually care about them, want to be around them, and want them to succeed. They feel it over time, and when it clicks together you won't have the energy to write a book or give a presentation because you'll be too busy whipping team's asses. Just my thoughts.
In regards to the original post question, I like some of the things in 3D coach, it is a little Biblical (I am not a real Biblical coach) but it does have some nice strategies in it regarding accountability and getting guys to work together. I have used some of them with some success. It is worth reading. Having seniors write a letter to the team, spotlighting guys who work hard after practice with kids leading the discussion. They are great, BUT you better have put in some time with the kids before you start doing those things to get ahead of the eye rolling and "do we have to" standard HS kid responses. If you've established a great relational base, I would use a lot of the strategies in the book and have done so before.
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Post by cwaltsmith on Dec 16, 2021 8:25:15 GMT -6
I agree it has become a buzz word that is thrown around almost as much as RPO lol, but it is a real thing. And its VITAL to success at our level and helps at every level. I just moved (last summer) from a program with terrible culture and terrible success about 37% win over last 20 yrs same coach, and even worse in their league, to a school with a great culture goes to playoffs 95% of time and competes in every game. MAIN DIFFERENCE, ... CULTURE! Its a real thing and I dont think there is a cookie cutter mold to fit all, beg borrow and steal and make it your own and get kids to buy in and now days, need parents buy in as well.
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Post by groundchuck on Dec 16, 2021 8:29:44 GMT -6
groundchuck is another HC on here who's accomplished a lot. Thanks for those kinds words. I am always up for football/culture talk. Hit me up. Always looking to learn too. |
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Post by option1 on Dec 16, 2021 9:05:10 GMT -6
I agree it has become a buzz word that is thrown around almost as much as RPO lol, but it is a real thing. And its VITAL to success at our level and helps at every level. I just moved (last summer) from a program with terrible culture and terrible success about 37% win over last 20 yrs same coach, and even worse in their league, to a school with a great culture goes to playoffs 95% of time and competes in every game. MAIN DIFFERENCE, ... CULTURE! Its a real thing and I dont think there is a cookie cutter mold to fit all, beg borrow and steal and make it your own and get kids to buy in and now days, need parents buy in as well. Good post. I shuttered typing culture knowing where using that term might lead. People are over it, but it is very real. The genesis of the thread was to try and find alternatives to the "cookie cutter" stuff out there. While I'm not judging the guys that pod on "vision", "standards", e+r..., ETC. most never address what or how they do it. There are also far too many trying to sell what to think. And then there are those that can essentially "buy" their culture. I wish it were as easy as giving out cool gear to get kids to buy in, but we are poor. |
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Post by cwaltsmith on Dec 16, 2021 9:15:04 GMT -6
I used to think that all the stuff would be seen as corny by kids. I was an old school guy that thought we didnt need to tell everyone all the good stuff we did bc as long as we kept doing things right way it would come out. Now day I think you have to market your program online bc kids like that stuff. A good online hype game is the #1 in school recruiting tool you can use.
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Post by tog on Dec 16, 2021 9:23:45 GMT -6
great suggestions to talk with the coaches mentioned here on this board
I cringe whenever I hear the word now. Espn and the recruiting industry has glammed onto it. A lot of coaches out there trying to gin up publicity for themselves about how great their stuff is, and trying to sell books and crap about it. Great for them, make your buck, no problem. It's ruining the game though with the astroturfed plasticity of it all.
All it is, is what we as football coaches have been doing all along. Help the kids become better folks, do it as a family, and that helps give you a chance to compete beyond what athletic gifts your team may or may not have.
Do we really need row row row your boat pj fleck self advertisers and scented candles in every room to do that?
I would not let row your boat guy into my school.
I would much rather talk to the men mentioned here that have shown how to build young people individually, and as a program.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2021 9:25:42 GMT -6
I used to think that all the stuff would be seen as corny by kids. I was an old school guy that thought we didnt need to tell everyone all the good stuff we did bc as long as we kept doing things right way it would come out. Now day I think you have to market your program online bc kids like that stuff. A good online hype game is the #1 in school recruiting tool you can use. You have to make it a thing. That doesnt mean social media necessarily. But it has to be something people want to be a part of. Are kids getting “ripped”? That fat kid in 8th grade is no longer fat. That soph that couldnt hit himself in the face in 9th grade, is now smacking people as a 10th grader. The team is 8-2(but the schedule is cupcakes except for the usual pita powers). Practices are fun and quick. The word has to be spread by players one way or the other. The coaches are strict, but fair. |
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Post by cwaltsmith on Dec 16, 2021 9:34:19 GMT -6
I used to think that all the stuff would be seen as corny by kids. I was an old school guy that thought we didnt need to tell everyone all the good stuff we did bc as long as we kept doing things right way it would come out. Now day I think you have to market your program online bc kids like that stuff. A good online hype game is the #1 in school recruiting tool you can use. You have to make it a thing. That doesnt mean social media necessarily. But it has to be something people want to be a part of. Are kids getting “ripped”? That fat kid in 8th grade is no longer fat. That soph that couldnt hit himself in the face in 9th grade, is now smacking people as a 10th grader. The team is 8-2(but the schedule is cupcakes except for the usual pita powers). Practices are fun and quick. The word has to be spread by players one way or the other. The coaches are strict, but fair. GOOD STUFF!!! |
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Post by groundchuck on Dec 16, 2021 10:52:28 GMT -6
A few thoughts from experience...
It should be intentional and authentic.
You can over-do it.
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Post by GuyinOhio on Dec 16, 2021 11:03:04 GMT -6
I always felt culture is a real thing, but the ones who have "it" and are really good with it do not have to talk about it all the time (specifically not say it or mention it every five words on social media). Expectations as someone mentioned is a good way of saying it, and to me it is more of something that people in the program just "know" if that makes sense.
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Post by coachcb on Dec 16, 2021 11:41:36 GMT -6
A few thoughts from experience... It should be intentional and authentic. You can over-do it.
Yes.
For the first few weeks of a season, we had pizza and Monday Night football at the school for the kids. Initially, the kids just congregated in small groups, didn't interact outside of small cliquey groups. We had a little over 30 kids show up and 8-10 groups scattered around the commons area. We decided to assign them to groups with captains being the "leaders" to try and get them to gel a bit more. That didn't work; they'd show up, eat their pizza in silence, play on their phones and then bail.
So, we figured we'd just break it up into position groups and the kids would go to their coach's house. We had the same result there; the kids wanted nothing to do with it. Eventually, the kids just stopped showing up, even for the free food. At the end of the day, we got the opposite result; it pointed out just how polarized we were.
We had to take a lot of other steps in the weight room and on the field before we jumped into team building exercises.
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Post by tog on Dec 16, 2021 11:47:12 GMT -6
I always felt culture is a real thing, but the ones who have "it" and are really good with it do not have to talk about it all the time (specifically not say it or mention it every five words on social media). Expectations as someone mentioned is a good way of saying it, and to me it is more of something that people in the program just "know" if that makes sense. this it's kinda like all the teaching crap they try and jam down our throats about how to be good teachers you can learn some of it but if you really have to get "it" from a book or some district imposed training they paid 20k for are you really a teacher/coach that should be in this biz? Experience working with good folks and talking with good folks about different scenarios and things on how to handle are way more important than coming up with silly slogans and acronyms and yo yo hype videos |
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Post by olballcoach on Dec 16, 2021 13:21:25 GMT -6
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Post by kylem56 on Dec 16, 2021 17:05:26 GMT -6
Randy Jackson who wrote the Culture Defeats Strategy books is good
Kenny Simpson from Arkansas has materials out there..
local (Michigan) guys to me who are good and have *it* figured out and do a good job
coachjm at Whiteford High School
Jesse Hoskins at Milan High School
Wade Waldrup at Lawton High School
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Post by tog on Dec 16, 2021 18:35:17 GMT -6
Randy Jackson who wrote the Culture Defeats Strategy books is good Kenny Simpson from Arkansas has materials out there.. local (Michigan) guys to me who are good and have *it* figured out and do a good job coachjm at Whiteford High School Jesse Hoskins at Milan High School Wade Waldrup at Lawton High School no comment |
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Post by wildcatslbcoach24 on Dec 16, 2021 18:41:10 GMT -6
Treat it like a math problem Culture itself is an expression, to create a winning equation you need: culture + quality coaching + community support = winning, sustainable program. If you’re missing 1/3 of the other expressions you can be highly successful in one area but fail miserably in the Win/ Loss column.
Yo me culture is having high expectations where people know the non negotiable standards, but also know you understand nuance and that everyone is a little different and you have the cultural competence to meet their football needs as well as Maslow’s needs. You meet that and you know you $&@! Coaching wise you should win a lot of games, or at least have a long tenure maximizing the potential of a school community and its student athletes.
Coaches with a number of “culture” guys, if they know the game and treat players equitably then they succeed. If all they have is the surface culture stuff they end up looking fake as hell. Kids want the guy who will love them as a player and a human and when SHTF in a game can rally them and control himself or herself well enough to steer the ship right. That is what culture is to me.
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Post by 60zgo on Dec 17, 2021 8:35:35 GMT -6
One of the best culture resources out there is a book called "Make The Big Time Where You Are" by Frosty Westering. It's out of print but still available for about 50-60 bucks. There's a couple of youtube videos of Coach Westering giving a clinic on his ideas as well.
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