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Post by fantom on Oct 13, 2015 19:37:02 GMT -6
One mistake that young coaches make is not understanding logistical and administrative duties. My first job was coaching JV's. A few days before our first away game the HC asked if I'd turned in my trip sheets. I had no idea what he was talking about. He explained that I needed to turn in requests for buses and that he'd done the first one for me. Then he showed me how to do them. I was fresh out of being a player. I just got onto the bus. I didn't know how it got there.
If somebody said that a mistake the veteran coaches make is assuming that young coaches know about stuff like that I can't argue. If a young coach aspires to be a HC, even if it's just a MS or JV HC, though, he'd better learn about stuff like buses, budgets, and eligibility forms.
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Post by PSS on Oct 13, 2015 19:39:12 GMT -6
As a first year volunteer assistant I was fortunate enough to get on a perennial large school powerhouse in the city. I came in the first day and was blown away by EVERYTHING! I had gone to a large classification school in high school 3 hours away and thought we did things pretty good, but this was an eye opener. As the summer began I did what was asked and didn't open my mouth. I set-up the field attended all jv and varsity games, sat in on al meetings and didn't contribute too much. I went to the offensive side (we had a split staff and this what I was comfortable with) and was overwhelmed with the knowledge and detail of the offensive coaches. I had NOTHING to contribute all year. As the year progressed I got more comfortable and tried to do what I could to build and develop our young men. During a week 9 practice, I ripped into a kid for loafing and went off and nobody stopped me. I instantly thought this is it. As practice concluded and I was cleaning off the field after everyone went in. As I came out of the equipment shed the DC said, "what took you so long to raise your voice?" I didn't have an answer. He said, "we could have used that fire on the defensive side." He explained that he was the only one who got after kids and that the other coaches kinda just did their thing. I realized that I chose being comfortable rather then uncomfortable in developing myself because it was safe. I realize now how many opportunities missed or avoided because of being safe as a coach early on. Didn't realize it until 10 years later. Just like building relationships with your athletes, building relationships with coaches is also important. Especially as a young coach. It allows you to learn your role. Sounds like you did a great job and the DC was giving you a pat on the back and encouraging to step up. It's part of growing up as a coach. You learn by experience and you learn from the coaches around you.
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Post by wolfden12 on Oct 13, 2015 19:48:07 GMT -6
PSS, I think often times people feel their voice is sometimes more important then their actions. I try these days to lead by example in actions and words. For example, call the HC's wife Mrs. when I see her, Answer the HC ?'s in front of staff and players with yes sir and no sir, encourage please and thank you's for everything. Society has changed and we as educators and teachers must establish the right way to do things both to kids and adults.
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Post by PSS on Oct 13, 2015 20:00:13 GMT -6
PSS, I think often times people feel their voice is sometimes more important then their actions. I try these days to lead by example in actions and words. For example, call the HC's wife Mrs. when I see her, Answer the HC ?'s in front of staff and players with yes sir and no sir, encourage please and thank you's for everything. Society has changed and we as educators and teachers must establish the right way to do things both to kids and adults. Yes, I totally agree. I've been coaching and teaching for over 20 years and I still do this every day. We have to model the correct way to communicate and show respect. When our HC feeds us on the weekend our staff goes out of the way to thank him.
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Post by PSS on Oct 13, 2015 20:08:36 GMT -6
One mistake that young coaches make is not understanding logistical and administrative duties. My first job was coaching JV's. A few days before our first away game the HC asked if I'd turned in my trip sheets. I had no idea what he was talking about. He explained that I needed to turn in requests for buses and that he'd done the first one for me. Then he showed me how to do them. I was fresh out of being a player. I just got onto the bus. I didn't know how it got there. If somebody said that a mistake the veteran coaches make is assuming that young coaches know about stuff like that I can't argue. If a young coach aspires to be a HC, even if it's just a MS or JV HC, though, he'd better learn about stuff like buses, budgets, and eligibility forms. I'm not a head football coach but I am a head track coach. Yes, there is a lot of paperwork you have to keep up with. Luckily, I have an AD that takes care of the travel budget for all sports and we're lucky enough to have an athletic secretary.
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Post by coachcb on Oct 14, 2015 7:31:05 GMT -6
The Young Coach Cardinal Sin for me is not developing an eye for detail. Particularly when I have sat down with said young coach and explained what how something should be taught (coaching cue words, demonstration, what to look for/correct etc..) These are the guys that don't understand that coaching football is TEACHING football.
Developing an eye for detail is no small task and it takes time but I expect that coaches gradually learn how to teach the game and show me that they can do so. I have seen many young coaches that never learn this and it p-sses me off to no end.
Tale of two coaches:
One guy this year is straight out of college and played defensive line for a small NAIA school. He coaches our OL and DL and it took him three weeks to develop a keen eye for detail. The dude is 22 years old but he is an excellent OL/DL coach because he pays attention and asks questions. He's all about the kids getting better and playing good, fundamental football. I've learned quite a bit from him as well; he has some great OL drills that I wrote down and will use in the future.
Our QB/DB coach is the opposite. He's been coaching for two years but he doesn't understand the basics of either position. I've had many professional conversations with him over the season about cleaning things up and he just refuses to do so. And, these aren't philosophical discussions either. You don't holler at a CB in man-man coverage for "not containing" on a sweep play. Especially after it's been explained to you why he cannot cover the WR and play the run at the same time. The guy is not focused on teaching the kids the game or growing as a coach. It's about his ego.
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Post by larrymoe on Oct 14, 2015 7:50:15 GMT -6
I will add to some of the good ones already posted. 1. thinking "lets bring more blitzes" will fix a defense or cover poor technique or cover low talent. 2. thinking "lets throw more" will fix a lack of talent, or lack of fundamentals. I don't think those are young coach mistakes, I think those are just dumb people mistakes. Plenty of people standing on your fences think exactly those same things.
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Post by funkfriss on Oct 14, 2015 8:40:45 GMT -6
Like this thread. Wish I had seen something like this back in the day. My list
1. Coaching is teaching the details - Just like you wouldn't let a kid do an addition problem without carrying the one you can't let a kid take an incorrect step, not use his hands, or whatever other small detail isn't being done right. The minute you see it and don't correct it you now have allowed it.
2. Mouth shut, eyes open - You are not the head coach, so don't try to make head coach decisions. Offer suggestions when appropriate, but don't take offense when your idea is not taken. Support the HC's decisions no matter what, and if you can't then it is time to find another place to coach. Take mental/written notes about what is going well, not well and learn from both.
3. Coaching is a skill - Like all skills, your coaching can be learned and improved upon. Never be satisfied with your knowledge and ability to coach. If you can't learn something from a 50-minute clinic talk then you are probably not trying to get better.
4. Culture + Character > X's + O's - Learn the X's and O's of football, but don't neglect to learn how to build positive character in your athletes and a positive culture for your team/school/community. Again, most people don't naturally know how to do this, learn it.
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Post by fbs on Oct 14, 2015 8:53:09 GMT -6
dead nuts, 100 percent correct. well said. there is certainly some responsibility on the HC in that he can't treat his young guys like they either don't deserve his time, or that they already know everything they're supposed to know. I've seen that mistake in multiple circumstances, and that's on the head man. the majority of the time, however, at least in my experience, is that the young guy doesn't think he needs to be taught anything, and that it's an insult for someone to try to teach them about something. I've had younger guys get offended when I tried to teach them about Oline play, and this was in a scenario where I'm the OC and Oline Coach and this little pi$$ant is fresh out of college and a JH coach. Know your stinkin role and shut your little mouth. I can't imagine why someone would be hesitant to learn from you. yeah I'm sure you can't... if you can't understand why that would make me angry then this whole thread probably addresses you in one way or another.
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Post by theyoungballcoach on Oct 14, 2015 9:11:35 GMT -6
In general, show up late for meetings; find a way of getting out of work; going to the coaches office as soon as practice is over; habitually disappearing when work needs to be done; or asking questions that don't pertain to what is being discussed.Find something to do. Don't wait to be told to do it. Take the initiative to do it. There is something that always needs to be set up, washed, put away, cleaned, or handed out. Doing these things will go a long way in making a cohesive coaching staff. It might have been mentioned but Coach Every Rep. Correct, praise, there is always something that needs to be said. That right there is the single most annoying thing I think. Even worse, coaches who do it tend to do it habitually.
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Post by fantom on Oct 14, 2015 9:20:44 GMT -6
The Young Coach Cardinal Sin for me is not developing an eye for detail. Particularly when I have sat down with said young coach and explained what how something should be taught (coaching cue words, demonstration, what to look for/correct etc..) These are the guys that don't understand that coaching football is TEACHING football. Developing an eye for detail is no small task and it takes time but I expect that coaches gradually learn how to teach the game and show me that they can do so. I have seen many young coaches that never learn this and it p-sses me off to no end. Tale of two coaches: One guy this year is straight out of college and played defensive line for a small NAIA school. He coaches our OL and DL and it took him three weeks to develop a keen eye for detail. The dude is 22 years old but he is an excellent OL/DL coach because he pays attention and asks questions. He's all about the kids getting better and playing good, fundamental football. I've learned quite a bit from him as well; he has some great OL drills that I wrote down and will use in the future. Our QB/DB coach is the opposite. He's been coaching for two years but he doesn't understand the basics of either position. I've had many professional conversations with him over the season about cleaning things up and he just refuses to do so. And, these aren't philosophical discussions either. You don't holler at a CB in man-man coverage for "not containing" on a sweep play. Especially after it's been explained to you why he cannot cover the WR and play the run at the same time. The guy is not focused on teaching the kids the game or growing as a coach. It's about his ego. And this often leads to the problem that was discussed in the earlier thread about players getting bored during everyday drills. I think that a lot of times kids get bored because coaches get bored. The coach gets bored because, instead of focusing and looking for particular technical points during a drill, they're just :doing the drill". If the coach isn't focusing and making corrections the kids will just go through the motions instead of trying to get better.
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Post by coachcb on Oct 14, 2015 10:39:04 GMT -6
The Young Coach Cardinal Sin for me is not developing an eye for detail. Particularly when I have sat down with said young coach and explained what how something should be taught (coaching cue words, demonstration, what to look for/correct etc..) These are the guys that don't understand that coaching football is TEACHING football. Developing an eye for detail is no small task and it takes time but I expect that coaches gradually learn how to teach the game and show me that they can do so. I have seen many young coaches that never learn this and it p-sses me off to no end. Tale of two coaches: One guy this year is straight out of college and played defensive line for a small NAIA school. He coaches our OL and DL and it took him three weeks to develop a keen eye for detail. The dude is 22 years old but he is an excellent OL/DL coach because he pays attention and asks questions. He's all about the kids getting better and playing good, fundamental football. I've learned quite a bit from him as well; he has some great OL drills that I wrote down and will use in the future. Our QB/DB coach is the opposite. He's been coaching for two years but he doesn't understand the basics of either position. I've had many professional conversations with him over the season about cleaning things up and he just refuses to do so. And, these aren't philosophical discussions either. You don't holler at a CB in man-man coverage for "not containing" on a sweep play. Especially after it's been explained to you why he cannot cover the WR and play the run at the same time. The guy is not focused on teaching the kids the game or growing as a coach. It's about his ego. And this often leads to the problem that was discussed in the earlier thread about players getting bored during everyday drills. I think that a lot of times kids get bored because coaches get bored. The coach gets bored because, instead of focusing and looking for particular technical points during a drill, they're just :doing the drill". If the coach isn't focusing and making corrections the kids will just go through the motions instead of trying to get better. I agree. We don't do the same drills each day. We ask that all coaches vary the drills that they do from day to day to avoid this. Half of Indy time is basic drills, the other half is fixing problems we've been seeing. Our OL/DL guy sees the same issues I do and fixes them without even having to discuss it. The other young guy takes it as a personal slight when we discuss things problems we see on the field even when it is talked about in a professional manner. I start off these conversations by telling them what I need to fix with LBs and RBs as well. It doesn't matter, I told him last week that what we see on the field is what we have either coached or what we have let happen. As such, there is no longer QB or DB Indy periods; those guys work in with the RBs and LBs in drills so we can get better.
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Post by realdawg on Oct 14, 2015 10:42:49 GMT -6
We got one this year that I used to coach. Good kid, played in college. Doesnt work at our school, works with at risk kids in the school system. Shows up late for practice occassionally bc of it. But thinks he is too good for laundry duty. Says he worked all day and is tired he doesnt have to do it. I'm not the HC or this wouldnt be a problem. But I have told him look MFer, I'm the DC and I've been at work the same amount of time you have for the last 15 yrs. Burns me up, but until HC makes him help it wont matter. When I started 15 yrs ago, all the rookie coaches were told, you got laundry duty till we tell you otherwise. End of discussion. That dont happen anymore. Sorry for the rant.
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Post by coachcb on Oct 14, 2015 11:12:32 GMT -6
We got one this year that I used to coach. Good kid, played in college. Doesnt work at our school, works with at risk kids in the school system. Shows up late for practice occassionally bc of it. But thinks he is too good for laundry duty. Says he worked all day and is tired he doesnt have to do it. I'm not the HC or this wouldnt be a problem. But I have told him look MFer, I'm the DC and I've been at work the same amount of time you have for the last 15 yrs. Burns me up, but until HC makes him help it wont matter. When I started 15 yrs ago, all the rookie coaches were told, you got laundry duty till we tell you otherwise. End of discussion. That dont happen anymore. Sorry for the rant. We have the same problem with after practice supervision with the Young Lombardi I described. We rotate who stays and watches the kids because some parents show up a half-hour after we're done and the kids need watched. I talked to the guy about it once and then watched him take off in his truck when he it was his turn. His excuse, "I don't get paid to babysit". I called up he AD, he had one meeting with the guy and now he's doing double duty to make up for the days he screwed the rest of us over. I shouldn't be ranting either; we're almost through with the season and the kid won't be coaching for us next year.
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Post by fantom on Oct 14, 2015 11:22:55 GMT -6
Just a half-hour? Man, you guys are lucky.
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Post by coachcb on Oct 14, 2015 11:29:01 GMT -6
Just a half-hour? Man, you guys are lucky. Yeah, it isn't bad which is another reason why it irked me the way it did. I have many stories about poor coaches and I probably sound like a d-ck on dcohio's level but we really have a shortage of decent coaches around here. We are a sparsely populated state and often get stuck with who ever comes off the street.
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CoachF
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Post by CoachF on Oct 14, 2015 11:42:37 GMT -6
I've only been coaching 4 years so I think this thread is very interesting/all coaches benefit from hearing about things like this and we have all been there, no one started and was perfect right off the bat.
1) biggest mistake I made my first couple years when working with freshman was getting angry at myself in the situation when it didn't go well. I was pissed because we only had 2 coaches for 50 kids and we stunk. I took ever loss personal and sometimes didn't think the kids cared. -truth: the kids probably didn't care about football as much as I thought or as much as me. Thing is you just have to be patient and enthusiastic and keep coaching them up.
2) gotta be willing to do the crappy assignments in the beginning. I never really had a problem with this because I believe I'm a hard working and I knew my place. However I've seen other young coaches like stated that didn't want to hurt their pride. -truth: gotta know your place and if your really on board for the program you'll do whatever it takes to help the program and kids be successful, not about you.
3) something I've just gotten better at each year is the eye discipline. When you see something and you know the fundamentals and technique you have to jump on it and coach it up. You're there to coach so you should be coaching the entire time, everything can be progressively improved and whatever happens is what you're allowing to happen.
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Post by fantom on Oct 14, 2015 11:54:24 GMT -6
3) something I've just gotten better at each year is the eye discipline. When you see something and you know the fundamentals and technique you have to jump on it and coach it up. You're there to coach so you should be coaching the entire time, everything can be progressively improved and whatever happens is what you're allowing to happen. This is something that takes a while to learn. As an OL coach I can't watch every player on every play. That's why we have a script. When I see that a particular play is coming I know where the key block or most difficult block or the weakest player is and that's where I focus. Anything else that I see is a plus. The same is true individual drills. There's one particular guy and one particular skill that I'm looking for.
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Post by silkyice on Oct 14, 2015 12:06:31 GMT -6
I always draw everything from an offensive perspective. I played OL and have a hard time drawing the D on the bottom. If you'e talking to the defense you should learn to draw it from the defensive perspective. It makes it easier to understand because, from the players perspective, the players are in the right spots: players on the defense's right are drawn on the right, left players are drawn on the left. it is from the defense's perspective when they are on top. Just imagine you are looking from under the ground up at them. Everyone is in the correct spot. ![;)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/wink.png)
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Post by coachirish on Oct 14, 2015 15:32:04 GMT -6
Had a young coach just today decide to change an offensive scout players assignment on a play. Like most of you the scout offenses plays are drawn up on playcards. I'm usually pretty mild mannered with my coaches but I lost it on that one.
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kcarls
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Post by kcarls on Oct 14, 2015 15:42:19 GMT -6
My dad was a coach, so I grew up in it. When I first started (not that I'm an old timer by any means now) I tried to follow these couple rules. I tried to remind myself of these.
1) Keep your mouth shut and dont offer advice unless someone asks. NOTHING worse than a new guy, know it all. And believe it or not people will ask eventually. NOBODY asks the dude who always has an opinion.
2) Be at EVERYTHING. Every meeting (even if you arent on varsity staff, ask the HC if you can listen in to learn) every practice, every workout, etc. You have to EARN the respect of your fellow coaches as well as the kids who don't know you.
3) Do anything asked. If you are asked to do film practice, paint lockers, wash laundry, etc. DO IT. and DO IT RIGHT.
4) If you think you should be on the varsity staff instead of Frosh DC. Do the job you were hired for. I didnt realize until now how important it is to not have slappys at the lower level. Maybe you can be counted on so you were placed down there. Where some other guy is on the varsity staff (but a dingleberry) where the OC/DC/HC can watch him while he coaches a position.
Just thoughts....
I'm glad our current staff gets along really well.
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Post by dytmook on Oct 14, 2015 15:53:57 GMT -6
Try to install plays without any clue on the blocking assignments.
Former JV head coach tried to install power wrong and he loved lead draw because you don't have to block anyone and there are no real blocking rules...
I was a young coach too, but we have to step in and fix power and try to fix the lead draw debacle.
Same guy was booted from at least 2 games that year. He was not the head guy the next year.
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Post by Defcord on Oct 14, 2015 19:04:03 GMT -6
Try to install plays without any clue on the blocking assignments. Former JV head coach tried to install power wrong and he loved lead draw because you don't have to block anyone and there are no real blocking rules... I was a young coach too, but we have to step in and fix power and try to fix the lead draw debacle. Same guy was booted from at least 2 games that year. He was not the head guy the next year. We had a guy on staff one year that every time he suggested a play we would ask him to draw it up he would do it without a defense. Finally after about three weeks our oc said "do think that bullshat would work if you ran it against a defense?" I was just a position coach so it was all very entertaining to me.
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Post by windigo on Oct 16, 2015 12:30:06 GMT -6
Not understanding that coaching is not about Xs and Os. When I was young I was like 'I know this game inside and out, why are we losing'. Now I know why. All coaching is life coaching the sport is just an excuse to get to the good stuff.
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Post by windigo on Oct 16, 2015 12:36:44 GMT -6
Had a young coach just today decide to change an offensive scout players assignment on a play. Like most of you the scout offenses plays are drawn up on playcards. I'm usually pretty mild mannered with my coaches but I lost it on that one. Oh damn I hate that. Had the same problem last year. We were playing a good team with a solid line (eventual state champions) they ran a 4-2 and never blitzed. More than anything we had to practice our doubles to second level. We spend all edd working on double to second level. Inside run line does great, secures the double teams and gets to second level. Scout team coordinator gets pissed and starts calling all out blitzes.
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Post by fantom on Oct 16, 2015 13:09:54 GMT -6
Had a young coach just today decide to change an offensive scout players assignment on a play. Like most of you the scout offenses plays are drawn up on playcards. I'm usually pretty mild mannered with my coaches but I lost it on that one. Oh damn I hate that. Had the same problem last year. We were playing a good team with a solid line (eventual state champions) they ran a 4-2 and never blitzed. More than anything we had to practice our doubles to second level. We spend all edd working on double to second level. Inside run line does great, secures the double teams and gets to second level. Scout team coordinator gets pissed and starts calling all out blitzes. If you didn't give him a script and just let him call the defense on his own it was your own fault.
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Post by windigo on Oct 16, 2015 14:37:59 GMT -6
If you didn't give him a script and just let him call the defense on his own it was your own fault. He had a script.
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Post by rsmith627 on Oct 16, 2015 15:04:30 GMT -6
If you didn't give him a script and just let him call the defense on his own it was your own fault. He had a script. Our DC and I get into it every week over this. I script all the way down to coverage and he gets into the wrong thing. Drives me nuts. "Coach, you don't know what coverage they'll be in" Not always, but I know tendencies and I won't call certain things against certain looks.
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Post by fantom on Oct 16, 2015 17:14:31 GMT -6
If you didn't give him a script and just let him call the defense on his own it was your own fault. He had a script. OK, it's definitely time to go off then.
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Post by silkyice on Oct 16, 2015 21:10:22 GMT -6
Our DC and I get into it every week over this. I script all the way down to coverage and he gets into the wrong thing. Drives me nuts. "Coach, you don't know what coverage they'll be in" Not always, but I know tendencies and I won't call certain things against certain looks. This has driven me driven me crazy as well. I am not trying to beat the scout team or even the first defense. I am trying to win the freaking game.
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