coacher
Sophomore Member
Posts: 191
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Post by coacher on Sept 14, 2007 12:06:03 GMT -6
Anybody running the pistol for the first time this year? How are you liking it? Do you feel you have acquired any distinct advantages from this formation that you didn't have when you weren't running the pistol.
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Post by coachjd on Sept 14, 2007 13:07:11 GMT -6
yes, we love it. We like the capabilities of having the down hill run game and still be able to read the backside end. What we have found is our younger teams who have very athletic QB's are thriving with the read play and some Q stretch, power and counter.
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Post by coach79 on Sept 14, 2007 14:45:33 GMT -6
I LOVE the pistol! At first i wanted soemthign different yet the same... make sense? Our PA game is working wonders because the running game is so effective.
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Post by eickst on Sept 14, 2007 17:16:21 GMT -6
Any links on a typical pistol offense? I'm familiar with the formation but have never really seen this offense live.
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Post by tog on Sept 14, 2007 20:33:45 GMT -6
2n year in it
zone read, veer, jets, powers, dart and standard sprintout/short/vertical passing game
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Post by poweriguy on Sept 14, 2007 20:37:39 GMT -6
savefile.com/files/823485Check out that power point by Coach Vint. He has other presentations that are very informative. Check out the playbook section here on the forums for his stuff.
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Post by fbdoc on Sept 15, 2007 11:20:42 GMT -6
So far it has worked well for us. Still finding out what our kids can do with it. Base plays for us are -
Fly sweep (in front of QB) / Dive
Toss
Triple and Sprint Option
Trap (FB & QB)
Quick Pass
Screens
Still Working on Sprint Out.
The biggest thing WE have gotten out of the pistol is escaping from formation tendancies we used to have out of shot gun. We have a big game this week so ask me on Saturday.
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Post by CVBears on Sept 15, 2007 12:36:47 GMT -6
Still Working on Sprint Out how are you protecting it? we are having some success with it and some failures and I'm looking for more info. |
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Post by fbdoc on Sept 15, 2007 13:50:12 GMT -6
We use our FB or our sweeper (fly motion) to try and chip the contain man depending on the route. Basically we reach on the play side and hinge backside. We have not run it in a game yet - we will look at a few combos this week - check with Tog as he has a very good scheme with his kids (wish I had him coaching our o-line).
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Post by tog on Sept 15, 2007 14:28:14 GMT -6
igook, what issue are you having with it
thanks doc
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Post by CVBears on Sept 15, 2007 16:21:54 GMT -6
Our issues are blocking it consistantly every down. We have a very athletic QB. Some times everything looks blocked well and others our QB gets out quick and simply gets the job done. Still other times the line is leaky. Our OC has us full slide away from the sprint with RB in charge of the edge playside.
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Post by tog on Sept 15, 2007 19:16:01 GMT -6
sliding away on sprintout is an issue if they bring 2 off the edge or anyone on the ol gets beat at all
treat it more like a stretch zone play with a lead back
try to reach them all, and make a wall backside
if there is nothing coming pressure wise frontside, then the ol and the back can look to help the next backside ol, and then look for a kill shot backside
if they have it covered=run it
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Post by CVBears on Sept 16, 2007 23:21:19 GMT -6
sliding away on sprintout is an issue if they bring 2 off the edge or anyone on the ol gets beat at all treat it more like a stretch zone play with a lead back try to reach them all, and make a wall backside if there is nothing coming pressure wise frontside, then the ol and the back can look to help the next backside ol, and then look for a kill shot backside if they have it covered=run it I appreciate that tog. Thank you |
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Post by coachstick on Sept 17, 2007 11:27:06 GMT -6
how do you guys read option the dart and zone out of pistol?
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Post by fbdoc on Sept 17, 2007 11:46:32 GMT -6
Same way we would out of gun. It's a beat faster, but we rep the heck out of it. Our QB actually likes it a lot better ("It feels better") than when we ran from gun last year.
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Post by CVBears on Sept 17, 2007 13:02:40 GMT -6
I saw coach ault talk about this last spring. He has his QB with his back to the playside/zone/dart side. The playside foot goes slightly back and to the playside at a 45. This is a small six inch step. The second step with the backside foot takes the both feet even with each other, paralellel to the LOS and pointed at the sideline. If a give, the QB gives the ball to the RB with the RB on the opposite side of the QB as the play (If dart is going right, RB gets the ball to the left of QB).
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Post by tog on Sept 17, 2007 19:27:20 GMT -6
the read stuff for the qb's is so much simpler step wise
just open up and ride it
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Post by 7384729737 on Sept 17, 2007 19:35:48 GMT -6
I am a little confused here. Are you guys talking about reading the back side end or play side on this?
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Post by tog on Sept 17, 2007 20:04:27 GMT -6
both
we read playside on veer
and backside on zone/dart
the steps for the qb are the same
the read is the same
the pull paths are a bit different, but the midline action by the qb makes for an easy mesh
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Post by 7384729737 on Sept 17, 2007 20:30:47 GMT -6
OK got you, so the HB's angle is changing. Basically the HB is cutting back after he receives the hand off on zone, right?
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Post by 1ispread on Sept 17, 2007 21:00:24 GMT -6
I dont run the pistol but I have a friend who put it in without knowing much or researching anything about it & whats interesting he installed it based on the book "coaching football" by John McKay, its literally John McKay's USC Power I. He removed the fullback put the quarterback in the fullbacks alignment 4 yds deep Tailback at 7 yds behind the QB, uses the fullback as a halfback, 2nd tightend or a slot receiver. Sucessful "old" offense made "new" pretty cool
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getbackcoach
Freshmen Member
"If it is important, you will find a way. If not you will find an excuse."
Posts: 92
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Post by getbackcoach on Sept 28, 2007 11:54:20 GMT -6
I'm also confused on how you can run the pistol and still read the backside end on a zone play. The only way I can figure is to have the qb turn his back to the LOS.
I really want to run pistol and we have messed around with it in practice. I love the same side read, but I don't want to sacrifice the backside read just to run veer. Running both would be ideal.
Example - Pistol Formation, Zone right. How can the QB read the backside DE?
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Post by coachjd on Sept 28, 2007 14:23:09 GMT -6
He opens up away from the play and the back takes a small jab step away from the playside and then heads down hill. Our aiming point is tighter than our regular zone play from the pistol, but has been a great play for us.
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Post by silkyice on Sept 29, 2007 21:58:41 GMT -6
I'm also confused on how you can run the pistol and still read the backside end on a zone play. The only way I can figure is to have the qb turn his back to the LOS. I really want to run pistol and we have messed around with it in practice. I love the same side read, but I don't want to sacrifice the backside read just to run veer. Running both would be ideal. Example - Pistol Formation, Zone right. How can the QB read the backside DE? I do not run the pistol, but it seems that the QB could open up with a drop step and his back to the right sideline and his face to the left sideline. This would allow him to read the backside DE (in this case, the DE on the offense's left). It would be similar to running the midline from underneath the center. It would be the same steps for the QB if he was running midline left. He would drop step back to the right to allow the FB to go up the middle while he could read the 3 tech defensive tackle. His face would be to the left sideline and his back would be to the right sideline. My guess is that out of pistol, this technique would be the same for zone right and veer left. This is what make it so good. That plus the fact that the RB is downhill instead of east-west like most gun zone read. Again, I don't run this, but think it would work. |
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Post by Coach Huey on Sept 29, 2007 22:02:14 GMT -6
silk ... that is how i have seen it done
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Post by tog on Sept 29, 2007 22:05:00 GMT -6
that is how we do it
gives us two actions for the price of one
and majorly messes with lb fits
we like it a lot
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crl
Junior Member
Pick me , pick me... I want to be on the RNC location scout team.
Posts: 476
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Post by crl on Oct 1, 2007 5:19:20 GMT -6
Howdy. sorry for late response on this.
Backside Read by QB- I started running Pistol back in late 2005-had some contact with Aults people and watched some film. I took it out to install running only 4 base plays. Firstly I was not really concerned with the backside read, but I quickly saw that it could be a weapon. But I could not get a read by the qb....ala gun, so I adjusted the Back. I do not run a true Pistol anymore, what I have done is set the RB with his inside foot align to the qb´s outside foot, either right or left, it gives me a blind angle for the first two steps for the RB to weakside, thus making the Whip stay in 30 teq- or displace to 70 or Eagle up.(IN A 43 Base)- as for the QB he then has a Direct look at playside in the mesh- his steps are he drops inside leg 6 inches- squares up to LOS and hands of- here he can pivot and carry outside weak having the RB block or pass protect on a playside slide- or hinge. I have added the inside shuffle pass, have the Slot drop back for the option and run a Veer with RB- I have also set it up in which I call Nasty, looks like a weak or strong- with 2nd rb playing 3yards of LOS of the Guard.- Speeds and passes from the speed look work most efficient.
You can move the rb weak or strong behind the qb- depends on how the line up!
Get the benfit of downhill and the backside read. I have even put two rbs in the pistol- and run powers and traps and even draws with qb on two back flares.
Hope this helps
CRL
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Post by ccscoach on Oct 1, 2007 5:21:55 GMT -6
We run the pistol. Biggest plays this year have been zone read, stretch and rocket. Rocket is great from the pistol same as from under and the stretch to compliment the rocket both too and away are great plays.
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getbackcoach
Freshmen Member
"If it is important, you will find a way. If not you will find an excuse."
Posts: 92
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Post by getbackcoach on Oct 1, 2007 10:39:30 GMT -6
Doh, I don't know why having the QB take a drop step didnt come to me sooner. Makes perfect sense, thanks.
How about Pistol in the redzone? One of the main reasons I want to run it is to get us running more North and South down there. Has anyone found that it can effective there?
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Post by realdawg on Oct 1, 2007 11:25:26 GMT -6
We are experimenting with the pistol some, we are stuggling with the zone-RB just isnt seeing the cut back, but FB trap is looking good out of it.
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