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Post by coachlc74 on Feb 12, 2016 8:02:14 GMT -6
kid not very good at all, cant help us win. but feels entitled to playing time. constantly trying to get others to take his side and throw off on starters, coaches, and all aspects of what great team chemistry is. in my area, we cant just dismiss a player. we have tried every possible scenario as coaches to handle it but just no solution. so suggestions???
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Post by silkyice on Feb 12, 2016 8:09:41 GMT -6
kid not very good at all, cant help us win. but feels entitled to playing time. constantly trying to get others to take his side and throw off on starters, coaches, and all aspects of what great team chemistry is. in my area, we cant just dismiss a player. we have tried every possible scenario as coaches to handle it but just no solution. so suggestions??? Can't dismiss a player? Not sure I understand. |
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Post by coachlc74 on Feb 12, 2016 8:12:18 GMT -6
we can not kick a player off the team without some kind of serious infraction. admin does not think a drama filled player that constantly keeps everyone on egg shells is a sufficient reason to cure the cancer! this kid and his parents have tried to do everything they know how to cause our whole staff problems.
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Post by John Knight on Feb 12, 2016 8:18:51 GMT -6
I would go to the Principal and AD and tell them flat out, this kid has to go. If not, time to gather your stuff and move on. I would not let one PITA run me off, but I would not let the admin tell me I couldn't kick a kid off for insubordination either.
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Post by blb on Feb 12, 2016 8:19:21 GMT -6
we can not kick a player off the team without some kind of serious infraction. admin does not think a drama filled player that constantly keeps everyone on egg shells is a sufficient reason to cure the cancer! this kid and his parents have tried to do everything they know how to cause our whole staff problems.
If he does not give you reason(s) to kick him off team that administration will support, your only recourse probably is to bury him on Scout Teams and bench.
He may cut himself or decide to endure anyway, and as he matures, may see the light. Takes some of them longer than others.
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Post by coachgtiller on Feb 12, 2016 8:19:39 GMT -6
we can not kick a player off the team without some kind of serious infraction. admin does not think a drama filled player that constantly keeps everyone on egg shells is a sufficient reason to cure the cancer! this kid and his parents have tried to do everything they know how to cause our whole staff problems. Sounds like you have bigger issues than just that player. |
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Post by coachlc74 on Feb 12, 2016 8:28:38 GMT -6
PITA??? in the age of everyone should play, or get a trophy, of course the parents are blind to his lack of talent to help varsity win! new admin has lent their ears to parents too often on complaints about playing time or who plays. this player will be a senior this coming season, and some of the things that I find out goes on with him are right down, cruel and hateful. but we will see, hopefully majority wins and his antics wont effect our team.
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Post by blockdownkickout on Feb 12, 2016 8:37:46 GMT -6
I had almost the exact same issue this past season. The kid was just always involved in some kind of drama. It was always someone on the team and him. I told my principal (thankfully very supportive) what I was going to do. I called the kid into my office and said there have been too many issues with him. He had had conflicts with 5 other players. I told him the next time I had to deal with a dramatic moment that involved him he would be dismissed. About 3 weeks later there was an issue in the locker room that almost turned into a fight and he posted some things on social media about a teammate. I immediately dismissed him. The parent came in a complained but my admin supported me. Long story but just trying to say you need to have the "if this happens one more time" talk. Then if it happens again and the admin won't support you dismissing him, it might be time to find another place to work.
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Post by coachlc74 on Feb 12, 2016 8:48:41 GMT -6
thanks. I really do need to have another conversation with admin, if nothing else to keep them in the loop and let them know even tho its off season, its still going on!
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Post by blb on Feb 12, 2016 9:12:49 GMT -6
thanks. I really do need to have another conversation with admin, if nothing else to keep them in the loop and let them know even tho its off season, its still going on!
I wouldn't.
Administrators are likely to think you're obsessing over this kid and be a little perturbed that it's not even your season. Will cast negative light on YOU.
Besides, they don't want to hear it anyway. As head coach, YOU'RE the designated problem solver.
Until it reaches critical mass - kid violates training rules, has excessive tardies or absences, is openly insubordinate, or some such - handle it yourself.
Or you can pay off his teachers to make him ineligible (I kid).
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Post by s73 on Feb 12, 2016 9:28:21 GMT -6
we can not kick a player off the team without some kind of serious infraction. admin does not think a drama filled player that constantly keeps everyone on egg shells is a sufficient reason to cure the cancer! this kid and his parents have tried to do everything they know how to cause our whole staff problems. When we are in the off season and a kid is pi$$ing me off for whatever reason and I'm tired of having him around but he hasn't really done "enough" to get kicked off, but I see him as a distraction, then I HEAVILY suggest that I think it best he "find something else to do next fall". This actually can be effective when a kid sees you would rather lose him then keep him. Many times they either quit or change. Not always though. But at least it's out in the open so no-one is shocked when you dismiss him later in the season. JMO. PS - I never ask admin if I can dismiss a player. I figure if it's that important to them they can come and see me about it. It's the old "better to ask for forgiveness than permission angle". |
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Post by John Knight on Feb 12, 2016 9:29:55 GMT -6
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Post by blockdownkickout on Feb 12, 2016 9:51:28 GMT -6
thanks. I really do need to have another conversation with admin, if nothing else to keep them in the loop and let them know even tho its off season, its still going on!
I wouldn't.
Administrators are likely to think you're obsessing over this kid and be a little perturbed that it's not even your season. Will cast negative light on YOU.
Besides, they don't want to hear it anyway. As head coach, YOU'RE the designated problem solver.
Until it reaches critical mass - kid violates training rules, has excessive tardies or absences, is openly insubordinate, or some such - handle it yourself.
Or you can pay off his teachers to make him ineligible (I kid).
Just an opinion and maybe this is just the relationship I have with my admin but I always let them know when I dismiss a kid from the team. I don't want them to get the angry parent phone call and be blind sided by the problem. The conversation usually lasts 30 seconds and it goes something like "Just a heads up but I kick Joey off yesterday for ____, in case you get a phone call" or "Joey is doing ______ and the next time I'm booting him." I feel like it's easier to be supported when things are out in the open. |
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Post by coachlc74 on Feb 12, 2016 9:59:38 GMT -6
absolutely, I give my admin heads up....they hate being surprised and caught off guard. which leads to a second meeting with the coach being called in to explain himself. I know there should be no explanation needed as we are ultimate decision makers, but there is always an accountability issue here with justifying everything to parents from admin!
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Post by bigmoot on Feb 12, 2016 10:16:33 GMT -6
and document everything...
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Post by coachirish on Feb 12, 2016 10:20:34 GMT -6
How is his attendance? Had a kid once much like you described, he had bad attendance though. I made him sign a contract stating that if he missed again he would be gone. He ended up missing again and that was end of problem.
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Post by silkyice on Feb 12, 2016 10:29:11 GMT -6
PITA??? in the age of everyone should play, or get a trophy, of course the parents are blind to his lack of talent to help varsity win! new admin has lent their ears to parents too often on complaints about playing time or who plays. this player will be a senior this coming season, and some of the things that I find out goes on with him are right down, cruel and hateful. but we will see, hopefully majority wins and his antics wont effect our team. Go for bullying or hazing or intolerance? Current buzz words |
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Post by silkyice on Feb 12, 2016 10:31:54 GMT -6
thanks. I really do need to have another conversation with admin, if nothing else to keep them in the loop and let them know even tho its off season, its still going on!
I wouldn't.
Administrators are likely to think you're obsessing over this kid and be a little perturbed that it's not even your season. Will cast negative light on YOU.
Besides, they don't want to hear it anyway. As head coach, YOU'RE the designated problem solver.
Until it reaches critical mass - kid violates training rules, has excessive tardies or absences, is openly insubordinate, or some such - handle it yourself.
Or you can pay off his teachers to make him ineligible (I kid).
Disagree. Keep admin informed. |
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Post by John Knight on Feb 12, 2016 10:41:31 GMT -6
Maybe you should have the Captains, "have a little talk with him." Is this 1978?
Sorry. Flashback moment.
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Post by hsrose on Feb 12, 2016 10:56:41 GMT -6
Johnny, I really do appreciate that you want to participate in the football program here at Wonderful High School. But the reality is that playing football here at WHS, like band or other sports, is an extra-curricular activity and is a privilege, not a right. I am under no obligation to give you a jersey. Your behavior recently is not in keeping with the core values of this program. I feel that I have no other choice but to have you and your parents sign this contract that specifies our core values and my expectations for your behavior. If there is another incident that does not reflect our core values and expectations I will remove your privilege to participate in this football program.
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Post by John Knight on Feb 12, 2016 11:02:30 GMT -6
Don't you have a parent meeting when they first enter your program? Shouldn't a copy of that already be on file? Just remind them of that and then remind them of the possible consequences.
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Post by CoachMikeJudy on Feb 12, 2016 11:25:23 GMT -6
kid not very good at all, cant help us win. but feels entitled to playing time. constantly trying to get others to take his side and throw off on starters, coaches, and all aspects of what great team chemistry is. in my area, we cant just dismiss a player. we have tried every possible scenario as coaches to handle it but just no solution. so suggestions??? Indefinite suspension- He's not kicked off the team, but he isn't going to play either...until you feel he's ready. If he doesn't like it he can walk. He doesn't travel to games, he doesn't dress out until he shapes up his attitude. |
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Post by coachgutz on Feb 12, 2016 12:24:13 GMT -6
How is his attendance? Had a kid once much like you described, he had bad attendance though. I made him sign a contract stating that if he missed again he would be gone. He ended up missing again and that was end of problem. Every member of our team and their parents are required to sign a contract at the beginning of each season. This states the expectations for behavior on and off the field. By signing the contract we can always point to it and explain all the violations they have and the resulting consequence. If we have a parent or player who still doesn't understand what they signed we will start a behavior contract and list everything that has happened. The player must sign when they are put on another step and each consequence is read to them. The final step is termination form the team. I would also suggest keeping admin in the loop. They don't like surprises. |
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Post by coachlc74 on Feb 12, 2016 12:39:11 GMT -6
some great info guys. appreciate it. some things we have done and implemented already, no change in attitude/behavior. Also had meeting with admin and informed them the divisiveness is still going within our off season workouts. so, I have approached our captains and they are just as annoyed as anyone else. they seem to think they can take care of.....lets hope...lol
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Post by coachcb on Feb 12, 2016 13:29:25 GMT -6
Well, I never coached in a school where you could kick a kid off of the team unless he violated school policies (drinking, drugs, abusive to staff, etc..) or if he didn't abide by program rules regarding attendance (they are booted after two unexcused absences). If those aren't the cases, then you'll likely not have administrative support. So, as blb has pointed out, you just bury him in the depth chart. Basically, he can play scout team, condition and then watch the team from the sideline during games. You have complete control over this and he'll just weed himself out. |
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Post by coachd5085 on Feb 12, 2016 13:36:30 GMT -6
Oh, if only there was some way to involve some of the other parents who Johnny's parents think he should be starting over...
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Post by IronmanFootball on Feb 12, 2016 13:40:48 GMT -6
We use a parent/player contract that says they have a 48 hour no contact rule after games, playing time isn't guaranteed, etc.
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Post by 33coach on Feb 12, 2016 14:00:20 GMT -6
some great info guys. appreciate it. some things we have done and implemented already, no change in attitude/behavior. Also had meeting with admin and informed them the divisiveness is still going within our off season workouts. so, I have approached our captains and they are just as annoyed as anyone else. they seem to think they can take care of.....lets hope...lol be careful with that. the kids parents could scream "bully" if anything happens... and you will see your captains be removed from the team. and if it comes out that you had any knowledge, they will crucify you. |
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coachnewman
Freshmen Member
On this team, we're all united in a common goal: to keep my job." -Lou Holtz
Posts: 85
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Post by coachnewman on Feb 12, 2016 14:02:07 GMT -6
Something needs to be in place that deal with anything detrimental to the team.
Put this player on a contract that you go over with the Administration and can have a sit down with the parents and player that you are putting him on because of these activities detrimental to the Team. Spell out everything, expectations, punishments, ect. Then administration will see you are trying to help this kid but acknowledging the problem and trying to come up with a solution as the final problem solver. Then nobody is surprised when you drop the ax, because as we all know these types of kids majority of the time will mess up again. MAKE SURE ADMINISTRATION, PARENTS, PLAYER, AND YOURSELF SIGN OFF ON THE CONTRACT AND GIVE OUT COPIES. (hope this helps)
JMO
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Post by blb on Feb 12, 2016 14:11:22 GMT -6
I wouldn't.
Administrators are likely to think you're obsessing over this kid and be a little perturbed that it's not even your season. Will cast negative light on YOU.
Besides, they don't want to hear it anyway. As head coach, YOU'RE the designated problem solver.
Until it reaches critical mass - kid violates training rules, has excessive tardies or absences, is openly insubordinate, or some such - handle it yourself.
Or you can pay off his teachers to make him ineligible (I kid).
Disagree. Keep admin informed.
In-Season, sure.
But this isn't football season and technically coach has no authority over the recalcitrant player, unless he is in OP's class.
Administrators are likely to think he's picking on the kid (especially if Mom or Dad suggest such a thing), fairly or unfairly, or that he can't manage his program, needs their help.
Either way could backfire.
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