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Post by bluedevil58 on May 19, 2015 12:45:57 GMT -6
I'm the only coach in the building at my current school. I coach the OL and DL and I'm the lone holdover from last year's staff after we got a new Head Coach. I'm planning to move on myself, but I want to leave the program in good shape and do my best until I land a new job.
Our numbers are down. We are a small school and had as many as 42 players on the roster last year and finished with 27 who were expected to return, but we went 0-10 and things got ugly. For spring practice we only had 25 players on our entire team. The biggest problem is that only 9 of them were "linemen."
Now the best 3 that we had, all returning starters including an all district player have quit, leaving us with a total of 6 offensive linemen in our program. Only 2 of those can play. Our district is full of teams who are very strong up front and our varsity starters would have a hard time making the 2 deep on those schools JV squads.
I try to recruit kids and talk them into playing, but none of them want to. The big boys, especially, just don't want to play football when they could be sitting at home playing video games or goofing off some other way. The other kids on the team say they'll quit if we move them to the line, even if they're never going to see the field at RB or WR.
How do you fix this and get kids to want to come out and play?
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Post by Coach Bennett on May 19, 2015 13:02:01 GMT -6
Get your booster club to start a scholarship for one graduating lineman per year.
I'm half joking. We did get a gift the other day. An 87 year old gentlemen who played 'back in the day' just called wanting to give a $1k scholarship to a lineman.
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Post by amakelky on May 19, 2015 14:49:58 GMT -6
Why the three returning linemen quit sounds like an important issue as well. You aren't going to find better kids walking the halls most if the time.
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Post by holmesbend on May 20, 2015 7:04:15 GMT -6
I wish "recruiting the halls" was as effective as it is cool & the right thing to say. I think most will sympathize with you in this. I personally never worried about "the halls" as much as I did finding the baseball, basketball & wrestling kids who weren't playing football. Those are the targets. I don't know how others feel, but those 15-16 year olds who aren't already playing one or two of those, probably tells you all you need to know. They either have zero drive for the commitment that athletics take and/or they have zero ability. It's hard, especially with the big boys.
Fact is, the main reason they aren't out there in the first place is....it's just hard. I'm not sure how you realistically talk the big boys into playing who aren't doing so already. Might snag a couple, but I know you are looking for more than that.
It's a hard sale....especially if they already have a vehicle, a steady job and a gal or two on the side. There is a whole lot of fun and freedom as they know it to be given up.
What kind of school? Rural-suburbs-inner city?
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Post by coach2013 on May 20, 2015 7:28:54 GMT -6
We give much love to basketball big men who get cut or baseball big men who get cut. We also use undersized guards and very unathletic centers most of time to create depth at other spots on the line.
Also as a small school we often cross train our tightends and guards. "guards are tightends that cant catch" is sort of our secret motto.
recruiting non athletes is tougher than catching a kid before he hits the ground after being cut from baseball or basketball.
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Post by bluboy on May 20, 2015 8:15:25 GMT -6
I don't know how others feel, but those 15-16 year olds who aren't already playing one or two of those, probably tells you all you need to know. They either have zero drive for the commitment that athletics take and/or they have zero ability. It's hard, especially with the big boys. Fact is, the main reason they aren't out there in the first place is....it's just hard. I totally agree. There are a bunch of athletic kids roaming the halls of our school, gym class heroes. Many of them don't have the guts, nerve, backbone, or any other body part to commit to something and work hard. |
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Post by blb on May 20, 2015 8:28:18 GMT -6
Take this into consideration: "Big boys," especially those that are overweight, do not like to run.
If you're doing a lot of sprints during practice or are going to do two months of "Speed Training" or "Conditioning" in the Summer you may lose some of them.
They may want to play Football but won't want to practice Cross Country.
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Post by holmesbend on May 20, 2015 8:52:47 GMT -6
...and, this might get a little off subject, but they just don't see it as fun.
Running these high school programs like college programs (D1 programs let their players go home for the month of May. NAIA and other lower levels, they all still go home for the summer) where they never get away from it just isn't very attractive.
Let's see....give up 3-4 nights (or more) a week during the summers...to lift....and run...some more, like we've been doing since December. Not counting the season, where we practice MORE and play LESS than some of these other sports? Ehh, I'll pass.
Doing this grind, damn near year round..for a guaranteed 9-10 nights out of the year? Some will read this as blasphemy, and that's fine, but I don't think concussions are the real reason behind kids not coming out. Gotta make it attractive to KIDS, and right now...it's just not.
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Post by bluedevil58 on May 20, 2015 11:04:09 GMT -6
Why the three returning linemen quit sounds like an important issue as well. You aren't going to find better kids walking the halls most if the time. They quit for different reasons. The All District one was disappointed that the guy he wanted to be HC, and a guy who told the kids he would definitely be the next HC for 6 months, didn't get it. This kid went hunting with him and had dinner at his house a bunch. They got close and he was hurt when it didn't happen. He also didn't like the new HC after playing for him in 8th grade. The kid who would have been a 4 year starter said a couple of old injuries to his knee and shoulder were bothering him too much. HC called him out for being a crybaby and sitting out practice over it, so he quit. The talented freshman claims he got in trouble and was told by his dad that he couldn't play football anymore. His dad hates getting him back and forth from practice. |
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Post by bluedevil58 on May 20, 2015 11:06:57 GMT -6
Take this into consideration: "Big boys," especially those that are overweight, do not like to run. If you're doing a lot of sprints during practice or are going to do two months of "Speed Training" or "Conditioning" in the Summer you may lose some of them. They may want to play Football but won't want to practice Cross Country. Our new HC is really emphasizing tempo in practice, with players sprinting everywhere for every drill. He's very committed to being a hurry up, no huddle team next season with 1 platoon and our linemen were getting gassed every day in full pads and 90 degree heat. Do you think that might have had something to do with it? |
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Post by bluedevil58 on May 20, 2015 11:12:08 GMT -6
We give much love to basketball big men who get cut or baseball big men who get cut. We also use undersized guards and very unathletic centers most of time to create depth at other spots on the line. Also as a small school we often cross train our tightends and guards. "guards are tightends that cant catch" is sort of our secret motto. recruiting non athletes is tougher than catching a kid before he hits the ground after being cut from baseball or basketball. At our school, basketball kids just don't really play football and no sport cuts kids unless it's for discipline reasons due to low participation. If a kid's been cut, it's a good bet he cut himself by skipping practice, missing games, or mouthing off to a coach. To make it worse, most of our best athletes with the best attitudes only play basketball. Catching kids who get cut from other sports just isn't an option here because they aren't there. Basketball is usually competitive in a weak district, so we've got a reputation as a "basketball school." It's also the only sport here with teams at all of our feeder schools. We are very rural with very few other sports and a lot of our kids, if they choose to be active, would rather go ride their 4 wheelers on the mountain or go hunting instead of playing anything. |
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Post by fantom on May 20, 2015 11:16:07 GMT -6
Why the three returning linemen quit sounds like an important issue as well. You aren't going to find better kids walking the halls most if the time. They quit for different reasons. The All District one was disappointed that the guy he wanted to be HC, and a guy who told the kids he would definitely be the next HC for 6 months, didn't get it. This kid went hunting with him and had dinner at his house a bunch. They got close and he was hurt when it didn't happen. He also didn't like the new HC after playing for him in 8th grade. The kid who would have been a 4 year starter said a couple of old injuries to his knee and shoulder were bothering him too much. HC called him out for being a crybaby and sitting out practice over it, so he quit. The talented freshman claims he got in trouble and was told by his dad that he couldn't play football anymore. His dad hates getting him back and forth from practice. You've said that you think that you want to do right before you leave. If so you should try to talk them into playing. They'll never have a chance to play football again. They can ride ATV's the rest of their life. They might hate the HC but they like football, right? So why let the bastard keep you from doing something that you love? Talk some sense into these kids. |
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Post by blb on May 20, 2015 11:16:14 GMT -6
Take this into consideration: "Big boys," especially those that are overweight, do not like to run. If you're doing a lot of sprints during practice or are going to do two months of "Speed Training" or "Conditioning" in the Summer you may lose some of them. They may want to play Football but won't want to practice Cross Country. Our new HC is really emphasizing tempo in practice, with players sprinting everywhere for every drill. He's very committed to being a hurry up, no huddle team next season with 1 platoon and our linemen were getting gassed every day in full pads and 90 degree heat. Do you think that might have had something to do with it?
Did they quit before or after Spring Practice started?
If before, maybe not.
If after, probably yes.
If they were quitting for the reasons you posted, why would they wait until after it started?
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Post by fantom on May 20, 2015 11:17:43 GMT -6
Take this into consideration: "Big boys," especially those that are overweight, do not like to run. If you're doing a lot of sprints during practice or are going to do two months of "Speed Training" or "Conditioning" in the Summer you may lose some of them. They may want to play Football but won't want to practice Cross Country. Our new HC is really emphasizing tempo in practice, with players sprinting everywhere for every drill. He's very committed to being a hurry up, no huddle team next season with 1 platoon and our linemen were getting gassed every day in full pads and 90 degree heat. Do you think that might have had something to do with it? As much as I'd like to say yes, I don't think so. We're talking about new kids so they don't know that. |
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Post by coach2013 on May 20, 2015 11:48:09 GMT -6
we have a rough future when it comes to linemen. we are at a point where the frosh and soph class have maybe 3 linemen between them and the biggest one doesn't lift weights because dad thinks hes a pro baseball prospect.
our baseball coach says "hes kinda outta shape" more or less.
so Ill let you know what magic comes up.
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Post by rcole on May 20, 2015 20:27:54 GMT -6
we have a rough future when it comes to linemen. we are at a point where the frosh and soph class have maybe 3 linemen between them and the biggest one doesn't lift weights because dad thinks hes a pro baseball prospect. our baseball coach says "hes kinda outta shape" more or less. so Ill let you know what magic comes up. Next time you have a baseball kid or dad or coach that doesn't want to lift, show them this: |
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Post by coach2013 on May 21, 2015 2:24:40 GMT -6
OH trust me- I have plastered that everywhere for our families and players to view.
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Post by hammer66 on May 21, 2015 5:39:39 GMT -6
we have a rough future when it comes to linemen. we are at a point where the frosh and soph class have maybe 3 linemen between them and the biggest one doesn't lift weights because dad thinks hes a pro baseball prospect. our baseball coach says "hes kinda outta shape" more or less. so Ill let you know what magic comes up. We went through the same thing. We were solid up front for many years. Had the kids. Had kids that were good but just couldnt break the starting line up. Then we went about four years with kids that were BAD. We were playing garbage cans out there. Last year we got a new HC and his approach with the OL was fabulous. Great scheme. Had fun with them. Praised them... treated them great. We had six that could play on a consistent basis. Going into this year we graduated 5 of the 6. We are just reloading. Our depth is going to be great. I think its a two fold issue. For one its cyclical and the other is how you treat them. |
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Post by coach2013 on May 21, 2015 6:05:43 GMT -6
Absolutely agree, our linemen are coached by 4 coaches....the backs...1,sometimes two. we love on our oline...I spend a ton of time with my oline and those are the guys I personally spot each workout.
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Post by blb on May 21, 2015 6:17:52 GMT -6
OL eat first at team meals, get first pick of seats on buses to away games.
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Post by olinedude on May 21, 2015 8:00:11 GMT -6
I'm the OL coach at my school and we have very few lineman for a school our size. I find that not only is everything true about big guys not wanting to run very much, but also you never know if a big is actually physical, aggressive, or has quick enough feet to actually block. Also, playing OL takes a while to learn the technique in my opinion. If I want to grab a guy out of the halls, if he's not a fr or soph he probably wont have time to develop.
The biggest thing is the drive to play though, I grabbed one freshman coming in that eventually quit because of this. Kid is legitimately 6'2 about 310-320 and very quick and explosive, but without the drive to play its hard to keep them on par with everybody else.
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2015 8:38:02 GMT -6
big guys are overrated. I have 3 guys who cant play, overweight, do not want to work.
I was at the grocery store, I ran into a nineth, who I have not seen on our campus, had to be 6-3 and about 190 lbs. easily, long and lean. He could have played defensive end for us six mo. ago.Body types, not size is what you need to look for in your halls.
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Post by natenator on May 21, 2015 8:44:45 GMT -6
I'll take strength and attitude over caring about their size.
I have two grade 9 linebackers who jack up every OL player we have including one who is 6'4, 290lbs.
My experience with big OL on our teams has been that they are slow, lazy, weak, soft, and always 'hurt'.
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Post by joelee on May 21, 2015 9:37:58 GMT -6
Take this into consideration: "Big boys," especially those that are overweight, do not like to run. If you're doing a lot of sprints during practice or are going to do two months of "Speed Training" or "Conditioning" in the Summer you may lose some of them. They may want to play Football but won't want to practice Cross Country. Our new HC is really emphasizing tempo in practice, with players sprinting everywhere for every drill. He's very committed to being a hurry up, no huddle team next season with 1 platoon and our linemen were getting gassed every day in full pads and 90 degree heat. Do you think that might have had something to do with it? Your head coach is trying to platoon at a small school with the roster size you have described? Not having linemen is only the tip of the iceberg. |
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Post by eaglemountie on May 21, 2015 11:09:53 GMT -6
Get your returners that quit back out there. Show them some love and find a way to lure their interest back. They are kids and are a little disappointed right now but that will pass. And when it does put the full press on them to return.
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Post by spartandefense on May 21, 2015 12:00:42 GMT -6
we have a rough future when it comes to linemen. we are at a point where the frosh and soph class have maybe 3 linemen between them and the biggest one doesn't lift weights because dad thinks hes a pro baseball prospect. our baseball coach says "hes kinda outta shape" more or less. so Ill let you know what magic comes up. Next time you have a baseball kid or dad or coach that doesn't want to lift, show them this: Funny. I have sent that exact same video to players that use the "my baseball trainer/coach" doesn't want me lifting. |
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2015 13:14:58 GMT -6
I am not ripping on baseball coaches, but the kids play baseball are normally the ones who do not want to flip tires, lift weight, run.
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Post by realdawg on May 22, 2015 2:38:21 GMT -6
Havent had much success recruiting our halls especially for linemen. Generally, kids you have to go recruit to play dont help you much. I am sure there are some exceptions but for us this is the general rule. Our numbers are pretty low and we recruited the halls pretty hard this winter just to get bodies, we got a bunch of kids who are 4'5 tall and run a 5.4 forty and 2 linemen. One is 6'2 270 and if a big old kid, but he is a sophmore and has never worked out and never played. His hips are so stiff he cant get in any kind of stance. To his credit he has worked pretty hard this week during spring practice and got better but he needs a year of JV ball. The other kid is 6'8 (not a typo) about 215. We have him working at DE and he is fairly athletic, runs good, and has been in wt lifting class and cleans and squats good. He has shown alot of promise and he may help us. We wont know for sure though until we can hit.
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Post by lochness on May 22, 2015 13:18:53 GMT -6
Recruiting the halls sucks!  Seriously, though...I've stopped doing this. I know this will draw criticism from some, but I firmly believe that if a kid needs to be begged to play, they aren't going to help you anyway...not by a long shot. I train my leaders how to recruit other RKG's. We HAVE been successful there. But me just looking at bodies and saying, "son, what's your name and why aren't you playing football?" Nah. |
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Post by fantom on May 22, 2015 15:45:50 GMT -6
Recruiting the halls sucks! Seriously, though...I've stopped doing this. I know this will draw criticism from some, but I firmly believe that if a kid needs to be begged to play, they aren't going to help you anyway...not by a long shot. I train my leaders how to recruit other RKG's. We HAVE been successful there. But me just looking at bodies and saying, "son, what's your name and why aren't you playing football?" Nah. I don't beg but I do ask. Kids are funny and sometimes they can be indecisive about what they want to do. Sometimes all that needs to happen is for somebody to ask. We got one of our all-time best players that way. If a coach at Lafayette HS didn't ask a chubby basketball player to play football nobody would ever have seen Lawrence Taylor play. |
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