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Post by fantom on Sept 21, 2011 10:57:39 GMT -6
In order to keep some of the other threads from deteriorating into a "kids today are soft" I'll post this in a new thread.
I'm one of the older coaches on this board. There are several of us. I'll be 58 soon and I've coached for 32 years. That means that I could have coached many of the coaches on this board. You know those things that we say about today's kids? Guess what? We probably said that about you. My coaches probably said them about me.
Do you really think that as freshmen you came in totally focused and ready to go every day?
Do you really think that on the first day in your first year of organized football you were ready and able to execute form tackles and drive blocks?
There certainly are fewer kids today who are willing to pay the price to be a good football team. There are certainly more distractions and excuses. So what? You have the kids that you have and you can't change that. Think the kids in the schools that you compete with are different? They're not.
Everybody's entitled to the right to gripe or vent to their peers. It's natural and normal. If you've really convinced yourself that the problem, year in and year out, is that your kids are intrinsically softer and lazier than others you're kidding yourself.
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Post by blb on Sept 21, 2011 11:09:20 GMT -6
As usual fantom has crystallized things.
We coaches have to remember - Football is a much more important part of our lives (and probably has been since an early age) than it is for the vast majority of our players, or we wouldn't be coaches.
How many of your players are going to become Football coaches? Or try to play CFB?
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Post by John Knight on Sept 21, 2011 11:14:42 GMT -6
I started coaching High School football in 1984 and kids were just as unmotivated and wimpy then as they are now on the whole. Parents were just as meddling, as well. The only difference was, I was young enough to fight them both!
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Post by fantom on Sept 21, 2011 11:20:04 GMT -6
I started coaching High School football in 1984 and kids were just as unmotivated and wimpy then as they are now on the whole. Parents were just as meddling, as well. The only difference was, I was young enough to fight them both! 1984? Rookie! (LOL).
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flingt
Junior Member
"We don't care how big or strong our opponents are as long as they're human.?
Posts: 311
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Post by flingt on Sept 21, 2011 11:41:46 GMT -6
1990 for me. I was wearing Sansabelt shorts back then. Nice.
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Post by blb on Sept 21, 2011 11:45:03 GMT -6
He's just a young buck (got my start in '75).
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Post by coachcb on Sept 21, 2011 11:52:47 GMT -6
It's funny, I worked with my old OL coach for a few years and we had a conversation that totally opened my eyes. I really wasn't coachable in a lot of ways; I couldn't stand going through drills at half speed, I didn't listen very well and tended to 'improvise' (i.e. cut block DL when I couldn't handle them in pass pro). I always assumed that coach disliked working with me (I could whip out a mile pretty quick after a few weeks with him) but he almost lost his varsity OL position because he went to bat for me with the HC in staff film sessions.
So, I was really 'one of those kids' in many ways but I really learned a lot about coaching after hearing this story.
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tlala2
Freshmen Member
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Post by tlala2 on Sept 21, 2011 12:14:28 GMT -6
I started coaching in 2011, and due to my completely thorough track record I can say that you're completely wrong... Kids today are just weak and soft and think that looking good translates to playing well.
Just kidding... and I know many of the kids when I played way back in 08 were the same way and the guys I grew up around when my dad coached had their lack of motivation as well.
It is just the nature of high school guys: they are going through changes in every aspect of their lives, and we have to guide them to be able to deal with those changes. That is possibly more important than driving them to success on the field.
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Post by outlawjoseywales on Sept 21, 2011 12:15:41 GMT -6
Absolutely no doubt about it-kids, parents, families and society is different now than it was when I started. It's silly to try and expect them to be the same as us. AND, it's nothing different-things change. I knew they were different as a young coach when I started out then they were when I was a kid in the 60's-the 70's saw to that. And things are much different now than they were with my 1st team in 1979. As to the point though. My last assignment, I didn't expect kids to be ready for the Florida heat. I had to make an effort to "climatize" the kids. It's only smart to do so. I did a number of things that I wouldn't have even considered doing back then-but you have to do them now. Well if you want to coach, that is. I could lament that they are all inside playing video games when I lived outside on my bike and in the woods building forts as a kid. And it's true. But hey, my Dad had to wake up an hoe the field BEFORE he went to school in barefeet. Most all southerners are from that stock. I'm sure my Dad could have lamented about how "soft" we were, no-he was happy me and my brothers had it better than he did. Of course you know we heard all the stories that we love to tell about "walking 5 miles, up hill to school everyday and back in the snow even in August." Gotta' do it. If you don't take into consideration that kids stay inside now and play video games and don't go outside as much as we did, you might make a mistake that could cost you. Things to consider.
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Post by fantom on Sept 21, 2011 12:25:28 GMT -6
Absolutely no doubt about it-kids, parents, families and society is different now than it was when I started. It's silly to try and expect them to be the same as us. AND, it's nothing different-things change. I knew they were different as a young coach when I started out then they were when I was a kid in the 60's-the 70's saw to that. And things are much different now than they were with my 1st team in 1979. As to the point though. My last assignment, I didn't expect kids to be ready for the Florida heat. I had to make an effort to "climatize" the kids. It's only smart to do so. I did a number of things that I wouldn't have even considered doing back then-but you have to do them now. Well if you want to coach, that is. I could lament that they are all inside playing video games when I lived outside on my bike and in the woods building forts as a kid. And it's true. But hey, my Dad had to wake up an hoe the field BEFORE he went to school in barefeet. Most all southerners are from that stock. I'm sure my Dad could have lamented about how "soft" we were, no-he was happy me and my brothers had it better than he did. Of course you know we heard all the stories that we love to tell about "walking 5 miles, up hill to school everyday and back in the snow even in August." Gotta' do it. If you don't take into consideration that kids stay inside now and play video games and don't go outside as much as we did, you might make a mistake that could cost you. Things to consider. A lot of kids today get driven to school. I rode a bus. My Dad walked. His Dad got a job. Whan I was a kid we didn't have air conditioning. You might as well have gone outside because it was no more comfortable inside.
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Post by jrk5150 on Sept 21, 2011 13:03:30 GMT -6
You can't trust your memory - it naturally is going to pick the stuff you "want" to remember - good and bad - and certainly isn't going to give you a complete picture.
There were never any "good old days" - things were just as f-d up in the 60's, and 70's, and 80's as they are today. The pressures on kids are the same, their reactions are the same. There are some changes around WHAT is putting pressure on kids, but the pressures aren't any different. There are certainly some differences in what they are exposed to, etc., but all in all - it's all the same.
You think kids were tougher? Nah - the hits hurt a lot less then, as kids were smaller, slower, weaker, less athletic, etc. Every generation gets physically a little bigger and a little faster and a little stronger on average. HS teams now are probably the physical equivalent of college teams 30 years ago. But not the mental or maturity equivalent, which makes you think they're even worse, since they LOOK like they should be acting more mature.
I'll go one step further - your memories from LAST YEAR are probably not so reliable, LOL. I remember thinking last year "my 2009 team was so much better, I can't believe my kids are screwing this up", only to go back and watch video and see...the same screw-ups in 2009. I was honestly stunned.
There's a reason that there is a cliche that starts with "the more things change"...
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Post by bucksweepdotcom on Sept 21, 2011 16:05:50 GMT -6
Someone wiser than me told me once. Kids don't change we are the ones that change!
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Post by blb on Sept 21, 2011 19:20:12 GMT -6
Someone wiser than me told me once. Kids don't change we are the ones that change! Every 12 months I get a year older. The kids I coach are still 14-18.
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Post by champ93 on Sept 21, 2011 19:25:32 GMT -6
the only thing that changes is the technology
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Post by fballcoachg on Sept 21, 2011 19:36:54 GMT -6
While I am one of those young bucks, I do think that kids are different however no different than I was from the kids 10 years before me and they were 10 years before them. As a US history professor of mine once said, " People remember the romanticized past that never was but always will be," it's something that I have always tried to keep in mind when comparing kids.
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Post by CoachCP on Sept 22, 2011 7:06:38 GMT -6
I think every generation has there own concerns. Right now, one of our coaches can't stand the "C" word, concussion. He thinks because kids hear it all the time, they freak out, and this year's group is weak, not as tough, ect... All they see on TV are injuries injuries injuries. 2-3 years ago it was the heat thing with him, same story. Not as tough, weakest group, ect. In his day and age though, it was HIV and AIDs. Kids didn't want to play because they were worried about that.
Kids will be affected by what they hear on TV or whatever they have to deal with in their environment. But every generation has its own excuse. ("Coach we can't practice b/c it's too hot" [we live in Illinois....], or "Coach we can't practice because I bumped my head at school"). Heck, when I played it was "Coach, we can't play b/c the mosquitoes and west nile virus".
So kids are no worse now compared to yesterday, last year or last decade. The kids that want to find an excuse will find an excuse, the kids who want to play will play. Period. No group is weaker or less tough.
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Post by airraider on Sept 22, 2011 7:18:35 GMT -6
I often think about the lack of motivation and wonder what goes through these kids minds on a play???
Then I think back to my days playing in high school... I had NO clue as an Olinemen of what ANYONE else was doing.... I just knew who I was supposed to block... that was it.. didnt know why.. didnt care why.
I was lazy... careless... and unmotivated.
That wasnt anymore of a reflection on my coaches than the way my players play today is on me.
I just didnt take any of it as serious as they did.
Its hard to accept that as a coach, but its reality.
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Post by CoachMikeJudy on Sept 22, 2011 7:37:48 GMT -6
Fantom-
I'm glad you posted that man. I always felt that was the case, being the age of someone you could have coached during your career.
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Post by coachbuck on Sept 22, 2011 8:37:29 GMT -6
Fantom, knight , blb thats awesome to be coaching that long. I think your correct fantom. We as coaches use that as an excuse a falllback incase we have a bad season. My team this year I was saying the same thing. About my h.s. team and my youth team. Both off to successful starts. Shame on me for being the soft one. One thing I always tell fellow coaches. As the season goes on I always hear x town is full of studs, they are always good. I always chime in, there is no substitute for hard work and there is no magic where they are at, its hard work. Good post, Im guilty of this. I fall into the category during the season, I love to be miserable. Dont enjoy the wins enough and stress to much on the losses.
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Post by fantom on Sept 22, 2011 8:55:22 GMT -6
One thing I always tell fellow coaches. As the season goes on I always hear x town is full of studs, they are always good. I always chime in, there is no substitute for hard work and there is no magic where they are at, its hard work.. Our baseball team has been bad. By "bad" I mean 1-19 consistently. Our baseball coach has often said that we just don't have baseball kids at our school. What the hell is a "baseball kid"? One of the best baseball programs in the league is in the same city, two miles away, on the same road. Are all the "baseball kids" zone to live there?
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Post by coachks on Sept 22, 2011 9:03:13 GMT -6
Absolutely no doubt about it-kids, parents, families and society is different now than it was when I started. It's silly to try and expect them to be the same as us. AND, it's nothing different-things change. I knew they were different as a young coach when I started out then they were when I was a kid in the 60's-the 70's saw to that. And things are much different now than they were with my 1st team in 1979. As to the point though. My last assignment, I didn't expect kids to be ready for the Florida heat. I had to make an effort to "climatize" the kids. It's only smart to do so. I did a number of things that I wouldn't have even considered doing back then-but you have to do them now. Well if you want to coach, that is. I could lament that they are all inside playing video games when I lived outside on my bike and in the woods building forts as a kid. And it's true. But hey, my Dad had to wake up an hoe the field BEFORE he went to school in barefeet. Most all southerners are from that stock. I'm sure my Dad could have lamented about how "soft" we were, no-he was happy me and my brothers had it better than he did. Of course you know we heard all the stories that we love to tell about "walking 5 miles, up hill to school everyday and back in the snow even in August." Gotta' do it. If you don't take into consideration that kids stay inside now and play video games and don't go outside as much as we did, you might make a mistake that could cost you. Things to consider. A lot of kids today get driven to school. I rode a bus. My Dad walked. His Dad got a job. Which, to your point, means what exactly in terms of "toughness." Is walking 2 miles to school going to make you more likely to stick your nose in the gut of a ball carrier? More likely to finish a block? I moved a lot when I was young, so I walked, rode a bus, was driven and drove myself at various points. My toughness level naturaly corresponded to how I got to school.
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Post by fantom on Sept 22, 2011 9:10:07 GMT -6
A lot of kids today get driven to school. I rode a bus. My Dad walked. His Dad got a job. Which, to your point, means what exactly in terms of "toughness." Is walking 2 miles to school going to make you more likely to stick your nose in the gut of a ball carrier? More likely to finish a block? I moved a lot when I was young, so I walked, rode a bus, was driven and drove myself at various points. My toughness level naturaly corresponded to how I got to school. It means that times change. You really played differently based on how you got to school?
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Post by coachks on Sept 22, 2011 9:11:44 GMT -6
Either your sarcasm detector (or mine) is off....
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Post by Defcord on Sept 22, 2011 9:13:55 GMT -6
This is an interesting post. I think several nailed it on the head and our coaching staff talks about this a lot. We are coaches generally because we love the game and are willing to work more and sacrifice more.
As players we never realized that other kids just weren't as committed as we may have been. I realized this for the first time in college when the best player from my high school went D1 and quit after his first year. I couldn't believe it. I was shocked and upset with him. He was a good friend and I asked him how he could just quit. He told me he just didn't care about football enough to keep playing. All of us care so much about football that we look at those who do not care as much about football as soft and weak. That probably isn't the case.
It's kind of like my golf game. I really enjoy to golf and I will go out with some buddies that are pretty good. They go to driving range and work at it two-three days a week. I just grab a few drinks and my clubs and hit the course when I go. This probably doesn't make me soft; just shows that I don't care enough about that particular activity to dedicate myself to it. My point is some of our players just want to have some fun with their friends playing football not be completely dedicated to the game.
Then to be honest some kids are just turds! I have been coaching for 8 years and it seems they have always been around, more so during losing years than winning years.
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Post by fantom on Sept 22, 2011 9:16:12 GMT -6
Either your sarcasm detector (or mine) is off.... Sorry. I'm known for my sarcasm, too. It's a question of perception. Everybody thinks the next generation has it soft.
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flingt
Junior Member
"We don't care how big or strong our opponents are as long as they're human.?
Posts: 311
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Post by flingt on Sept 22, 2011 9:34:03 GMT -6
I'm in my mid forties with a teenage son and daughter and 2 elementary school sons. The biggest difference I see from when I was growing up are the distractions and the comptetiveness in school. No, we didn't have video games, Ipads, any of that so we filled more of our time DOING things and not worrying about being connected. When I take my family back to my small midwestern town from Atlanta, they are always stunned at the size of the place. My son has also gotten to know some of my friends sons who play sports there and the amount of time spent training for each sport varies too.
I know that todays kids are different, but as stated earlier, it's not their fault.
WE are the ones who must adjust to them, not them to us. Look at how the emphasis on uniforms in college has increased. Oregon and Maryland, the Pro Combat line, you think that's for middle aged men? No, it's for todays' high school players. Nike and Under Armour get it.
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Post by champ80 on Sept 22, 2011 9:42:21 GMT -6
It also is influenced by where you coach........rural kids.....are a lot different than suburban kids....or inner city kids................how affluent is your clientele...........give me a group of small town rural Texas country boys anytime..........
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Post by fantom on Sept 22, 2011 10:03:16 GMT -6
It also is influenced by where you coach........rural kids.....are a lot different than suburban kids....or inner city kids................how affluent is your clientele...........give me a group of small town rural Texas country boys anytime.......... One of the biggest fallacies in sports. There's a school in our state that couldn't be more different from us demographically. They're in literally the richest county in the US per capita. We're not. The racial mix of our teams is very different. Yet we've played each other four years in a row in either the state semis or finals. Very tough ballgames.
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Post by champ80 on Sept 22, 2011 10:29:58 GMT -6
It also is influenced by where you coach........rural kids.....are a lot different than suburban kids....or inner city kids................how affluent is your clientele...........give me a group of small town rural Texas country boys anytime.......... One of the biggest fallacies in sports. There's a school in our state that couldn't be more different from us demographically. They're in literally the richest county in the US per capita. We're not. The racial mix of our teams is very different. Yet we've played each other four years in a row in either the state semis or finals. Very tough ballgames. Did not mention race (demographics) at all.......you are making an assumption....................but I do know that here, in Texas....it doesn't matter if you are black, white or hispanic....your attitude....your perspective toward sports is different if you are raised in a rural setting......as compared to that of suburban or inner city.............................. What I have said is a rule of thumb.......there are exceptions to everything.....as you have mentioned.........................affluence....(money) gives you opportunity for a wider variety of influences that take away from sports in many cases.......where those oppotunities are not as available to many rural kids................
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Post by fantom on Sept 22, 2011 10:33:24 GMT -6
One of the biggest fallacies in sports. There's a school in our state that couldn't be more different from us demographically. They're in literally the richest county in the US per capita. We're not. The racial mix of our teams is very different. Yet we've played each other four years in a row in either the state semis or finals. Very tough ballgames. Did not mention race (demographics) at all.......you are making an assumption....................but I do know that here, in Texas....it doesn't matter if you are black, white or hispanic....your attitude....your perspective toward sports is different if you are raised in a rural setting......as compared to that of suburban or inner city.............................. What I have said is a rule of thumb.......there are exceptions to everything.....as you have mentioned.........................affluence....(money) gives you opportunity for a wider variety of influences that take away from sports in many cases.......where those oppotunities are not as available to many rural kids................ I never said that you said anything about race. My point was only to show that two very different schools have had great success.
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