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Post by utchuckd on Jan 6, 2010 7:52:02 GMT -6
It's just his secondyear. Give him a couple more to get more option guys in there and then we can see what he does.
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Post by olinecoach61 on Jan 6, 2010 7:55:56 GMT -6
Yeah, give him some time, GT is going to be making some noise.
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Post by bigm0073 on Jan 6, 2010 7:56:50 GMT -6
WHen was the last time Ga Tech won the ACC before Johnson was there?
When was the last time they were in a BCS Bowl game before Johnson...
Year two.
In two years he has taken a pretty irrelevent middle of the road team to national contention.. Basically he accomplished what Saban accomplished his first two years at Bama... With less talent then Bama..
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Post by touchdownmaker on Jan 6, 2010 8:14:59 GMT -6
Hey they were in position to win that game several times. silly mistakes, silly mistakes. I get the feeling he doesnt have the brightest group after watching that. some smart kids and some ....eh...
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Post by emptybackfield on Jan 6, 2010 8:18:24 GMT -6
while i think what Paul Johnson runs down at G. Tech is a good offense and he knows it in and out very well... i dont see him winning too many bowl games with it...yea he will probably get 10 wins every year with it because not many teams run this offense, so Defensive coordinators adjust to it within a week and playing well is highly unlikely. But when it comes to the bowl where teams have more than 2 weeks to prepare for it.. i dont see him winning too many of them do to the fact of him only running a limited amount of plays. I thought the exact same thing when LSU hit them in the mouth last year. Then...I witnessed Air Force and Navy bending Houston and my Mizzou Tigers over last week.
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Post by coachdubyah on Jan 6, 2010 8:24:08 GMT -6
Let me start off by saying that I have been a PJ fan since his days at Georgia Southern, but he/the team really dissappointed me in this game. They were very basic on offense. I watched them a lot this year and it seemed as though they didnt do a lot of what they had been doing as far as formations. Very little unbalanced. VS FSU they got in Trips and motioned #2 as the pitch man and ran IV both towards and away from trips. Honestly, I expected them to pass more considering what the defense was doing. Drives me nuts that the only receiver they throw to is the big guy #8. On one of their first drives they ran 4 verts and both slots were wide open. Iowa did not cover them, but Nesbitt rared back and threw it to the Iowa Alumni 3 rows up from the sideline.
However, I could not be happier for Iowa. Their Oline is excellent. They were textbook all night long on IZ and OZ. Ferenz is an amazing coach and an OLine guy. Which makes him a favorite of mine. Defensively, Iowa's DC pretty much has PJ's number. They faced off when Hawaii played (some big ten team) in the Oahu Bowl. Hawaii got destroyed in that game. Iowa's DC said he did the same thing this time that he did then.
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Post by morris on Jan 6, 2010 8:29:57 GMT -6
while i think what Paul Johnson runs down at G. Tech is a good offense and he knows it in and out very well... i dont see him winning too many bowl games with it...yea he will probably get 10 wins every year with it because not many teams run this offense, so Defensive coordinators adjust to it within a week and playing well is highly unlikely. But when it comes to the bowl where teams have more than 2 weeks to prepare for it.. i dont see him winning too many of them do to the fact of him only running a limited amount of plays. All those guys in the ACC had a year to get ready for it. Clemson saw it twice this year and I believe they had 2 weeks to get ready for it the 2nd time. With GT it is a matter of time. When they struggle early in a game most of the time it is just a matter of time before PJ gets them going. Like the drive to bring the score to 17-14 I believe. They just started to rip off clips of yards. If Dwyer does not run backwards then they at least have type of chance. Instead he puts them in a huge hole. They threw an INT at a bad time (not that there is a good time to throw one) and the RB made a huge mistake. GT's offense is like TT in that there are times when it lags and looks bad until they get a good idea of what the defense is doing. Then the flood gates open.
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Post by dubber on Jan 6, 2010 8:54:28 GMT -6
while i think what Paul Johnson runs down at G. Tech is a good offense and he knows it in and out very well... i dont see him winning too many bowl games with it...yea he will probably get 10 wins every year with it because not many teams run this offense, so Defensive coordinators adjust to it within a week and playing well is highly unlikely. But when it comes to the bowl where teams have more than 2 weeks to prepare for it.. i dont see him winning too many of them do to the fact of him only running a limited amount of plays. All those guys in the ACC had a year to get ready for it. Clemson saw it twice this year and I believe they had 2 weeks to get ready for it the 2nd time. With GT it is a matter of time. When they struggle early in a game most of the time it is just a matter of time before PJ gets them going. Like the drive to bring the score to 17-14 I believe. They just started to rip off clips of yards. If Dwyer does not run backwards then they at least have type of chance. Instead he puts them in a huge hole. They threw an INT at a bad time (not that there is a good time to throw one) and the RB made a huge mistake. GT's offense is like TT in that there are times when it lags and looks bad until they get a good idea of what the defense is doing. Then the flood gates open. That is exactly what I thought. I would like to point out Stanzi throwing a pick six made this game much closer. The uniqueness of GT's offense is an advantage, but isn't it pretty obvious that was the best defense GT played all season?
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Post by coachcb on Jan 6, 2010 8:55:04 GMT -6
Why do they keep calling this the "spread option"? I consider what Oregon and West Virginia are running as the "spread option"...not this stuff. Is it because there are actually guys split out as opposed to the olden days wishbone triple option? PJ was the first coach to coin the term 'spread option'. He uses 4 threats at the LOS all day. The teams that ran option when he first started using the offense ran everything out of the I formation and Splitbacks; always using a TE.
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Post by blb on Jan 6, 2010 9:10:47 GMT -6
Why do they keep calling this the "spread option"? I consider what Oregon and West Virginia are running as the "spread option"...not this stuff. Is it because there are actually guys split out as opposed to the olden days wishbone triple option? PJ was the first coach to coin the term 'spread option'. He uses 4 threats at the LOS all day. The teams that ran option when he first started using the offense ran everything out of the I formation and Splitbacks; always using a TE. Didn't see the whole game - did Tech throw All Streak Lickety-Split ("4 Verts") last night? Didn't see a Pop pass to a slot back either. Did see Iowa's corners ignoring SEs and coming to pitch immediately with safeties covering over the top. Tough to run option (or anything else) against 9-man front.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2010 9:21:28 GMT -6
I thought their offense played well enough to win. Thier d was way to "iffy" to me. They lost that game up front on both sides of the ball and had little to do with schemes and plays IMHO.
Duece
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Post by senatorblutarsky on Jan 6, 2010 9:37:45 GMT -6
PJ was the first coach to coin the term 'spread option'
Not sure about that... PJ coached with Bob Wagner at Hawaii when they ran "The Hawaii Run & Shoot". When asked what that was, he said "Spread Option".
Plus, I'm sure someone before him got the idea (I know both PJ and Wagner coaches w/ Mouse Davis... as did my college HC... the Run & Shoot really exploded in to many different versions)
I have a lot of old UH stuff... we basically ran their offense at the start of my career.
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Post by Coach JR on Jan 6, 2010 9:47:54 GMT -6
Am I missing something? I'm seeing them in their base 4-3 playing the option how everyone else does. DE- dive, OLB- QB, S- filling inside/out, C- pitch. Are they doing anything special I am not noticing or just kicking their @ss? Maybe I'm missing something, then If 24 yards on 11 plays isn't getting you @ss kicked..... I think it takes a very good coach to run an effective triple option team. And it works great for the most part in conference, in season, when you're the only team running it and the teams you face had a game last saturday, and the following saturday...but with extra time to prepare, these young DCs to make calls to some of the older guys that developed defenses to stop it...and nothing else on the radar...it can be stopped...and with no passing attack to losen things up, it can get ugly when that happens.
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Post by outlawjoseywales on Jan 6, 2010 9:52:00 GMT -6
Iowa seemed to prove the old addage, "if you can run off-tackle you win." But saying it and doing it are two different things. Iowa's line was strong on both sides of the ball, but their ability to pass the ball won the game for them. Ga. Tech's inability to complete passes was very glaring, and it normally isn't.
Doesn't anybody run counters anymore? Maybe it's a lost art, or defenses are too good, I don't know. Being an old wing-t guy/wanna-be DW guy, we run counters constantly, so I really miss seeing it.
OJW
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Post by coachorr on Jan 6, 2010 9:53:24 GMT -6
In heaven there is no beer!!!!!!!!!! What? Then I guess I will stop being a nice person now that you tell me that.
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Post by coachorr on Jan 6, 2010 9:55:57 GMT -6
30+ days to get ready for it, versus 5 may have been a factor in this game. Also, the Iowa dline was very effective in block destruction. Pretty hard to make a read when there is a 290lb man in your face.
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Post by wingt74 on Jan 6, 2010 9:57:44 GMT -6
GT offense does well because it is so uncommon, and teams only get one week to prepare.
Handling the splits, drive blocking, and cutting is just as important as narrowing down the responsibilities of dive/qb/pitchman. Media focuses too much on just the option aspect of the O.
Iowa had a month. That has a LOT to do with their showing. Still have to execute...and they did. Nice to see the big ten do well.
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Post by blb on Jan 6, 2010 10:00:46 GMT -6
Norm Parker (Iowa DC) has been around for about 1,000 years - was Perles' DC at MSU awhile back - and is one of the best.
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Post by senatorblutarsky on Jan 6, 2010 10:14:51 GMT -6
Norm Parker (Iowa DC) has been around for about 1,000 years - was Perles' DC at MSU awhile back - and is one of the best
And I believe he was the DC when Mich. St. beat Hawaii in the Aloha Bowl 33-13 (When Johnson was the OC for UH).
I enjoyed the game... I'm a big fan of what both GT and Iowa do on Offense (GT more for overall scheme and Iowa for blocking schemes)... so it was an enjoyable one.
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Post by phantom on Jan 6, 2010 10:17:04 GMT -6
The rules committee meeting should be interesting this year. I've heard that there will be a lot of sentiment to close some loopholes in chop and crack blocking rules.
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Post by blb on Jan 6, 2010 10:34:35 GMT -6
That was my kind of football - an option team against a (basically) Pro-I team, not basketball on grass. Boy I'm getting old.
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Post by senatorblutarsky on Jan 6, 2010 10:42:32 GMT -6
That was my kind of football - an option team against a (basically) Pro-I team, not basketball on grass. Boy I'm getting old.Right there with 'ya... on the OLD part too...
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Post by brophy on Jan 6, 2010 11:09:07 GMT -6
I love option football, but the lack of answers by GT wasn't "good football". GT didn't provide much of anything to break Iowa's defensive game plan.
Doing the same thing over and over again with the same results, doesn't (IMO) warrant a merit badge.
Not hating on GT at all, though. Triple is a viable and effective offense, and this game wasn't indicitive of any 'future' litmus test for GT (they will be fine doing what they do). They just didn't execute. That said, I love me some 'boring' old Norm Parker defense.
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Post by groundchuck on Jan 6, 2010 11:24:10 GMT -6
If you give Norm Parker a month to prepare he is going to scheme to shut you down.
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Post by brophy on Jan 6, 2010 11:30:22 GMT -6
I'm not sure/sold on the time thing.
Parker is going to do what he does and sit.........he doesn't "scheme" the hell out of any team they play.
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Post by coachcb on Jan 6, 2010 11:37:28 GMT -6
1. PJ will continue to develop the program; again, he's only in his second year. He's basically took players that he hadn't recruited, plugged them into his system and won games. Given him time to recruit; Ga tech will be tough to stop.
2. Iowa's defense just played fantastic assignment football. Couple that with the fact that the rest of the defense that wasn't being 'read' killed blocks and tackled well.
3. I will say, I was very surprised that they didn't come after Clayborn a little more with ISV; he was on the 6 tech/1 tech side of the defense alot. When they did come after him, they loaded him with the FB a lot.. Dwyer's a heck of a player, but he just got punished by Clayborn.
4. They kept trying to establish midline, all night... It just wasn't there; the front seven was closing in on Nesbitt fast and they took away the dive. Now, I know that you don't want to let a defense dictate what you do, but it just wasn't there.
5. Nesbitt had all of the pocket presence and patience of an ADD 5 year old that had just drank a gallon of corn syrup. His eyes were on Clayborn all night; there were pockets for him to step up into, but he tried to scramble. And he generally scrambled right into Clayborn.. He got frustrated; when an option QB gets worked up, he's going to play a step slower and blow reads.. No way around it.
6. Their defense didn't play well, but then again, they haven't played well all year. Kudos to the Iowa offensive staff; they went after Tarrant all night, even after he picked one and took it to the house. And, they got abused up front.
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Post by dubber on Jan 6, 2010 11:45:29 GMT -6
I love option football, but the lack of answers by GT wasn't "good football". GT didn't provide much of anything to break Iowa's defensive game plan. Doing the same thing over and over again with the same results, doesn't (IMO) warrant a merit badge. Not hating on GT at all, though. Triple is a viable and effective offense, and this game wasn't indicitive of any 'future' litmus test for GT (they will be fine doing what they do). They just didn't execute. That said, I love me some 'boring' old Norm Parker defense. I remember watching an old VHS tape of Air Force in the early 90's playing some big time school. On their first couple series, they mixed in some PAP and quick game.....nothing a competent HS senior QB couldn't complete, but it completely screwed the defense up and Air Force went on to rush for over 350 yards or something. I like the DW, and while I doubt I will ever run it, if I did, we would throw 30% of the time, and I would have just as many rushing yards as if I ran 90% of the time. Perception: "The more times we run the football, the more rushing yards we will have." Reality: "The more off balanced a defense is, the more rushing yards we will have." It's the difference between a Team line that reads like this: 0 receptions 45 carries, 200 yards And this: 6-10, 73 yards 35 carries, 275 yards Superpower's DW teams are a great example of this, and while I doubt they throw 30% of the time, they are a little more apt to PAP on first down and essentially get down to what we are talking about here: If you REFUSE to conflict defenders IN ALL ASPECTS, then you are screwed once you face someone with the Jimmies and Joes to match you. And this is not a "we all need to pass more" comment. Passing teams fall into the same trap. We did it this season. We were so good at throwing deep we just kept doing it....didn't matter if it was working or not. Had we been more apt to throw perimeter screens and our quick game concepts (as well as run the ball a little more), we would have greatly increased the completion % on our deeper throws, and become more efficent as an offense overall. Do you know how you can tell when TT is going to roll an opponent? When they start reeling off 12 yard runs, it is all over but the crying. This was posted last year, but I think Brophy nailed it, the BEST way to stop TT is to stop their running game (and limit Y.A.C.), because in making an offense one-dimensional, you severe limit their ability to operate.
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Post by coachnichols on Jan 6, 2010 11:48:55 GMT -6
I love option football, but the lack of answers by GT wasn't "good football". GT didn't provide much of anything to break Iowa's defensive game plan. Doing the same thing over and over again with the same results, doesn't (IMO) warrant a merit badge. Not hating on GT at all, though. Triple is a viable and effective offense, and this game wasn't indicitive of any 'future' litmus test for GT (they will be fine doing what they do). They just didn't execute. That said, I love me some 'boring' old Norm Parker defense. I'm agreeing with brophy here. GT didn't seem to have an answer (or at least anything they could excute) to a defense lining up and whipping them upfront. I think GT will continue to improve and with a more consistent passing game, will be more dangerous. Of course a better defense will help too. I'd like to ask you guys (especially triple option coaches) what you would have done in Johnson's place? I know it's easy to do the "Monday Morning Quarterback"-thing, but I want to hear what you would do if the defense shuts down your inside run game and plays their assignments well on the outside.
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Post by blb on Jan 6, 2010 11:50:58 GMT -6
I'm not sure/sold on the time thing. Parker is going to do what he does and sit.........he doesn't "scheme" the hell out of any team they play. Missed 1st Quarter, but saw Iowa only use two or three different alignments (DTs mostly), they fired OLBers when Tech got close to goal line - that was about it.
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Post by phantom on Jan 6, 2010 11:55:49 GMT -6
I'm not sure/sold on the time thing. Parker is going to do what he does and sit.........he doesn't "scheme" the hell out of any team they play. I don't think that the extra time was important as far as scheme. I think that the extra practice time is a big help for getting players to play assignment defense at full speed.
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