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Post by groundchuck on Nov 2, 2023 7:51:24 GMT -6
So a school a friend of mine coaches at a school that has roughly 25% of the high school population on an IEP. He told me that about the same percentage of boys on the football team are on an IEP and mostly it is stuff related to LD (Learning disabled). They are a small school and so there are about 40 boys out for football.
How does one adjust to deal with coaching kids who need it simplified, modified, slowed down, etc. They can learn but it takes more time, they forget more etc. When we talk about the game is moving too fast for that kid, it literally is moving too fast for them. I love and believe in match coverages and things like Steeler and Stubbie. But what if kids simply cannot learn it?
What if on the O-Line they just can't be taught we are NOT blocking this guy because we are reading him in the option game. Do they need to have it distilled down to the idea that hey just block the guy in front of you every time and let the RB sort out the rest?
Speaking about how to adjust O and D schemes.
Practice reps.
Film study
Etc etc.
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Post by chi5hi on Nov 2, 2023 11:19:12 GMT -6
For O.Line, use a count system. The Center blocks #0, and everyone on the play-side counts from the Center's block to find their counterpart i.e., #1...#2 #3 etc.
At the very least you get everyone going in the correct direction.
Now, depending on the called play, the Center will be assigned to block Over on certain plays...Right...or left on others. Whomever he calls out is #0.
You can add in a rule that tells the O.Linrmen that when they count, and the guy they counted to is a Linebacker...he should pull toward the play.
Years ago I did that when coaching Pop Warner...and it worked.
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Post by blb on Nov 2, 2023 11:55:46 GMT -6
So a school a friend of mine coaches at a school that has roughly 25% of the high school population on an IEP. He told me that about the same percentage of boys on the football team are on an IEP and mostly it is stuff related to LD (Learning disabled). They are a small school and so there are about 40 boys out for football. How does one adjust to deal with coaching kids who need it simplified, modified, slowed down, etc. They can learn but it takes more time, they forget more etc. When we talk about the game is moving too fast for that kid, it literally is moving too fast for them. I love and believe in match coverages and things like Steeler and Stubbie. But what if kids simply cannot learn it? What if on the O-Line they just can't be taught we are NOT blocking this guy because we are reading him in the option game. Do they need to have it distilled down to the idea that hey just block the guy in front of you every time and let the RB sort out the rest? Speaking about how to adjust O and D schemes. Practice reps. Film study Etc etc. I think you answered your own question. If they can't learn it-retain it and they forget more it has to be cut down to the most basic levels (especially terminology) and re-taught and repped daily. There is no sense trying to do more than they can do well in spite of what you know X- and O-wise as the coach. I once coached at a school where thanks to our JV coach who was a "Resource Room" (SPED) teacher got some kids out who started-contributed that might not have otherwise played. One of them set the school record for TDs and points scored in a season that hasn't been broken yet. Coaching is teaching regardless of the level of your students. |
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Post by bulldogsdc on Nov 2, 2023 12:47:00 GMT -6
Great clinic put on by Madison Co. FL head coach years back about this. I believe he is up in GA now.
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Post by coachd5085 on Nov 3, 2023 4:52:53 GMT -6
What if on the O-Line they just can't be taught we are NOT blocking this guy because we are reading him in the option game. Do they need to have it distilled down to the idea that hey just block the guy in front of you every time and let the RB sort out the rest? What/how are they practicing? If the kids spend a good amount of time hitting a sled dummy thats in front of them, or blocking a guy in front of them during chutes/board drills, it probably makes things much more confusing when you tell someone struggling to comprehend things “ No don’t block this person in front of you” If you start drills on sound (hit, hut, go, whistle etc) it probably makes it confusing to tell a kid to “watch the ball”. |
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Post by wingtol on Nov 3, 2023 5:24:39 GMT -6
Sounds just like the last school we were at and also the district I work in as well. First off just cause a kid has an IEP doesnt mean they are unable to get it. I am sure we all know the range an IEP covers so just like in the classroom you have to find those adaptations that fit the kid. We always would draw plays up, use video, wlak it, and run it as ways to teach a play so you are teaching it across many differnet mediums. Find a kid that gets it and make sure they are helping a kid who might need it on the field with assignment or alligment or whatever.
Sometimes you have to slow it down some or just make it easier, athletic IQ and intelligence IQ can be vastly differnet for sure. Sometimes they get the football part alot more than any classroom stuff. And as always play to their strengths!!
It can be tough when the numbers are that high and you have to remind yourself of that. When the chit show would be begin at times we would just say to each other "27%....27%...." and keep grinding lol
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Post by raider92 on Nov 3, 2023 7:47:12 GMT -6
I taught resource sped and imo the "learning disability" diagnosis is just code for "doesn't like school and doesnt have much structure at home" in most cases.
I've almost always been able to coach those guys pretty much exactly the same as anyone else because as coaches we should be simplifying things across the board anyway.
If the kid really does genuinely struggle to get it then super clear rules are the best tool I've found. Give them an either/or even if the rule isnt 100% perfect for all scenarios it will be better than a kid who's clueless
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Post by groundchuck on Nov 3, 2023 8:07:09 GMT -6
Sounds just like the last school we were at and also the district I work in as well. First off just cause a kid has an IEP doesnt mean they are unable to get it. I am sure we all know the range an IEP covers so just like in the classroom you have to find those adaptations that fit the kid. We always would draw plays up, use video, wlak it, and run it as ways to teach a play so you are teaching it across many differnet mediums. Find a kid that gets it and make sure they are helping a kid who might need it on the field with assignment or alligment or whatever. Sometimes you have to slow it down some or just make it easier, athletic IQ and intelligence IQ can be vastly differnet for sure. Sometimes they get the football part alot more than any classroom stuff. And as always play to their strengths!! It can be tough when the numbers are that high and you have to remind yourself of that. When the chit show would be begin at times we would just say to each other "27%....27%...." and keep grinding lol Absolutely true. Large range. I teach special education myself which is why he was talking to me. Just like in the classroom they can get it, but it can be a bigger challenge. It doesn't mean they don't want to work with those kids. They are just trying to figure out if they are doing it using best practices or not. |
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Post by jg78 on Nov 3, 2023 19:19:38 GMT -6
Truer words have never been spoken.
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Post by tog on Nov 7, 2023 21:48:54 GMT -6
For O.Line, use a count system. The Center blocks #0, and everyone on the play-side counts from the Center's block to find their counterpart i.e., #1...#2 #3 etc. At the very least you get everyone going in the correct direction. Now, depending on the called play, the Center will be assigned to block Over on certain plays...Right...or left on others. Whomever he calls out is #0. You can add in a rule that tells the O.Linrmen that when they count, and the guy they counted to is a Linebacker...he should pull toward the play. Years ago I did that when coaching Pop Warner...and it worked. gawd no poba for this to me line up, know which direction is playside, done no counting for those kids ever |
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Post by coachcb on Nov 8, 2023 12:14:17 GMT -6
So a school a friend of mine coaches at a school that has roughly 25% of the high school population on an IEP. He told me that about the same percentage of boys on the football team are on an IEP and mostly it is stuff related to LD (Learning disabled). They are a small school and so there are about 40 boys out for football. How does one adjust to deal with coaching kids who need it simplified, modified, slowed down, etc. They can learn but it takes more time, they forget more etc. When we talk about the game is moving too fast for that kid, it literally is moving too fast for them. I love and believe in match coverages and things like Steeler and Stubbie. But what if kids simply cannot learn it? What if on the O-Line they just can't be taught we are NOT blocking this guy because we are reading him in the option game. Do they need to have it distilled down to the idea that hey just block the guy in front of you every time and let the RB sort out the rest? Speaking about how to adjust O and D schemes. Practice reps. Film study Etc etc. I've had a similar experience as your friend. We simplified things significantly across the board to accommodate. The OL was still a struggle and I failed to adjust to it. We were using GDB-esk rules for our blocking schemes and it confused the hell out of the kids. And we only had four total blocking schemes. We slowed everything way down, chalked and walked through things on a daily basis and things eventually clicked. If I had listened to you guys and taught tracks,we would've been much, much better. |
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Post by echoofthewhistle on Nov 9, 2023 5:43:06 GMT -6
Because nobody said it.
Academic smart and football smart are completely different and unrelated.
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Post by coachcb on Nov 9, 2023 8:51:15 GMT -6
Because nobody said it. Academic smart and football smart are completely different and unrelated. I respectfully disagree. Although the kids may have more motivation to absorb and retain information in a sport, they're ability to do so will be hampered by a learning disability. And, adjustments need to be made accordingly. We had taught GDP rules to many, many kids with success before I took over at the school. Our OL was riddled with LD kids and I was shocked by how hard it was for them to pick up on them. Hell, they were blowing assignments against static fronts during pre-practice walk throughs three weeks in. Stunt pick-up was a nightmare. We had already made those rules as simple as possible and presented them to the kids in a "best practices" manner. We chalked it, walked it, went through slowly, broke everything down on practice and game film, etc.. etc... But, the moral of that story is that there's almost always a simpler way. Coaches on here suggested that I kick over to down-tracks but I ignored them. We started using those tracks later on and it was astounding how quickly the kids picked them up. |
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Post by tog on Nov 12, 2023 18:38:47 GMT -6
Because nobody said it. Academic smart and football smart are completely different and unrelated. very true but there is also, just dumb no matter what |
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Post by somecoach on Nov 13, 2023 11:54:46 GMT -6
Short choppy 4 word sentences.
I.e.: zone block right?
Guy in gap? get him
No on in gap? create combo
Pattern Math Quarters:
If he runs past the linebackers cover him, otherwise find ball.
at times it won't be perfect but it will be functional.
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Post by jgordon1 on Nov 14, 2023 11:03:47 GMT -6
For O.Line, use a count system. The Center blocks #0, and everyone on the play-side counts from the Center's block to find their counterpart i.e., #1...#2 #3 etc. At the very least you get everyone going in the correct direction. Now, depending on the called play, the Center will be assigned to block Over on certain plays...Right...or left on others. Whomever he calls out is #0. You can add in a rule that tells the O.Linrmen that when they count, and the guy they counted to is a Linebacker...he should pull toward the play. Years ago I did that when coaching Pop Warner...and it worked. I've always had success w a count system |
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Post by jgordon1 on Nov 14, 2023 11:06:59 GMT -6
I'll probably get bashed but fundamentals aren't as important as assignment. Spend more time on who and not on how.
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Post by blb on Nov 14, 2023 11:14:15 GMT -6
I'll probably get bashed but fundamentals aren't as important as assignment. Spend more time on who and not on how. Have to teach OL Who to block first, then How. Missed blocking assignments will kill an offense faster than anything. |
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Post by 60zgo on Nov 16, 2023 13:23:12 GMT -6
I mean.... Read the IEP. It will tell you what the kid needs.
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Post by blb on Nov 16, 2023 14:26:49 GMT -6
I mean.... Read the IEP. It will tell you what the kid needs. Of course. But what do you do in a situation such as OP's with SEVERAL kids who have IEPs that may require different accommodations? How would you practice-teach scheme then? Game plan? His question was not about coaching just ONE kid with an IEP-SPED diagnosis. |
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Post by IronmanFootball on Nov 16, 2023 15:56:18 GMT -6
Went 7-4 at a school where 50% of the school had an IEP/504. Keep in mind at one school where we had 30+ guys with 3.0+ GPA's and dudes go to Annapolis and West Point, I made the calls even easier. "Liz Baltimore" = doubles left base zone left + auto stalk-bubble RPO tag built in.
IEP school: Huddled every time, always had a series of rules, tried to keep base the same year to year.
We blocked nutsack to nutsack on the O and the play had "rip" and "liz" in the call for zone. "ZoRo RIP" "ZuLu LIZ" Zone Left for Zulu. Every run had an auto stalk-bubble to the twins with the solo running a slant to stalk.
We "split field" called the passes at the center. "Doubles Right Slant Hitch REO" = left side runs slant, right side runs hitch. TE always went to the call, RB away (RB can flip with a "strong" call)
Slant and Hitch had rules, if you're the 2nd WR to that side, you run a vert. If it's trips and you're the TE you run an over route to the opposite hash.
Rule breakers were mascot names. We had 2-3 of those. "Nole" = slant-arrow, "Gator" = vert-out
Anything with an option route in it started with an O. Oiler = 6; Ohio = Stick (option hitch inside the out)
We went on set for jet motion (QB called it) and Go for normal plays (center called go). Don't go on 2, just have a dead call. Tell OL to close their eyes. No call = why move?
We had 1 pass protection, and 2 sprint out calls
Pass pro: REO (right for OL, end on the opposite for RB) and LEO
Sprint out: RAM (right for OL, at the man for RB) and LAM
ROB (right for OL, out of backfield for RB) and LOB
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Post by Coach.A on Nov 17, 2023 14:37:42 GMT -6
We have a large number of IEP kids on our roster.
We switched to position specific wristbands a few years ago and have had great success using this system. Each position's wristband tells the player exactly what to do on each play.
For example, if we run Bucksweep Right, the Right Guard's band will say:
"Pull Right & Kickout 1st man outside of W's block".
The Right Tackle's band will say: "Block Inside Gap-Down-Backer"
etc.
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Post by ccscoach on Nov 19, 2023 7:08:41 GMT -6
Set it up like this. Left WR= next best he gets screens, Right WR= best. Y= big wr becomes TE in 21P, H= fullback, T= best runner, Q= best thrower smart kid has to run enough or throw enough. LT= best pass protector, LG= best puller, C= smart kid, RG= strong big kid, RT= strong big kid
Just use wristbands.
Signal the formation then have everyone yell the number of the play or write it on a board whatever you want to do.
Then have your run plays go in one direction. Gap Scheme plays to the right zone scheme plays to the left. Then quite literally the kids up front can just step left.
Rules for any zone run = left gap, right Combo, 2nd level.
Rules for any gap run= left gap, right Combo, backside backer.
Then for anyone doing anything different you just tag their Job on the band. Trap rt, Wrap rt so on.
Same thing for the fullback. Power rt might says Kick rt, Split zone might say Split rt.
WRs it's just whatever route and the depth.
Pass Pro just make it simple.
Man pro
LT= man
LG= man, not there dual
C= man, not there dual
RG= man, not there dual
RT= man
TB/FB= near backer to edge
half slide
LT= man
LG= Covered man uncovered slide weak
C= slide rt (C and LG covered man)
RG= slide rt
RT= slide rt
TB= Left LB to Edge
Gap
LT= slide lt
LG= slide lt
C= slide lt
RG= slide lt
RT= slide lt
TB= rt D gap
FB= rt C gap
You can use all three of these it's just matching hots with the protection that's always a chore.
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Post by 60zgo on Nov 30, 2023 13:58:33 GMT -6
I mean.... Read the IEP. It will tell you what the kid needs. Of course. But what do you do in a situation such as OP's with SEVERAL kids who have IEPs that may require different accommodations? How would you practice-teach scheme then? Game plan? His question was not about coaching just ONE kid with an IEP-SPED diagnosis. Visual Playbooks. Wristbands with Jobs/Skills. Color coded words or symbols. |
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