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Post by Coach Huey on Nov 21, 2005 22:13:05 GMT -6
can't recall the % from that year......but in 1996-1997 Lee was still only 65-67% run team.
my point(s) aren't that the balance is achieved in percentages. it's mainly that i don't see a team getting to 70% pass on a regular basis (entire season) due to many factors. those teams that run it 70% still have that "fear factor" of the pass. Lee had some great TE's during their run too and that guy had to be accounted for.
guess what i'm saying is....athletes make it easy........for those of us without athletes we probably need to develop schemes that will allow us to have answers to what the defense is doing. that is what i mean by balance. not a percentage.
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Post by boblucy on Nov 21, 2005 22:21:12 GMT -6
In the '99 Title game, Lee threw quality passes that were high percentage when they did pass, it was just enough to keep the safeties back.
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Post by tog on Nov 21, 2005 22:25:57 GMT -6
In the '99 Title game, Lee threw quality passes that were high percentage when they did pass, it was just enough to keep the safeties back. that is balanced then at least the perception of balance |
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Post by boblucy on Nov 21, 2005 22:27:08 GMT -6
kw, I did'nt understand you. I gave an example of a high school team that ran on almost every play, got 7 yards a carry, and threw the word "balance" out the window. Then, I gave an example of a college team that refused to go with what worked as opposed to something that was NOT working, just for the sake of balance.....
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Post by boblucy on Nov 21, 2005 22:29:03 GMT -6
You got it, Tog, "the perception of balance". That's the best way to put it.
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Post by tog on Nov 21, 2005 22:30:46 GMT -6
kw, I did'nt understand you. I gave an example of a high school team that ran on almost every play, got 7 yards a carry, and threw the word "balance" out the window. Then, I gave an example of a college team that refused to go with what worked as opposed to something that was NOT working, just for the sake of balance..... maybe they were getting that much running because they were throwing it so much? |
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Post by boblucy on Nov 21, 2005 22:50:57 GMT -6
The high school team had now Chicago Bear Cedric Benson in the backfiled. He ran for almost 3K in 1999. With the talent they had on the O-line and a back like Benson, balance would have been playing into the defenses hands. They were a high percentage passing team, it was rare but it was effective when they did throw it. Miami in the Fiesta Bowl, had the Heisman Trophy winner under center, after his 4th int, I would have just run the ball on every down after that. Penn State made a strategic decision to ALLOW Miami to run!! Under no circumstance were they going to let Testaverde throw, but Miami's OC was stubborn. If the OC for Miami had taken what the defense was giving him, they would have won easily. By staying with the balance theme, and not taking what was there was simply playing into Penn State's hands!!!!!
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Post by DLine06 on Nov 22, 2005 0:49:07 GMT -6
Balance is not about percentages, yards and stats. Balance is achieved when you have an offense that can get you positive yardage from anything the defense can give you.
My high school is a dominant running team that loves the inside zone. We'll line up in the I and run. Splitback, run, 2 TE's with 2 WR's and a RB... run and then play action pass. We played a school in the first round that totally shut down the running game by having their D-Line cut and totally comitting to the run with a Cover 2 scheme. 2nd half, we came out in 2 TE's, 2 WR and 1 RB and just kept hitting them with play action passes. Our QB threw for 5 TD's. We won 38-24.
I believe in the philosophy that my mentor belives in. Run the football. If the plays works, run it again till they shut it down. Go perimeter, inside or run the draw. Once you have the defense overcomitting, hit them with the deep bomb.
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Post by coachcalande on Nov 22, 2005 7:33:24 GMT -6
anyone notice that the Steelers changed their run/pass ratio and started winning again...they have the heaviest run ratio in the league dont they?
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vtjapes
Sophomore Member
Posts: 173
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Post by vtjapes on Nov 22, 2005 7:45:59 GMT -6
guess what i'm saying is....athletes make it easy........for those of us without athletes we probably need to develop schemes that will allow us to have answers to what the defense is doing. that is what i mean by balance. not a percentage. In my humble opinion balance is if you get contributions out of all your skill players, it's not how many runs or how many passes. Rushing through 12 games Rush Attempt / Yds. ..............386 / 2775 Passing through 12 games Comp / Att / Int ....74 / 130 / 1 These are the stats for Lakeland HS in Florida 74.8% run. While I agree that athletes make it easy at the HS level great coaching can be far more benefitial to a program. Sticking with Lakeland as my example (HC Bill Castle is one of the winningest coaches, I think 6th all time, in Florida)....their "greatest" athlete in this span is Rod Smart AKA "He hate me" Cross town rival in the same span has had Ray Lewis, Freddy Mitchell, the backwards kicker Paul Edinger, TE Desmond Clark, and such and Lakeland still pretty much dominates them teaching sound mechanics and making the little talent he does have reach it's maximum potential. Stats for the starting QB Player........./ Att./Comp./Int./Yds./%.../TD/2pt #13 Billy L./ 120/.... 72/...1/.976/60%/10/3 Some will argue that 60% with only 1 INT they should throw more, but I say b/c they run so well and threaten to do it on any down and any distance the defense needs to stay balanced and not over commit. as I said earlier balance has nothing to do with %. My philosophy can be summed up by these quotes... "You want to force the defense to defend the whole field," says Meyer. "All things being equal, anybody can stop the run and anybody can stop the pass. But can you stop both?" "Distributing the ball to all the different skill players is our biggest emphasis," says Leach. "We're not a team that hands it to one guy and throws it to two. We want all five skill positions to touch the ball." "I chuck it down there every so often, just to let people know we'll throw deep," says the Ol' Ball Coach. "If you don't throw it deep, they'll never back up." |
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Post by boblucy on Nov 22, 2005 18:12:42 GMT -6
Speaking of the Dreadnaughts......I saw a Lakeland game on tv, and from my observations, their offense was really good, but it was the Lakeland DEFENSE which scared me just sitting on the couch. I have never in my life seen a defense that fast and explosive on the high school level. No wonder why USA Today has them #1 in the country, although, Carroll in Texas may be just as good, who knows.
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Post by tog on Nov 22, 2005 19:12:09 GMT -6
The North Shore defense from a couple of years ago might be one to take a look at.
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Post by boblucy on Nov 22, 2005 21:06:14 GMT -6
Tell me about North Shore. What type of D did they use? What was their personnel like?
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Post by tog on Nov 22, 2005 21:44:53 GMT -6
Galena Park North shore. Think it was 4-3 based. They could have beat my d1 college team I played on.
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Post by los on Nov 24, 2005 7:54:10 GMT -6
It all gets back to the old football adageof, make um think run then pass or make um think pass then run. I think teams that are perennial winners use this rule of thumb, during every game and at the end of the season it all kind of balances out!
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Post by DLine06 on Nov 30, 2005 23:32:18 GMT -6
Galena Park North shore. Think it was 4-3 based. They could have beat my d1 college team I played on. I agree with tog. The year Galena Park North Shore won the title, they would line up in 2 TE's with 3 RB's. They sent their main RB going to the left while the QB rolled out from center and kept it on the sweep. The QB was the fastest guy on the the team and he outran both his blockers and tacklers. I have a program that most people haven't heard of. This program is in Celina, Texas. Celina is a small 2A school that starts football up in the pee-wee ages. From pee-wee through your senior year, you would learn the plays that the varsity runs. This program at one point won 4 consecutive state championships. They moved up to 3A in which they lost only 2 games. Both teams that beat this school went on to beome state champions or runner-up. This school gets their kids to play in large numbers which is unsual for 2A schools. Primaraily I think and tog correct me if I'm wrong, Celina is a more run first team but can pass whenever. |
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Post by coachcalande on Dec 1, 2005 6:13:41 GMT -6
Celina as in the 10-1 defense?
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Post by tog on Dec 1, 2005 6:14:17 GMT -6
Never seen Celina play other that highlights.
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Post by DLine06 on Dec 4, 2005 21:57:13 GMT -6
I found out some more on Celina...
Celina is the #1 team in 2A for Texas played against the Crawford Pirates, which were the current 2A D2 State Champs and is President Bush's home town.
Celina had 415 yards of offense rushing the ball along with 1 pass for 13 yards. Celina used and this is no lie either, 13 different RB's throughout the game.
I'm not sure but I think Celina is 4-3 but can't swear to it... their bright orange jerseys were like a blur seeing them run the football.
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Post by Coach Huey on Dec 4, 2005 22:00:17 GMT -6
their 10-1 appears to be nothing more than a double eagle 50 or a modified "bear" front. i'm sure it has much more in's & out's than that.
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