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Post by cfoott on Nov 12, 2022 12:03:02 GMT -6
What format do you use to grade players? What do you do if a player is under performing, but you don't have depth behind him? Thanks in advance.
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Grading
Nov 12, 2022 12:37:48 GMT -6
Post by coachwoodall on Nov 12, 2022 12:37:48 GMT -6
The format I liked the best was a points system. It was basically a check list of things you want a player to do (as well as not do) during the course of a game. For each play you simply tallied how many of those actions occurred by each player.
The biggest problem with this is that a player could do everything right on a given play, but not do what was on the list. It is much more outcome orientated in nature.
The reason I liked it more was that the old +/- system could have half your team get a failing grade, but your stud ______ players scored 5 TDs and you won the game ....
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Post by chi5hi on Nov 12, 2022 12:40:10 GMT -6
I never thought it was a good idea to grade players. They're either good enough to be on the field or they're a back up player.
These guys don't want to be graded, they want to go outside after school and play. They're still kids after all!
They get enough grading from their classroom instructors. I want to help them relax a little and forget about classes and grades for a while.
Even if this grading is supposed to be in-house only among the staff, they know.
But, that's just me...and I've been known to be wrong on occasion.
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Post by fantom on Nov 12, 2022 12:42:54 GMT -6
What format do you use to grade players? What do you do if a player is under performing, but you don't have depth behind him? Thanks in advance. If you can't replace a guy there isn't much point grading. Making notes of things to improve would be a better use of time.
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Grading
Nov 12, 2022 12:44:49 GMT -6
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Post by raider92 on Nov 12, 2022 12:44:49 GMT -6
Agree with what's been said above, if you cant replace a guy theres no reason to grade in season imo. We grade at the end of the season and tie it into our end of year evaluations to discuss what a guy needs to improve on and what we are thinking for him for next season.
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Grading
Nov 12, 2022 12:48:09 GMT -6
Post by coachwoodall on Nov 12, 2022 12:48:09 GMT -6
Number: DEFENSE PRODUCTION POINTS Name: Opponent: Positive Points / Times / TOTAL Series (1) First Hit (2) Assist (1) Sack * (3) QB pressure (1) TFL * (2) Batted Ball (1) Forced Fumble * (3) Fumble Recovery * (3) Ball Hawk (1) Big Hit * (3) Big Play * (3) PBU (1) Lock Down (1) INT * (3) Great Execution (1) * represents automatic star Total Positive Points: Negative Points Metal Error (-1) Unnecessary Penalty (-2) Loaf (-3) Total Negative Points: 1 Star every 15 points Overall Total:
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Post by larrymoe on Nov 12, 2022 12:52:30 GMT -6
Coached for 21 years in 7 different programs. Never graded a player or film once.
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Post by coachd5085 on Nov 12, 2022 13:01:12 GMT -6
What format do you use to grade players? What do you do if a player is under performing, but you don't have depth behind him? Thanks in advance. Your second question is why I really don't think most HS programs/coaches would benefit from thinking about the first question. The scenarios where a detailed formalized grading system adds value to a HS program are likely quite rare. Not to mention the added headache/question as to what to do when your player lines up against a superior opponent on Friday Night. How does one grade a cornerback who "does it right" but gets "Mossed"? How do you grade an OL who steps with the correct foot, has low pad level, puts his hands and hat right at the aiming point, and gets stoned by the kid who will be practicing in Athens in the spring as an early UGA enrollee? I could never come up with anything that satisfied myself.
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sbackes
Sophomore Member
Posts: 224
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Post by sbackes on Nov 12, 2022 14:06:20 GMT -6
As an OL coach I use a spreadsheet with OL jersey numbers across the top and play clip numbers on the left side. For each play you earn 1 (job done) or 0 (job not done). Highlight the plays that are “5 for 5s” (1s across the board). The higher percentage of 5 for 5s, the better the unit played and typically the more points you scored. The goal each week is to increase the percent of 5 for 5s each week.
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Grading
Nov 12, 2022 14:49:27 GMT -6
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Post by Defcord on Nov 12, 2022 14:49:27 GMT -6
If you can’t replace a guy all you can do is coach him up.
But as long as you have 12 guys, everyone’s replaceable.
We will stick with a kid that’s trying to do what we are asking pretty long but a kid that’s not trying to do what we need him to gets to hang out on the bench.
As far as grades I prefer correction notes because they are going to make the whole position group better not just the individual.
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Grading
Nov 12, 2022 15:37:33 GMT -6
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Post by newt21 on Nov 12, 2022 15:37:33 GMT -6
As an OL coach I use a spreadsheet with OL jersey numbers across the top and play clip numbers on the left side. For each play you earn 1 (job done) or 0 (job not done). Highlight the plays that are “5 for 5s” (1s across the board). The higher percentage of 5 for 5s, the better the unit played and typically the more points you scored. The goal each week is to increase the percent of 5 for 5s each week. This is similar to what I do, but I also tally minus for a negative on the play if you negatively impact the play aka your dude was in on the tackle or you blew the assignment (doesn’t count against total grade but good to know). I give a neutral if they’re just there, didn’t really. They can also get a +2 for a pancake. Our goal is a 70% grade, you played well if you get 70%, 80% is great and I’ve never given above 90%.
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Deleted
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Grading
Nov 12, 2022 16:54:25 GMT -6
Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2022 16:54:25 GMT -6
Absolutely and not just games. If your best players are not doing what they are suppose to do, they really are not your best players. And that goes beyond the practice field and game night. Every player, whether it is legit or not, needs to be under the impression they have a legit chance to start, earn playing time/practice reps, just as much as the so called studs need to understand they are not guaranteed anything either. 0- you did nothing, you didnt know your assignment, your technique awful 1 - generally speaking you are still awful, but maybe you got close on technique or you went hard or you went in the right direction. 2.- you went in the right direction, you were aggressive or maybe you knew your assignment. 3- you got it all right.
What generally happens is the seniors get it. Nobody gets 3, the good ones will 2.5 The junior may or may not. 1.5-2.4 Soph do know what hit him. Frosh dont know.
And that generally applies to everything. So even if you grade practice, the chances are your best players are going to get it correct more times than not in more way than not.
If you want culture, it has to be understood that talent alone is not enough. Otherwise, the coach, the coaching staff is full of themselves.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2022 18:43:51 GMT -6
I never thought it was a good idea to grade players. They're either good enough to be on the field or they're a back up player. These guys don't want to be graded, they want to go outside after school and play. They're still kids after all! They get enough grading from their classroom instructors. I want to help them relax a little and forget about classes and grades for a while. Even if this grading is supposed to be in-house only among the staff, they know. But, that's just me...and I've been known to be wrong on occasion. I used to believe that grading was essential because my own coaches always did it growing up and posted the results publicly as a motivator. Looking back, the grading system really only motivated a few OL by giving them a stat to talk about. Over my career I’ve gone away from detailed grading for all the reasons you describe. It usually just amounted to a waste of time. I could see obvious mistakes easily enough just from watching the film and make notes to correct those. Pretty soon, I had more than enough key things to work on—there was no point in going further with player-by-player grading on every play except to just torture myself.
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Grading
Nov 13, 2022 18:14:16 GMT -6
Post by blackknight on Nov 13, 2022 18:14:16 GMT -6
Grade using this system: 2 = Exceptional play 1 = Did your job with acceptable technique 0 = Flaw in technique or assignment -1 = Complete Bust / Mental or Physical Make notes on why a 2 or 0/-1 Grading is more about being a tool for improvement.
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Grading
Nov 13, 2022 18:18:01 GMT -6
Post by coachd5085 on Nov 13, 2022 18:18:01 GMT -6
Grade using this system: 2 = Exceptional play 1 = Did your job with acceptable technique 0 = Flaw in technique or assignment -1 = Complete Bust / Mental or Physical Make notes on why a 2 or 0/-1 Grading is more about being a tool for improvement. In what way can a grading system such as this be a superior tool for improvement over simply pointing out mistakes on film and reinforcing successes?
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Grading
Nov 13, 2022 18:52:23 GMT -6
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Post by Defcord on Nov 13, 2022 18:52:23 GMT -6
Grade using this system: 2 = Exceptional play 1 = Did your job with acceptable technique 0 = Flaw in technique or assignment -1 = Complete Bust / Mental or Physical Make notes on why a 2 or 0/-1 Grading is more about being a tool for improvement. In what way can a grading system such as this be a superior tool for improvement over simply pointing out mistakes on film and reinforcing successes? Not this one but I’ve seen other charts that are production charts. I don’t remember any in detail but something like: -2 Critical Error -1 poor technique/missed assignment/loaf 0 didn’t affect play +1 Good Play +2 Tackle +3 TFL +4 Sack +5 Takeaway The rationale would be that you as a coach can gauge how productive a player is. It helps to distinguish who is making big plays. I don’t use it but I can see why some coaches do.
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Grading
Nov 13, 2022 19:16:52 GMT -6
Post by coachd5085 on Nov 13, 2022 19:16:52 GMT -6
In what way can a grading system such as this be a superior tool for improvement over simply pointing out mistakes on film and reinforcing successes? Not this one but I’ve seen other charts that are production charts. I don’t remember any in detail but something like: -2 Critical Error -1 poor technique/missed assignment/loaf 0 didn’t affect play +1 Good Play +2 Tackle +3 TFL +4 Sack +5 Takeaway The rationale would be that you as a coach can gauge how productive a player is. It helps to distinguish who is making big play I don’t use it but I can see why some coaches do. Ok, but how is that a tool for improvement? I have graded and used production chart when coaching D1 football and was fortunate to have competition for playing time. At the HS level though, I have never been blessed to have that level of competition for playing time.
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Grading
Nov 13, 2022 19:53:15 GMT -6
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Post by Defcord on Nov 13, 2022 19:53:15 GMT -6
Not this one but I’ve seen other charts that are production charts. I don’t remember any in detail but something like: -2 Critical Error -1 poor technique/missed assignment/loaf 0 didn’t affect play +1 Good Play +2 Tackle +3 TFL +4 Sack +5 Takeaway The rationale would be that you as a coach can gauge how productive a player is. It helps to distinguish who is making big play I don’t use it but I can see why some coaches do. Ok, but how is that a tool for improvement? I have graded and used production chart when coaching D1 football and was fortunate to have competition for playing time. At the HS level though, I have never been blessed to have that level of competition for playing time. I don’t use it so I can’t say for certain. I’ve pondered it. I think it would help by emphasizing what was most important to the success of the defense to the kids. Then it would also keep the kids motivated to try to accomplish those things that the coaches put on the production chart. I don’t think it would do it as well as giving specific feedback but I do think you get what you emphasize so it’s not a complete waste of time.
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Deleted
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Grading
Nov 13, 2022 21:16:19 GMT -6
Post by Deleted on Nov 13, 2022 21:16:19 GMT -6
If you are entirely sold on playing your best players at all cost, than you cannot complain about depth, practice habits, scout team looks, attendance or your coaches “showing when they can.” Why would anybody show up, do a good job when it wont matter? Your star players have no reason to show up for practice or perform in practice, nor do your backups/scrubs Why would you expect your coaches to show up when the star athlete is exempt from all the rules. Culture is not pom poms, games, players having fun at practice, movie night, football sat. Culture is how business is conducted.
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Post by coachphillip on Nov 17, 2022 16:21:32 GMT -6
Didn’t grade in high school. Never saw the point. The guy is the guy.
Graded in JuCo. ATAK* was the criteria. Alignment. Technique. Assignment. Key Read. * was extra bonus point. Every play was possible 4 points. If you aligned, used proper technique, nailed your assignment, used actions dictated by your key read, and made a huge play then you got 5 out of 4.
Just how we did it. Not very hard. Excel formula did all the math. Total points for a game. Average points per play. Also allowed you to do average points by criteria in a pivot table. Can also use data points to show improved field of play over the course of a season. Example being a player averaged 0.78 points (essentially a 78% score) in alignment through the first five weeks, but bumped to 0.93 points for the last five weeks.
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Grading
Nov 17, 2022 21:17:08 GMT -6
Post by flacoach10 on Nov 17, 2022 21:17:08 GMT -6
We usually grade a game early in the season to provide feedback and then have the players grade themselves on another game. Sometimes it's interesting to see if the way they grade themselves is harder or softer than their coach. Can provide some insight into their mindset.
Always stuck with a simple grading system, + or - for 100% effort, assignment and execution on each play. So 3 possible +'s per play. If a kid played 30 plays then he would have 90 possible +'s. Let's say he had 70 +'s and 20 -'s then his grade would be a 78%.
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Post by s73 on Nov 17, 2022 23:21:41 GMT -6
What format do you use to grade players? What do you do if a player is under performing, but you don't have depth behind him? Thanks in advance. Where I coach now we go over film w/ the kids & they have their own grade sheet. We comment on it and they are asked to" grade" themselves. Reality is they are making their own notes of mistakes they made and need to correct. I like it. Not time consuming and encourages them to reflect on their own performance and put in writing things they need to fix.
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Grading
Nov 18, 2022 9:07:25 GMT -6
Post by coachcb on Nov 18, 2022 9:07:25 GMT -6
I grade out the OL (+/-) but a) I don't make it public and b) anyone who grades over a 90% earns an OL specific t-shirt that the boys love.
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Grading
Nov 18, 2022 9:14:50 GMT -6
Post by wink1111 on Nov 18, 2022 9:14:50 GMT -6
I teach AP US History...I'm always grading something!
Oh wait...not THAT type of grading...sorry...I'll see myself to the door...
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Post by coachklee on Nov 18, 2022 20:49:09 GMT -6
What format do you use to grade players? What do you do if a player is under performing, but you don't have depth behind him? Thanks in advance. Coach him up & MAKE him believe how important his improvement is to the success of the team!!!
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Grading
Nov 20, 2022 11:34:52 GMT -6
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Post by tripsclosed on Nov 20, 2022 11:34:52 GMT -6
Most HS coaches already have enough on their plate, I'd rather take the time that would be spent grading to spend some more time studying the next opponent
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