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Post by carookie on Dec 28, 2021 18:49:21 GMT -6
Today's passing of John Madden got me thinking. I believe playing John Madden Football (the video game) has had a noticeable impact on how I view X's and O's to an extent; and am wondering if this is the case for others.
Disclosure, I am 41 years old, and was playing Madden in one form or another from about '91-'05. And while most of my buddies just ran all verts or toss on offense, I always liked the freedom of motioning one guy, then another, to where I was going to run. If they didnt adjust, I had the advantage. If they did adjust I'd just audible the opposite way.
Moreover, at a time when most teams in the higher levels were almost always 21 personnel and heavy running (and my youth teams were much the same) Madden allowed us to explore different theories. Especially for those couple of versions that allowed you to draw up your own plays.
Ditto on defense, where I'd rarely stick in the base 4-3 stuff, and created my own blitzes and stems.
In any case, I know play design and calls are but a small part of the game, but wondering how many others had a similar experiences?
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Post by larrymoe on Dec 28, 2021 19:40:55 GMT -6
John Madden is a gigantic reason I had/have the interest in football that I do. I could have listened to him and Pat Summerrall announce anything. Between Madden and the 84/85 Bears, that's where my interest in the sport were born. I'd never watched a game before late in the 84 season. The first game I distinctly remember watching was the 84 Bears/49ers game.
And then, the video games started coming out as I got into Jr High/HS and without them I may have never actually played the sport. I had no intention of playing as an 8th grader.
Not a lot of people hold up to your idealized vision of them when you're younger. Madden did for me. It's safe to say he's an idol of mine.
Also, his book was my first time hearing about the Beef House in Covington Indiana. Fantastic steaks there.
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Post by coachdubyah on Dec 28, 2021 19:48:39 GMT -6
He alone began my fixation of drawing up plays much like he did on the TV. Add the video game and I was hooked. Madden has impacted the game as much as the forward pass.
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Post by 19delta on Dec 28, 2021 23:56:01 GMT -6
He always just seemed like a really good guy who loved what he did.
About 20 years ago, I picked up Daryl Stingley's autobiography ("Happy To Be Alive") at a garage sale. There's a great story in there about how much Madden did for Stingley and his family after the game in which Stingley was paralyzed by Jack Tatum. That's my favorite story about Madden.
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Post by larrymoe on Dec 29, 2021 11:01:15 GMT -6
This guy seems like he'd be a lot of fun at parties-
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Post by 19delta on Dec 29, 2021 11:06:37 GMT -6
This guy seems like he'd be a lot of fun at parties- Oof. That's got to be a bit, right? ☹️ |
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Post by 19delta on Dec 29, 2021 11:09:25 GMT -6
This guy seems like he'd be a lot of fun at parties- Great response from this guy... 🤣 |
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Post by spreadattack on Dec 29, 2021 14:12:41 GMT -6
Setting aside the stupid season on twitter, Madden was really an amazing figure - totally authentic, a legit winner and coach, excellent teacher (first to his teams, then to the whole football community). He even spent a lot of time with the video game developers in the early years talking football and helping them figure out how to make the game feel like football, especially in those early 1990s years when the technology wasn't there.
(The original story is that the developers told him that game systems could only handle 7 on 7 at the time, and he said that wasn't football and it needed to be 11 on 11. They told him that would "take years to make," and he said, "Well, then it will take years to make." Two years later they released the first Madden football game -- 11 on 11.)
He was just spooky good at explaining stuff without making you think he was trying to act smarter than you, which was especially valuable when you're young and learning the game. Plus he understood line play, and helped a lot of casual fans appreciate it and those players -- which is hard for many to do.
There's been some fun clips posted recently. I enjoyed this one, which I'd never seen before. (Think about his audience here -- the entire world watching the Super Bowl in the 80s, and he's going to explain the Bear 46 defense.)
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Post by tog on Dec 29, 2021 17:11:08 GMT -6
zero
I loved him like everyone else
but
he brought in the oooooooh ahhhh lowest common denominator espn ization of the game to no end
not sad
the game is worse because of him
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Post by Defcord on Dec 29, 2021 18:24:07 GMT -6
I read in his book that when he first started coaching that he wanted to get experience so he would go to high school games on Friday nights and try to call the game and learn from the experience.
I am too young remember him coaching but his books were entertaining and Kenny Stablers book spoke well of him.
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Post by joelee on Dec 29, 2021 18:53:37 GMT -6
There are thousands of coaches who are better at end end of game and end of half, time management from playing Madden.
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Post by coachd5085 on Dec 29, 2021 19:41:15 GMT -6
zero I loved him like everyone else but he brought in the oooooooh ahhhh lowest common denominator espn ization of the game to no end not sad the game is worse because of him By making the broadcast more entertaining... ?  I have to disagree here. The "game" has been the most popular sport and maintained the same level of popularity it has had since overtaking Baseball in the mid 60s. It could be argued that the more entertaining broadcasts were a major factor in this. |
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Post by larrymoe on Dec 29, 2021 20:08:09 GMT -6
zero I loved him like everyone else but he brought in the oooooooh ahhhh lowest common denominator espn ization of the game to no end not sad the game is worse because of him I suppose he's responsible for the ESPN inaction of basketball, baseball and every other sport too then? This is a horribly bad take. |
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Post by tog on Dec 29, 2021 21:16:05 GMT -6
zero I loved him like everyone else but he brought in the oooooooh ahhhh lowest common denominator espn ization of the game to no end not sad the game is worse because of him I suppose he's responsible for the ESPN inaction of basketball, baseball and every other sport too then? This is a horribly bad take. fine by me |
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Post by fantom on Dec 29, 2021 22:33:49 GMT -6
zero I loved him like everyone else but he brought in the oooooooh ahhhh lowest common denominator espn ization of the game to no end not sad the game is worse because of him OK, I'm having a hard time figuring out exactly what you didn't like about him. |
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Post by tog on Dec 29, 2021 22:54:32 GMT -6
zero I loved him like everyone else but he brought in the oooooooh ahhhh lowest common denominator espn ization of the game to no end not sad the game is worse because of him OK, I'm having a hard time figuring out exactly what you didn't like about him. he was a great coach, I would have loved to talk with him about the badasses I've read all the books about the raiders he was entertaining as an announcer also, I grew up watching him and enjoying it looking back on it I think he inadvertently started the espnization of everything in our mass culture and that is NOT a good thing |
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Post by coachd5085 on Dec 30, 2021 8:50:35 GMT -6
OK, I'm having a hard time figuring out exactly what you didn't like about him. he was a great coach, I would have loved to talk with him about the badasses I've read all the books about the raiders he was entertaining as an announcer also, I grew up watching him and enjoying it looking back on it I think he inadvertently started the espnization of everything in our mass culture and that is NOT a good thing What do you mean by "espnization" of everything? I don't follow. |
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Post by coachd5085 on Dec 30, 2021 9:03:49 GMT -6
What do you mean by "espnization" of everything? I don't follow. Espn-ization No, I understood that part. What does he mean by ESPNization. What does he consider being "ESPNized" to mean? |
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Post by coachd5085 on Dec 30, 2021 9:18:38 GMT -6
No, I understood that part. What does he mean by ESPNization. What does he consider being "ESPNized" to mean? Everything is a highlight, everything is about is about me, Old school espn, sportcenter. When espn was watchable Are you incapable of forming actual coherent thoughts or sentences? What the hell does that second clause have to do with the first? You have been asked COUNTLESS times to at least proofread your posts before sending. I know that is harsh, but damn man. Your first 10 words have nothing to do with the last 8. You consistently make posts that seem as if there are words in your head that don't ever get typed out. And people have mentioned this at least a dozen times. I don't get it. It is a text based message board. If you aren't going to try and communicate effectively, why type anything at all. |
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Post by zach3wr on Dec 30, 2021 11:04:54 GMT -6
I would guess the ESPNization refers to the emphasis of entertainment vs. in-depth analysis. Think of Lee Corso throwing on a mascot head to pick a winner. I think both entertainment and analysis provide great value to the game. Entertainment grows participation and increases the audience, therefore increasing funding for the sport. Analysis keeps the game evolving from a strategic level and helps teach the game to young athletes. Obviously the pendulum can swing too far in one direction (think XFL) or the other.
Madden could take the complicated and simplify it for the common man. 10 year-olds don't need an in-depth treatise on Cover 4 secondary-reads to fall in love with football. But if a former coach can make it exciting and grow the game, even though it doesn't teach me anything new, I'm all for it.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2021 12:06:48 GMT -6
Madden was an incredible announcer and coach. If you grew up with him as THE announcer in the 80s and 90s, he was absolutely incredible and so personable he almost felt like part of the family as he explained the game. I'm grateful I got to grow up with him on my TV.
The Madden video games have influenced generations of coaches from very early ages by helping people to fall in love with the game and start to understand what was going on underneath.
Personally, I wonder how much of the Madden games influenced future coaches to get into no huddle offenses with a few plays, based out of spread sets with mobile QBs, and then run option--you see that quite a bit now, even though it used to be rare IRL but easy to do on the games. That was always the way to win, especially when playing against a friend. A fast guy like Tyrod Taylor running speed option to open grass and possibly going for 200 yards on the ground was a lot more fun on those old games than a drop back passer like Tom Brady.
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Post by spreadattack on Jan 3, 2022 8:14:16 GMT -6
Re: ESPNization of football, it's at least to a degree the price for football being far and away the most popular sport in America, by a large stretch. That popularity directly correlates to more kids growing up playing it, more peewee and high school players, more college players of all levels and stripes.
It's definitely true that if I go to Buffalo Wild Wings on Sunday and listen to the football takes at the bar it's pretty brutal, and I bet if you go to the international curling convention those dudes are purists and can tell you every subtlety of the game, and probably bemoan the know-nothing fans that show up every 4 years when the winter olympics are on and they suddenly become curling fans -- but how many kids grow up playing curling, and even the folks that get into it, how many watched one of those winter olympic curling broadcasts and decided "maybe I'll try that"?
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