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Post by coachnichols on Mar 24, 2007 7:54:28 GMT -6
Question for everyone old and young! With experience or not! Offensive or defensive coaches! Doublewingers or normal people! ;D
ANY TIPS ON MAKING CO-COORDINATORS WORK AT THE HIGH SCHOOL LEVEL?
I need some advice because my attitude about this is not good. Seems to me it's a problem waiting to happen. Any thoughts? Feel free to PM if you would rather, I just need the advice!!!!
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Post by fbdoc on Mar 24, 2007 8:09:01 GMT -6
OVER COMMUNICATE! Make sure both of you know what the other is doing so 1. It gets done and 2. You're not stepping on each others toes. Break down everything from scouting to practice to game plan to play calling. I think one guy needs to be the play caller but he has to LISTEN to the other coordinator who may see something that needs to be taken advantage of. It can work - if both of you want it to.
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Post by CVBears on Mar 24, 2007 12:41:22 GMT -6
Maybe to plan everything together prior to practice, games, etc., so that EVERYTHING was decided ahead of time in a game/no bickering. "The draw comes in this situation and the mesh route comes here." Another way could be to switch who is calling plays each quarter.
I really don't like co-coordinators, but these were just a couple of things that I thought of if I was forced in that situation.
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Post by ajreaper on Mar 24, 2007 13:38:50 GMT -6
LOL, I think Co anythings exsist when the top man cannot make the call on who to give the job to or is worried about upsetting one or the other. In high school I think it's clearly a one man job IMO.
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eric58
Junior Member
Me sparring Bruce Lee back in 79'
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Post by eric58 on Mar 24, 2007 14:00:19 GMT -6
My two friends were both "CO HEAD COACHES" for the freshmen level. It worked out in the beginning of the season but eventually everyone saw who had more knowlege and experience. The next season there was no two coaches.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2007 14:02:47 GMT -6
I can't think of any particular school right off the top of my head, but it seems that a lot of colleges have gone to "run game coordinator" and "pass game coordinator" set ups. I know sometimes comparing this to your situation would be apples and oranges but contacting a school could give you some help.
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Post by coachveer on Mar 24, 2007 15:54:45 GMT -6
I don't know how to be can be co anything..Someone has to have final say on Friday night.
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Post by coachnichols on Mar 24, 2007 16:15:13 GMT -6
Communication will be huge for sure, but does anyone have ideas about how to break it down (duties I mean)? I have heard of offensive co-coordinators ("run game" and "passing game") like wolverine55 said...my situation is defense. I have experience coordinating the 3-5, my fellow coordinator has one year of experience as a position coach at the varsity level. Any thoughts? LOL, I think Co anythings exsist when the top man cannot make the call on who to give the job to or is worried about upsetting one or the other. In high school I think it's clearly a one man job IMO. I totally agree with this. My concern is, like eric58 said, will we have the same situation he mentioned? ("It worked out in the beginning of the season but eventually everyone saw who had more knowlege and experience.") I don't know that that will be good for anyone.
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Post by brophy on Mar 24, 2007 16:22:33 GMT -6
I've done it, and it's not great.
It's nice to be 'team-players' and working together, but ultimately, ONE guy has to make a decision. THAT guy is the coordinator. You can call it what you want (titles) but everybody that helps the coordinator is the "co-coordinator".
I gotta agree with eric58 on this one, man.
It's like having a woman roomate who you aren't dating, or something - it's just an accident / aggravation waiting to happen.
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Post by phantom on Mar 25, 2007 13:46:58 GMT -6
I'm not a fan of co-coordinating situations. One of Clausewitz's principles of war is Unity of Command, meaning that somebody has to be in charge. In the heat of battle somebody has to make the decisions and somebody has to be accountable. I believe that that principle applies to football (or any leadership position) and I believe that cases where co-anythings work are rare.
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Post by fbdoc on Mar 25, 2007 13:53:28 GMT -6
Like I said, one guy really has to be the play caller. Even when the head coach calls the plays, if he is smart, he's taking input from another coach. I think this Co-coordinator stuff is just trickle down from the the NFL... a guy is no longer an assistant coach he's the Assistant HEAD Coach. It's just another way to enhance your resume for the next job!
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Post by phantom on Mar 25, 2007 14:22:13 GMT -6
Like I said, one guy really has to be the play caller. Even when the head coach calls the plays, if he is smart, he's taking input from another coach. I think this Co-coordinator stuff is just trickle down from the the NFL... a guy is no longer an assistant coach he's the Assistant HEAD Coach. It's just another way to enhance your resume for the next job! In the NFL it's more about keeping an assistant on staff. Guys with certain titles cannot move to other teams except for a HC job.
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coachdl
Sophomore Member
"Losers always whine about the their best. Winners go home and..."
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Post by coachdl on Mar 30, 2007 10:15:29 GMT -6
don't forget, at the NFL and college level passing/run game coor. is primarily for breakdowns but they still have ONE coordinator.
I have coached on a defensive staff like this. Currently I just got my own label of CO removed. It is a bad situation. here is the advice I gave my co-coor. and what i looked at my self: -Assume your the coor and act accordingly. -Grab the bull by the BALLS. -Don't assume that the other guy will even share your vision. -The biggest pitfalls we had was the other/inferior co-coor.: schemes were vastly different the me and coor (4-3 vs 35) he was not organized and the KIDS DIDN'T THINK HE WAS THE COOR. - Players believed in the right person. _You are the one with the experience. USE IT. he has only coached one year. my gosh, you may not even know if he's an adequate assistant. let alone co-anything.
You will have bumps in the road. If the HC does not remove the co title, he will want you to incorporate the co into what you are doing. Just know the difference between a question and challenge. this is when it going to get interesting; whether it's with the HC or CO.
Our situation solved it's self. our organization and scheme's and passion won out with everyone: players, parents, fellow coaches. however, the title never was lifted until after the season was over. the HC only brought up the CO when the other guy complained.
PM me if there is anything else I can help you with. I wish you the best in this situation. Stay the course!!!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2007 11:29:24 GMT -6
I was a co-DC and it worked out for one reason: the two of us each had about half a functional brain which made us whole--okay not exactly but sort of. He hated the details, the scripts, the drawing the cards, the organizing practice, the stats, the film cut-ups, etc. but had a great eye for what was going on in the game, made great calls and could see the whole field well. On the other hand I liked putting the package together, doing those little things, scripting, etc. and the like. He loved the booth, I like the field. He was a chart guy, I'm a "they're gonna screen us now" guy. But the essence is that deep down we had the same philosophy and belief. I knew the scheme better, he had a better gameday presence in the calls. I could adjust on the fly with kids on the field, he was great at seeing what needed adjusting and fixing it at halftime. And we went on veto power. If my instinct told me not to blitz and he wanted me to send it in, I'd voice my opinion. I think I did it about 6 times that season and he changed the call every time but one. It worked out the other 5 and the 1 time he didn't change we got beat on screen. He'd ask my opinion on which stunt--do we bring it inside or outside? I'd offer advice, he'd call. Mutual respect. But I think that situation was totally unique and we're both better from it. I'm a better play call guy now which is great because he has since moved on. So my advice (and it sounds totally lame) is to have the 2 guys write down on paper their top 5 areas of comfort and what they most like in the game. Then talk it through. You may find that one guy is absolutely fine not calling the shots on Friday but he'll totally get the crew ready on Monday thru Thursday. You may be surprised to find out that like me and my buddy, you too have half a brain!
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Post by brophy on Mar 30, 2007 14:23:15 GMT -6
I think Co anythings exsist when the top man cannot make the call on who to give the job to or is worried about upsetting one or the other. I just had to echo this
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Post by coachnichols on Mar 30, 2007 14:40:14 GMT -6
I thank all of you for your responses. I hate to say it now that you went to the trouble to help me, but I have removed myself from that situation. I couldn't take the job for MANY reasons (okay, I took it but have since given it back!)
Thanks for all your help! I'm of the opinion that it doesn't (and wouldn't have) worked. I think it would have "worked" but it was not going to be the best situation for the team. One guy should be given the reigns to run with, preferrably a guy with experience. ;D
Thanks again everyone!!!!!
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Post by phantom on Mar 30, 2007 14:55:42 GMT -6
I thank all of you for your responses. I hate to say it now that you went to the trouble to help me, but I have removed myself from that situation. I couldn't take the job for MANY reasons (okay, I took it but have since given it back!) Thanks for all your help! I'm of the opinion that it doesn't (and wouldn't have) worked. I think it would have "worked" but it was not going to be the best situation for the team. One guy should be given the reigns to run with, preferrably a guy with experience. ;D Thanks again everyone!!!!! Don't feel bad about asking the question. That's what the board is for so, even if your specific situation is no longer applicable, it was and remains a good topic.
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