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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2020 19:05:19 GMT -6
I have seen 3 kids, Marginal non power 5 talent, do exactly what you said. I want them to do what they do in cook outs, when i give them rides. “Hey coach, Nice ride..” (200,000 mile Ford F-150 I bought for 3k). “You can afford all of this being a teacher..”(as they are chowing down steak, corn, mash potatoes, chicken, hot dogs, soda, Gatorade to their heart’s content). It is ok to be a janitor. But there is more out there for the kids. Lot more. The saucer eyes when our retired cop tells stories of doing things these kids do in video games (different times). Why would you not want them to go be a cop? Or a nurse? I know from family, nurses are capable of incredible income. A fire fighter, a paramedic, banker, stock traders...i would much rather expose my kids to those things than the guy flipping burgers, or picking up trash. My kids have no idea what those jobs provide. They dont have those examples at home, none of them. So, I am assuming you had the kids do janitorial tasks as part of community service project and that is why those 3 kids were so inspired by doing that service project that they decided to do that as a career? Because that is the concern you are expressing. No, what you are saying is that you had 3 kids who were pretty good football players but didn't have an interest in attending college. What the hell does that have to do with someone having a community service project where the kids may be doing some type of manual labor??? Hell, I would argue that all of the stuff you complain about regarding these types of service projects and community events would be much more likely to expose them to the things you talk about. To show them more is out there than they realize. To show them that being part of a community will benefit them better in the long run than "out to get mine". These kids wont do it. Mandatory or not. If I offer it, it takes them maybe a day to turn into a reason to not be at practice. Church study hall, family reunions you name it. It gets mentioned? Its time To go half ass. Not go to school. On top of that, I am not interested in organizing, being a part organizing, chaperoning it. Not why I am there. And most kids, much less adults, this one included, dont get warm and fuzzy about manual labor, doing something for free.
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2020 19:06:18 GMT -6
So, I am assuming you had the kids do janitorial tasks as part of community service project and that is why those 3 kids were so inspired by doing that service project that they decided to do that as a career? Because that is the concern you are expressing. No, what you are saying is that you had 3 kids who were pretty good football players but didn't have an interest in attending college. What the hell does that have to do with someone having a community service project where the kids may be doing some type of manual labor??? Hell, I would argue that all of the stuff you complain about regarding these types of service projects and community events would be much more likely to expose them to the things you talk about. To show them more is out there than they realize. To show them that being part of a community will benefit them better in the long run than "out to get mine". Seems to me that with all the complaining about kids today being entitled maybe doing some dirty work would be good for them. Its the adults in the room. Not the kids.
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Post by coachd5085 on May 12, 2020 19:57:09 GMT -6
These kids wont do it. Mandatory or not. If I offer it, it takes them maybe a day to turn into a reason to not be at practice. Church study hall, family reunions you name it. It gets mentioned? Its time To go half ass. What does the lack of work ethic in the community have to do with anything being discussed, other than the fact that you don't think the kids would show up. Hell, I would say THAT is a valid reason. Many Title I schools that I know have stopped doing the American Heart Associations "Jump Rope for Heart" fundraiser because the AHA is geared to sending out mass emails and getting credit card / bank card contributions. That doesn't work for some communities. I get that. This sounds like the real reason you think the ideas are foolish. No judgement on your feelings either. I just think one should be honest about it. Isn't that part of the reason FOR doing it? Doesn't have to be manual labor, but could be reading to kids, visiting a nursing home etc. To try and see if any of them DO indeed pick up some warm and fuzzy feelings about helping others. Not arguing for it, again just surprised at the level of "W T F" from other coaches.
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2020 20:29:27 GMT -6
These kids wont do it. Mandatory or not. If I offer it, it takes them maybe a day to turn into a reason to not be at practice. Church study hall, family reunions you name it. It gets mentioned? Its time To go half ass. What does the lack of work ethic in the community have to do with anything being discussed, other than the fact that you don't think the kids would show up. Hell, I would say THAT is a valid reason. Many Title I schools that I know have stopped doing the American Heart Associations "Jump Rope for Heart" fundraiser because the AHA is geared to sending out mass emails and getting credit card / bank card contributions. That doesn't work for some communities. I get that. This sounds like the real reason you think the ideas are foolish. No judgement on your feelings either. I just think one should be honest about it. Isn't that part of the reason FOR doing it? Doesn't have to be manual labor, but could be reading to kids, visiting a nursing home etc. To try and see if any of them DO indeed pick up some warm and fuzzy feelings about helping others. Not arguing for it, again just surprised at the level of "W T F" from other coaches. Kids work when they want to work. When they have reason to work. The deal is to get them to that point. True in football and the classroom. I want kids to arrive at their own conclusions. And yes even if I disagree. I have no problem with the good deeds stuff as long as its the kid who wants to do it, and in its proper place, which is not an athletic coaches job. There are clubs and things that promote and arrange such stuff, not to mention plenty of volunteer opportunities. And if kids want to do stuff, I will not discourage it. I do believe football take to much of a kids time, but its not the football stuff that is time consuming. Its the speeches, its coaches not ready to go, not having a plan, kids have to have their fun. It kids spending time on their phones, its the 7on7 kids talking trash taking their time getting ready to do their reps. Warm and fuzzy belongs in the movies. I think the rah rah stuff, pump up the jam stuff is silly and phony especially pre game stuff.
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Post by 54695469 on May 13, 2020 7:25:52 GMT -6
What does the lack of work ethic in the community have to do with anything being discussed, other than the fact that you don't think the kids would show up. Hell, I would say THAT is a valid reason. Many Title I schools that I know have stopped doing the American Heart Associations "Jump Rope for Heart" fundraiser because the AHA is geared to sending out mass emails and getting credit card / bank card contributions. That doesn't work for some communities. I get that. This sounds like the real reason you think the ideas are foolish. No judgement on your feelings either. I just think one should be honest about it. Isn't that part of the reason FOR doing it? Doesn't have to be manual labor, but could be reading to kids, visiting a nursing home etc. To try and see if any of them DO indeed pick up some warm and fuzzy feelings about helping others. Not arguing for it, again just surprised at the level of "W T F" from other coaches. Kids work when they want to work. When they have reason to work. The deal is to get them to that point. True in football and the classroom. I want kids to arrive at their own conclusions. And yes even if I disagree. I have no problem with the good deeds stuff as long as its the kid who wants to do it, and in its proper place, which is not an athletic coaches job. There are clubs and things that promote and arrange such stuff, not to mention plenty of volunteer opportunities. And if kids want to do stuff, I will not discourage it. I do believe football take to much of a kids time, but its not the football stuff that is time consuming. Its the speeches, its coaches not ready to go, not having a plan, kids have to have their fun. It kids spending time on their phones, its the 7on7 kids talking trash taking their time getting ready to do their reps. Warm and fuzzy belongs in the movies. I think the rah rah stuff, pump up the jam stuff is silly and phony especially pre game stuff. Amen.
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Post by shocktroop34 on May 13, 2020 10:15:09 GMT -6
Men, there is a reason that our legal system has terms such as argumentative and speculation in which objections can be placed. Many of the comments, not in favor of coaches utilizing community service, are basically applying theories under one, if not both, of these two terms.
Argumentation occurs when someone tries to offer a conclusion of what they think happened, instead of allowing facts to determine the outcome. The argumentative positions in this thread are trying to draw an ending, based on little to no evidence, instead of producing facts that would prove a coach is trying to boost his own status.
Speculation occurs when the argument is supported by a flimsy theory, no evidence, or an unreliable source. One coach who sees another coach posting community service projects online can only speculate as to why that person may be doing such.Thus, it holds no argument unless it can be proven that said coach has a specific agenda to earn likes and self-promote. In short, when you speculate you are simply guessing.
So, let's consider the impractical ideas that stem from guessing. Anyone want to guess your wife's weight? Yeah, me neither. Hey, instead of watching film, let's guess how many times our opponent sends pressure on third down. Oh, and don't worry about having your taxes done, just guess how much you owe and send it in. I'm sure they'll be fine with it.
Unless a person has an in-depth conversation with someone who has specific self-promoting ideas, it is an unsafe practice to try to speak to the "operation" of another person's mind (which is also another objectionable term).
Instead, why don't we allow those who (on the surface) appear to do be doing good, allow them to do so without fear of ridicule, as opposed to besmirching their intent before we know the facts.
At the end of the day, I see the same things you guys see. Are there clowns out there? Absolutely. But one could also argue that the acts themselves are still benefiting someone in a positive manner. That fact, in and of itself, it much easier to prove.
The cynicism that has crept into our society has made us skeptical of every good thing that comes down the road. Let's not forget that we are (in large part) talking about high school football. One of the last, yet withering threads, holding together the best parts of American society. If we can't stand in the gap for each other on good deeds, then we're finished and we don't even know it yet.
I'll be the first to call a spade a spade. But until then, let's consider taking the idea of community service at face value and allow it to continue helping the community, regardless of the intent in which it was delivered.
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2020 11:47:29 GMT -6
Men, there is a reason that our legal system has terms such as argumentative and speculation in which objections can be placed. Many of the comments, not in favor of coaches utilizing community service, are basically applying theories under one, if not both, of these two terms. Argumentation occurs when someone tries to offer a conclusion of what they think happened, instead of allowing facts to determine the outcome. The argumentative positions in this thread are trying to draw an ending, based on little to no evidence, instead of producing facts that would prove a coach is trying to boost his own status. Speculation occurs when the argument is supported by a flimsy theory, no evidence, or an unreliable source. One coach who sees another coach posting community service projects online can only speculate as to why that person may be doing such.Thus, it holds no argument unless it can be proven that said coach has a specific agenda to earn likes and self-promote. In short, when you speculate you are simply guessing. So, let's consider the impractical ideas that stem from guessing. Anyone want to guess your wife's weight? Yeah, me neither. Hey, instead of watching film, let's guess how many times our opponent sends pressure on third down. Oh, and don't worry about having your taxes done, just guess how much you owe and send it in. I'm sure they'll be fine with it. Unless a person has an in-depth conversation with someone who has specific self-promoting ideas, it is an unsafe practice to try to speak to the "operation" of another person's mind (which is also another objectionable term). Instead, why don't we allow those who (on the surface) appear to do be doing good, allow them to do so without fear of ridicule, as opposed to besmirching their intent before we know the facts. At the end of the day, I see the same things you guys see. Are there clowns out there? Absolutely. But one could also argue that the acts themselves are still benefiting someone in a positive manner. That fact, in and of itself, it much easier to prove. The cynicism that has crept into our society has made us skeptical of every good thing that comes down the road. Let's not forget that we are (in large part) talking about high school football. One of the last, yet withering threads, holding together the best parts of American society. If we can't stand in the gap for each other on good deeds, then we're finished and we don't even know it yet. I'll be the first to call a spade a spade. But until then, let's consider taking the idea of community service at face value and allow it to continue helping the community, regardless of the intent in which it was delivered. Now you have to give that speech to those who propose, support the idea about those who oppose the idea, my own words, non sense. You cant preach tolerance then be intolerant.
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Post by macdiiddy on May 13, 2020 14:00:14 GMT -6
This time of year our football team has done a community service project in our community in which the players would be "rented" to do yardwork, etc in exchange for a donation to a charity. Has anyone done any kind of "virtual community service" during or before our current situation? Any ideas? Trying to think of a way to get our guys to be able to help in the community while keeping everyone safe. Thank you and stay safe. Since this tread turned into debating the highly controversial issue of community service, I am attempting to give a substantive answer to your question. Now I do not know of anyone doing "virtual community service" but a few ideas that may work with COVID restrictions: -Go grocery shopping elderly individuals. -Have each player operate independently and offer to do yard work for their neighbors. -Communicate with a nursing home to see if they can schedule blocks where a couple of players facetime with those that have not had visitors in a while. -Post a video of a player reading a children's book to that evil social media. Parents can then have their kids watch it, when it is convenient for them. -Organize a service project at a business or school in your community. Have kids sign up for shifts. So the idea would be the team is planting a garden for business A. Tommy shows up for an hour. Then leaves as Johnny shows up. Minimizes contact and still allows you to complete your project. Just some random idea. Good Luck.
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