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Post by larrymoe on Mar 29, 2020 6:19:46 GMT -6
So you're pissed because coaches are asking others thoughts on whether there will be a 2020 season? I don't think anyone here is disregarding or ignorant of the devastation this pandemic has caused on multiple levels, maybe people just want something to look forward to? Nope not at all the wondering if there will be a football season, IMO that's actually a healthy thing to do. My response was towards some of the ignorant comments I just read, I should've specified but I'll just leave it at that. So, the only way to handle this is as you and others dictate and any other idea is ignorance? Cool. It must be awesome being the smartest man in earth. |
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Post by badtotheflexbone on Mar 29, 2020 10:59:31 GMT -6
Nope not at all the wondering if there will be a football season, IMO that's actually a healthy thing to do. My response was towards some of the ignorant comments I just read, I should've specified but I'll just leave it at that. So, the only way to handle this is as you and others dictate and any other idea is ignorance? Cool. It must be awesome being the smartest man in earth. Wait you're right, lets undo a month of isolation and get back to normal all so you can go out to enjoy a movie and eat at restaurants again, that's a MUCH BETTER PLAN |
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Post by clampmaster3000 on Mar 29, 2020 11:56:03 GMT -6
So, the only way to handle this is as you and others dictate and any other idea is ignorance? Cool. It must be awesome being the smartest man in earth. Wait you're right, lets undo a month of isolation and get back to normal all so you can go out to enjoy a movie and eat at restaurants again, that's a MUCH BETTER PLAN Only restaurant I need is my drum barrel grill with a few low grade steaks and a few cracked nattys. That’s the American way |
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Post by bobgoodman on Mar 29, 2020 12:17:33 GMT -6
Were any football seasons canceled for the polio epidemics of the 20th Century? A Google search turns up many stories of seasons or parts of seasons being canceled for polio, but nothing like the breadth and duration of what's being discussed here. |
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Post by bobgoodman on Mar 29, 2020 12:40:07 GMT -6
If this thing passes and the experts think it's good to go then Amen. But, as Herbstreit said in the above article, might be wiser to wait until we have a vaccine. There will either never be a vaccine for this, or it'll take years. Coronaviruses abound. They're estimated to cause 15% of colds. The likelihood is that concern over this one will simply recede into the background, and it'll be lost among all the other viral pneumonia cases. Pneumonia is one of the leading causes of death in advanced countries. There's a vaccine for pneumococcal pneumonia that's somewhat effective, but there are none for viral pneumonias, which are more prevalent. It is possible to produce vaccines for RNA viruses, as evidenced by influenza. Over many years, a desire to produce effective vaccines against influenza have resulted in a routine whereby vaccines are now cranked out in time for the anticipated epidemic strain for the coming season, and the effort frequently succeeds pretty well. It took years to get to that stage. A similar effort long ago to produce a vaccine for rhinovirus, the most common type of common cold virus, produced one that wound up not working, and serious efforts in that direction were abandoned in favor of influenza control. It's conceivable that the attention for this year's coronavirus epidemic will result in a similar effort to produce vaccines against future strains of coronaviruses, but interest in this year's strain will have passed by the time such a program starts to bear fruit. Meanwhile people will just understand that they might any time contract viruses that might cause a cold, and in rare cases will kill them, especially if they're already old and sick. If it's not pneumonia from this cause, it may be from another. It would be silly to shut down civilization over such fear. |
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Post by bobgoodman on Mar 29, 2020 12:55:12 GMT -6
If you think that the only way to have a football season is to do things the way that they're done now you may be right that there's no way to play this year. Things haven't always been done this way, though. I graduated HS in 1970 and old timers like myself and a few others here remember how differently things were done. When football season ended the players moved on. Some played other sports, some got jobs, some just acted like normal teenagers. Coaches may have had a few team meetings and passed out information about how to do things individually to get in shape but few schools had organized programs and those that did ran programs that would be considered laughably half-a$$ed my today's standards. Football started when practice officially started in August. Because players had to practice their way into getting into shape, games started later. That meant that playoffs were shorter. Football season started later because the whole academic calendar started later then. Playoffs were shorter because there wasn't such a mania for playoffs then (I blame the Stanley Cup); some states didn't have them at all for football, and in the others you'd have to be undefeated or nearly so to qualify, and some leagues didn't even send entries to them. |
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Post by stilltryin on Mar 29, 2020 15:21:44 GMT -6
Were any football seasons canceled for the polio epidemics of the 20th Century? A Google search turns up many stories of seasons or parts of seasons being canceled for polio, but nothing like the breadth and duration of what's being discussed here. The worst polio epidemic in the U.S. was in 1916, with 27,000 cases and 6,000 deaths nationwide. Dr. Fauci was on TV today talking about the likelihood of "millions" being infected by this coronavirus, and the possibility of 100,000-200,000 deaths. If that's where the numbers are pointing as we get into the summer, getting through 2020 without high school football will be the least of our worries. |
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Post by larrymoe on Mar 29, 2020 16:19:04 GMT -6
So, the only way to handle this is as you and others dictate and any other idea is ignorance? Cool. It must be awesome being the smartest man in earth. Wait you're right, lets undo a month of isolation and get back to normal all so you can go out to enjoy a movie and eat at restaurants again, that's a MUCH BETTER PLAN I think your perception of why people want this over says far more about you than it does them. Personally, I think it needs to end ASAP because if it doesn't your going to screw this country up beyond recognition. Those people talking about restaurants and sports just want a return to normality as that is all they know. Nothing wrong with that. |
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Post by bobgoodman on Mar 29, 2020 19:08:50 GMT -6
Were any football seasons canceled for the polio epidemics of the 20th Century? A Google search turns up many stories of seasons or parts of seasons being canceled for polio, but nothing like the breadth and duration of what's being discussed here. The worst polio epidemic in the U.S. was in 1916, with 27,000 cases and 6,000 deaths nationwide. Dr. Fauci was on TV today talking about the likelihood of "millions" being infected by this coronavirus, and the possibility of 100,000-200,000 deaths. If that's where the numbers are pointing as we get into the summer, getting through 2020 without high school football will be the tualeast of our worries. OK, those are a guess at the high end on how many might eventually (This year? Next? Over a decade?) get this type of viral pneumonia. In an average year, a million Americans go to the hospital with pneumonias, and 50,000 die of it. So in the coming years, some of those pneumonia cases and deaths will be from Covid-19. People were afraid of polio because it was causing serious cases in all ages, especially the relatively young. Covid-19, not so much. |
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Post by s73 on Mar 29, 2020 21:38:39 GMT -6
The worst polio epidemic in the U.S. was in 1916, with 27,000 cases and 6,000 deaths nationwide. Dr. Fauci was on TV today talking about the likelihood of "millions" being infected by this coronavirus, and the possibility of 100,000-200,000 deaths. If that's where the numbers are pointing as we get into the summer, getting through 2020 without high school football will be the tualeast of our worries. OK, those are a guess at the high end on how many might eventually (This year? Next? Over a decade?) get this type of viral pneumonia. In an average year, a million Americans go to the hospital with pneumonias, and 50,000 die of it. So in the coming years, some of those pneumonia cases and deaths will be from Covid-19. People were afraid of polio because it was causing serious cases in all ages, especially the relatively young. Covid-19, not so much. Alright, some transparency here: Not at all an expert at any of this and am only basing my next comments on what I think, have read, have heard, etc. Yes, everything you are saying is true, that we always have many deaths b/c of these types of things, etc. WHAT I UNDERSTAND to be the difference in this scenario is that we have vaccines, or treatments or familiarity w/ these other things, PLUS we have a greater ability to fight those things off due to immune system familiarity. With the current corona virus, if we took no precautions, due to no immune system familiarity, treatment, etc. the death toll would POSSIBLY be much like the Spanish flu of the early 1900's, not like the usual flu season. That seems to be expert opinion from what I understand. It is b/c of current precaution that it mirrors a typical flu season rather than that disaster from way back when. Again, not an expert but I do know Italy's mortality rate is almost 10% and they are no longer trying to treat anyone over the age of 60. That's a pretty scary situation. Anyway, JMO / understanding of current events. |
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mc140
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Post by mc140 on Mar 30, 2020 0:45:35 GMT -6
If the spring seasons are cancelled, which is looking a lot more likely, I'd prefer to just go back in August and skip the summer. I doubt will be back before the 4th of July if there is summer contact days allowed.
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Post by mnike23 on Mar 30, 2020 6:55:09 GMT -6
school/football, follow a similar path....
we get back to school before june, and how many parents will say "im not letting my kid go and get sick". and what can schools do about it? not much, doubtful if anything. cant fail a kid because parents are scared.
Im afraid we may follow a similar path in the fall, with or without a known vaccine. how many parents will say, "you play football and all that sweat and helmets and touching and shoulder pads and all that, hes not playing I dont want him getting sick". and who could fault that parent?
touching on something else that was talked about, coaching stipends.
i know none of us coach because of the money (unless your a big money state player, texas, georgia, parts of mississippi, alabama,panhandle florida and south carolina), what happens to those big timers making 100k and they dont teach a class and only coach football? Do they still get paid? isnt alot of their paychecks from boosters, say schools pay admin pay (11month AP pay for example is 75k) and boosters throw in 30k on top of that.
if they arent fundraising to help pay the HC, because 'ball was cancelled, how can those guys justifibly get paid?
hoping for the best, I sure do miss seeing the weight room and the green grass. ready for installs and some 7 on 7 and to hear some pads popping.
but fellas,,,,,it sure dont look very good. right now.
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Post by veerandshoot on Mar 30, 2020 7:31:30 GMT -6
I think everything is up in the air and a lot beyond our control. Things need to get back to normal no doubt......but it's tough to talk about how inconvenient things will be for us as coaches and athletes in regards to football, when we see the thousands dying and the health care/front line workers having things in their lives turned upside down everyday.
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Post by s73 on Mar 30, 2020 7:54:20 GMT -6
school/football, follow a similar path.... we get back to school before june, and how many parents will say "im not letting my kid go and get sick". and what can schools do about it? not much, doubtful if anything. cant fail a kid because parents are scared. Im afraid we may follow a similar path in the fall, with or without a known vaccine. how many parents will say, "you play football and all that sweat and helmets and touching and shoulder pads and all that, hes not playing I dont want him getting sick". and who could fault that parent? touching on something else that was talked about, coaching stipends. i know none of us coach because of the money (unless your a big money state player, texas, georgia, parts of mississippi, alabama,panhandle florida and south carolina), what happens to those big timers making 100k and they dont teach a class and only coach football? Do they still get paid? isnt alot of their paychecks from boosters, say schools pay admin pay (11month AP pay for example is 75k) and boosters throw in 30k on top of that. if they arent fundraising to help pay the HC, because 'ball was cancelled, how can those guys justifibly get paid? hoping for the best, I sure do miss seeing the weight room and the green grass. ready for installs and some 7 on 7 and to hear some pads popping. but fellas,,,,,it sure dont look very good. right now. This is exactly how I feel. Would love to have football back but is it going to be something crazy / unmanageable? Rather not rush it and have a full return to normalcy rather than "shoe horn" it in for the sake of having football and it's all crazy. Not to mention, maybe some kids come out and parents are kind of against it, but let them anyway, but then maybe things aren't going great. Built in excuse now. I've been doing this a long time and the concussion situation has already changed the landscape of football so much, changing it even more could make this thing almost unrecognizable to what it was even 5-10 years ago. Maybe I'm being an alarmist, but I would rather take our time and do it right, whatever that looks like I can't say. |
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Post by s73 on Mar 30, 2020 8:07:36 GMT -6
I think everything is up in the air and a lot beyond our control. Things need to get back to normal no doubt......but it's tough to talk about how inconvenient things will be for us as coaches and athletes in regards to football, when we see the thousands dying and the health care/front line workers having things in their lives turned upside down everyday. Have a co-worker from Spain, don't know her any better than saying hello in the halls. But....she emailed the staff a week and half back to say we all need to take this very seriously because her father who lives in Spain passed away and she obviously couldn't be there with him. She said she also has 3 other elderly relatives who are in quarantine with a positive result. My sister - in - law is a nurse in Michigan and is very concerned for her own well being and stressed at the work load they are having to endure right now. It's really a weird situation b/c the President refers to this as a war, but you walk outside on a sunny day & people are walking their dogs, no bombs are dropping, in my neighborhood everyone is trying to be a little more polite when we see each other (from a distance that is) so on the surface things seem "not that bad". But the reality is different, it's just not visible which I think gives some a false sense of security unless they are affected by this directly through their own health or the health of a loved one, or a loss of a job / wages / etc. Then it all becomes pretty real. I guess FOR ME, I hate it when a dad sits in the stands and runs his mouth second guessing all of my decisions b/c frankly he has no idea what's really happening in real time, not to mention what happens at practice, in team meetings, etc. So I prefer not to 2nd guess the EXPERTS who are dealing w/ this stuff. I don't want to be "the loud mouth in the stands". I will humbly do what the experts think is best b/c frankly I know that I don't know. As always, JMO. |
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Post by kcbazooka on Mar 30, 2020 8:19:12 GMT -6
Maybe we’ll do what NASCAR is doing go virtual football. Go Madden - and compete online with the teams on the schedule...
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Post by irishdog on Mar 30, 2020 9:55:35 GMT -6
If you think that the only way to have a football season is to do things the way that they're done now you may be right that there's no way to play this year. Things haven't always been done this way, though. I graduated HS in 1970 and old timers like myself and a few others here remember how differently things were done. When football season ended the players moved on. Some played other sports, some got jobs, some just acted like normal teenagers. Coaches may have had a few team meetings and passed out information about how to do things individually to get in shape but few schools had organized programs and those that did ran programs that would be considered laughably half-a$$ed my today's standards. Football started when practice officially started in August. Because players had to practice their way into getting into shape, games started later. That meant that playoffs were shorter. You know what? There was still football, Some teams were good and some were bad, just like it is today. Maybe the new normal will be the old normal and maybe that would be a good thing. Amen coach! Nice to hear a voice of reason in the football wilderness. Couple of other aspects you left out. We started practices toward the end of August instead of the first of August (even July in some places!) because school started either the last week of August, or the day after Labor Day. Also, in most places the season ended (playoffs/state) around Thanksgiving and the winter sports season started in December, not October. And we all survived. |
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Post by kcbazooka on Mar 30, 2020 10:26:43 GMT -6
I'm definitely older than dirt - I remember having "captain's practice" about two weeks before (actual) two-a-days and that was it. I do think we were in better shape than today's youth as we went outside more than this generation does. I remember the football coaches getting us jobs in the summer detasseling corn for the local farmers to get us acclimated to the heat/humidity.
I was a three-sport athlete and I've said before I don't know if I would have been in today's setup. The demands/requests that all sports coaches put on their athletes in their off-season has gotten out of hand. If you go to football camp the basketball coached is peeved if you miss a weekend tournament. If you play summer baseball the football coach is mad when you miss 7-on-7.
And I remember school and games starting after Labor Day and having eight-game seasons. After the eight games you were done. No playoffs and that was OK. The teams that were good knew it and the teams that were not as good knew it too.
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Post by badtotheflexbone on Mar 30, 2020 10:31:14 GMT -6
Wait you're right, lets undo a month of isolation and get back to normal all so you can go out to enjoy a movie and eat at restaurants again, that's a MUCH BETTER PLAN I think your perception of why people want this over says far more about you than it does them. Personally, I think it needs to end ASAP because if it doesn't your going to screw this country up beyond recognition. Those people talking about restaurants and sports just want a return to normality as that is all they know. Nothing wrong with that. I think we all want the same thing, I just understand there's going to be sacrifices involved due to the current situation. And based on the current experts, the "cycle" of the virus is just in it's beginning phases so let's not undue everything all because everyone wants things back to normal. |
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Post by badtotheflexbone on Mar 30, 2020 10:32:30 GMT -6
Maybe we’ll do what NASCAR is doing go virtual football. Go Madden - and compete online with the teams on the schedule... Have you guys seen the joke that is the WWE? Lol I have to give it to those entertainers though doing all that on TV without any fans and holding a straight face |
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Post by coachd5085 on Mar 30, 2020 10:33:34 GMT -6
And I remember school and games starting after Labor Day and having eight-game seasons. After the eight games you were done. No playoffs and that was OK. The teams that were good knew it and the teams that were not as good knew it too. I think about this scenario often during college bowl season (and now playoff season unfortunately) comes around. Every year talks about a playoff, and now expanding it. Just have a schedule. Play your games. Move on with life. |
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Post by huddlehut on Mar 30, 2020 11:11:42 GMT -6
Just read that Great Britain was implementing 6-months worth of precautions... I know that their climate is different, etc...but that would put us through the end of September.
I'm retired now, but just can't help thinking about the local team here in town. They're likely going to be the best team ever fielded by the high school - with a real shot at a state title - and may not even get to play a game. It's a shame... but what can you do?
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Post by badtotheflexbone on Mar 30, 2020 11:39:22 GMT -6
Just read that Great Britain was implementing 6-months worth of precautions... I know that their climate is different, etc...but that would put us through the end of September. I'm retired now, but just can't help thinking about the local team here in town. They're likely going to be the best team ever fielded by the high school - with a real shot at a state title - and may not even get to play a game. It's a shame... but what can you do? Maybe they'll consider doing a shorten season? Just league games + playoffs? One can hope right |
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Post by s73 on Mar 30, 2020 11:57:15 GMT -6
Just read that Great Britain was implementing 6-months worth of precautions... I know that their climate is different, etc...but that would put us through the end of September. I'm retired now, but just can't help thinking about the local team here in town. They're likely going to be the best team ever fielded by the high school - with a real shot at a state title - and may not even get to play a game. It's a shame... but what can you do? Maybe they'll consider doing a shorten season? Just league games + playoffs? One can hope right This is what I think will happen. Either we get a whole season or a shortened one. I think no season is possible but probably unlikely. JMO. |
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Post by canesfan on Mar 30, 2020 14:27:57 GMT -6
Just read that Great Britain was implementing 6-months worth of precautions... I know that their climate is different, etc...but that would put us through the end of September. I'm retired now, but just can't help thinking about the local team here in town. They're likely going to be the best team ever fielded by the high school - with a real shot at a state title - and may not even get to play a game. It's a shame... but what can you do? That’s kind of like us. Don’t know that we’re a state champion team but this should be our best team. The thought of them not getting to play us hard to think about. |
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Post by 53 on Mar 30, 2020 19:01:03 GMT -6
It will be interesting to see if the state associations can survive the hit on revenue too.
We had to cancel state basketball and all spring sports. If they lose football and fall sports too, can they stay finically afloat with all of their over head
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Post by freezeoption on Mar 30, 2020 19:47:53 GMT -6
State associations will be fine. Ours stopped paying for a lot stuff. They got money.
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Post by bobgoodman on Mar 30, 2020 20:37:42 GMT -6
OK, those are a guess at the high end on how many might eventually (This year? Next? Over a decade?) get this type of viral pneumonia. In an average year, a million Americans go to the hospital with pneumonias, and 50,000 die of it. So in the coming years, some of those pneumonia cases and deaths will be from Covid-19. People were afraid of polio because it was causing serious cases in all ages, especially the relatively young. Covid-19, not so much. Alright, some transparency here: Not at all an expert at any of this and am only basing my next comments on what I think, have read, have heard, etc. Yes, everything you are saying is true, that we always have many deaths b/c of these types of things, etc. WHAT I UNDERSTAND to be the difference in this scenario is that we have vaccines, or treatments or familiarity w/ these other things, PLUS we have a greater ability to fight those things off due to immune system familiarity. There is no vaccine against most viral agents of pneumonia. When someone is said to have gotten "viral pneumonia", that means they got pneumonia from some unidentified virus. Sometimes a known viral infection of the respiratory tract, such as influenza, can progress to pneumonia. In the spring of 2018 I got a bronchiolitis (some would class it as a pneumonia) from what was discovered to be parainfluenza B. There's no vaccine for that. How'd I get infected? Who knows? (Might've been from one of my students, who had a sick baby.) We have a vaccine against bacterial pneumonia (which is caused by a particular agent that can cause other infections), and we have vaccines against epidemic flus; but for the most part we don't try to prevent the spread of viral pneumonia by trying to keep the virus(es) that cause it from being passed around. Instead we just assume such viruses are always going around, and try to keep people from being so debilitated that they get sick from them. |
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Post by s73 on Mar 30, 2020 21:30:31 GMT -6
Alright, some transparency here: Not at all an expert at any of this and am only basing my next comments on what I think, have read, have heard, etc. Yes, everything you are saying is true, that we always have many deaths b/c of these types of things, etc. WHAT I UNDERSTAND to be the difference in this scenario is that we have vaccines, or treatments or familiarity w/ these other things, PLUS we have a greater ability to fight those things off due to immune system familiarity. There is no vaccine against most viral agents of pneumonia. When someone is said to have gotten "viral pneumonia", that means they got pneumonia from some unidentified virus. Sometimes a known viral infection of the respiratory tract, such as influenza, can progress to pneumonia. In the spring of 2018 I got a bronchiolitis (some would class it as a pneumonia) from what was discovered to be parainfluenza B. There's no vaccine for that. How'd I get infected? Who knows? (Might've been from one of my students, who had a sick baby.) We have a vaccine against bacterial pneumonia (which is caused by a particular agent that can cause other infections), and we have vaccines against epidemic flus; but for the most part we don't try to prevent the spread of viral pneumonia by trying to keep the virus(es) that cause it from being passed around. Instead we just assume such viruses are always going around, and try to keep people from being so debilitated that they get sick from them. Perhaps, but I think the issue here is ease of contagion. It is said to be much more contagious than most other corona type viruses with a much higher fatality rate. I think these are the major issues. I don't believe the world would be choosing to shut itself down & commit economic suicide if the experts in the filed didn't feel the alternative was much worse. |
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Post by bobgoodman on Mar 30, 2020 21:55:53 GMT -6
There is no vaccine against most viral agents of pneumonia. When someone is said to have gotten "viral pneumonia", that means they got pneumonia from some unidentified virus. Sometimes a known viral infection of the respiratory tract, such as influenza, can progress to pneumonia. In the spring of 2018 I got a bronchiolitis (some would class it as a pneumonia) from what was discovered to be parainfluenza B. There's no vaccine for that. How'd I get infected? Who knows? (Might've been from one of my students, who had a sick baby.) We have a vaccine against bacterial pneumonia (which is caused by a particular agent that can cause other infections), and we have vaccines against epidemic flus; but for the most part we don't try to prevent the spread of viral pneumonia by trying to keep the virus(es) that cause it from being passed around. Instead we just assume such viruses are always going around, and try to keep people from being so debilitated that they get sick from them. Perhaps, but I think the issue here is ease of contagion. It is said to be much more contagious than most other corona type viruses with a much higher fatality rate. I think these are the major issues. I don't believe the world would be choosing to shut itself down & commit economic suicide if the experts in the filed didn't feel the alternative was much worse. The world doesn't get to choose that. The bosses do. And the bosses get to choose the experts too. |
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