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Post by phantom on Feb 15, 2007 8:53:19 GMT -6
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Post by brophy on Feb 15, 2007 8:55:19 GMT -6
QUICK! GET MY KID AN AGENT!
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Post by superpower on Feb 15, 2007 9:05:03 GMT -6
Certainly doesn't make the job of the high school coach any easier.
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Post by wingtol on Feb 15, 2007 9:16:24 GMT -6
That is all about the $$$$ right there. There is no way to tell how a frosh/soph is gonna pan out. Our 6'4 240 FB this year started out as a 5'9 145 CB his frosh year. I have also seen kids who were animals as frosh/soph then never panned out on the varsity cause they were just the big fish in a small pond. All about $$$$$ if you ask me.
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Post by wingman on Feb 15, 2007 12:50:19 GMT -6
I get a lot of mail like that and toss it immediately.
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Post by Coach Huey on Feb 15, 2007 13:09:06 GMT -6
think it has little to do with "recruiting" or "exposure" and more to do with money. it is not aimed at the kids, it is marketed to the parents as a way to get their kid the exposure for that scholarship ... money maker.
not saying some good doesn't come from it. if people wish to send kids, great. but, the major reason for its existence is that there is a market for it and the organizers are capitalizing on that market.
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Post by CVBears on Feb 15, 2007 13:21:01 GMT -6
What a crock of $&^*. Next thing some jack will do is have a combine for pee wee pop warner players to see what 10 year old team they can get a scholarship for.
its all about $$$ and has nothing to do with the kids
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Post by bulldogoption on Feb 15, 2007 14:14:38 GMT -6
There is some major issues with deifying high school kids. I just read an article saying that the majority of the kids who play on the McDonald's all america basketball game don't pan out to be the superstar they are supposed to. And who's fault is that? Ours for watching it and talking about it. The chat rooms that are about HS sports are the same way. Kids hear adults questioning and criticizing other adult coaches and players all the time on TV, so they do the same thing on a website annonymously.
I know of a morally inept person taking money from parents in order to put their kids name on such a ranking website and placing him in the rankings. It makes me want to puke....but we keep paying more and more money to see Pro and College sports so I don't see it getting any better.
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Post by fbdoc on Feb 15, 2007 16:11:18 GMT -6
Our players will NOT be participating.
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Post by Yash on Feb 15, 2007 16:36:07 GMT -6
Its all about the money, sure a college may pick up some guys from it, and I'm sure that they will show percentages of how many guys go to the camp that get scholarships, but thats just to sucker more kids into paying their cash. If you send out tapes and are a legit player, you'll go somewhere.
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Post by phantom on Feb 15, 2007 17:47:48 GMT -6
All about money? Just because they charge $70?
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Post by ajreaper on Feb 15, 2007 23:59:19 GMT -6
I took 7 kids to it last year and will take players to it this year- and why not? The kids enjoyed it, it really added some motivation and intensity to their off season work as they trained for it and it gave them a look at where they stacked up with other athletes their own age- it opened eyes and motivated them to work hard to improve and in some cases reinforced that their hard work was paying off. 2 of my kids were selected for the super 100 camp and had a great weekend in New Jersey- whether they ever get to college via an athletic scholarship it'll be something they'll remember their entire lives. Why should they wait until their juniors? Wouldn't prior experience and training lead to improved combine results in later years? It's a pretty well run event and the kids enjoy the experience and learn from it- not a bad thing at all.
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Post by wildcat on Feb 16, 2007 7:05:27 GMT -6
I took 7 kids to it last year and will take players to it this year- and why not? The kids enjoyed it, it really added some motivation and intensity to their off season work as they trained for it and it gave them a look at where they stacked up with other athletes their own age- it opened eyes and motivated them to work hard to improve and in some cases reinforced that their hard work was paying off. 2 of my kids were selected for the super 100 camp and had a great weekend in New Jersey- whether they ever get to college via an athletic scholarship it'll be something they'll remember their entire lives. Why should they wait until their juniors? Wouldn't prior experience and training lead to improved combine results in later years? It's a pretty well run event and the kids enjoy the experience and learn from it- not a bad thing at all. I think most of those combines are a complete crock, but I think ajreaper makes a great point...nothing wrong with kids seeing how they stack up. We had a kid a few years ago...decent football player, but nothing to write home about. Anyway, his mom and dad were convinced that Junior was scholarship material and thought that the coaches weren't doing their job because the phone wasn't ringing off the hook with college coaches. So, we took the kid to a combine so he could see what a REAL high school LB was supposed to look like. In almost every event, this kid (again, a solid small-school football player) finished in the bottom 5 and in a few events, he had the worst score of the entire group. I felt bad for the kid because his bubble that had been blown by his parents had been burst, but it was a reality check well worth the $60 or whatever it was. |
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deter
Freshmen Member
Posts: 42
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Post by deter on Feb 16, 2007 7:14:42 GMT -6
Superpower said it best; "it doesn't make our job any easier".
I coach at a middle to upper class school so a lot of our kids have some money, enough money to do crap like this as well as go to any self-proclaimed "joe-blow" who says "I am an expert at whatever". The kid comes back proclaiming how great the "expert" said he was and we have to be the bad guys and remind him that of course he is going to say you're great b/c you're paying him $300.00 per hour of individual instruction!!!
All this stuff does is pull against the concept of "team" that we have to work so hard to instill in kids that are the product of an overzealous, unrealistic, and SELFISH SOCIETY.!!! It's not enough anymore to just have an enjoyable and successful high school football playing experience; now its:
"where's MY ring?"
"where's MY guarantee to the NFL?"
"where's MY scholarship?"
"where's MY awards?"
"where's MY records?"
Any when these don't come (and for most they don't) whose fault is it? OH, YES ITS THE COACHES FAULT!! B/c parents & players have to blame somebody b/c all these self-proclaimed "gurus" said little Johnny was the next great whatever and that coach messed him up!!
Sorry for getting on my soapbox a little but the media, commentators, parents, and exploiters of the game like this underclassman combine really take away from what the game is all about.
NO CHILD LEFT BEHIND DOES NOT APPLY TO ATHLETICS, EVERYBODY IS NOT A SUPERSTAR!!
Peace
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Post by ajreaper on Feb 16, 2007 9:14:15 GMT -6
LOL, How is this event "exploiting" anyone? It's a combine essentially a competition among players in a variety of events- none of my kids were told how great they were or that they were super star material. All the results were posted for the event so every kid and their parents could clearly see where they stacked up both at the combine they attended and at the others held through out the US. Even the two athletes who were selected for the super 100 combine were not unduly praised or made to believe they would end up super stars with D1 college offers by the bushel full. In fact if anything this provides an opportunity to bring some reality to a kid and his parents. And if a kid is truly driven he'll look at his performance, indentify where improvement is needed and work hard to improve. And what's wrong with the eye opener coming as a freshman or sophmore so there's more time to make the strides that may lead them down a road they'd not otherwise have had an opportunity to travel? I think it unprofessional for coaches to simply lump all such things into the "this is bad, it exploits kids and parents and makes our job harder as coaches". LOL, our job is not supposed to be easy- before you pass judgement how about something have some actual knowledge of and experience with that which you choose to condemn. I'm no business expert but I doubt this guy has realized a whole lot of financial upside to this venture of his- he saw a nitch that was not being filled and he's making a huge investment of time and resources to make it work- I'd say let's give him the benefit of the doubt. If it is simply a lets take your money and offer false hopes endeavor it'll die out on it's own.
My guess is I'm the only poster who actually attended a couple of these- if it exploited my kids or I believed it was bad for them I'd never expose them to it.
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deter
Freshmen Member
Posts: 42
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Post by deter on Feb 16, 2007 11:54:57 GMT -6
Coach,
Coach, you're right, I can't honestly speak on something that I have not ever been to. I am speaking more from kids receiving a lot of individual instruction from so-called experts who over-compliment these kids just to keep them coming back to spend more money. If this combine is well-done and this is a lot of good coming from it and not giving kids a false sense of reality about their abilities then accept my apology.
As far as the "exploitation" part, I see a lot of people doing things in the name of "good for high school sports" but I don't see any of them doing them for free. I know we live in a free market system where everybody is supposed to get "theirs" but I think you have to be careful with high school athletes because their dreams make them very vulnerable.
I really respect a lot of these professional athletes who return to their home towns and put on free clinics for kids that no other way could possibly afford a clinic, combine, or any other type of instruction such as this. I wish more people did things like this.
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Post by coachd5085 on Feb 16, 2007 12:19:34 GMT -6
Some of you guys beat me to it. While there are several cons to these type of events, the big PRO is that it is 100% objective. Height, weight, vertical, 40, shuttle...no outside gurus can sugar coat momma and daddy on these. I find them very useful for eyeopeners for parents of solid good high school players.
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Post by CVBears on Feb 16, 2007 14:27:57 GMT -6
but don't you test your kids any way? what is the point of these combines? colleges don't sign/recruit (legally) underclassmen for a reason: so they can develop. Why would anyone care what johnny did in the 2nd grade if he is trying to be a DB and runs a 6.7 40 as a senior? "start creating a name for yourself early" is the official message from the promoters, but the part of the sentence they left out was "...and let us take your money on the way in. By the way, would you like to buy a T-shirt?"
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Post by coachd5085 on Feb 16, 2007 15:00:22 GMT -6
igrook...ah, but the difference is they get objectivley tested against REAL DUDES...
However, if you are close enough to a DI school that has a "meat market" camp over the summer...they are also great opportunities (and you can pick up a few bucks working it too) to show your "all-stars" just where they stood.
Was able to take a couple of kids with delusional parents to both LSU and Auburn camps this past summer... well, lets just say the kids "got it" and were able to tell the parents "umm..mom, dad, there is this different breed of cat........"
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Post by phantom on Feb 17, 2007 9:58:51 GMT -6
igrook...ah, but the difference is they get objectivley tested against REAL DUDES... However, if you are close enough to a DI school that has a "meat market" camp over the summer...they are also great opportunities (and you can pick up a few bucks working it too) to show your "all-stars" just where they stood. Was able to take a couple of kids with delusional parents to both LSU and Auburn camps this past summer... well, lets just say the kids "got it" and were able to tell the parents "umm..mom, dad, there is this different breed of cat........" I respect your opinion and if you see a use, fine. I just worry that it's another step toward basketball, where there's a national ranking list of 11-year olds. |
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Post by coachd5085 on Feb 17, 2007 10:15:48 GMT -6
phantom..don't get me wrong. I wouldn't promote these type of combines. Like I said, I think the GOOD in them is simply to knock the "pretenders" down a peg. Now flip side is also true though...what a pain in the butt these type of things are with the "testers". Players who can run fast, jump high, lift buildings..but just can't play football well. These kids will do great at such combines..and then nag you to death because you can't get them to South Bend.
Would I prefer such combines didnt exist...yes... Aren't the college meat market camps pretty much the same? Yes. But since they both exist, lets look at possible good things that can come from it.
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Post by phantom on Feb 17, 2007 10:26:27 GMT -6
I work a college camp and the way I read the new rules it looks like a lot of the "meat market" part of it is now illegal. I hope so.
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Post by coachd5085 on Feb 17, 2007 10:29:36 GMT -6
phantom...what rules? expound please?
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Post by phantom on Feb 17, 2007 10:33:16 GMT -6
From what I've read college coaches cannot go to combines and, at on-campus camps, cannot do any testing.
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Post by coachd5085 on Feb 17, 2007 10:44:50 GMT -6
When did these rules get enacted? Wasn't last year, or I know a whole heap of Top25 schools that are about to get slammed.
Can you point me to the new rulings?
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Post by phantom on Feb 17, 2007 10:53:33 GMT -6
I can't. I read about it in the paper. I do know that it kicks in this year. I also know that I'll be happy and a lot of D.1 coaches will, too, if that's accurate.
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Post by CVBears on Feb 17, 2007 13:28:22 GMT -6
phantom..don't get me wrong. I wouldn't promote these type of combines. Like I said, I think the GOOD in them is simply to knock the "pretenders" down a peg. Now flip side is also true though...what a pain in the butt these type of things are with the "testers". Players who can run fast, jump high, lift buildings..but just can't play football well. These kids will do great at such combines..and then nag you to death because you can't get them to South Bend. Would I prefer such combines didnt exist...yes... Aren't the college meat market camps pretty much the same? Yes. But since they both exist, lets look at possible good things that can come from it. I see your point coach. I guess I just think that adding a combine like this for underclassmen is adding another un-needed layer of fat to an already quite large hog. But, I definitely see your point of the "good for knocking 'pretenders' down a peg." |
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