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Post by poundit52 on Feb 22, 2019 9:11:15 GMT -6
Can anyone share a credible system they have used or have seen others use to grade players based off of game film? I've been searching the internet for an article or anything and I can't find much. Any ideas?
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Post by cqmiller on Feb 22, 2019 11:31:15 GMT -6
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Post by coachgutz on Feb 22, 2019 12:09:44 GMT -6
We give +/- for each play. Very simple and basic, but were really looking for if the player did their job and did it the right way. If technique was off it can result in -, if effort or footwork was bad it can result in -. If they did what they were supposed to do +. At then end we average their grade. 80% or higher gets an award sticker for their helmet.
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Post by poundit52 on Feb 22, 2019 12:53:15 GMT -6
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Post by Defcord on Feb 23, 2019 5:58:49 GMT -6
On defense we just make a cut up. 10-20 plays with corrections and compliments. We want to find them doing the same skills we emphasize for their position both right and wrong so that they can connect the dots and give us more of the good. Our head coach still wants a percentage grade for our kids because the local media and all star games ask for it. We just make it up, which I don’t mind because even when we were doing +\- grades there was so much ambiguity between coaches that the precise percentage wasn’t as accurate as the number provided.
We still do a +\- grading system on offense cause our head coach likes it. It’s all done on paper. Each play is graded with a + if the play was executed perfectly with great effort. That standard to me is nearly impossible to reach. What does perfect execution and frat effort mean? What if a kid steps with the wrong foot but adjusts and whips a kid because the other guy isn’t as talented, is that perfect? Some coaches give that a - because it wasn’t technically perfect and that step will hurt them against a better player. Sims coaches would give that a + and say it was perfect because you can’t control every little detail and when the kid made the correction that is perfect execution because he did what he had to to make the block.
What I like about a correction and compliment cut up is I get to emphasize what we want from a position with both positive and negative feed back. It takes a lot less time and kids are seeing the notes write on the film instead of a piece of paper. Last year I had family in town from out of state so I didn’t grade over the weekend and a majority of my kids text me Sunday morning and asked when the defensive note would be up. I also coach the offensive line and they never asked about the grade sheet. Not sure what the difference was but to me it meant they at least like to see the film as part of the grading process so this year if we still have to do the +\- for offense instead of using paper I am going to do it right on the screen with hudl notes.
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Post by coachd5085 on Feb 23, 2019 7:26:23 GMT -6
We give +/- for each play. Very simple and basic, but were really looking for if the player did their job and did it the right way. If technique was off it can result in -, if effort or footwork was bad it can result in -. If they did what they were supposed to do +. At then end we average their grade. 80% or higher gets an award sticker for their helmet. What if their effort was great, their footwork spot on, leverage good, technique correct, and they just happen to be playing against a bigger/stronger/faster guy that friday night? |
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Post by cqmiller on Feb 23, 2019 7:27:43 GMT -6
Kid gets a 5 and we ask if he got the autograph of the kid as he whipped his ass...
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Post by Defcord on Feb 23, 2019 14:56:55 GMT -6
Those guys that grade effort, how do you quantify what effort is, besides just knowing it when you see it?
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Post by CoachPut on Feb 23, 2019 16:58:22 GMT -6
I use +/0/-
0 would be doing what you are suppose to do, run the right route, hit the right drop, block the right man, etc.
+ would be above and beyond, extra block, pancake, etc.
- would be penalty (holding, false start), wrong read, route, footwork, etc.
If there was 70 plays and got straight 0's they would grade at 100%, if they have 10 -'s and no +'s it would be 60/70, and 5 +'s with 2 -'s would be 73/70. In theory they can get above 100% but it is harder to get a + than it is to receive a -
You can receive double -'s for "LOAFs" or personal fouls (more "really" bad things)
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jaydub66
Sophomore Member
Varsity D-Line Coach
Posts: 223 
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Post by jaydub66 on Feb 23, 2019 20:36:43 GMT -6
have position coaches use modular stats. A lot of coaches use a check minus check plus, etc system. It tends to become a pretty arbitrary system because you end up just start putting plus or minus on little things you notice rather than the whole picture.
Have the guy coaching QBs have Good decisions, bad decision, accurate, inaccurate
Guy coaching WRs, TEs accurate catch, accurate drop, inaccurate catch, inaccurate drop, hustle plays (blocking down field)
Guy coaching RBs, good decision, bad decision, run efficiency (4 yard run, TDs, 1st down runs added up and divided by the total number of runs. It's a better stat than rushing average)
Guy coaching O-line can grade each player individual on first steps (did they step correctly and make good contact) and then grade the whole group (small, average, big hole, or 2.5+seconds in pass pro)
You can do similar stuff on Defense
Dline - quick off the ball, slow off the ball, good contact, bad contact, etc.
It's just a way to have a complete, objective way to track what groups and players do well and poorly.
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Post by coachgutz on Feb 25, 2019 12:35:37 GMT -6
We give +/- for each play. Very simple and basic, but were really looking for if the player did their job and did it the right way. If technique was off it can result in -, if effort or footwork was bad it can result in -. If they did what they were supposed to do +. At then end we average their grade. 80% or higher gets an award sticker for their helmet. What if their effort was great, their footwork spot on, leverage good, technique correct, and they just happen to be playing against a bigger/stronger/faster guy that friday night? We would give them a plus in that situation. |
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Post by 60zgo on Feb 25, 2019 19:53:24 GMT -6
I got exposed to some new grading methods this past weekend at USA Football Conference. Why do you grade and what are you going to do with it? If you just want to score a result and call kids out on performance then +/- is fine. If you want to drive performance you'll need more data. Met some folks this weekend recording 10+ columns of info for each tackle!!
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Post by cwaltsmith on Feb 26, 2019 10:42:38 GMT -6
Love this... 4 of the 5 are definitively measureable, and finishing is a great way to measure effort IMHO... Love the weekend schedule also... With hudl there is no reason to set in a room for 10 hours as a staff hashing out film... |
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Post by coachcb on Feb 26, 2019 11:20:45 GMT -6
We give +/- for each play. Very simple and basic, but were really looking for if the player did their job and did it the right way. If technique was off it can result in -, if effort or footwork was bad it can result in -. If they did what they were supposed to do +. At then end we average their grade. 80% or higher gets an award sticker for their helmet. This is how we do it. But, we only grade players if they're fighting for a position. We watch each position and make notes on what went well/didn't go well but we'll only quantify it if two kids are fighting for a spot. We have to be careful with our grading though. We'll still give a kid a "+" if they weren't fundamentally sound but made the play. We'll out a note next to the play stating what needs to be fixed. On the flip side of the coin, they'll get a "+" if they did everything right but just got their butt whooped by a better athlete. These are generally rare occurrences given that we're trying to figure out which athlete is better than the other. In the first case, if the kid does everything wrong but still makes the play, he's probably our guy; we just need to coach him up. In the second case, the kid probably isn't fit to be at the spot. |
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Post by drmackey on Feb 26, 2019 14:21:03 GMT -6
I use +/-. If they get a - I explain why. Grade sheets are returned to the players before we share the film with them. I post grades on a bulletin board outside the locker room with game stats. We use it as another way to hold them accountable to each other.
It also helps keep coaches accountable. If kids are all making the same mistake then its my fault. If a player continually makes the same mistake then its my fault. Sometimes I need to communicate more effectively to the position coach. Sometimes we need to do a better job teaching.
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Post by cqmiller on Feb 26, 2019 14:50:03 GMT -6
cwaltsmithThe first time thru figuring out how to grade all 5 categories takes quite a while. We do a "practice run" in the spring with our entire staff using about 40 clips from the season before as well as using film for our 1st opponent the following year, just to teach the new guys how it works and improve our speed if possible. This year we have it setup so that our OL coach has to do the inside 3 (G, C, G), and nobody else has to do more than 2 players of grading. If you can grade a play for both kids in about 90 seconds, you can do a 40 snap offensive game in 1 hour. If you can go faster, you can do more in an hour, or if you go slower it may take you a little longer, but your staff can split the work after the practice-run to make it equal for everyone. This year, I'm gonna try to have the kids grade themselves for at least 10-15 plays and see if I can get them to start thinking like a coach. We'll see how it goes.
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Post by silkyice on Feb 26, 2019 18:58:59 GMT -6
Why not just watch every play with every player and every coach as a team?
Comment when needed. Good, Bad, Ugly, etc.
What exactly does the grade do?
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Post by silkyice on Feb 26, 2019 19:14:27 GMT -6
Why not just watch every play with every player and every coach as a team? Comment when needed. Good, Bad, Ugly, etc. What exactly does the grade do? provides individual feed back. You cannot do that in a film session as a team. You would be their for 2 days. Then it provides one on one time with position coaches. We have done it for the last 8 years. Takes 1.5 hours usually. Do it on Saturday morning. Chick-fil-a biscuits, Krispy Kreme Doughnuts, OJ, and milk. Don’t comment on every player on every play. But praise what needs to be praised, fix what needs to be fixed, and chew what needs to be chewed. |
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Post by fantom on Feb 26, 2019 20:52:59 GMT -6
We have done it for the last 8 years. Takes 1.5 hours usually. Do it on Saturday morning. Chick-fil-a biscuits, Krispy Kreme Doughnuts, OJ, and milk. Don’t comment on every player on every play. But praise what needs to be praised, fix what needs to be fixed, and chew what needs to be chewed. we did that for a time. The problem is kids were to busy bust in chops, walk in around getting food drink. 90 wasted minutes. In the group meeting they will spend time breaking one player and it goes around. Next year we do this with practices. If they were busting chops and walking around it was your fault because, as a coaching staff, you allowed it. |
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Post by cwaltsmith on Feb 27, 2019 7:32:14 GMT -6
Why not just watch every play with every player and every coach as a team? Comment when needed. Good, Bad, Ugly, etc. What exactly does the grade do? We have always done this way, but even when your on top of kids making them pay attention, they pay less attention in big groups... Smaller groups allows more one on one learning and teaching. Just my opinion, but individual feedback is proven to be better than group. |
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Post by cqmiller on Feb 27, 2019 9:12:57 GMT -6
A school around this area is notorious for their 6 hour sunday film sessions where they go thru EVERYTHING from the Friday game with everyone in the room... SO MUCH TIME
But they've won like 12 state titles in the last 20 years... they force the kids to put in the time.
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Post by planck on Feb 27, 2019 9:47:21 GMT -6
This really isn't a direct answer, but personally I don't like grading film. I provide specific feedback on each play, and a summary of feedback. I don't especially care if a kid got an A or a C, I want to tell him the specific things he did right and wrong, and how to fix the wrong things.
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Post by coachdavis11 on Feb 27, 2019 10:52:47 GMT -6
Haven't graded film in a while but when I was on staff that did it was + or -... I thought that it held the kids accountable and they wanted to know what their grade was... 70% was considered winning football... the highest offensive grade was the Attacker (game captain) and the highest defensive grade was the Head-Hunter (game captain also)... Things that got you a minus were missed blocks, interceptions, fumbles, loafing, running by somebody instead of blocking them, missed tackles, getting beat deep on a pass, etc.... a plus was given for making a block or a tackle, interceptions, touchdown runs, (all offensive players got a + for that)... So I guess it really boiled down to results based....
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Post by rosey65 on Feb 27, 2019 11:35:40 GMT -6
I was under a good grading system as a player:
Points:
3 - above and beyond, pancake, exceptional play, etc
2 - successful block w/ good technique
1 - successful block w/ bad technique
0 - unsuccessful block
-1 - chit the bed... pull wrong way, protection miss. etc
Count total number of plays, then double that number for points possible. Grade is what ever percentage they earn out of total points possible. It really helped to focus on successful blocks, being effective, and keeping exceptional blocks in mind.
It's pretty easy to implement about as objective as you can get.
I've never done it as a coach. I dont have the time, nor is there really a reason to grade my kids. I know they suck, THEY know they suck, no one needs to see in writing how bad they actually are. I could see it being used if there were 8+ kids in play to be a starter, but I dont know any HS programs with a wealth of OL like that...
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