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Post by wingt74 on Apr 30, 2007 8:17:58 GMT -6
Hi, my name is Steve, and I'm a draft-a-holic. I love it. GMs BS the media for months, coaches avoid question or give blah answers to "what do you think of this player?"
Suddenly, these guys are on the clock...and all of their strategy is there for the world to see as they chose a QB...showing the obviously don't have faith in their current QBs.
There are no guaranteed stars. (Although...Calvin Johnson looks as sure a pick as there have been in a while)
My team, the Packers. No proven RBs, all kinds of trouble in the redzone scoring. Favre is coming back for 1 last hurrah...and they pick an injury prone DL in the first round. I was disappointed.
Now - as a coach, I ask myself. How do you build a team? And I remember - A good system, an Olineman, a Dline and a QB with leadership.
So I look back and think...ya know? Not such a bad pick.
Thoughts? Any other examples of strategies that look bad to a fan, but from a coaching perspective make sense?
Also - Sleepers? I really like that kid from Rutgers, Brian Leonard. Just seems to make plays and move the chains.
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Post by fbdoc on Apr 30, 2007 8:42:17 GMT -6
As we all put together our own teams (with our coaches) in preparing for a game or a season, NO ONE outside the program such as parents, students, principals and the like really KNOW what is going on with each individual player, what their work ethic is, how tough they are, if they are depressed because they broke up with their girlfriend, or any other factor that goes into you as the coach putting him in the game.
The same is true for drafting a player onto an NFL team. We simply don't know - and neither does Mel Kuiper, Ron Jaworski, the newspaper guys, the radio guys, and especially the fans - all the factors that determone why or why not a player gets picked. Selecting a player in the draft has huge (career making or ending!) ramifications for the coach and GM.
Down here in South Florida, Cam Cameron was BOOOOOOOOED by the fans in attendence when he came out to talk about the Dolphins first pick (Ted Ginn Jr.) when everybody wanted Brady Quinn. Here is something the casaul fan probably didn't know - namely that Terry Shea, the Dolphins new QB Coach was Quinn's private coach for the past 2-3 months as he was preparing for the combines, tryouts, etc. Cam Cameron is one of the QB gurus right now having developed Drew Brees and Philip Rivers into pretty darn good NFL QB's and I think that he should be given the benefit of the doubt. If this brain trust felt that Brady Quinn ws not worth the pick that they had, then how in the heck can the casual fan question it? Oh yeah, they saw Quinn play 5 or 6 games on TV. I don't have a problem with the interest generated by the draft, but c'mon guys... let it go!
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Post by coachcb on Apr 30, 2007 9:01:23 GMT -6
Gotta agree with you there fbdoc, even the most experience draft analyst is a moron when it comes to a lot of these situations. They watch a little film on the kid, look at the combine numbers and then criticize coaches who have been in the game for 3 decades.
As far as Quinn goes, there's a reason he went as late as he did; he's a mediocre prospect at the pro level.
-His arm strength is over-rated. He can't throw the deep outs with zip; the combine went a long way towards proving that.
-He makes poor decisions. During the USC and LSU games, he continually threw into double coverage. He tried to throw flag and fade routes repeatedly against man free and man under Cover 2 situations.
-His stats are a result on great playcalling (Charlie's a stud) and poor defenses.
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Post by wingtol on Apr 30, 2007 9:02:29 GMT -6
Speaking as a Dolophins fan (for the time being at least) I respect their decission not to pick Quinn, But Ginn Jr at 9?  ?? They could have traded down a few spots and gotten some picks or something then taken him later on. I saw plenty of Ohio St. games this year since we live in Big Ten country and I have no idea why they took him 9. |
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Post by CVBears on Apr 30, 2007 9:11:08 GMT -6
Speaking as a Dolophins fan (for the time being at least) I respect their decission not to pick Quinn, But Ginn Jr at 9? ?? They could have traded down a few spots and gotten some picks or something then taken him later on. I saw plenty of Ohio St. games this year since we live in Big Ten country and I have no idea why they took him 9. I was thinking the exact same thing. Even as a huge Notre Dame fan, I still feel that Brady Quinn is extremely over-rated. But Ted Ginn at 9? What about Willis to help out an aging Zach Thomas? Or a DB to help out with all those WR's that division foe NE picked up? |
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Post by wingt74 on Apr 30, 2007 10:32:55 GMT -6
Ginn was the player they wanted for their team. They just so happened to have the 9th pick. They either A. couldn't find a team to trade with to drop down the board or B. Didn't want to drop down in the draft for fear of losing their player.
Like anything else, if Ginn gives them some explosiveness in the return game and is a legit deep threat, it was a great pick.
Same with Quinn. Nobody can say for sure he will be good, great...or bad.
Some questions you will have to find out the hard way.
How will a player repond to a ton of money?
How will a player play when he focuses 100% of his time and energy on football...not having to worry about getting a C in math class?
An interesting note: You have to admit, Notre Dame's offense was pretty good last year right? But, other than Quinn, only one offensive player was drafted in the 5th round or lower (an OT).
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Post by wingtol on Apr 30, 2007 11:52:26 GMT -6
Hey I'm not saying they should have taken Quinn. I just don't get reaching with the 9 pick for a guy who no one has projected as a #1 wr when you have a mess at QB, no O-Line to speak of, and your defense is getting older by the day. Just seemed like a reach to me to take him at 9, esp when he's a speed guy with a bum foot! I saw someone post on a Dolphin board.....Great now we can return the kick to the 35, go 3 and out, and then throw our tired old defense back out there and repeat the whole process.
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Post by brophy on Apr 30, 2007 12:12:26 GMT -6
Game is all about field position.....punt returns are the defense's one shot at an offensive play, make it count.
but
VALUE ---- do you want to commit 15% of your 'budget' to a guy that will only touch the ball 6 - 8 times a game?
Cameron better put in some killer reverses and bubbles for this kid.
As far as the Packers....nothing like getting a bunch of dirt balls in the draft for the second year straight. Well, at least they got Moss......whooops....!!
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Post by coachtimmy on Apr 30, 2007 17:40:37 GMT -6
Ahh, here's the other thing with the Dolphins. They worked out Quinn 3 times in addition to all the time Terry Shea spent with him. And if Quinn was that good then why would all those teams pass up on him? I believe there was a reason that around combine time his "stock was dropping" and fast so I'm not sure it's really THAT big of a surprise.
The thing about Ginn is that his ability of returning kickoffs and punts must have allowed the Dolphins to grade him a little higher than other teams and add to the fact that they lost their only kickoff/punt returner and backup this offseason that was a glaring need for them.
If you look at Randy Mueller's (GM) last 10 drafts, he has hit on every single one of his first pick of the draft. You don't count the one year he was in Seattle and Holmgren picked and with Saban as Saban had the final say because Jason Allen was Saban's pick. So I think you have to trust the man that has a great history of first draft picks the last decade and has rebuilt teams like New Orleans in the past.
Finally, there was a reason Cameron had a Mini-Camp BEFORE the draft (April 13-15th), to see what kind of talent he has on the offensive and defensive side of the ball and evaluate the needs of the team from there.
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Post by coachd5085 on Apr 30, 2007 17:52:33 GMT -6
Gotta agree with you there fbdoc, even the most experience draft analyst is a moron when it comes to a lot of these situations. They watch a little film on the kid, look at the combine numbers and then criticize coaches who have been in the game for 3 decades. As far as Quinn goes, there's a reason he went as late as he did; he's a mediocre prospect at the pro level. -His arm strength is over-rated. He can't throw the deep outs with zip; the combine went a long way towards proving that. -He makes poor decisions. During the USC and LSU games, he continually threw into double coverage. He tried to throw flag and fade routes repeatedly against man free and man under Cover 2 situations. -His stats are a result on great playcalling (Charlie's a stud) and poor defenses. Anyone else see the irony here? Dispute the qualifications of draft analysts in beginning of the post , and then confidently opine on the short comings of Brady Quinn for the remainder? Bottom line, NOBODY knows..lol. Just remember, that EVERY team would have drafted Tony Mandarich if given the chance. Every team with QB needs would have taken Ryan Leaf/Jeff George with the 2nd pick of the draft. I tend to just side with the coaches on these issues. To critique an NFL coach/GM on their draft with the limited information we all have is akin to having mommies and daddies talk about how H.S. coaches would be in the state title game if they would just play timmy at QB like he did in Pop Warner, and run the same defense that Coach Moose ran in the 9-10 year old all-star team. |
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Post by khalfie on Apr 30, 2007 19:32:48 GMT -6
All I know is...
Bears got Chris Leak and Darrius Walker from free agency...
Got to like those pick ups!
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Post by brophy on Apr 30, 2007 20:08:22 GMT -6
I don't know of any team this weekend that had a "bad" draft.....except the Packers (I have no idea what they are doing). Seems like everyone filled needs and got good depth with all their picks.
from the NY Post
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Post by dacoachmo on Apr 30, 2007 20:13:20 GMT -6
can't tell about draft picks until @ 5 years down the road...
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Post by wingt74 on May 1, 2007 7:12:36 GMT -6
I don't know of any team this weekend that had a "bad" draft.....except the Packers (I have no idea what they are doing). Seems like everyone filled needs and got good depth with all their picks. [/quote] If the DT becomes a strong player...it was a good pick. you know 75% of the WRs taken will end up being a bust anyway. So whats the difference? |
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?? They could have traded down a few spots and gotten some picks or something then taken him later on. I saw plenty of Ohio St. games this year since we live in Big Ten country and I have no idea why they took him 9. 
