|
Post by somecoach on Jan 23, 2017 23:23:19 GMT -6
I read on the Glazier Clinic website there is going to be a "Chalk War" at the Atlantic City one.
Has anyone ever attended one of these?
I guess its a literal "whoever has the chalk last contest?"
|
|
|
Post by coachdubyah on Jan 24, 2017 5:54:08 GMT -6
I say we lock a bunch of wing t and double wing guys in there and see who walks out.
|
|
|
Post by bigmoot on Jan 24, 2017 6:59:48 GMT -6
I read on the Glazier Clinic website there is going to be a "Chalk War" at the Atlantic City one. Has anyone ever attended one of these? I guess its a literal "whoever has the chalk last contest?" The room will implode due to the uber-awesomness of the...dare i say it...THE FACEMELTER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
|
|
|
Post by pvogel on Jan 24, 2017 7:12:22 GMT -6
I say we lock a bunch of wing t and double wing guys in there and see who walks out. They'll be extremely disappointed when they have to use expo markers and its not a literal chalk board... lol
|
|
|
Post by pvogel on Jan 24, 2017 7:15:00 GMT -6
And i dunno I've never really enjoyed them. It is all about who has it last. And they all just seem kind of awkward. Way more entertaining and beneficial really when youre just bsing with a guy on a whiteboard in the hotel room with beverages.
I saw one several years ago with Hal Mumme on the board. Moderator kept asking him scenarios and his answer was always mesh. So it offered very little strategy wise. But I did get a lot of info on how to run mesh against everything so that was cool haha
|
|
|
Post by coachfloyd on Jan 24, 2017 7:17:27 GMT -6
weightlifting competition?
|
|
|
Post by **** on Jan 24, 2017 10:54:19 GMT -6
And i dunno I've never really enjoyed them. It is all about who has it last. And they all just seem kind of awkward. Way more entertaining and beneficial really when youre just bsing with a guy on a whiteboard in the hotel room with beverages. I saw one several years ago with Hal Mumme on the board. Moderator kept asking him scenarios and his answer was always mesh. So it offered very little strategy wise. But I did get a lot of info on how to run mesh against everything so that was cool haha Mesh is kind of a universal coverage beater so I could see that.
|
|
|
Post by pvogel on Jan 24, 2017 11:41:22 GMT -6
And i dunno I've never really enjoyed them. It is all about who has it last. And they all just seem kind of awkward. Way more entertaining and beneficial really when youre just bsing with a guy on a whiteboard in the hotel room with beverages. I saw one several years ago with Hal Mumme on the board. Moderator kept asking him scenarios and his answer was always mesh. So it offered very little strategy wise. But I did get a lot of info on how to run mesh against everything so that was cool haha Mesh is kind of a universal coverage beater so I could see that. Ya and Mumme is a fun mix of confident and stubborn. But it was cool in just seeing what he believes in and all the answers to what the DC was throwing at him. The Scenario stuff was odd and not as natural
|
|
|
Post by silkyice on Jan 24, 2017 11:48:29 GMT -6
Is the chalk war more of a question and answer type situation instead of someone trying to best another?
Meaning, it is 3rd and 10, here is the defense. What is your play call? Ok, good call, but what if they do this? Now this? What is your adjustment? Now this?
Or is it who has the biggest piece of chalk contest?
First one sounds cool. Seconds sounds terrible.
|
|
|
Post by **** on Jan 24, 2017 11:58:52 GMT -6
Is the chalk war more of a question and answer type situation instead of someone trying to best another? Meaning, it is 3rd and 10, here is the defense. What is your play call? Ok, good call, but what if they do this? Now this? What is your adjustment? Now this? Or is it who has the biggest piece of chalk contest? First one sounds cool. Seconds sounds terrible. It's the second one. Website says Bruce Cobleigh, Roswell HS, GA: Spread Wing-T (Jet Offense) vs. Donald Davis, Calvert Hall College HS, MD: 4-4 Defense Bruce Cobleigh, Roswell HS, GA: Spread Wing-T (Jet Offense) vs. Gabe Infante, St. Joseph's Prep HS, PA: 4-3 Defense Bruce Cobleigh, Roswell HS, GA: Spread Wing-T (Jet Offense) vs. Aaron Brady, Malvern Prep, PA: 3-4 Defense And others
|
|
|
Post by nhsehs on Jan 24, 2017 12:15:32 GMT -6
I sat in on a "chalk war" with Taylor Mazzone and Pat Fox. I don't remember it perfectly but from what I do remember it was interesting. The moderator did a good job of being specific as far as down/distance, field position, etc
Mazzone would draw up a formation and play and Fox would talk about how he would defend it. Then Mazzone would counter, and then Fox would adjust. Again, I *think* that was how it went.
It was more interesting to hear the dialogue between the two and the thought process behind why they did what they did.
Some of the discussion points centered around personnel. Mazzone would do things knowing he had a great WR, Fox would do things knowing he's playing a HS QB, etc
Overall, it was a nice little changeup.
|
|
|
Post by coachcb on Jan 24, 2017 12:40:00 GMT -6
Lol... This reminds me of the old Whitebboard feature that we used to have on this site.. Sessions in there made the p-ssing matches between us S&C guys look like constructive conversations at a tea-party.
|
|
|
Post by dblwngr on Jan 24, 2017 13:00:12 GMT -6
The only way I would go to this is if I knew both dudes had been drinking.....and would continue to drink through the duration of the chalk war!
At least that's how it's always been done after hours in the hotel lounge when I go to clinics.
|
|
|
Post by **** on Jan 24, 2017 13:40:13 GMT -6
Lol... This reminds me of the old Whitebboard feature that we used to have on this site.. Sessions in there made the p-ssing matches between us S&C guys look like constructive conversations at a tea-party. Top-Down. Ride or die.
|
|
|
Post by Coach Vint on Jan 24, 2017 13:40:35 GMT -6
We have these at every clinic, it just isn't organized. There as a night at THSCA that @coachhuey and tog and @pss will remember well. I believe it was in 2012, and I will just say it just got heated! Two coaches in each other's face going at it!
|
|
|
Post by Chris Clement on Jan 24, 2017 17:48:45 GMT -6
Is there a mediator? I think the offense should win if they can come full circle back to the same play they started with.
|
|
|
Post by jg78 on Jan 24, 2017 18:30:01 GMT -6
Is there a mediator? I think the offense should win if they can come full circle back to the same play they started with. Knowledge being equal, I would think an offensive guy should have the advantage on the chalk board. That's because we're assuming (I suppose) that all offensive personnel is capable of executing the scheme. (The QB can make all the throws, for example.) But also because a huge part of great defensive coaching (more so than offensive coaching) is film study and playing to your opponent's tendencies and personnel strengths / weaknesses. In a competition like this, that's a non-factor.
|
|
|
Post by silkyice on Jan 24, 2017 18:39:02 GMT -6
Offense definitely has the advantage on the board. They have ball and we are assuming (I guess) that they can make all the blocks, execute, know what is going on, and there is no time factor on a chalk board.
Most advantages a defense has are negated on a chalk board.
|
|
|
Post by jg78 on Jan 24, 2017 19:16:23 GMT -6
Offense definitely has the advantage on the board. They have ball and we are assuming (I guess) that they can make all the blocks, execute, know what is going on, and there is no time factor on a chalk board. Most advantages a defense has are negated on a chalk board. Exactly. There are a lot more moving parts (and potential mistakes to be made) on offense compared to defense. On the board, we're assuming all of those intricate moving parts are always working together in harmony, which is hardly the case with 15-18 y/o football players with all sorts of flaws and limitations.
|
|
|
Post by Chris Clement on Jan 24, 2017 21:10:29 GMT -6
Yeah I'd rather see it properly wargamed so the mediators determine stuff like successful blocking, play result, etc and we go through a full game.
Did I just invent football dungeons and dragons?
|
|
|
Post by jturner on Jan 24, 2017 21:42:40 GMT -6
I've heard of something similar where coach a will send film to coach b and they will gameplan one or both sides of the ball. This is done to a) get more practice scouting an opponent and b) having someone that doesn't play you tell you about your tendencies, deficiencies, and strengths you might not think you have. The last one is the most helpful in my opinion. We all know Johnny is a turd, but has the other team found him? Finally, it may also be a good opportunity to bounce some what if/x and o stuff off each other without having to worry about giving away secrets. I've never done this full fledged, but it seems to have it's merits
|
|
|
Post by carookie on Jan 24, 2017 22:15:28 GMT -6
I would rather see two expert position coaches, of opposing sides of the ball, go through a technique war; although I have been in those too and usually its the guy who is doing more than just a walk thru tempo that wins.
Short of that I hope the defensive coach just blurts out, "over cover 7. If my guys execute I win, if not you win." and walk away.
|
|
|
Post by tothehouse on Jan 24, 2017 23:09:07 GMT -6
I think a game of Battleship should be played at the same time. You get a "hit" you get to draw.
|
|
|
Post by larrymoe on Jan 25, 2017 7:50:10 GMT -6
Maybe I'm not "coachy" enough, but I hate this kind of crap.
I had an assistant that would literally get erect at the thought of drawing stuff on the board. He always wanted to do this kind of stuff. Thing he never realized was, we were a school of 180 kids. He can talk all about getting his outside linebacker to stay home on boot, but I know the kid has an IQ of 70 and runs a 5.9 and is a wuss. I'm going right at him as often as I can.
Theoretically, you can do anything with an X and O. Kids aren't Xs and Os though.
|
|
|
Post by **** on Jan 25, 2017 10:20:06 GMT -6
I would rather see two expert position coaches, of opposing sides of the ball, go through a technique war; although I have been in those too and usually its the guy who is doing more than just a walk thru tempo that wins. Short of that I hope the defensive coach just blurts out, "over cover 7. If my guys execute I win, if not you win." and walk away. If my kids defeat all their blocks I win, if your kids execute all their blocks you win. Drop the mic
|
|
|
Post by veerman on Jan 25, 2017 13:32:55 GMT -6
There were some at the AFCA clinic this year. I sat in on Tim Stowers Option vs Josh Ramos 3-4. There was no chalk/white board used. Tim got up and explained how he likes to run the option, and Josh got up there and explained about his 3-4. NO if/then, no adjustments to what the other does....I was very disappointed, but then again I was very disappointed with the AFCA convention as a whole. As far as clinics go it was one of the worst I have ever been to. As a networking stand point it was great, just not what I was hoping for.
|
|
|
Post by newcoryell on Jan 25, 2017 13:42:18 GMT -6
Yeah I'd rather see it properly wargamed so the mediators determine stuff like successful blocking, play result, etc and we go through a full game. Did I just invent football dungeons and dragons? Hmm. I've actually played a really ROUGH version of D20Football........if I remember correctly at the time we had Tom Brady written up as a 15th level character. Oh to be a nerd.
|
|
|
Post by gibbs72 on Jan 25, 2017 14:27:18 GMT -6
I like them just to hear different ideas of how people stop different things.... even if it turns into a p***sing contest at the end. I still get some good ideas.
|
|
|
Post by jg78 on Jan 25, 2017 15:21:26 GMT -6
I like them just to hear different ideas of how people stop different things.... even if it turns into a p***sing contest at the end. I still get some good ideas. Yeah. As long as both coaches checked their egos at the door and turned it in to a good "If you did X, we would try to do Y" kind of talk, it could be productive.
|
|
|
Post by fantom on Jan 25, 2017 15:26:09 GMT -6
Yeah I'd rather see it properly wargamed so the mediators determine stuff like successful blocking, play result, etc and we go through a full game. Did I just invent football dungeons and dragons? Hmm. I've actually played a really ROUGH version of D20Football........if I remember correctly at the time we had Tom Brady written up as a 15th level character. Oh to be a nerd. Hate to say it but if you're throwing out terms like "D20" and "5th level character"..........
|
|