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Post by dacoachmo on Feb 3, 2008 21:09:14 GMT -6
nuff said...
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Post by spos21ram on Feb 3, 2008 21:11:20 GMT -6
Never saw a team win a championship by scoring 0 points though  |
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Post by phantom on Feb 3, 2008 21:23:56 GMT -6
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Post by wildcat on Feb 3, 2008 21:27:30 GMT -6
That Giants pass rush was murderous...
If you were the Pats O/C, what would you have done differently?
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Post by khalfie on Feb 3, 2008 21:36:16 GMT -6
Never saw a team win a championship by scoring 0 points though Defense can score? I thought you knew? Plaxico said his defense would hold NE to 14... who's the dummy now? And another thing... I say we get rid of all of the offensive boards... and just talk defense for the rest of the season! Who's with me? And the '72 Dolphins? And Mercury Morris? ;D |
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Post by spos21ram on Feb 3, 2008 21:41:08 GMT -6
I say you need a good balance of offense and defense to win a championship. A great defense with a poor offense will win you games but not a championship.
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Post by coachd5085 on Feb 3, 2008 21:43:21 GMT -6
Actually--I think Mike Greenburg has this one correct. In the NFL, defense wins you championSHIP....singular. A Hall of Fame quarterback wins you championSHIPS plural.
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Post by theprez98 on Feb 3, 2008 21:43:57 GMT -6
The defense didn't drive 82 yards in 12 plays.
The defense didn't scramble away from an almost sure sack.
The defense didn't make an amazing catch against a helmet.
The defense didn't throw or catch the winning TD.
Give defense its credit, sure. But the offense played just as an important role.
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Post by spos21ram on Feb 3, 2008 21:45:26 GMT -6
The defense didn't drive 82 yards in 12 plays. The defense didn't scramble away from an almost sure sack. The defense didn't make an amazing catch against a helmet. The defense didn't throw or catch the winning TD. Give defense its credit, sure. But the offense played just as an important role. Exactly |
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Post by khalfie on Feb 3, 2008 21:46:03 GMT -6
I say you need a good balance of offense and defense to win a championship. A great defense with a poor offense will win you games but not a championship. Other team can't score... you can't lose! A great defense not only can score, while playing defense, but gives a poor offense so many more, and better opportunities to score. |
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Post by groundchuck on Feb 3, 2008 21:46:29 GMT -6
That Giants pass rush was murderous... If you were the Pats O/C, what would you have done differently? How many screens did they throw to Faulk or Maroney? I guess maybe throw more screens and draws to slow down the rush. That pass rush was relentless. |
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Post by khalfie on Feb 3, 2008 21:48:18 GMT -6
The defense didn't drive 82 yards in 12 plays. The defense didn't scramble away from an almost sure sack. The defense didn't make an amazing catch against a helmet. The defense didn't throw or catch the winning TD. Give defense its credit, sure. But the offense played just as an important role. The defense held the best offense in the NFL to 14 pts... Which allowed the offense to win a game, by putting points on the board 3 times! Offense played a role, but not a just as important role. |
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Post by spos21ram on Feb 3, 2008 21:48:40 GMT -6
I say you need a good balance of offense and defense to win a championship. A great defense with a poor offense will win you games but not a championship. Other team can't score... you can't lose! A great defense not only can score, while playing defense, but gives a poor offense so many more, and better opportunities to score. If don't think the Gianst offense had a huge part of that win then you're crazy. And by the way the Giants defense didn't score |
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Post by wildcat on Feb 3, 2008 21:50:21 GMT -6
It appeared to me that, for some reason (the ankle, maybe?), McDaniels and Belichick wanted to keep Brady in the pocket. I really thought that if they would have booted him out or even just moved the pocket on a half-roll or something, that could have bought Brady some time.
I don't know, though...with that Tuck kid coming up the middle and Omenyuri (sp?) and Strahan coming off the edge along with some well-timed blitzes from the secondary...not sure moving Brady would have done any good.
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Post by spos21ram on Feb 3, 2008 21:50:47 GMT -6
And the 10 minute drive in the first quarter was done by the offense. Kept the Pats off the field. A good ball control Offense is a great defense
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Post by khalfie on Feb 3, 2008 21:52:03 GMT -6
Other team can't score... you can't lose! A great defense not only can score, while playing defense, but gives a poor offense so many more, and better opportunities to score. If don't think the Gianst offense had a huge part of that win then you're crazy. And by the way the Giants defense didn't score I've been called worst... But IIRC, that offense turned the ball over 2? Special Teams put the defense right back on the field after a stop in their territory... how many times did the Pats walk away without any points... Not saying the offense didn't do its part... just wasn't as big of a part as the defense... Its a crime that Manning is the MVP... that D-line won that game... But I do understand... the Mannings are the first family of football, being everyone has this overexaggerated belief in offense. |
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Post by theprez98 on Feb 3, 2008 21:53:36 GMT -6
Offense played a role, but not a just as important role. 2 TD passes in the 4th quarter seems like "an important role" for the offense to play! You need balance to win like the Giants did. Defense didn't win it. Offense didn't win it. A hot team playing like a team won it. |
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Post by theprez98 on Feb 3, 2008 21:54:54 GMT -6
Have we forgotten this is a team game?
And I mean team in the broadest sense. Offense, defense, special teams, coaching, supportive owners...
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Post by dacoachmo on Feb 3, 2008 21:55:36 GMT -6
If the Giants' defense doesn't hold the Pats down then the 17 points by the Giants' offense is not enough to win the ball game.
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Post by spos21ram on Feb 3, 2008 21:56:35 GMT -6
Have we forgotten this is a team game? And I mean team in the broadest sense. Offense, defense, special teams, coaching, supportive owners... Are you the only other rational person in this thread? |
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Post by khalfie on Feb 3, 2008 21:56:58 GMT -6
Have we forgotten this is a team game? And I mean team in the broadest sense. Offense, defense, special teams, coaching, supportive owners... Nope... haven't forgotten... Just trying to remind my brethern, that even though all teams are created equal, it doesn't mean they perform equally.  |
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Post by theprez98 on Feb 3, 2008 21:57:22 GMT -6
If the Giants' defense doesn't hold the Pats down then the 17 points by the Giants' offense is not enough to win the ball game. Yes, and then the offense goes out and scores again. Your argument is not logical, because you're saying "if the Pats get more points, the outcome is different." But allowing the Pats more points, you fail to allow the opportunity for the Giants to also score more points. |
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Post by spos21ram on Feb 3, 2008 21:57:29 GMT -6
If the Giants' defense doesn't hold the Pats down then the 17 points by the Giants' offense is not enough to win the ball game. we could go on forever. If Manning didn't escape that rush and have his WR catch a ball off his helmet then they woouldn't hae won. |
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Post by theprez98 on Feb 3, 2008 21:58:26 GMT -6
Have we forgotten this is a team game? And I mean team in the broadest sense. Offense, defense, special teams, coaching, supportive owners... Are you the only other rational person in this thread? Apparently. I prefer not to drink the kool-aid on either side of the ball. I think deep down even these defensive coaches know it too, but their pride is getting in the way of acknowledging it. |
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Post by Yash on Feb 3, 2008 21:58:47 GMT -6
If I'm the offensive coor. I tell the HC to run a kicker out on 4th and 13 instead of going for it. I think a 47 yarder is a higher percentage play than 4 and 13
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Post by goldenbear76 on Feb 3, 2008 21:59:04 GMT -6
No such things as defenses winning championships...man I'm a huge Giants fan..goin back to the days of Carl Banks, Pepper Johnson, LT..etc..
The Giants offense played wonderful ball control offense, limited a great offense to few possesions, got the game into the 4th quarter, and won with a fantastic catch by David Tyree. The Giants defense did what they needed to, to contain the pats limited possesions. This is what balanced offense is, with a great defensive effort.
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Post by theprez98 on Feb 3, 2008 22:00:12 GMT -6
No such things as defenses winning championships...man I'm a huge Giants fan..goin back to the days of Carl Banks, Pepper Johnson, LT..etc.. The Giants offense played wonderful ball control offense, limited a great offense to few possesions, got the game into the 4th quarter, and won with a fantastic catch by David Tyree. The Giants defense did what they needed to, to contain the pats limited possesions. This is what balanced offense is, with a great defensive effort. Thank you...finally more rationality. |
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Post by wildcat on Feb 3, 2008 22:03:15 GMT -6
If I'm the offensive coor. I tell the HC to run a kicker out on 4th and 13 instead of going for it. I think a 47 yarder is a higher percentage play than 4 and 13 I actually thought that punting in that situation would have been a good call if you didn't think your kicker could make it...the way the Pats were playing in defense at that point, trying to pin the Giants deep and make them go the length of the field seemed like a good decision. I just didn't think that there was any way at all the Pats were going to convert that 4th and 13th the way Brady was playing and the way the NY pass rush was bearing down on him. |
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Post by spos21ram on Feb 3, 2008 22:03:34 GMT -6
I think you can some up what wins championships in one word.....
BALANCE
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Post by dacoachmo on Feb 3, 2008 22:07:44 GMT -6
jeeezzz.....okay, okay...All I am attempting to do is give credit to the Giant's defense, not start a debate of each side of the ball.
How about this, taking into consideration all the factors that can impact a game. (Defense,Offense, AND Special Teams).
The friggin' Giants defense played the best. Yes, the team played great too.
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