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Post by jlenwood on Oct 12, 2015 19:50:39 GMT -6
This is going to be a long post/question/rant...so bear with me.
The community I coach in has changed dramatically over the last 5-6 years. When the recession hit, a ton of people lost their homes and houses went empty. Nowadays, most of those homes are full of renters, and we are talking about small 1000 square foot houses. In other words, houses that can be bought cheap and turned into a rental.
So with the cheap rental housing, a new type of "family" has moved into the community. Before anyone reads anything racial into that, I am talking poor whites. The last I heard almost 70% of the kids in the HS receive a free lunch. Every cop I talk to says heroin is in half of the homes, in other words it has gone downhill fast, as it has become a welfare community.
Herein lies the issue. With so much entitlement going on, with so many single parents or two non-working parents at home, most of the kids are lacking in work ethic, and also a sense of right and wrong when it comes to decision making. When you have parents who exhibit bad, illegal behavior it is not hard to figure out why some of the kids in the school act the way they do.
So my question is, with such a change in the way kids are being raised we are having a lot of "code of conduct" issues where athletes are being kicked out of sports for violating the C.O.C. Most of these kids are just making poor choices because I truly believe they can't make sound "right or wrong" choices. So if anyone else is having these types of issues, have any of your schools modified their code of conduct rules to address the kids you have at this time.
My thought is instead of kicking kids out of sports, give them options such as community service, and not some easy pick up trash type of service, but real "feed the homeless" or work with sick or elderly. Real service that might open their eyes to some of the harsh realities of life when you make some bad choices. The reality is that these kids are not the type of kids that when I was in school, or even my kids were in school, know right from wrong. I could tell a kid 6-7 years ago not to smoke weed or cigs, and they would get it. The kids we have now don't see anything wrong and they don't make that distinction of right/wrong like kids did 5-10 years ago.
So do you think we should change our COC rules to adapt and try to educate these kids, or just stick with what has been done in the past and hope they learn by punishment?
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Post by lions23 on Oct 12, 2015 20:56:28 GMT -6
I think you have to find ways to teach the rights and wrongs within your program. You can't do that if kids are getting kicked off and they aren't with you.
I have known about kids making poor choices but maybe onlookers other way and try to find ways to teach and help the kid. Administrations aren't going to change those kinds of rules. Now if a minis in trouble for doing something and gets caught by school or police there isn't much you can do.
However if you truly believe that the kids don't know any better our most important job is to teach. Like I said you can't do that if he isn't there. So these are instances we refer to at my very tough school as using your professional discretion.
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Post by PSS on Oct 13, 2015 5:54:24 GMT -6
IMO, When the action is being condoned at home it's our responsibility to teach them the difference between right and wrong. If not then our society will never improve.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 13, 2015 6:00:31 GMT -6
So much of this i cultural rot. Without a roots movement, nothing to do with politics, you are sort of fighting a losing battle.
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Post by wingtol on Oct 13, 2015 6:24:02 GMT -6
First start here coachcharacter.com/Best stuff out there if you ask me, been using it for years and its outstanding! Second I feel your pain. We have been talking about this as coaches as well with our team. Our grade policy and other policies are way to punitive for the community we coach in. It's a good place but literally is split down the middle of the good side and the bad side of town (it's small too like 2x2 miles big district). Lots of heroin going around as well. So we get kids in high risk situations all the time and unfortunately they are the ones who suffer the most from these policies. We have kids who are allowed no contact with the team if their grades are bad, not saying they should play but they need to be around doing stuff like water cleaning up etc. It just blows my mind that our board is so proud of their policy that they ignore the kids who need to be involved in stuff the most are pushed out to the streets by their stupidity. As it's been said on here before some kids need football more than football needs them. It just kills me that we are forced to send kids home who need to be around good male role models and be in safe situations because of stupid policies that make no sense. I remember a kid showing up to go to an away game and being told can't go right in front of the bus. Kid had tears running down his face as we pulled away. His dad dropped dead a few years ago, family has nothing, kid has to miss sometimes to baby sit his kdg sister so mom can work, like out HC said what do they think he's gonna do go home and study?!?! He needs to be around and safe. It's not all just academics either we have had some COC problems as well, like you said for the most part kids making dumb choices and getting caught. Just blows my mind how quick in high risk areas people are to throw kids to the wolves. |
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Post by chi5hi on Oct 13, 2015 8:05:27 GMT -6
There's a sad attitude of entitlement out there. In some communities Mom and Dad (if there is a dad at home) have it, and pass it down to the children.
Be the best coach/mentor you know how to be. You can't change a lot of things, but sometimes you can inspire. I coached a kid through high school, he went on to D1 ball in college, graduated and was drafted into Professional football. He entered the world of drugs and crime and is now in prison. Where did the failure happen?
You do what you can, but ultimately a person's life is his own responsibility.
Part of why I love this profession is because my colleagues actually care about their kids, as is evidenced by the thread above. Here is where an individual earns the title of "Coach" because its more than X's and O's.
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Post by coachphillip on Oct 13, 2015 8:20:18 GMT -6
I've been thinking long and hard about this too, coach. I sometimes wonder if I'm naive because I firmly believe that almost every kid I coach is a good kid who just needs to get his head on straight. Maybe I'll keep believing that until I get burned enough times to change my mind. But, I think I agree with the sentiment from others, you can't help kids who aren't there.
Our kids are quitters. They get it from their parents. Their parents quit whenever things get rough. Their parents quit on marriages and leave their spouses and children. Their parents quit on relationships with them and leave them to fend for themselves. Their parents quit jobs even though their families need them to maintain stable incomes. Their parents quit fighting for sobriety and give in to the pull of drugs. Our kids learn to quit early and often. We are often times the only adults who challenge them to be better than that and we end up becoming "one of the haters". So, what do we do when we catch them falling off the path? We send them home to the idiots who messed them up in the first place!
I don't think we should change the standard, but we definitely need to adjust the way we go about upholding the standard. We need to create an atmosphere within our teams that make them want to be there because it's a place of love and growth. But, we also need to push them to grow. I'm just rambling now. Trying to figure out what to do about my starting SS who lives in a shelter for at risk youth in Oakland. Tough situation.
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Post by PSS on Oct 13, 2015 8:37:24 GMT -6
The Team is all that many have. Building a culture of success of not only winning but being successful in school. That's just as important as winning. Sure, losing will get you fired but not having the best interest of your players is morally wrong. You have to do what's best for them. Make sure they graduate. Help them get out of the situation they're in whether it's going on to a trade school, college, or the military.
Our district drug test our kids. If positive we don't throw them out. They have to sit for 6 months until they are clean, plus an alternative school assignment. They are welcomed back with opened arms, with a clean slate. We teach have a semi-rehab that they go through that teaches them to make the right choices. Since I have been here we have only had one kid test positive. They hold each other accountable.
I have had several kids choose the military route. They finish serving and use their GI bill to get their education. Whatever it takes to get them out of their neighborhoods and into the world to be productive citizens.
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Post by fbs on Oct 13, 2015 9:09:04 GMT -6
I've done the at risk thing for most of my career, be it poor white kids or inner city minorities. one thing is for certain, you'll never change a thing if they don't trust you. the key is that the period you have them needs to be the best part of their day. once you have that type of relationship with your kids, they will do anything for you, and that includes changing their behaviors when they are away from you.
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Post by jlenwood on Oct 13, 2015 10:39:56 GMT -6
Thankfully we have some members of our BOE who are actually looking at re-doing the punishment phase of these rules, so there will be more opportunity to be a part of the team or extracurricular activity.
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Post by fantom on Oct 13, 2015 11:22:53 GMT -6
Thankfully we have some members of our BOE who are actually looking at re-doing the punishment phase of these rules, so there will be more opportunity to be a part of the team or extracurricular activity. Be ready for some push-back. There will be people in the community and in the building who will consider that "coddling". |
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Post by PSS on Oct 13, 2015 12:34:53 GMT -6
I guess I've been real lucky to have the support of the administration and community in most places I've been. I have developed lots of lifetime friendships with former athletes that have made good for themselves when everything was against them going through HS.
One place the coaching staff would go pick up our kids on the other side of town and take them to school, then take them home after practice. Many times we fed them with our own food. This goes a long way in building bonds and making sure that student-athletes are doing the things necessary to be successful in school. Not saying it fits all cases but it worked for those kids.
I just think of it as part of my job. I coach in order to help kids become successful not only in athletics but also in life. I want them to become successful adults and parents.
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Post by coachcb on Oct 14, 2015 7:45:45 GMT -6
Administrations that do this p-ss me off. They're sending the kids right back to where they're learning all of these bad behaviors by kicking them from sports.
I've taught in poor areas my whole career (including a Native reservation..) and I do what I can to keep the kids out for sports because they need the structure and support. I had a kid miss practice once because he was out driving drunk and spent the night in jail; mom and dad couldn't be found to bail him out. It would have been his third missed practice (i.e. booted from the team) but we sat down with him, the AD and the principal and made a deal with him. He wouldn't be booted from the team if he attended alcohol and drug awareness classes each week BEFORE he went to court for his DUI. He went to class twice a week, after practice and we kept him out for ball.
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Post by CoachMikeJudy on Oct 14, 2015 9:36:20 GMT -6
Football (and sports in general) is one the last avenues where discipline, commitment, and rewarding effort can be taught effectively.
You have one MAJOR thing to dangle in front of a difficult kid- PLAYING TIME. You would be amazed at what some of the most difficult students will do to get what they want. If they LOVE football they will tow the line for you.
You obviously have dealbreaker rules that if they cross the line, they may be suspended indefinitely. I try to setup our team rules to be parallel with our school rules- i.e. if school hands out a suspension then you are suspended from games as well. But then there are things that in school may not get disciplined but we take very seriously- like effort, demeanor, coachability etc. This is where you can make a great impact on the kids.
We don't have 504s for football. IEPs? Don't apply to football. Ride situation? That's the kids' problem to solve. The mantra is "no excuses, no one cares." It sounds a lot more harsh then it's presented- basically saying your teammates need you and there is no excuse for letting them down.
A kid that continues to make poor decisions in school and the community either doesn't love football or is not being coachable (assuming you are teaching these character lessons).
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Post by ftbll7801 on Oct 14, 2015 9:49:49 GMT -6
I have been fortunate enough to take over 2 struggling programs with many of the issues that have been stated. I have found that like fbs said, it is about trust. IMO you have to build it inside out. We started with character/attitude before we really got into the football side. We have been fortunate enough to win more games at both places in a couple of years then they did in 5-10 before. I say that to reassure you that you can do it. It is a lot of hard work, but that is what we signed up for. We must support each other also. We are all of what some of these kids have.
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Post by 33coach on Oct 14, 2015 10:23:18 GMT -6
This is going to be a long post/question/rant...so bear with me. The community I coach in has changed dramatically over the last 5-6 years. When the recession hit, a ton of people lost their homes and houses went empty. Nowadays, most of those homes are full of renters, and we are talking about small 1000 square foot houses. In other words, houses that can be bought cheap and turned into a rental. So with the cheap rental housing, a new type of "family" has moved into the community. Before anyone reads anything racial into that, I am talking poor whites. The last I heard almost 70% of the kids in the HS receive a free lunch. Every cop I talk to says heroin is in half of the homes, in other words it has gone downhill fast, as it has become a welfare community. Herein lies the issue. With so much entitlement going on, with so many single parents or two non-working parents at home, most of the kids are lacking in work ethic, and also a sense of right and wrong when it comes to decision making. When you have parents who exhibit bad, illegal behavior it is not hard to figure out why some of the kids in the school act the way they do. So my question is, with such a change in the way kids are being raised we are having a lot of "code of conduct" issues where athletes are being kicked out of sports for violating the C.O.C. Most of these kids are just making poor choices because I truly believe they can't make sound "right or wrong" choices. So if anyone else is having these types of issues, have any of your schools modified their code of conduct rules to address the kids you have at this time. My thought is instead of kicking kids out of sports, give them options such as community service, and not some easy pick up trash type of service, but real "feed the homeless" or work with sick or elderly. Real service that might open their eyes to some of the harsh realities of life when you make some bad choices. The reality is that these kids are not the type of kids that when I was in school, or even my kids were in school, know right from wrong. I could tell a kid 6-7 years ago not to smoke weed or cigs, and they would get it. The kids we have now don't see anything wrong and they don't make that distinction of right/wrong like kids did 5-10 years ago. So do you think we should change our COC rules to adapt and try to educate these kids, or just stick with what has been done in the past and hope they learn by punishment? we have seriously loosened our C.O.C - (granted we dont answer to a school board, so keep that in mind). this year in particular, i have more 1 parent homes - on the "bad" side of town, with one or both parents in jail - living with a guardian..., kids (at 13 & 14) partying pretty hard... we have made the decision to say: "these kids need football, more then football needs them." and talk to them about their actions...but we dont punish them for the bad decisions as long as the cops arn't involved and its not effecting their safety on the field. some of you may think of this as irresponsible - but my argument to that is, they are going to do it anyway...at least we give them a place for 2.5 hours a day where they are away from it, and they know they can come to us and talk to us about it in a judgement free way.its a really crappy situation, but i dont see another way to do it. kicking them out wont do them any good; we will just be another adult that abandoned them.... |
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Post by fbs on Oct 14, 2015 10:33:49 GMT -6
I've also learned a few other things from experiences that might be helpful. my second job was at a place in fort worth that was on the poor side of town and had not had any success in a long time. The school was seen as a stepping stone job and often was a revolving door for guys looking for bigger and better things. Basically it was a great first head coaching job and was a good place to go for a year and then get a better job. This breeds mistrust from kids, and it kills morale in a lot of cases. I remember coming down a little hard on a kid and he tried to quit. After talking to him, he tells me "I'll be back next year when ya'll are gone." It's something that might not seem like an issue when you get to a place like that, but you soon realize that it really is. Trust truly is everything. Just a few years ago I was at another poor city school where the kids were relatively level headed but some (like everywhere) weren't sold on white coaches (who they thought were rich... yeah ok) being able to relate to poor black kids. There was also the issue of those kids not being seen by the community in a positive light for a number of reasons, but the number one reason was poor black kids in a rich white community. We started doing community projects, working with the city and having our fundraisers out in the city among those people. The confidence those kids had and the trust that was built by overcoming these issues was immeasurable. You can preach being a good person and character and attitude for as long as you want, but you have to put them in situations where it's both put into practice and also rewarded. What I've found is that with those types of kids, they must see a payoff or you'll lose them. Don't tell them if they're good people and students that they will win 16 ball games. Make them understand this is about changing their lives in a positive way and you'll have them. The successes will follow that.
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Post by ksmitty79 on Oct 14, 2015 19:45:01 GMT -6
Lets face it. We coach a game where a majority of our players (for most of us) are on free or reduce lunch, single parent homes. I coach at a place where we have the polar opposites when it comes to social standings. We have kids that live on the golf courses in Million Dollar homes and vacation in the Caribbean to the kid that has no clue where the Caribbean is better yet where they are going to stay the next week after mom and her 3 kids get kicked out of their section 8 house. With that being said one thing I had to learn was I had to open up to the "at-risk." A lot of the young men that we coach has never had a consistent positive male figure in their lives. I always share with my players why I got into coaching. "Long story short..My father was and Alcoholic and my parents divorced when I was older. I looked at my high school coach as father figures. I want to be just like that guy." Football is and outlet for every kid.. Doesn't matter! Some kids are tax write off kids (as awful as that sounds) and they are looking for the same guidance as the kid that goes "home" to someone that has nothing. OK let me get off of my soapbox
As far a C.O.C stuff we believe kicking a kid off the team sends a message to that kid that we have given up on them (the whole coaching staff) which makes us just like everyone else in their life. Our goal is by their Jr. Sr. year to make sure they understand what society expectations are. Do we change our C.O.C stuff absolutely not. Everything is Case by Case... A kid that lives in trap houses doesn't understand what appropriate behavior is. Much like the kid that lives in the Million Dollar home has no clue what the other side of the shoe even looks like. As football coaches that is part of our job, Teach life lessons through the game of football. The whole process (weights,grades,community involvement,practice,planning,assessment,evaluation) can be translated into real life. Just love your kids up through thick and thin. Be honest and Loyal to them.
prac
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Post by jlenwood on Oct 14, 2015 20:21:51 GMT -6
On one hand, I hate the thought of lowering standards. But the reality is that some of these kids, while not thugs, have a hard time making quick decisions that are the RIGHT decision. To many of them just do the dumbest sh!t and don't think a thing about it. It really is a mind numbing exercise to try and coach some of these knuckleheads on a daily basis, but you can't just kick 'em to the curb.
I don't know, it seems to be a razor thin line between holding a kid to a high standard, and yet trying not to run them off back into the mess of a home life they have. I have always thought all of the leadership stuff that guys try to put their players through was kind of a way for the coach to feel good about maybe he was doing something good for a kid. But after seeing some of the stuff that Meyer is using at OSU, and some of the things I have been looking at, it may be time to try and put a program in place to get a hold of these kids as underclassmen.
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Post by lions23 on Oct 14, 2015 21:31:06 GMT -6
On one hand, I hate the thought of lowering standards. But the reality is that some of these kids, while not thugs, have a hard time making quick decisions that are the RIGHT decision. To many of them just do the dumbest sh!t and don't think a thing about it. It really is a mind numbing exercise to try and coach some of these knuckleheads on a daily basis, but you can't just kick 'em to the curb. I don't know, it seems to be a razor thin line between holding a kid to a high standard, and yet trying not to run them off back into the mess of a home life they have. I have always thought all of the leadership stuff that guys try to put their players through was kind of a way for the coach to feel good about maybe he was doing something good for a kid. But after seeing some of the stuff that Meyer is using at OSU, and some of the things I have been looking at, it may be time to try and put a program in place to get a hold of these kids as underclassmen. What do you know about what is going on at OSU? |
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Post by jlenwood on Oct 15, 2015 6:03:13 GMT -6
On one hand, I hate the thought of lowering standards. But the reality is that some of these kids, while not thugs, have a hard time making quick decisions that are the RIGHT decision. To many of them just do the dumbest sh!t and don't think a thing about it. It really is a mind numbing exercise to try and coach some of these knuckleheads on a daily basis, but you can't just kick 'em to the curb. I don't know, it seems to be a razor thin line between holding a kid to a high standard, and yet trying not to run them off back into the mess of a home life they have. I have always thought all of the leadership stuff that guys try to put their players through was kind of a way for the coach to feel good about maybe he was doing something good for a kid. But after seeing some of the stuff that Meyer is using at OSU, and some of the things I have been looking at, it may be time to try and put a program in place to get a hold of these kids as underclassmen. What do you know about what is going on at OSU? |
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Post by CoachMikeJudy on Oct 15, 2015 7:59:39 GMT -6
On one hand, I hate the thought of lowering standards. But the reality is that some of these kids, while not thugs, have a hard time making quick decisions that are the RIGHT decision. To many of them just do the dumbest sh!t and don't think a thing about it. It really is a mind numbing exercise to try and coach some of these knuckleheads on a daily basis, but you can't just kick 'em to the curb. I don't know, it seems to be a razor thin line between holding a kid to a high standard, and yet trying not to run them off back into the mess of a home life they have. I have always thought all of the leadership stuff that guys try to put their players through was kind of a way for the coach to feel good about maybe he was doing something good for a kid. But after seeing some of the stuff that Meyer is using at OSU, and some of the things I have been looking at, it may be time to try and put a program in place to get a hold of these kids as underclassmen. Maybe rather than think of "lowering the standards" consider it a stepped approach- ultimately we want them to be perfect, but we have to be willing to lead them in that direction 1 step at a time. So start with the bare minimum- what do you ABSOLUTELY need from a player. In my eyes it's attendance- if you aren't here I can't coach you up! Then it's coachability- When prompted to do something (be it technique or improve your effort) do you do the best you can to meet that new standard? Then it's effort- Are you willing to go hard every rep/every drill? "Die with an empty clip" mentality Now comes commitment- if I can get you to be here, allow me to coach you, and you give me great effort are you now willing to set aside your personal wants and needs to be a better team? Are you willing to grind it out in the face of adversity? Are you willing to make tough decisions to be a part of this thing? Are you making football a priority? Can you think about whether my behavior (in class or at home) is making me a better player and us a better team? Does my effort in life meet my goals? You can't have the last one without the first one. Take these at-risk kids and GET THEM WITH YOU as much as possible. Hell, that's what my offseason consists of- you are either playing a school related sport or you are with me in the weight room; not just trying to get better but to ensure that you are NOT alone making poor decisions...I can keep coaching you year-round. |
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Post by pistola on Oct 15, 2015 9:21:29 GMT -6
On one hand, I hate the thought of lowering standards. But the reality is that some of these kids, while not thugs, have a hard time making quick decisions that are the RIGHT decision. To many of them just do the dumbest sh!t and don't think a thing about it. It really is a mind numbing exercise to try and coach some of these knuckleheads on a daily basis, but you can't just kick 'em to the curb. I don't know, it seems to be a razor thin line between holding a kid to a high standard, and yet trying not to run them off back into the mess of a home life they have. I have always thought all of the leadership stuff that guys try to put their players through was kind of a way for the coach to feel good about maybe he was doing something good for a kid. But after seeing some of the stuff that Meyer is using at OSU, and some of the things I have been looking at, it may be time to try and put a program in place to get a hold of these kids as underclassmen. yes you could be lowering the standards, but if the kids dont know any better how can you expect them to meet the standards in place.. you've got to start somewhere and work your way back up to where you want it. |
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Post by fbs on Oct 15, 2015 13:39:46 GMT -6
if it's life that we are talking about here, then I'm not even going to mention football. where we are failing kids, at least in Texas, is that education is built solely around college. most of these kids aren't going to college, sorry to be the bearer of bad news. Whether it's due to not wanting to or economic situation, there are a BUNCH of kids who will not go on to be college students, and that's fine. It's not the reality that most people are ready for yet, and certainly not any BOE members. Where we are failing them is selling them a culture that tells them that they are a failure if they don't go to college. I'm telling you right now that if I had it all to do over again I might think twice about going to college, and just learn a trade. I know this, an average electrician makes a whole lot more than I do, and in a lot of cases he works for himself. NCLB was a farce. It meant well, as did the politicians that pushed it, but it has failed us miserably. Trade school is the answer. keep the education system as is, and kids will go to school as usual until 10th grade. After 10th grade they can make the choice to stay in high school, which is college prep, or go to trade school, which is career prep, and you get to go learn how to make a living in something you WANT to do.
the way this all ties in together with the original topic is that if kids can see that they are learning something useful, i.e. skills that will make them money, and they are not being force fed something they either don't want or can't have, they will find a way to be successful. Being held to a standard is pointless if the kid isn't invested AT ALL in the end result.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 15, 2015 15:57:49 GMT -6
if it's life that we are talking about here, then I'm not even going to mention football. where we are failing kids, at least in Texas, is that education is built solely around college. most of these kids aren't going to college, sorry to be the bearer of bad news. Whether it's due to not wanting to or economic situation, there are a BUNCH of kids who will not go on to be college students, and that's fine. It's not the reality that most people are ready for yet, and certainly not any BOE members. Where we are failing them is selling them a culture that tells them that they are a failure if they don't go to college. I'm telling you right now that if I had it all to do over again I might think twice about going to college, and just learn a trade. I know this, an average electrician makes a whole lot more than I do, and in a lot of cases he works for himself. NCLB was a farce. It meant well, as did the politicians that pushed it, but it has failed us miserably. Trade school is the answer. keep the education system as is, and kids will go to school as usual until 10th grade. After 10th grade they can make the choice to stay in high school, which is college prep, or go to trade school, which is career prep, and you get to go learn how to make a living in something you WANT to do. the way this all ties in together with the original topic is that if kids can see that they are learning something useful, i.e. skills that will make them money, and they are not being force fed something they either don't want or can't have, they will find a way to be successful. Being held to a standard is pointless if the kid isn't invested AT ALL in the end result. If you are not interested in standards, why make them go to school at all. |
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Post by brophy on Oct 15, 2015 16:14:13 GMT -6
3 things... 1) With these type of demographics it becomes important to engage ALL the kids at every level and provide as many inclusive activities as possible. Find reasons to get together and it doesn't always have to be to produce something for the program ("work"). Have a movie night, have a lift-a-thon, do a volleyball tournament....make sure the TEAM is together as much as possible throughout the entire year and that when you do it remains a positive experience (not always demanding something out of them). Set aside an activity once a month in the spring/summer to volunteer to some community effort (could be non-profit or a fundraising gig) so that the kids see they impact the community around them (its all bigger than just one or two people). The point is build a positive peer culture then you won't have to worry about running around enforcing rules (your kids will do it for you). brophyfootball.blogspot.com/2009/07/there-is-no-secret.html2) You're gonna have kids who need football more than football needs them. Kids that may not start, but want to be part of the team but are on the fringe. Make sure you have the resources to account for these kids, whether it be transportation, grades, equipment, or communication with their guardian. You have to demonstrate that the program wants to involve everyone. 3) You're gonna have kids who football needs more than maybe they want to commit. This is the soul-selling dilemmas you will face. These kind of kids can grow into cancers if you don't set consistent expectations (or cave at the first inkling of these stud athlete's whims). tl;dr version you don't have to change any standards you have for behavior or grades. The key is to be more proactive and engaged with the students and the family members (who are willing to return your calls). Educate, educate, educate at every moment you're with the kids (decision making, how to take notes in class, how to look at the big picture, etc) The days are over when kids would do anything to be on the football team (to win the favor of the coach) and do everything the coach told them. Either your program is stimulating the community to be involved or the program will be begging and coddling just the athletes that can win them some games whatever the cost |
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Post by fbs on Oct 16, 2015 10:44:20 GMT -6
if it's life that we are talking about here, then I'm not even going to mention football. where we are failing kids, at least in Texas, is that education is built solely around college. most of these kids aren't going to college, sorry to be the bearer of bad news. Whether it's due to not wanting to or economic situation, there are a BUNCH of kids who will not go on to be college students, and that's fine. It's not the reality that most people are ready for yet, and certainly not any BOE members. Where we are failing them is selling them a culture that tells them that they are a failure if they don't go to college. I'm telling you right now that if I had it all to do over again I might think twice about going to college, and just learn a trade. I know this, an average electrician makes a whole lot more than I do, and in a lot of cases he works for himself. NCLB was a farce. It meant well, as did the politicians that pushed it, but it has failed us miserably. Trade school is the answer. keep the education system as is, and kids will go to school as usual until 10th grade. After 10th grade they can make the choice to stay in high school, which is college prep, or go to trade school, which is career prep, and you get to go learn how to make a living in something you WANT to do. the way this all ties in together with the original topic is that if kids can see that they are learning something useful, i.e. skills that will make them money, and they are not being force fed something they either don't want or can't have, they will find a way to be successful. Being held to a standard is pointless if the kid isn't invested AT ALL in the end result. If you are not interested in standards, why make them go to school at all. you obviously have no idea what I was getting at. The problem IS the standards, and that they are based around every kid going to college, and all we are doing is giving them a lot of information they will never need. I have no clue what I learned in Biology or Algebra because it wasn't useful to me for any reason at all... I knew it at the time too, but I was still forced to take those classes. It's the same thing in college. Why in the world are there "basics" in college? At that point you have some sort of idea what you're headed toward, so you should not be forced to take classes you don't really need. Career paths should start the junior year of high school, and this would solve a lot of the problems we face in the schools. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 16, 2015 10:57:01 GMT -6
If you are not interested in standards, why make them go to school at all. you obviously have no idea what I was getting at. The problem IS the standards, and that they are based around every kid going to college, and all we are doing is giving them a lot of information they will never need. I have no clue what I learned in Biology or Algebra because it wasn't useful to me for any reason at all... I knew it at the time too, but I was still forced to take those classes. It's the same thing in college. Why in the world are there "basics" in college? At that point you have some sort of idea what you're headed toward, so you should not be forced to take classes you don't really need. Career paths should start the junior year of high school, and this would solve a lot of the problems we face in the schools. Get what you are saying, I am asking why stop there. Why not just repeal the law that says every student must... |
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Post by fbs on Oct 16, 2015 11:03:44 GMT -6
Well I think you have to keep them in place to some degree, but we have allowed politicians and bored moms to get us into a hole that is so complicated that it would take years of sustained progress to get out of it. For example, the idea that there must be standardized testing, and that those tests should be tied to funding, without exceptipn. I'm a big supporter of a split curriculum where you either have career prep or college prep. The college prep side would continue to have to college readiness standards and continue to be very much centered around getting kids ready for that.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 16, 2015 12:19:28 GMT -6
Well I think you have to keep them in place to some degree, but we have allowed politicians and bored moms to get us into a hole that is so complicated that it would take years of sustained progress to get out of it. For example, the idea that there must be standardized testing, and that those tests should be tied to funding, without exceptipn. I'm a big supporter of a split curriculum where you either have career prep or college prep. The college prep side would continue to have to college readiness standards and continue to be very much centered around getting kids ready for that. The society is going, the schools will not get fixed, and they and governance really really are no longer an issue worth talking about bein fixed. I'll stop there because of where this goes. |
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