When to help or not help??

What's your position?

Are you a youth guy helping HS coaches?
HS coach helping area coaches?
What is this special offense that you can't stand to see butchered?

I would gladly help any coach THAT IS NOT IN OUR CONFERENCE with anything he needs. We are all thieves and beggars. That's how we learn and adapt.

Help the guy out, and if he butchers it and fails, its his own fault, not yours. Take pride in what you do and spread the word. If he wants to suceed, he'll be back or will go and do his own leg work.

Guys,

Thanks for the feedback. I think that it is very clear, thanks to the responses, that one should keep certain things secret or at least close to the vest when it comes to helping out conference opponents or guys you might face in the future. As I mentioned, I have no problem helping people out on this board or out of my area.

I think the rules I will follow will be to only help on fundamental progressions but no X's and O's to coaches in my area. I figure they can do the footwork on the defense or offense they think is best. That way I can give them an honest opinion and they can do with it what they wish. in other words, I will be helpful but will no longer give them the rope to hang me later. Loose lips sink ships. LOL.

Thanks guys.

John

If you don't feel comfortable sharing - no 'mandate' from your peers is going to make you feel any better about it.

You aren't obligated to share anything, so I wouldn't feel bad about not sharing.

However, WHAT can you really "share" that is revolutionary ground-breaking in football? If this guy can't figure it out, then what can you really impart to him, anyway?

I guess (and maybe I'm wrong), but I don't really have a problem sharing anything, mainly because;

1) it isn't rocket science

2) do you know the rationale behind its use (how do you know WHEN we will use it)?

3) do you know what we are looking to accomplish against every look we see?

4) even if you do KNOW, can you out-execute us?

5) If you can out-EXECUTE us, how do you match up with our personnel? ...and "its not the talent, but the talent in the TEAM"

6) if you can do 1-5, you will make me better - forcing me to adapt & make "my system" more bullet-proof

7) Reciprocity - I have stolen everything I know. How can I steal all of tog's concepts on "cover 2", then turn around and claim them as my own and try to horde that info from anyone else?

8) Sharing with other coaches is a practice that actually HELPS you more than it does them, because it can galvanize your beliefs in what you are doing and forces you to put "your stuff" into clearer concepts and ideas.

9) If you believe that play calls alone are the reasons teams win or lose, then you haven't been coaching long...

10) IF, after all that, you still don't want people to run this "super-scheme" without your 'consent' or support, then it is just an ego-thing, using football for some self-gratifying profit. I mention this, because if this exposed your personal insecurities, it is a great opportunity to make yourself better.

Other than keeping your competition in the gutter so you don't get challenged, I don't see the strategic advantage of any "behind the curtain" secrets could help a coach.

However, I'm not advocating to share - some folks just don't know what to do with the information you give them, anyway. I would be against wasting my time in that instance.

Without being argumentative, your Wing-T / Slot-T stuff you clearly have taken from other authors. So, what would be so difficult to explain what you run, why you run it, and how you implement it?
I think the REAL issue is, you don't like this guy - and for that, I can't fault you one bit.
I just wouldn't justify not liking him by putting it on "your system" as a reason not to share.

John, what level are you coaching?

I am kind of confused, because on one hand you say you don't want to have them change what you think is the most successful way to run the scheme, but on the OTHER HAND you say you don't want to face the scheme either.

Bottom line, to me, it seems you feel you have a competitive advantage schematically, and you don't want to lose it. And that is perfectly acceptable. All of the rationalizations just seem like bunk to me though. Just say, I don't want you to run this scheme.

Just like when a kid says he doesn't want to play football. Perfectly acceptable. Just don't try to give reasons why, like "concentrate on my grades, work on baseball to get a scholarship, I might get hurt...etc. " Just say, I don't want to play football.

I think we are getting a little off track on this subject and its more to do with not shooting yourself in the foot than ego. I think some have equated my post to me acting selfish.

I doubt anybody would mail their cross town rival the team playbook or allow them to sit in spring practice while you install your "O" or "D". Especially when your job is on the line (not my case).

I think that you have to set a limit or boundary when it comes to immediate rivals. I see no problem here on the internet because the chances one of my teams will face off against a coach on these boards are almost "zero". I also see no problem with helping out a coach from outside my area. My problem is limited to helping out potential rivals.

BTW, over the years I have helped just about every coach in my area so maybe I know what the end result will be in my case. When I started there was only one other coach that I felt could out coach me. The guy has a 30 year head start so he is an experienced football coach. He avoided me for the longest time. When I asked him to teach me about his systems or philosophy he politely declined. That forced me to learn and to become better as a coach. Eventually I started to beat him so that made me a better coach. Later I asked him why he never gave in to my hounding him to teach me a few things and his answer was "I have a responsibility to my coaches and players and it would not be right to assist a rival coach".

In my particular case I know I will face off against this guy at some point. So i see no problem helping him out with fundamentals such as how to block or how to play linebacker and passing along drills. I do think schemes are off limits to rival coaches. Let them do their own scouting report or footwork.

John

jcarbon2 -- maybe you should just direct him to this website... he could all the help he needs if he wants to put in the time...

Coach,

I run the wishbone. Nothing fancy but I did put the time in to learn from certain HS coaches. So there is my pet peev with details. BTW, I did not say "revolutionary" in any of my posts.

At this time I am the DC on an adult team and he is the OC. I am the OC at the 8-10 and 10-12 level. Both teams won their championships last year. We will probably face off at a lower level in the future.

I know its about fundamentals. I have been at it for the same amount of years.

So you're refusing to help someone who is on the same staff as you? I'm assuming I got this wrong...

I'm with K, are you on the same staff for the adult team? He wants to use your wishbone on the adult team?

Phantom,

I agree with you 100%.

Or simply tell him the deal. "If you're going to run my wishbone successfully you need to spend more time practicing it and I don't think you have the practice time to do so, therefore me helping you is pointless."


I understand what you're saying but I find it odd that you won't help a fellow staff member.