The Double Slot....consensus?

I agree....hard to defend...can be multiple and lends itself to the quick pass game & option.

But that is what is so great about this offense. If you run well, you can out of many formations. If you can pass well you can out of many formations but you have the option to pick. You can find the few things you do well and run the crap out of them from various formations with minimal change.

Excellent info...I was told Clovis high runs the DS...does anyone know how to contact the offensive coaches..do they post here? Would love to see and discuss plays or a playbook with them (if they would).

it's a great base to then expand and contract from

but, like khalfie is saying, it is up to the coaches to focus the offense based on the talent available

Ok Khalfie... Not an argument (but I'll give a response just the same):

^{1. The multiplicity, subtracts by adding to much, which divides a teams focus...
(see what I did there? )}

Can easily happen- which is why pulling in the reigns and filtering this (or any) system is important- otherwise it is too much.

^{2. True Double Slot, might as well be double tight, double wing, and when your offense is that compact,}

Completely true from my perspective- but not always the case from the perspective of defenses we face. We used to align in 2TE full house- and we run much of the same stuff now, but we will face less in the box now sometimes.

^{you have to have superior personnel, because you have now brought all 11 players into the mix}

I'll disagree here- we can hide players easier than we would in 2TE wishbone, for example (of course you gotta throw to those SEs once in a while). I also like it if we have 1 superior back we can use him as a runner more without being overly right/left handed (again, I'm comparing this to when we ran the wishbone)

^{3. Motioning from the Double Slot, only changes the dynamics of the offense, if they leave the box. Orbit motion only takes you to an I wing formation, but you still have 11 in the box. Motioning to the sidelines, gives you 1 split, but you still have 9 to 10 defenders in, or near the box.}

A wing can motion back to an I back spot, can motion across to a wing T or wishbone HB spot, can motion to a sniffer back spot- to me Dynamic would include alignment position and angles made by an effective pre-snap action. So you could run I plays, wing t-plays, wishbone plays, yet still be within one system and not have the "myriad offense".

^{4. Once you start varying the splits, spreading them out; Spread wing, twins with backside wing, double twins, unbalanced trips... are you still double slot?}

Who cares?

^{5. The Double slot, basic motion to trips bunch, or orbit motion, has been well studied, and doesn't provide the defensive conflicts inferior personnel will need to be competitive.}

Well...if a wishbone, wing-t, double wing, run-and shoot, etc. CAN help inferior personnel- so would a DS, because it can morph in to any of those. If they can not... well neither will the DS or anything else (except... Single Wing? ;D )

Khalfie... your responses are very similar to my DCs. We argue about this all of the time. I see where Coach Bruce is going with this idea... I was there at one time too, thinking the same things. And to be honest, I've kind of come around to Khalfie's camp a bit-I've learned that the only coach I routinely outcoach ... is myself.

^{Bluto said that you need great athletes.}

Don't recall saying this... I did imply several times that you do not need great athletes for this (average kids who execute will do well in it).

^{some are multiple which, to me, means that they don't have a philosophy.}

Also, I'll respectfully disagree... between posts, I was thinking about our running game and where it originated.
Of 14 running plays:
4 came from the I formation
3 from Straight T
3 from Wing T
2 from Wishbone
1 from Double Wing
1 from 1 back

We've been using this system for many years now- it is multiple (in origin anyway), but completely within the realm of our philosophy (which is we aim to run power and misdirection very well, plus aim to be competent in a simple (1 read) option game and the passing game).

^{All double slots are not created equal.}

This is a great point and what I like about the DS as a formation- it is not as easy to pigeonhole as some other offensive sets.

Now I also did say that :

^{I'm not trying to start an argument here}

OK... apparently THAT is a lie.

we are double slot base with a zone identity
this allows us to run jets, IZ, OZ, veer, trap, power, gt, gc, ga, and all sorts of mish mash of that stuff with concept passing spreading the formation in and out as we want

we are all gun

the beauty of it to me is, it has elements of option. wing-t, air raid, traditional spread, all rolled into one, that allows us to swing more towards one aspect of the playbook from year to year

but the core is still so fundamentally sound that we can add all that other stuff on top and just make it window dressing to make it appear much more complicated to a defense than it is to our kids

ok.... love the discussion and have learned one thing in my 16 yrs of coaching..everyone is right if they do what they believe in.


AS a former DC all I can say is that i hated seeing balanced formation schemes (unless they had very distinct tendenancies) since you had to cover everything. One thing I wont do as an OC is run and I formation scheme since as a former DC you drew everything up against what? the I formation.

Amen to that! Our defensive playbook is full of I form...LOL

Now add motion to the balanced offense and watch the vultures (offensive coaches in the box) pick out the weak link to our now vanilla defense.

Yes, but without a TE you will be forever outnumbered at the POA, and you will have shortened the path to the QB in passing situations.

I am in Southern California and we have a double slot system that has been succesful for years. Last year we averaged over 350 yards/game and over 30 ppg. That being said, here are my biggest observations of the double slot:

1. The innovation of reading the backside c-gap defender on run plays turned this from a novelty finesse offense into one that really had balance. We can now run gt counter--our bread and butter play--out of double slot and I am convinced it is as good as any counter from a fullback/tight end oriented system.

2. You have to have at least one go-to wide receiver that really scares the defense. You can move him around to any of your four receiver spots, but you have to have someone who forces them to put at least one safety over the top. If the defense feels it can easily lock you up in Cover 0, you better have answers in the form of traps and screens, etc, but that makes it tough.

3. The double slot can completely take good defensive players out of the game. I remember a team 11 year ago running it (one of the first I am aware of) against the school at which I used to coach, and we had a great all-league run stopping linebacker who we had to bench in the second quarter. He just could move in space and they were smart enough to take advantage of it wherever he was--option routes, drags, picks, name it.

4. Your slot receivers especially have to be able to block. If you have interior receivers who can't block, it will really hurt your run game, period. You are putting those guys i the game in lieu of fullbacks and tight ends, so they had better be able to at least get in the way effectively, or your ability to break long runs will be severely hampered. If you have one slot receiver who is a special athlete that can run your short and occasionally intermediate routes and then also motion into a fullback spot, you can really do some special things with the defense in terms of formation and personel match ups.

5. Like all offenses, you have to have answers and they had better be good. If they __________, we will _________. I actually think the double slot is one of the easier formations from which to create answers. This is mainly due to being able to isolate personel match ups, stretch the whole field, making defenders play in space, etc.

6. Lastly, your trigger man has to be smart, not necessarily talented. Because the ability to get big plays out iof the spread is high, our trigger man's number one and two jobs are: 1. don't hurt us by turning the ball over or losing big yards and 2. Know where the ball needs to go. If you can accomplish those two things in the spread, there will be solid production.

if you come out in doubles, you are evenly stretching the field (formation-wise) horizontally & vertically.

The defense has to respect that.
By mere alignment / positioning they can outnumber themselves.

I don't see where a TE gives an inherent advantage, unless that PLAYER is the difference maker.

Out of double slot, you CAN run pretty much anything (doesn't mean you HAVE to)
Motion in a slot to run jet, run belly, run isos, run bubbles, run your quick game, run power.

the formation, itself, is the threat.....to the defense......with all that space, you pretty much have to declare what you are going to do and WHAT the matchups will be.

You can equally run deep & quick game and run the ball effectively....the FORMATION is a multi-dimensional threat.

I believe we are talking 1x1 off the tackle

Thats where flexbone guys line them up. I know if you like to chuck the ball around more, you move em out further.

Technically I would call them wings if I wasnt talking about the flexbone, but the flexbone is sometimes called a double slot formation or spread option, although spread option now usually means shotgun option.

I dont want to call flexbone double wing because well that invokes images of guys lining up foot to foot and then I get queasy