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Post by senatorblutarsky on Jun 1, 2007 23:54:41 GMT -6
I just got home from Colorado... when checking messages, I had 2 that were calls about jobs that recently opened up. I returned both calls- one is not of interest, but one is. Here's the deal:
1. School is class B (3A-4A size for most) in Nebraska. I'm in Class D (Class 1A) right now.
2. It is closer to Colorado (immediate family is in CO... this job is about 190 mi. from "home"), but not in CO (a plus). I'm 500 mi. from home right now.
3. Good football tradition (hard times lately...but on a slight upswing). We have great tradition here.
4. AD is a guy who I've known for a while. He was a DC at another school a few years back and asked my DC and myself to come out and help him run our defense... so he thinks I know what I am doing. We have 2 new administrators here. Some questions about them... they seem OK though.
5. Pay will be similar (will get credit for all years). Cost of living is higher (mainly housing costs are higher... still reasonable).
6. Position is full-time PE/Weights (a plus)- no administrative work. Currently I am 1/2 time PE plus 1 English and AD.
All these seem like positives... and they are. Bigger school, but not too big, closer to family, still in state so I keep retirement in tact. Overall, it is a position I think I would really like.
On the other hand...
1. Where I am is a great football school.
2. I have great assistants- all friends and good guys who have total buy-in (3 of 5 coaches played for me).
3. I'm making good $ here... house is almost paid off (a few years left), and I am tired of "starting over". I've moved up the coaching ranks... the move up in classification is not a big deal to me.
4. We start Monday (state rule can not start until June). This seems really late for a job to be open... especially at this school.
5. First year will be difficult if not impossible to get things in adequately at such a late date... if I take this job (not a guarantee that I'll even be hired), realistically, I'm looking ahead to the 2008 season.
6. I turned down another offer earlier. Current players knew about the other offer and I reassured them I was staying. To leave now would feel like betrayal.
Anyway... if anyone has some perspective, I'd love to hear it. I need to let them know if I have interest by Monday (my deadline... not theirs).
Thanks.
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Post by flycoach on Jun 2, 2007 0:19:56 GMT -6
The other job has basically all the pluses that I would want heading into a job. Closer to family, a supportive A.D. a weight training position (you will have that program up and running before you know it.)
It is not betrayal to those players if you explain the family situation. They may not understand now but they will.
The only question you need to ask yourself is "do I really want to start over." As you know already starting over is a pain is the a$$. Great feeling once you turn it around but lots of time and energy. But with reduced workload, by that I mean no more A.D. duties, you couldv'e hit the jackpot. Good Luck. Let us all know what happens.
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jebaird
Probationary Member
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Post by jebaird on Jun 2, 2007 1:34:35 GMT -6
Be honest with yourself. Where do you want to be? I'm the type of person that finds it hard to leave if I'm happy, and easy to leave if I'm not....
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Post by phantom on Jun 2, 2007 2:36:38 GMT -6
I just got home from Colorado... when checking messages, I had 2 that were calls about jobs that recently opened up. I returned both calls- one is not of interest, but one is. Here's the deal: 1. School is class B (3A-4A size for most) in Nebraska. I'm in Class D (Class 1A) right now. 2. It is closer to Colorado (immediate family is in CO... this job is about 190 mi. from "home"), but not in CO (a plus). I'm 500 mi. from home right now. 3. Good football tradition (hard times lately...but on a slight upswing). We have great tradition here. 4. AD is a guy who I've known for a while. He was a DC at another school a few years back and asked my DC and myself to come out and help him run our defense... so he thinks I know what I am doing. We have 2 new administrators here. Some questions about them... they seem OK though. 5. Pay will be similar (will get credit for all years). Cost of living is higher (mainly housing costs are higher... still reasonable). 6. Position is full-time PE/Weights (a plus)- no administrative work. Currently I am 1/2 time PE plus 1 English and AD. All these seem like positives... and they are. Bigger school, but not too big, closer to family, still in state so I keep retirement in tact. Overall, it is a position I think I would really like. On the other hand... 1. Where I am is a great football school. 2. I have great assistants- all friends and good guys who have total buy-in (3 of 5 coaches played for me). 3. I'm making good $ here... house is almost paid off (a few years left), and I am tired of "starting over". I've moved up the coaching ranks... the move up in classification is not a big deal to me. 4. We start Monday (state rule can not start until June). This seems really late for a job to be open... especially at this school. 5. First year will be difficult if not impossible to get things in adequately at such a late date... if I take this job (not a guarantee that I'll even be hired), realistically, I'm looking ahead to the 2008 season. 6. I turned down another offer earlier. Current players knew about the other offer and I reassured them I was staying. To leave now would feel like betrayal. Anyway... if anyone has some perspective, I'd love to hear it. I need to let them know if I have interest by Monday (my deadline... not theirs). Thanks. Looking at it objectively, the only real plus for the new school is the proximity to home. Financially, with the salary being similar but a higher cost of living, you're looking at a pay cut. Getting settled in and established at this late date will be murder. The clincher to me is #6, you told the kids that you're staying. |
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Post by kcbazooka on Jun 2, 2007 6:22:20 GMT -6
for what its worth, to me it seems too late to be changiing - the grass is not always greener...
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Post by coachjd on Jun 2, 2007 6:52:21 GMT -6
Coach,
I have been reading your post on this board now for close to 2 years. I believe you are a coach of integrity and pride. I know you do a great job of teaching your kids all the other great things that go along with coaching football other than the x's and o's. When I read your first post and saw that you told your team that you are not leaving, then IMO, you should stay. Other job opportunities will come with better timing.
Best of luck coach and follow your heart!!!
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Post by ajreaper on Jun 2, 2007 6:54:38 GMT -6
My take is you are established and happy where you are at, you no longer have a need as a HC to move on and accept the challenge to reright a program earning yourself additional "stripes" as a coach building a rep and a resume. Realistically how often do you go "home" to visit family? If it's only a few times a year at best being a few hours closer does not off set any of the reasons to stay where you are at.
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Post by toprowguy on Jun 2, 2007 8:31:23 GMT -6
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2007 10:03:14 GMT -6
I'm just kind of echoing what others have said, but you seem very happy where you are. To me, a move at this late a date would not be worth it, even to be closer to family.
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Post by coachd5085 on Jun 2, 2007 10:38:34 GMT -6
A few things to ask yourself--
1. What are you looking for? A new challenge? or just something different, realizing (as I am sure you do) that different is not always better?
2. If you left, would they promote from within? If so, I wouldn't worry much about the "leaving the kids" angle. They still have someone they are comfortable with, and YOU get the added bonus of allowing a coach you know to get a HC position.
3. The distance. Is 190 miles really that much closer than 500? Will that change any behaviors? at 190 miles, you are looking at a 5 to 6 hour round trip right? Does that make trips more frequent, or just a little quicker? Obviously at 1000 mile round trips any visits become overnight stays. at 380 mile round trips, do you anticipate much more frequent single day visits?
4. The staff you would be going to... always a question mark.
5. Teaching load... full time PE is nice
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Post by fbdoc on Jun 2, 2007 10:43:39 GMT -6
Got to go along with the others regarding having told your players you're staying. IF there were major extenuating circumstances such as much LOWER cost of living or a BIG move up the career ladder, then I could see the move. Everybody has a different "family" situation (my mom lives in Oregon, I live in Florida!) but they're always just a flight away. My opinion - stay this year, and then look for your dream job after the season. Right now it may be Too Late - see other post  |
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Post by coachpoe on Jun 2, 2007 10:58:25 GMT -6
Coach, the new position seems like a great offer, which is why I am surprised it hasn't been filled yet. Timing is huge when making a move, and it looks like the timing isn't right on this one. Be patient I am sure you will have some more great offers to move in the future, if that's what you want. If not you are in a great situation where you are at.
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wccoach
Sophomore Member
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Post by wccoach on Jun 2, 2007 11:06:30 GMT -6
Reasons to stay: Great football school, Great staff, Great tradition, you are the AD (I know that can be a pain, but you have control), lower cost of living, kids believe in you and your program, Start this seasons team on MONDAY!, You know what you got and you know how to make them win.
Reasons to leave: Uh...........Only 190 miles from the family
I would not make the move unless it was my absolute DREAM JOB. If the job was 30 miles from home and I was the Head Coach I might think about it. Just another idiot's opinion!
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Post by casec11 on Jun 2, 2007 17:15:29 GMT -6
"Grass is not always greener" The move sounds more latteral and if your going to make a move like that this late it seems it should be an offer that blows you away...
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bhb
Junior Member
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Post by bhb on Jun 2, 2007 19:34:26 GMT -6
house is almost paid off (a few years left), and I am tired of "starting over That right there says it all to me- no way in heck if my house is almost paid for am I going on the hook for another 30 years unless it's my absolute dream job.. Sure, I understand you've built some equity up, and you'll make a good chunk of change in the sale of your house- but you'll also spend the majority of that replacing your old home at these crazy prices houses are going for these days.. |
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Post by coachjim on Jun 3, 2007 7:20:36 GMT -6
In your post, the top portion is written almost robotically. The bottom reasons, for why you should stay, seems energized and excited. I think you have already made your mind up, by the looks of it. Just because you choose to stay, doesn't mean you are underachieving. Moving upward, does not always mean success. Being happy... does.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2007 10:43:28 GMT -6
That was exactly how I read it too, coachjim.
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Post by bulldogoption on Jun 3, 2007 13:23:20 GMT -6
A couple of random thoughts
1. If you wait for the "perfect job at the perfect time", IMO it will never happen. You have obviously done a super job of building the program you are at. For that reason, leaving, whenever you do it, is going to be difficult for you and your school.
2. Moving up in size a bit has got to be an improvement in facilities and equipment.
3. The job sounds like it would be nice. You would really be focusing on football 100% of the time.
4. Family is a big deal, IMO. 3 hours away vs. 9 hours away makes some short visits much easier. But still far enough that you won't have visits too frequently.
5. I just got done reading Lou's book Winning Every Day and Barry's book Don't Flinch. A common idea I found was that most people let opportunities go for whatever reason waiting for things to be perfect.
6. Good Luck!!!
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Post by kcbazooka on Jun 3, 2007 14:05:44 GMT -6
lol, SO what did you do! we all want to know!!
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Post by senatorblutarsky on Jun 3, 2007 17:13:22 GMT -6
lol, SO what did you do! we all want to know!!
Still pending. We have our first day of summer conditioning tomorrow, and I will make the call out there after.
A few things to add:
Out here in the sparsely populated areas- 190 mi. is nothing. Right now I drive 100 to go out (Sioux Falls is about 100). Why that is such a plus is my parents would likely attend almost every game (like they did when I coached in CO).
Full time PE means no more NCLB BS. I am tired of meetings, workshops, etc. that have nothing to do with nothing and only take time away from me and make me a worse teacher. As one who has continuously railed against NCLB (I have written a book on the subject- working with an agent right now... no lie.. 141 pages of anger against NCLB). Kind of ironic... Office Space is on TV now... and I want what Peter wanted- to be left alone to do what I want to do (which is coach and teach weights).
Had this job been open in March, I would have taken it in a heartbeat.
My contemplation is should I let a 3 month difference be the deciding factor in doing what I want to do vs. doing what I am willing to do.
Don't get me wrong- I have a very good job... and I know my situation is better than it is for most coaches and I am very fortunate. I looked over a lot of situations elsewhere- just to see what is out there and no other job made me too excited when comparing them to what I have. This job is what I have set up as an ideal... so that certainly makes it harder to ignore- even with the late opening (which occurred, by the way, due to a late resignation- the previous coach resigned Wednesday).
I appreciate the feedback on the board- which is why I asked. And I agree with most- to me 2007 football started in January. March/April is not too late from a planning perspective if you are well organized. June (and probably July) is tough, if not impossible to pull off. Early in my career I took a HC job in July. The best thing about that year was I learned (and constantly experienced) humility.
I really do not think I will pursue this... but I still want to kick it around a bit more.
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Post by coachmoore42 on Jun 3, 2007 21:41:01 GMT -6
I am tired of "starting over" This one would seal it for me. You don't seem up for "starting over." You could be setting up for failure at the new place, or at least a miserable time doing something you aren't into. |
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Post by coachd5085 on Jun 3, 2007 23:49:56 GMT -6
If the job was open in March you would have taken it in a heartbeat...
WHY aren't you taking it in a heartbeat now?
IF the answer is because YOU don't think you could get everything set up at the new place in that short a time..., that is valid
IF you feel that you would be leaving the current team in a bad spot.....THEN GO. They will understand and you will probably give one of your current great staff members a HC shot.
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Post by senatorblutarsky on Jun 4, 2007 19:46:24 GMT -6
Final update:
I called the AD there and told him thanks but no thanks. There are just too many variables at this time. Mainly, I don't want to try to move now... and I don't want to start football in July. Plus, I don't think I would be let out of my contract without a fight... and the bottom line, this year might be fun. Not a lot is expected of us (we lost our studs), but we are going for our 20th consecutive playoff year. It will be a challenge, but I am looking forward to it. We'll see what I think when we start off 0-4.
Thanks for the replies. I appreciate it.
p.s. if anyone on here is looking for a head coaching job (in Nebraska... but it is a resort area). Let me know. I told him if anyone came to mind, I would let him know. I do think it would be a pretty good situation.
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newhc
Sophomore Member
Posts: 209
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Post by newhc on Jun 6, 2007 8:44:47 GMT -6
Reading this post was a Great Read for a very great perspective. I have a similar situation.
Here is the Tale of the Tape
The Old School
4A
New AD For next Season
No Administrative Support
New County Rule concerning academics (2.0 and No E) I think this will hurt my program
I have only been HC for 1 year and I went 5-5
I don't see alot of talent in grades 9, 10
Academics are hard here (School Not met AYP) NCLB
Block Schedule with 1 Planning
Salary is higher
The New Job
4A School
Play on Friday
3 Teams (Fresh, JV, V)
School is much better AYP Scores (I'm a Algebra Teacher)
School was ranked in the Newsweek top 1300 Public Schools
Better Facilities More Space for Practice
What seems like a Better Administration (I think)
Similar athlete as Old school based upon combine numbers previous team went 6-4.
Have 30 8th Graders lifting now (found this out during the interview)
Same state
I don't have to relocate
Have 7 50 minute periods I have to teach 5
I don't have the job offered as of yet, but the word on the street is that I am the candidtae that will be chosen. Still haven't heard anything as yet.
I am leaning to taking the offer.
Sorry senator didn't mean to take over your thread, but wanted some help
Thanks in advance
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Post by jhanawa on Jun 6, 2007 9:51:37 GMT -6
Senator, you forgot to calculate in which area had the better pheasant hunting....lol
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Post by fbdoc on Jun 6, 2007 13:35:56 GMT -6
Newhc
Looks and sounds like the new position has some advantages. Is there anything beneath the surface that keeps this from being a slam dunk?
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Post by flycoach on Jun 6, 2007 13:40:10 GMT -6
[supKind of ironic... Office Space is on TV now... and I want what Peter wanted- to be left alone to do what I want to do (which is coach and teach weights). Ummm, Yeahhh, I'm going to need you to come in on saturday..... LOL |
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newhc
Sophomore Member
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Post by newhc on Jun 6, 2007 15:00:09 GMT -6
I don't believe so. It may just be dark water. LOL
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Post by senatorblutarsky on Jun 7, 2007 7:36:30 GMT -6
Senator, you forgot to calculate in which area had the better pheasant hunting....lolWe have some of the best pheasant hunting in the state. They are everywhere. I almost killed (got killed by?) one on the bike the other day. That was back when I used to ride... before we had tornado warnings every evening  Ummm, Yeahhh, I'm going to need you to come in on saturday.....
LOLI'm gonna have to ask you to come back later. I've got a meeting with the Bobs in a couple of minutes. Sorry senator didn't mean to take over your thread, but wanted some helpNo problem. Do these two schools play each other since they are in the same class and presumably close to each other? If so, does that affect anything? Not having to relocate to get a new job is a plus (in large communities anyway). It might be a problem here if I took a job at another town and retained a residence here.
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newhc
Sophomore Member
Posts: 209
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Post by newhc on Jun 7, 2007 8:01:41 GMT -6
Well The New School just reposted the Head Football Coach Vacancy, so that made my choice easy. I most definetly think that this was a blessing from God, cause if I had gotten the offer, I would have taken it.
Senator, The schools don't play each other, could probably deep in the playoffs.
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