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Post by drfootball99 on Jun 1, 2009 18:59:42 GMT -6
Coaches, Scenerio: You get a talented group of freshman coming in. Some of these athetes are immediately ready for JV and 1 or 2 for varsity (starters). Do you keep them together on Freshman team to win and cultivate a winning atmosphere? (OR) Do you split them up and have them compete against higher skill levels?
I know what I would choose but I want your input......
You guys are the best. Thanks for your insights.
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Post by kylem56 on Jun 1, 2009 19:17:58 GMT -6
Thats a tough question. I would say it depends on what the state of your varsity program is. Don't bring up frosh onto varsity unless they are going to actually contribute to the team and actually help you get a win. If the freshmen is a better player than the senior... hell why not. Thats just something you and your staff will have to evaluate during pre season
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Post by bigm0073 on Jun 1, 2009 19:35:21 GMT -6
Agree with above... Last year I brought up 16 freshmen and sophomores to play for us. Only had 7 seniors and only 3 of them played much...
Bottom line went 1-9 and took our lumps..
NOW.... We have 23 out of 26 returning (kicker, punter) and they are all back. As a 9th grade class my current rising juniors were undefeated... They are hungry and ready for payback. Weight room has been great. I say play them. I have done this in the past with great success.
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byuwolverine
Junior Member
Life is a game of inches --- Add them up in any aspect and there is your outcome.
Posts: 285
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Post by byuwolverine on Jun 1, 2009 20:06:54 GMT -6
Im going into my third year. Our Frosh class my first year is the most talented the school has had. We mainly kept them together for the freshman year, we brought up 3 to JV to fill some spots that year since that soph. class was a thinner. Then brought up 8 to varsity the next year and they were our best players and we went to the playoffs. Since we split them up their sophomore year, we now have quality depth for the next two years with just that class.
Players can jump from freshman to varsity their sophomore year and not be intimidated, this group is fun to coach because they want to be good but they are still immature at times but they are gamers.
Bottom line, what do you think will give you the most depth for the money years of that class, the junior and senior years?
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Post by coachd5085 on Jun 1, 2009 22:05:40 GMT -6
Coaches, Scenerio: You get a talented group of freshman coming in. Some of these athetes are immediately ready for JV and 1 or 2 for varsity (starters). Do you keep them together on Freshman team to win and cultivate a winning atmosphere? (OR) Do you split them up and have them compete against higher skill levels? I know what I would choose but I want your input...... You guys are the best. Thanks for your insights. Again, as stated on the board before, I the question is only pertinent depending on how you set up your program. What does "keeping them together" mean? Some programs have separate staffs for various levels. For some, all the players practice together, and play separate games.
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Post by coachdawhip on Jun 1, 2009 22:14:05 GMT -6
If you have a freshmen team let them start the whole season there be successful and then see if you can use them on varsity.
If you don't have to play them on fridays and can keep them together for 1 year do so.
We did this, the chemistry and belief system in each other was great the Freshmen team went 7-0. This year they went 12-1 as seniors, because that core group knew each others strengths and weaknesses
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Post by briangilbert on Jun 1, 2009 23:18:20 GMT -6
In Ohio an option could be to only use them on Special Teams because you have to play 2 consecutive plays for a quarter.
So you could technically play your talented freshman in every 9th grade game and still give them varsity experience.
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Post by coachjd on Jun 2, 2009 4:44:05 GMT -6
As said before, what ever the state of the varsity is would determine how much you want to play the 9th graders.
Personally, I would want them to stay together and dominate if at all possible. Let them develop a swagger, an attitude, etc.....
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bamf99
Probationary Member
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Post by bamf99 on Jun 2, 2009 5:07:08 GMT -6
I agree, swagger and attitude are critical to the game of football. The only way I could see a frosh coming up is if he will start on varsity. Why bring a kid up if he gets limitted playing time at the varsity level, also why bring a kid up to j.v. when he could get the same game experience (minus the quality of players) on the freshman team. The difference is the team atmosphere and hopefully the winning that will come by keeping some of your studs on the freshman team.
With that being said, I also agree with the other points, it depends on your program. Many teams do have different coaches for different teams. If you are bringing a kid up to coach him up that may be the right thing to do. It is so important to have quality coaches in charge of your freshman team working on the fundementals of your varsity system. And if your varsity team is struggling then it might be smart to work the freshman kids into the varsity program slowly....maybe play them midway through the season. It does all depend on your program.
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Post by coachwoodall on Jun 2, 2009 6:49:01 GMT -6
Caveat: We have 3 levels (Fresh, JV, Var). We have 160 on our wt room roster for this summer (all levels). In SC we can play a kid 8 quarters a week. So we don't have to make a cut and dried decision down here.
I say keep them down as a group. The Freshman we dress on Friday, rarely can do anything more than get mop up time, with a couple of notable exceptions, one being our RB who might end up being the #1 recruit in the nation this year. We let them (some) dress and get to be exposed to the big lights, but feel it is extremely important to let them dominate at their level of competition to gain confidence. There is also a degree of intimidation for our region opponents to know that as they get older, they are facing the same guys that beat the brakes off of them as freshman, again and again and again.
I have worked at a smaller school where we NEEDED those type of freshman to get wins. As a general rule, many of the those kids end up with the 'big head' and can become problems later b/c they start feel a since of entitlement, or the attitude of 'why do I need to work to get better, I started/played in the 9th grade'.
I am however, in agreement with dcO, that would rather have an underclassmen as one of my backups, since he will be returning. At my current situation, I am becoming less inclined to think that way. However, the situation we are in is probably a rarity. I just would rather my #2 FS be a junior/soph instead of freshman for example.
There have been countless threads on here about 'how do we develop leadership?'. Well, unless you have just that exceptional freshman, most of the time he will not be one that will take the lead and set an example if he is surrounded by upper classmen. If they stay with their class, then they can develop and we can foster that leadership much easier. Also by staying together, the class cohesion will grow stronger and stronger as time goes by.
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Post by drfootball99 on Jun 2, 2009 8:31:19 GMT -6
All great responses... Thanks...
I see it as the little brother phenom. We all know, or even have been, the little brother who grows up playing with the big brother. He is always getting "thumped" and eventually learns to adapt and compete with the older sect. Then when it comes time to compete against his own age groups, he plays at an extremely high level, much more advanced than those his age. This, coupled with the depth it creates within the program, is why I am in favor of playing freshman up if they start.
Agree / Disagree?
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Post by phantom on Jun 2, 2009 8:44:52 GMT -6
All great responses... Thanks... I see it as the little brother phenom. We all know, or even have been, the little brother who grows up playing with the big brother. He is always getting "thumped" and eventually learns to adapt and compete with the older sect. Then when it comes time to compete against his own age groups, he plays at an extremely high level, much more advanced than those his age. This, coupled with the depth it creates within the program, is why I am in favor of playing freshman up if they start. Agree / Disagree? Not knowing the state of your program I really can't give a hard answer. When my old boss took over this program it was one of the worst AAA programs in the state if not they country. They were stuck in a multi year losing streak and had had one or two winning seasons in their entire history. He had a very talented group of young players so he made a conscious decision to keep them together on JV to let them feel some success, which was something new to them. It worked. If you're in a similar situation- new to an historically bad program- then there's something to be said about keeping them together. If not then probably not.
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Post by groundchuck on Jun 2, 2009 20:17:00 GMT -6
If at all possible I would want to keep them together and let them learn how to win together. Like JD said let them get a swagger. Winning fosters more winning.
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hwkfn1
Junior Member
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Post by hwkfn1 on Jun 3, 2009 10:33:39 GMT -6
We will have that situation this fall. A great incoming freshmen class and an average at best sophomore class. We have never, since I have been at my school, brought up a freshmen to play varsity. We talked about bringing up some freshmen this fall to play sophomore, but the more we talked about it, we realized that we didn't want to ruin the freshmen class as our sophomores have a horrible attitude. Our sophs to be have averaged only about 4-5 kids working out all off-season so far.
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