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Post by bluecrazy on Feb 12, 2009 15:44:58 GMT -6
This is being used in the Turning a program around thread.
What does this mean to you?
And, how would you go about doing it?
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Post by cqmiller on Feb 12, 2009 15:53:04 GMT -6
I'm going through that right now... School we are at has had 0 discipline before us. If we would have come in and just "cleaned house" by enforcing 1000 rules right off the bat, then we would loose numbers, games, and the program. (When I say no rules, I mean kids would not come to practice all week long and still start & play all game before we got here)
Had to pick our battles the last few years... kids who missed practices didn't play on fridays, but we had to let some "tardies" slide by or we could have been in trouble. Tightened it up a little this season, and next season we will tighten it up a little more with the tardies.
Pick the top 3 or 4 things that you NEED to have controlled, and work on those. Then when those are taken care of, move on to 3 or 4 "less important" ones.
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Post by Bill Vasko on Feb 12, 2009 20:59:02 GMT -6
When you take over a new program, there is an adjustment period on both sides for a while as each side feels out the other. We tried not to change too many things all at once, but still tried to implement our philosophy. We keeping adding on bit by bit, knowing that things will really turn around as new kids come into the program and we eliminate the cancers.....
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Post by touchdownmaker on Feb 13, 2009 4:38:56 GMT -6
sample of tightening screws, maybe too fast at first...depends on who you ask.
1) kids get a new coach 2) new coach brings in rules and new ways (all in writing and explained in pre season meeting/parent meeting/letters) 3) kids test and test - especially former stars 4) coach holds kids accountable 5) some kids quit, others complain to parents, parents whine and make excuses for kids- testing continues 6) coach sticks to guns and tightens screws more- not having much fun, team losing, focus is on distractions 7) more kids quit, administration asks if they are needed to step in 8) coach sticks to guns- does it his way refusing to compromise principles, fears micromanagement- knows it will get worse before it gets better 9) few kids left but biggest cancers are gone, or at least badly outnumbered. Kids hearing "with us or against us" 10)improved relationship with team, team wins out , coach earns respect 11) numbers grow, different kind of kids coming out for sport 12)coach promises kids that it will be harder next year- tightening screws 13) quitters asking to come back 14) coach explains that quitters conform, coach doesnt conform 15) quitters stay quitted or become committed- coach doesnt care 16) new environment in weight room and a different kind of attitude about the team and coach. 17) Coach confronts those who are missing from off season and gets leaders on them now. changing from coach driven program to player owned program in coaches image 18) bad attitudes show themselves are held accountable even in the offseason 19) kids told basically "you are in or you are out" in the off season so they cant be a distraction in season * the best part is that the kids who are in the coaches corner GET ALL OVER the kids who try and steer the ship in the wrong direction. They are quickly isolated and left to huddle like losers elsewhere. 20) much more fun to coach kids who want to win and understand that it takes hard work.
For me tigtening the screws is not limited to players but includes the staff as well.
1) coaches called, emailed often, called to meetings and clinics 2) coaches given study guides and materials and asked frequently how the learning is going 3) coaches given written expecations (twice ) and constant talk about how we need to step up as a staff
Tightening screws applies to classroom management as well. Kids who are testing at this point get swift discipline as theres no time for explanations and warnings. At this point they either are stupid or stupid if they are breaking rules. They learn to tell their friends " dont do it in coach's class"
Tightening screws applies to parents and their clique as well. Coach draws in and includes the parents who are supportive (getting kids to football and communicating etc) while isolating and excluding those who are not supportive. parents are given newsletters, emails, phone calls including discussions on where their kids are in the program (point system). Emphasis on players family making sacrifices and adjusting vacation plans etc rather than coach having to bend for each kid individually.
Continuing with WHAT WAS PROMISED and not bending due to previous seasons whining. etc
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Post by warrior53 on Feb 13, 2009 4:50:06 GMT -6
I'm going through that right now... School we are at has had 0 discipline before us. If we would have come in and just "cleaned house" by enforcing 1000 rules right off the bat, then we would loose numbers, games, and the program. (When I say no rules, I mean kids would not come to practice all week long and still start & play all game before we got here) Had to pick our battles the last few years... kids who missed practices didn't play on fridays, but we had to let some "tardies" slide by or we could have been in trouble. Tightened it up a little this season, and next season we will tighten it up a little more with the tardies. Pick the top 3 or 4 things that you NEED to have controlled, and work on those. Then when those are taken care of, move on to 3 or 4 "less important" ones. Good luck cq!
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Post by touchdownmaker on Feb 13, 2009 6:13:43 GMT -6
I am considering have an off season meeting, just with the quitter players and their parents. Id like to have all of them in a small room with a bright light shining in their eyes. Id like to have them sweating while I grill them:
" are you here to break down what I am working hard to build?" "who sent you?" ' tell me why I should take you back?" "why do you want to play football here?" " have you cleared your busy over extended schedule?" "parent, can you keep your mouth shut and support all of the kids for the good of the program?" " sign your player and parent contracts or walk away and do not come back"
lol
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Post by bluecrazy on Feb 13, 2009 8:52:21 GMT -6
I am considering have an off season meeting, just with the quitter players and their parents. Id like to have all of them in a small room with a bright light shining in their eyes. Id like to have them sweating while I grill them: " are you here to break down what I am working hard to build?" "who sent you?" ' tell me why I should take you back?" "why do you want to play football here?" " have you cleared your busy over extended schedule?" "parent, can you keep your mouth shut and support all of the kids for the good of the program?" " sign your player and parent contracts or walk away and do not come back" lol Excellent! Make sure you video it so we can all see it!!!
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Post by jpdaley25 on Feb 13, 2009 9:14:05 GMT -6
"Stay quitted, or become committed!" I love it!
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coachgeorge51
Sophomore Member
Cliches and mottos is mindless verbal nonsense.
Posts: 151
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Post by coachgeorge51 on Feb 13, 2009 9:22:38 GMT -6
Never email with a parent or a player in regards to issues pertaining to football. Always hold face to face meetings or you will be in for a world of hurt.
Your emails will be forwarded to everyone - school board, superintendent, principal, A.D., other parents, etc.
I had a buddy tell me this and it holds true. I actually tested it once and sure enough - the email was sent on to everyone. It was actually funny because I told the A.D. that I was going to send a polite, yet firm stance in my response and be prepared for it to be forwarded to everyone.
I know head coaches who emailed parents and the parent (crazy freaking lowlifes) changed the original coaches response before sending it out to the school board.
Don't trust anyone, especially during a your time of rebuilding.
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Post by jpdaley25 on Feb 13, 2009 9:29:48 GMT -6
Very wise coachgeorge51. I also apply that philosophy to anything written (except posting their maxes). I never give the kids any kind of written evaluation; it is always verbal.
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Post by touchdownmaker on Feb 13, 2009 9:32:32 GMT -6
I disagree based on the idea that teenagers have a filter that is fubar. Putting your evaluations and expectations in writing (forward a copy to your admin) will cover your butt when that one kid runs home and tells his EVEN CRAZIER mother what you "said about him". Emails are fine too provided you can communicate tone in yours in some say.
for example :
you never lift
is alot different from
You have participated in just 2 out of 19 scheduled workouts.
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Post by touchdownmaker on Feb 13, 2009 9:34:18 GMT -6
correction- loose lips sink ships, do not put anything in writing that you want kept secret, in that regard, i agree.
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Post by rideanddecide on Feb 13, 2009 9:55:27 GMT -6
I agree with TDmaker on this one. I've had email save my butt before because I keep all messages in a communication binder. When a parent tells me " You said......" I can fall back on the email and "refresh their memory".
Just be careful how you word things and always be professional.
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Post by touchdownmaker on Feb 13, 2009 9:59:52 GMT -6
True story, when I finished one season at the freshman level I gave a speech while we were all in the endzone after our final game. I was giving the whole " now its time to get right back into the weight room to prepare for next year" speech and the poor attitude "i only got 5 plays even though i didnt deserve to see the field" kids filtered what I said into: "coach said if we dont lift weights we arent allowed to play next year" and I believe to this day that it cost me a HC job at that school. I also believe the current varsity HC DID say that but blamed it on me ha ha. way to throw me under the bus coach. (hes not coaching any more ) would have been much better to save my speech and hand out letters for the parents thanking them for their time, support and commitment to football as well as including off season expectations etc. again, forwarded to the bosses.
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Post by jpdaley25 on Feb 13, 2009 10:38:58 GMT -6
Here's a flip side true story.
Many moons ago, I used to do grade sheets on all of my RB's for every game like we did in college. It had the player's name, the name of each play we ran, a check, a plus or a minus for each play, and the player's overall grade. One player graded out at 40% in an early game and I moved another back in front of him. The next thing I know, I'm in the superintendant's office and he's chewing my @ss for degrading and demoralizing the kids. Next, the principlal is chewing my @ss for being negative with the kids and not having any positives on there. Next, my grade sheet ends up in a cutting and brutal editorial in the local newspaper, and now the HC is chewing my @ss. Next, we are having a parent meeting, and I'm having to apologize for my actions, or hit the road. After it's all over, the coach tells me, "I hope you learned your lesson -Never put things in writing about the kids. it can always be turned against you."
So I've followed that policy ever since. The only things I put in writing about a player are there maxes, stats, and attendance.
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Post by touchdownmaker on Feb 13, 2009 10:48:00 GMT -6
Well grades in a school are to be kept private by law, you cant publish ACADEMIC grades. You can however hang stats and things like that. Wonder who you gave your grade sheet to??? Your principal and hc were out to get ya bro.
I was slapped on the wrist for being careless with written stuff once too. I had 3x5 cards for each kid, I kept attendance records and also graded practices and often jotted down notes such as 'bad attitude" next to a practice date etc. Stuff to justify playing time or captain status. I left the darned things in the med kit and the girls soccer coach got a hold of it. next thing I know the lady Ad has her panties all wadded up over the 'bad attitude" comments getting around to the players. (roll eyes).
THERE WASNT AN ISSUE WITH WRITTEN INFO, THERE WAS AN ISSUE THAT THE LADY AD HATED MEN. She was just looking for something, just like it sounds like your principal and hc were looking.
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Post by touchdownmaker on Feb 13, 2009 10:51:00 GMT -6
anyhow back to the whole turning the screws slowly. I think you need to fill your roster out with guys you can trust YOUR GUYS and if you are a new coach the roster is probably filled out with THEIR GUYS guys you cant trust who might be loyal to the old staff or to no one at all but themselves. Over time you can crack down harder and tighter as your roster is filled with your guys who will back and defend you. I am seeing this now. I have a starter or two from last year who are on the fence, are they my guys yet? hard to say, but know this, they are on the outside looking in if they are not. I see my program turning into OUR PROGRAM as we speak.
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coachgeorge51
Sophomore Member
Cliches and mottos is mindless verbal nonsense.
Posts: 151
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Post by coachgeorge51 on Feb 13, 2009 10:51:04 GMT -6
Don't get me wrong, it is imperative that you keep attendance records and document your players performance in the weight room. You will need this when speaking with parents - but just do it face to face if possible.
Here is what I do: 1. after two unexcused absences - speak directly with the player 2. after third unexcused absence - speak directly with player and his position coach 3. after the fourth - send a letter home requesting a parent meeting, then hold the meeting with the intent to revisit the players goals and program expectations - not a personal attack in any way.
I also meet with each player and a parent in an end-of-the-year post-season conference where they set personal and team goals. This gives me something to address when they are not meeting their goals. It give credence to my concern because the kid is not doing what he said he was going to do.
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Post by groundchuck on Feb 13, 2009 13:01:33 GMT -6
I subscibe to the "high speed drill" anaolgy to but..........
if you tighten screws too fast without being a little cautious the wood might splinter.
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Post by touchdownmaker on Feb 13, 2009 13:27:14 GMT -6
We all fantasize about the high speed drill. I am not sure I understand it really because in some cases if a kid was PERMITTED to play despite poor grades and discipline his whole life, its going to take some time to TEACH HIM how things are, you cant just cut his butt and give up on him. (particularly if his Mother is superintendant for example)
There are places where its all about winning, one way or another, just win. Grades, discipline, nothing matters...just win games and thats from the administration and school board!!!!!!. The kids know it and live their lives that way and their parents (former players) on the board telling the admin that the coach has to win period. rare maybe, but a reality.
There are places where losing is expected and tolerated and the kids have lived their lives that way. Teach first, discipline second. Thats my thinking on it.
IF you are taking over at a place where the cupboard is bare but there is a winning tradition things can get tough fast. Folks blame you for the losing and the players are all loyal to the former staff. It takes time to develop relationships and get THEIR GUYS to become YOUR GUYS and until that happens, losing happens.
As we keep saying, every situation is different. One thing for sure, discipline is the most logical choice as relationships are being built.
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