|
Post by 29sweep on Oct 31, 2008 20:13:48 GMT -6
There was no penalty on this play. Maybe some of you have already seen this.
|
|
|
Post by coachd5085 on Oct 31, 2008 21:19:21 GMT -6
Yes.
|
|
|
Post by tog on Oct 31, 2008 21:26:44 GMT -6
no
he is on the field
the whistle hadn't blown
fair game
|
|
|
Post by eickst on Oct 31, 2008 21:27:14 GMT -6
Big time cheap shot.
|
|
|
Post by coachd5085 on Oct 31, 2008 21:35:41 GMT -6
no he is on the field the whistle hadn't blown fair game have to disagree with this 100% coach. 1) Whistle does NOT end a play. The Whistle simply signals that a play is over. 2) Football has an orderly system about it. Saying "he is on the field...fair game" is not only inaccurate from a rules standpoint, but it isn't far removed from a paradigm in which you willing violate rules with the intent to injure,while simply receiving a 15 yard penalty. Can't block their 3 tech...just hold him up, chop the knees, knock him out and take a measly 15 yard penalty. Football is not this game. Football is about advancing the ball/stopping the ball's advancement.
|
|
|
Post by eickst on Oct 31, 2008 21:36:53 GMT -6
no he is on the field the whistle hadn't blown fair game Actually the kicker can't be hit until the ball touches the ground or another player, or he advances 5 yards from his scrimmage line. At least in FED anyway, don't know what level of football that was.
|
|
|
Post by tog on Oct 31, 2008 21:48:18 GMT -6
no he is on the field the whistle hadn't blown fair game have to disagree with this 100% coach. 1) Whistle does NOT end a play. The Whistle simply signals that a play is over. 2) Football has an orderly system about it. Saying "he is on the field...fair game" is not only inaccurate from a rules standpoint, but it isn't far removed from a paradigm in which you willing violate rules with the intent to injure,while simply receiving a 15 yard penalty. Can't block their 3 tech...just hold him up, chop the knees, knock him out and take a measly 15 yard penalty. Football is not this game. Football is about advancing the ball/stopping the ball's advancement. for an offensive lineman that is kicking someone's asss to the whistle it does how in the wide world of sports is an OL that is dominating someone supposed to know when the f-ing play is over? our kicker has been warned about this scenario and we will attack other team's kickers if we feel the need they are on the field they can make the damn tackle therefore they are someone that we can block
|
|
|
Post by eickst on Oct 31, 2008 21:52:24 GMT -6
Sorry Tog, but you are wrong on this one. Maybe one of the officials from the rules section can chime in but I am looking at the rule book right now, Rule 9, Section 3, Article 4.
"The kicker or place-kick holder of a free kick may not be blocked before: a. He has advanced 5 yards beyond his free-kick line; or b. The kick has touched the ground or any other player.
|
|
|
Post by tog on Oct 31, 2008 22:03:18 GMT -6
Sorry Tog, but you are wrong on this one. Maybe one of the officials from the rules section can chime in but I am looking at the rule book right now, Rule 9, Section 3, Article 4. "The kicker or place-kick holder of a free kick may not be blocked before: a. He has advanced 5 yards beyond his free-kick line; or b. The kick has touched the ground or any other player. www.ncaapublications.com/Uploads/PDF/Football_Rulesadc982b5-03fb-4e27-828c-c2d26b95e6c1.pdfwe don't use fed poontang rules ncaa rules don't appear to make it illegal and even if it was it isn't a cheap shot have a real dang player as a kicker
|
|
|
Post by coachd5085 on Oct 31, 2008 22:16:06 GMT -6
fed rules or not...that is 100% B.S pure cheap shot. The kicker hasn't even finished his kicking motion.
|
|
|
Post by tog on Oct 31, 2008 22:25:29 GMT -6
fed rules or not...that is 100% B.S pure cheap shot. The kicker hasn't even finished his kicking motion. fed rules or not it is still damn football
|
|
|
Post by coachd5085 on Oct 31, 2008 22:28:36 GMT -6
yes coach..it is FOOTBALL. You are exactly right. And there is a PURPOSE in football. That purpose is NOT striking defenseless players.
|
|
|
Post by tog on Oct 31, 2008 22:39:52 GMT -6
yes coach..it is FOOTBALL. You are exactly right. And there is a PURPOSE in football. That purpose is NOT striking defenseless players. that guy isn't defenseless don't run through the kickoff so hard or you might get knocked on your keister accomplishes the goal----don't kick it so deep I have zero problem with this the kicker is someone that can make the tackle on KOR On a similar note, how do you feel about hitting the qb after an interception? I think he is total free game however you can hit him as he is someone that can make the tackle
|
|
|
Post by coachd5085 on Oct 31, 2008 22:49:33 GMT -6
yes coach..it is FOOTBALL. You are exactly right. And there is a PURPOSE in football. That purpose is NOT striking defenseless players. that guy isn't defenseless don't run through the kickoff so hard or you might get knocked on your keister accomplishes the goal----don't kick it so deep I have zero problem with this the kicker is someone that can make the tackle on KOR On a similar note, how do you feel about hitting the qb after an interception? I think he is total free game however you can hit him as he is someone that can make the tackle HELL..lets allow the QB to hit after he rleases the ball. Will keep him from following through...accomplishes the goal Coach, It saddens me to say that I have lost a little respect for you based on your comments here. FOOTBALL has objectives...just randomly hitting people to hit people is called mayhem. He can be blocked..AFTER he establishes himself as a potential tackler. Following through on the kicking motion HARDLY has him as a potential tackler.
|
|
|
Post by tog on Oct 31, 2008 23:00:52 GMT -6
that guy isn't defenseless don't run through the kickoff so hard or you might get knocked on your keister accomplishes the goal----don't kick it so deep I have zero problem with this the kicker is someone that can make the tackle on KOR On a similar note, how do you feel about hitting the qb after an interception? I think he is total free game however you can hit him as he is someone that can make the tackle HELL..lets allow the QB to hit after he rleases the ball. Will keep him from following through...accomplishes the goal Coach, It saddens me to say that I have lost a little respect for you based on your comments here. FOOTBALL has objectives...just randomly hitting people to hit people is called mayhem. He can be blocked..AFTER he establishes himself as a potential tackler. Following through on the kicking motion HARDLY has him as a potential tackler. look i am an offensive coach that thinks that a qb that is releasing the ball and if the defender takes a step and then hits him well that's ok too much more than that step is not cool here is the difference a kicker is a potential tackler on the kor a qb letting go of the ball is still an offensive player when do you tell the defender to slow up? as soon as he gets anywhere near the qb? one step? two steps and then hit the qb? when? this is all gray area the op's video is totally fine with me would I choose to do it? depends depends on how many steps their kicker take s to kcik it that deep iif he needed a full run on like that guy to make a kick, then guess what? if I thought it was best for my team to get that in the kicker's mind that we are coming at him forcing him to take fewer steps and to kick the balll not as far then so be it I don't really care if I am in the majority on this or not. I like this game played full speed until the whistle
|
|
|
Post by tog on Oct 31, 2008 23:03:20 GMT -6
I have an idea, why don't we just use the a-11 for every down? that would solve it eh?
I guess I am a neanderthal, but if you are on the dang field, then be ready to be hit!!!!
|
|
|
Post by 29sweep on Oct 31, 2008 23:09:35 GMT -6
The kicker on this play is the starting QB from Highland in Pocatello, ID. Taysom Hill has a full-ride to Stanford and the cross-town rival Pocatello coach Tom Harrison wanted to rough him up a little because Highland's whole offense revolves around him. Harrison was suspended one game for ordering the hit and many are calling for his job. He is the most successful coach in Idaho history, winning 9 or 10 state championships. If he is fired over this, he will not have a hard time finding a job elsewhere.
|
|
|
Post by hustleandheart on Oct 31, 2008 23:14:13 GMT -6
There was no penalty on this play. Maybe some of you have already seen this. If the kicker was smart he'd rifle it into that boys chest...
|
|
|
Post by tog on Oct 31, 2008 23:23:03 GMT -6
The kicker on this play is the starting QB from Highland in Pocatello, ID.. even more reason to go hit him just to rattle his cage make him think about how hard he kicks off and how he wishes to play te game at qb
|
|
|
Post by eickst on Oct 31, 2008 23:25:09 GMT -6
Looks like they fixed the cheap shot artist the next time.
|
|
|
Post by coachorr on Oct 31, 2008 23:26:04 GMT -6
Tog, with all due respect, the Kicker is on a full ride to Stanford as a Q. I believe the rules in our state state that there must be a cushion given to kickers.
|
|
|
Post by 29sweep on Oct 31, 2008 23:29:43 GMT -6
Yes I saw the retaliation hit and I was going to post it. Thanks for doing that. I just put the clip on before I explained the situation because I wanted a non-biased opinion on the play.
coachorr, if it was against the rules, why wasn't there a call?
|
|
|
Post by coachorr on Oct 31, 2008 23:30:07 GMT -6
People are in an outrage, and I pointed out that if the strategy was to keep the ball out of the end zone (as it is on every play) and to also block the last line of defense, then I don't feel it is a cheap shot, however, if the order was given to "take him out" or "hurt him", then I think it is uncalled for.
The HC was suspended for one game pending investigation and one assistant for Highland (the kicking team) was suspended for a game as well, for alegedly asking for the cheap shot artist to be taken out. Every one is back to work and life goes on.
|
|
|
Post by coachorr on Oct 31, 2008 23:31:21 GMT -6
A freind of mine who is an official and a freind of the officials on the field, claims he did not see it. I have not seen the actual rule, but it is what people are saying.
|
|
|
Post by coachorr on Oct 31, 2008 23:40:40 GMT -6
Coincidentally, the HC of Highland, Gino Mariani, made the statement that if these are the kind of antics they are going to display that the game should just be canceled, as the game has no playoff implications (Poky is 4A and Highland is 5A).
Well, what is interesting about that statement is that the Pocatello School district (same district for both schools) pays $100,000 a year to use the facility for three high school football teams and graduation I think. Well this rivalry game, titled the Black and Blue Bowl, is so important because there is usually an average of 10,000 to 12,000 fans who attend this game. This game foots a major part of the bill, the district pays.
On a side note, Dirk Koetter, former HC of Boise State and Arizona State comes from Pocatello. He was at one time the HC of Highland High and his dad was the HC of Pocatello High School. Also, the current HC of Highland, was formerly the HC of Pocatello High, but moved up on the hill for greener pasures. The current HC of Pocatello High, Tom Harrison, went on a 49 game winning streak at the 3A level.
|
|
|
Post by coachcb on Nov 1, 2008 0:02:48 GMT -6
How is it a cheapr shot???
-He is a member of the KOR team and on the football field. -He can make the tackle on the play. -He is facing the guy that hit him; he wasn't ear-holed (which is still legal) or clipped. -He wasn't held or thrown on ther ground. -Contact was made while the ball was live and the play was running.
|
|
|
Post by phantom on Nov 1, 2008 0:18:24 GMT -6
If the game was played in Idaho then it was played under Fed rules. As others have said that means that the kicker can't be blocked at the point that he was blocked. It was illegal and should have been penalized.
|
|
|
Post by coachweigelt on Nov 1, 2008 1:20:14 GMT -6
a little late on this but:
1st - TOG what is going on, always had alot of respect for your comments? WHat happend? 2nd - in the second vid it looks like a block below the waist which would be illegal also 3rd - if the people here saying no cheap shot then the following is leagal?
|
|
|
Post by coachweigelt on Nov 1, 2008 2:42:43 GMT -6
And by the way, if your KOR Player is so good to outrun the coverage team (with the help of his fellas blocking of course) and he then cannot beat the kicker... Well that must be a heck of a KICKER!!
|
|
|
Post by timtheenchanter on Nov 1, 2008 3:45:07 GMT -6
Hey guys,
For those of you in Texas, this isn't a cheap shot but it is a foul:
c. The kicker of a free kick may not be blocked until he has advanced five yards beyond his restraining line or the kick has touched a player, an official or the ground. 9.1.4.c
It's a 15 yard personal foul. If the ball touches the ground or a player, all bets are off and the kicker can be lit up like a Christmas tree.
|
|