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Post by coachd5085 on Oct 16, 2008 9:53:06 GMT -6
I strongly suggest you turn in your resignation tomorrow, if not sooner. Is it really that serious? At the end of the day...HS football  After reading your various post in diff threads...you know everything about every subject. Guess your headed for victory 300 in your coaching career this year.... Look captain.. I certainly don't claim to know everything about everything, but I, with 100% can GUARANTEE YOU that I know a HELLAVUA lot more than anyone whose responses are "Lineman just lazy and want [sic] come off the ball" "but I've been resorting to more I-formation to get the guys coming off the ball" (What the heck does the backfield alignment have to do with initial charge) "too lazy to show pass on screens and draws" "fat boys are lazy and you can't tell me any different..." I mean come on guy. YOU are the one playing the kids. YOU are the one motivating the kids. YOU are the one training the kids. |
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Post by phantom on Oct 16, 2008 10:12:52 GMT -6
Gentlemen, none of you have lazy overweight linemen? Sure we do. They don't play, though. Neither do lazy underweight guys. |
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Post by phantom on Oct 16, 2008 10:26:45 GMT -6
Is it really that serious? At the end of the day...HS football After reading your various post in diff threads...you know everything about every subject. Guess your headed for victory 300 in your coaching career this year.... Look captain.. I certainly don't claim to know everything about everything, but I, with 100% can GUARANTEE YOU that I know a HELLAVUA lot more than anyone whose responses are "Lineman just lazy and want [sic] come off the ball" "but I've been resorting to more I-formation to get the guys coming off the ball" (What the heck does the backfield alignment have to do with initial charge) "too lazy to show pass on screens and draws" "fat boys are lazy and you can't tell me any different..." I mean come on guy. YOU are the one playing the kids. YOU are the one motivating the kids. YOU are the one training the kids. As often happens, coachd says what I think but more harshly than I would. Coach them better. Motivate them better. Have a better offseason conditioning program so that you don't have to rely on fat guys. Sorry if I also came off as harsh but I'm getting old and I'm not as patient as I used to be. Terms like "lazy" kind of set me off. |
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Post by coachgreen05 on Oct 16, 2008 10:30:59 GMT -6
Coach Green, your line isn't very good, because you don't have any respect for them. The comment about fat guys, just shows how you really feel. You can't disguise these sentiments to the kids. "Fat boys are lazy,and you cant tell me any different. Ive seen it my entire life,on all levels of football. They get the entire first part of practice during special team periods. Usually at least 30 min. Then we break and out first reg period is individual time for offense. " Why not have your oline coach work with these guys during the first thirty minutes of practice? One more question, How many linemen are captains? O-Line coach does work with them. I look out for them the most. I think they have tuned out the O-Line coach. I have never said anything negative to the players. |
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Post by coachgreen05 on Oct 16, 2008 10:33:05 GMT -6
i guess every coach in here is undefeated ,with great lineman ,that never take plays off and only have positive thoughts about every player.
Thanks for the responses everyone
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Post by touchdownmaker on Oct 16, 2008 10:53:15 GMT -6
I recently replaced a 285 lb "mr potential" with a "rudy" type who is less than half of his weight. The kids overwhelmingly are thrilled with the move. Sometimes the best motivation is just replacing an underachiever.
In an attempt to answer the question, encourage your "hawgs" coach to try some new drills, new teaching methods and focus more on bags, boards and shutes.
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Post by coachorr on Oct 16, 2008 11:03:00 GMT -6
I hate the word "hawg".
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Post by wingtol on Oct 16, 2008 12:07:48 GMT -6
How do they practice? If they aren't practicing hard then don't expect them to play hard. If they are hitting bags or doing drills that make no sense in your scheme then don't expect them to be bad a$$es out on the field. Circle them up and do some 1-1 in front of the whole team and get everyone excited. You'll find some kids who want to play when the whole team is going nuts. I noticed our OL playing kind of soft this past game so yesterday we circled it up and went at it. When a starter gets his butt kicked by a back up or underclass man it seems to change his attitude a bit.
I firmly believe that if you aren't getting after it in practice then don't expect them to get after it on Fri nights. And also don't forget you can't BS kids too much they know if what they are doing has any impact on what they do when the game happens so make sure your OL coach is doing drills that translate into what you expect to accomplish on game day.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 16, 2008 13:00:25 GMT -6
Totally agree with the last post. I'll will add that letting the lineman "do nothing" the first half hour of practice tells me the coaching staff is a little lazy as well.
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Post by coachgreen05 on Oct 16, 2008 16:41:58 GMT -6
In an attempt to answer the question, encourage your "hawgs" coach to try some new drills, new teaching methods and focus more on bags, boards and shutes. Thanks,thats what im looking for |
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Post by coachgreen05 on Oct 16, 2008 16:42:58 GMT -6
Totally agree with the last post. I'll will add that letting the lineman "do nothing" the first half hour of practice tells me the coaching staff is a little lazy as well. where was that in the thread? |
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Post by coachbb on Oct 16, 2008 18:08:17 GMT -6
Do you film practice? Film practice and try to correct the mistakes before they come up in a game. Definetly get team, try to get any group run sessions, and watch what goes wrong.
Have you talked your o-line coach about what he feels the problem is? Be professional and respectful, but grill him to get to the bottom of your dilemma. There are two reasons why lineman do not come off the ball:
1. They don't know what to do or how to do it
2. They lack discipline
Make sure it is not reason 1, then brainstorm with your line coach how to correct the lack of discipline, focus, etc. I am glad to share any ideas with you because this is a problem I am trying to fix right now.
Good luck.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 16, 2008 21:19:02 GMT -6
My apologies, coachgreen, if I wrongly interpreted an earlier post. Coachorr in the next post has the quote I was looking for.
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Post by coachorr on Oct 16, 2008 21:26:47 GMT -6
This is what Wolverine was talking about:
"They get the entire first part of practice during special team periods. Usually at least 30 min. Then we break and out first reg period is individual time for offense."
This is where it was said, and I took it how wolverine took it.
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Post by cltblkhscoach on Oct 17, 2008 5:12:16 GMT -6
I went from a line that averaged 6'2 270 across the front to guys that probably average 5'11 170 this year. No returning starters from the previous year, and a program that has seen four coaches in four years. It has totally been night and day, and we can't run the ball to save our lives. It's bad when you're running Jet Sweep and you're getting beat by the DE on the playside....
But the thing I know I haven't focused on like I should is technique....that's something last year we drilled into our OL's heads. Everyday we had drills we did that focused on the basics of our offense. This year taking the step to an OC has brought different challenges and I've had to focus more on other things. I think both me and my head coach see eye to eye on what we need to do - offseason live in the weight room. All the technique in the world isn't going to help a kid who can't squat 225.....
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Post by los on Oct 17, 2008 5:34:40 GMT -6
See....I'd probably think the opposite....."that proper techniques would be "even more" important, to a smaller lineman".....sometimes the bigger guys can get away with being a little high or slow off the ball, because of their size?.....Smaller guys don't have that luxury.....also....depends on what your asking them to do......some of the best linemen I've coached, were 150-175 lb. smaller guys.....
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Post by Deleted on Oct 17, 2008 9:13:26 GMT -6
Here's what I don't understand... ...ok...the Oline isn't blocking very well...well now there are only about 3 reasons why this is happening. #1 - they aren't being coached right #2 - they can't #3 - they won't You say your Oline coach is adequate...so that leaves the last 2. My question would be WHY don't you try different kids or a different scheme? Because if they can't, then that's your fault as a coach for asking kids to do something they simply can't do. If they won't and it seems like this is what you think, then why the heck would you play them? and don't give me the canned excuse "we don't have enough players" or "they are the only one's big enough"...that's BS. Someone doing it right is always going to be better than a bigger, stronger, more athletic kid doing it wrong. We've got 2 guards, one is 6'1" 245 or so...sucks, he's horrible. He's so bad that I'm pretty sure we should be suspended for a year for even playing him. The other one...he's 5'9" 175 lbs and he does a fine job. Sure sometimes he gets over matched by the DTs we see but he isn't screwing it up for lack of effort and a lack of balls to go try and he's very productive. There is no set size requirement for any kid at any position on a high school football field. There is a little frustration flowing here on this particular thread...our Oline is the same way coach and even though we couldn't reach a 5 tech if our life depended on it, we still try to do it every week, heck we can't even reach our JV 5 techs in practice, how in the phuk are we going to reach a Varsity kid on friday night? Optimism is great until reality hits you in the face. You know I simply don't understand some coaches sometimes...are you so in love with this certain set of kids that you won't bench them? Chit, I've got a 6'2" 223 lb runs a 4.5 Blue Chip sophomore linebacker and if his a$$ doesn't set the edge and do his job like he's capable...not even do it "right" he better do it right, that's expected...but like he is capable of...then I bench his a$$ period flat out and he and all the others know it. /rant so my advice is, either change your scheme or change the kids doing it. chit, now my blood pressure is up already and it's only 11:00... I know what the problem is, our kids no longer give a $hit what happens. i don't have enough kids to switchthem out, and the organization won't allow us to forefit.. SO this week the entire offensive line is going to rotate in the backfield. so they can see what the hell it's like getting buried over and over again |
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Post by coachd5085 on Oct 18, 2008 21:32:03 GMT -6
Just another thought...make sure you are not confusing LAZY, with NOT EXPLOSIVE.
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Post by coachgreen05 on Oct 21, 2008 5:51:20 GMT -6
This is what Wolverine was talking about: "They get the entire first part of practice during special team periods. Usually at least 30 min. Then we break and out first reg period is individual time for offense." This is where it was said, and I took it how wolverine took it. They get that part of pracice for extra indy work,not to just rest . |
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Post by coachgreen05 on Oct 21, 2008 5:53:20 GMT -6
Just another thought...make sure you are not confusing LAZY, with NOT EXPLOSIVE. I consider lazy... When I ask you what you did wrong,u automatically know,but dont have the pride to go hard or hold that block the extra second. |
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Post by coachd5085 on Oct 21, 2008 6:00:13 GMT -6
coachgreen--just some thing you might want to work on.
Fear of being "off balance" and falling. I have noticed that most kids who don't come off the ball hard (on offense and defense --defense especially) don't like the unbalanced "falling" sensation. They haven't figured out yet that they gain their balance through the contact. That engaging the opposing lineman is will keep them up. They are very weak in the hips, legs, and hands...and as such, their stances are back heavy, and their first instinct (and thus, their first movement) is UP, to regain balance instead of forward. I would work 6 point and 4 point explosion drills..just have them try to push themselves as far horizontally as they can off of both feet. Just get in the stance, and on the command, "dive" forward off of a 6 or 4 point stance. Get them more comfortable being off balance.
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Post by coachd5085 on Oct 21, 2008 6:03:37 GMT -6
Just another thought...make sure you are not confusing LAZY, with NOT EXPLOSIVE. I consider lazy... When I ask you what you did wrong,u automatically know,but dont have the pride to go hard or hold that block the extra second. See, this is where I think you are going wrong (Just my opinion). "Going hard, or holding a block an extra second...is a PHYSICAL thing, not necessarily a "will" thing. Especially "going hard". One time a coach was complaining of the line not coming off hard. Every day after practice he would just gripe that they wouldn't "fire off" and were soft. So I sent had the filmer film that coaches individual drills. While watching after practice, I saw the line coach demonstrating how to "fire off"...and he was coming off softer, slower, and HIGHER than any of the kids. HE turned beet red in the coaches film session...he was CERTAIN he was firing off the ball like the next John Hannah or Dwight Freeny. HE was "firing off" but the kids were "not"...until he saw the film. Message...it is not always an effort/will thing, but a physical thing. |
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Post by casec11 on Oct 21, 2008 6:20:36 GMT -6
coachgreen--just some thing you might want to work on. Fear of being "off balance" and falling. I have noticed that most kids who don't come off the ball hard (on offense and defense --defense especially) don't like the unbalanced "falling" sensation. They haven't figured out yet that they gain their balance through the contact. That engaging the opposing lineman is will keep them up. They are very weak in the hips, legs, and hands...and as such, their stances are back heavy, and their first instinct (and thus, their first movement) is UP, to regain balance instead of forward. I would work 6 point and 4 point explosion drills..just have them try to push themselves as far horizontally as they can off of both feet. Just get in the stance, and on the command, "dive" forward off of a 6 or 4 point stance. Get them more comfortable being off balance. The light went on when I read this, I never considerered the off balance thing. I think this is what my 13 yr old kids need. CoachGreen, If the lineman are being "lazy" try to create some competitive drills, let them know their starting positions are up for grabs and if you see younger kids working harder and getting it done give them a shot. This may light a fire in them. Also look around your team maybe you have a back up fullback or linebacker DE ect. that has a good work ethic but is behind someone more talented... the line may be a good spot for him to see the field, infuse a hard working mentality, and upgrade your line at the same time. They call em "Big Uglies" but they don't have to be. -Good luck |
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Post by coachorr on Oct 21, 2008 15:24:22 GMT -6
Coach 5085, your point about the line coach not demonstrating the drill. I try to find kids who are doing a drill correctly and ask them to model the drill, because of what you just stated. Great point.
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Post by coachdawhip on Oct 21, 2008 16:08:50 GMT -6
coachgreen,
I have been in the same boat. Our OL coach is our HC. He isn't a screamer and they practice a ton with indy. They don't finish blocks, they hit and stop and that's not at all what we teach.
I think the best thing you can do is teach them contact and finish the block. Even if it starts out 3 seconds and whole. Make them do drills where they block until you blow the whistle. You have to teach them to finish the job.
To every coach who says he can make chicken salad out of the worst chicken s***t. I know about 3 schools where I would love for you to go prove it.
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KCoach
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Post by KCoach on Oct 22, 2008 7:01:00 GMT -6
We had problems running the football this season aswell. We had undersized lienmen who were average in skill and strength. Towards the end of the season before play-offs we pulled our heads out of our #$%^^ and put our best athlete at TB. he had played OLB and WR and we didn't want to beat him up to bad so we didn't intially put him there. We increased our run production from 100 a game to 200. you must ahve a kid who can break that first tackle, without that that I don't think it matters a whole lot what scheme or drills you do or run with your line.
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Post by coachgreen05 on Oct 22, 2008 7:26:14 GMT -6
coachgreen, I have been in the same boat. Our OL coach is our HC. He isn't a screamer and they practice a ton with indy. They don't finish blocks, they hit and stop and that's not at all what we teach. I think the best thing you can do is teach them contact and finish the block. Even if it starts out 3 seconds and whole. Make them do drills where they block until you blow the whistle. You have to teach them to finish the job. To every coach who says he can make chicken salad out of the worst chicken s***t. I know about 3 schools where I would love for you to go prove it. Thats us,you hit it on the head |
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