burn
Sophomore Member
Posts: 181
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Post by burn on Oct 1, 2008 23:07:02 GMT -6
I have a rule you miss practice you don't play for at least a quarter for whatever reason. You miss two practices you don't play and I probably pull your gear. So here is the situation our best athlete and player misses Tuesday and Wednesday because he and his girlfriend have a kid. I am not planning to play him this week but my staff is adament he plays because of the circumstances. The kids all want him to play but I really could care less about his circumstances as it pertains to football. I personally feel the kid is better off getting a job but that is just me. The administration is pressuring me to work with him because they believe I am the only positive influence in his life. I care for this kid but at what point do we let life and his decisions take effect. The local Jr college wants this kid because he'll never make it into a 4 year but everybody calls about him. He is a 6'4" receiver/db that runs a 4.5 and has turned his life around from gangs and drugs. My problem is that I, my staff, the school and my players have invested in this kid a ton. Do I coddle this young man or do I let him sink or swim? I have no idea on this one. There is much history and I am not looking really for an answer but I am looking for some of your own problems with issues similar to this. It may or may not affect my decision but I would appreciate your input. Thanks to any in advance.
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Post by justryn2 on Oct 2, 2008 6:31:18 GMT -6
Coach, it's your team and you can have whatever rules you want and enforce them however you want. However; in the "real" world, if your school tried to fire you as a teacher because you took two days off to be with your wife when she had your child, my guess is you would find that a bit unreasonable. Punishing a player who just suffered a death in the family or the birth of a child seems to me like putting football priorities way out whack.
Just my opinion.
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trojan
Junior Member
[F4:wingtcoach.com] [F4:wingtcoachdon]
Posts: 494
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Post by trojan on Oct 2, 2008 8:03:43 GMT -6
You can stick to some kind of principles, and you'll get support from a couple of old school parents. You can stick to your principles and expect the administration to contradict you, or at least pressure you to cave. You can abandon your principles, feel like you should have actually taught the kids some real world values, and your administration will find something else to gripe about. I guess my point, minus the cynicism, is that you have to do what you feel is right. Either you think your rule is flexible or it is firm. You either believe that this kid should play in the game, or you don't think he should this week. On this board, like everywhere else, opinions are all over the place, so you'll eventually hear the opinion that agrees with your own. Go with that.
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Post by jpdaley25 on Oct 2, 2008 9:35:20 GMT -6
Your rule allows you no flexibility. I have tough rules too, but I always tag onto the end, "In the event of family emergencies or other events beyond the players control, the player will not be punished at all, but decisions will still be made based on what is best for the team." This makes it a judgement call on your part. Don't let your rules back you into a corner.
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Post by splitricky5 on Oct 2, 2008 9:43:28 GMT -6
If you have the rule, you need to follow it. Have him on the sidelines. Have him participate as a spectator. Tell him that his decisions have a greater impact than just on himself and he needs to know that as a football player and as a father. Your job as a coach is to treat every one of those players equally, whether they are players or not. Let him know you care for him and you are glad he was able to be there as a father, but as the head of this program, it is your responsibility to maintain the standards established by the head coach.
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Post by Yash on Oct 2, 2008 11:18:05 GMT -6
Would you tell a fellow coach on your staff that if they missed practice due to the birth of a child that he can't coach that week? The kid is doing the right thing and being there for the girl. Now no matter what you think whether it was right or wrong to have the kid you have to give the kid props for being there and being a father. Whoever said that there are plenty of single mothers raising kids fine these days, get real! You think those women wouldn't rather have a father to raise the child with!? This guy is being a father like society needs him to be. You want to do the right thing here without going against your team rules, have the kids vote on whether or not he gets to play friday. Now you are putting the decision on the team. You can't kick this kid to the curb because he has chosen to do the right thing.
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Post by olinecoach61 on Oct 2, 2008 11:30:45 GMT -6
Its a poorly written rule. Your a high school football coach, if what you say about this kid is true (turning his life around, etc), cut him a break. He just had a kid for goodness sake! Never create rules you are unwilling to enforce 100%. There are always extenuating circumstances and your rules need to account for that somehow. Be the role model to this young man that he now has to be for his child.
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Post by phantom on Oct 2, 2008 11:36:23 GMT -6
This is why I don't believe in hard and fast rules.
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Post by lsrood on Oct 2, 2008 11:51:24 GMT -6
Coach, The one point I would make for you to consider is this: if you are one of the few positive role models this kid has in life, do you risk driving him away because of your perceived inflexibility and heading back into that lifestyle you described, or do you take into consideration the extenuating circumstances and come to a compromise that allows you to maintain your standards and discipline and makes him aknowledge that he has a responsibility to his teammates as well as his new family. Only you know the entire story and all the circumstances surrounding it, and ultimately the decision rests in your hands.
I haven't had to deal with a similar situation, but have had to deal with missed practices due to deaths of relatives as DC Ohio related and in each instance I have attempted to find a middle ground that is acceptable for all involved. In our program we prioritize like this: 1. Academics 2. Family 3. Football Because of this if a family situation comes up we look at all the circumstances surrounding it before a decision is made.
Every coach is going to look at things in a different manner and there is no one right way. You have to do what is right for you, but more importantly you have to do what is right and best for your player and team as well. Good luck because it won't be an easy decision either way.
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burn
Sophomore Member
Posts: 181
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Post by burn on Oct 2, 2008 22:49:12 GMT -6
Thanks for the responses and I am going to sit him a quarter. He understands completely and we have talked extensively. I am more worried about the rest of his life and the decisions he makes from here on out. He missed the second day because there were medical problems with his girl friend and he felt that he needed to be there. They are keeping her there for observation for a third day but the baby is fine and healthy and his girl friend is going to be fine. I have the rule because of non commital players in a school that has had a history of this problem. We are attempting to change the atmosphere of the school and this rule has made a difference in commitment. The other players on the team came to me on his behalf and I feel the maturity and accountabiltiy we are trying to instill is evident in there actions. He was willing to accept any discipline and understood his choice. I thank you all for your responses.
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Post by splitricky5 on Oct 3, 2008 5:52:56 GMT -6
Good luck to you coach. Great job working with a guy not only on football but on the rest of his life. He will appreciate your commitment to him for the rest of his life.
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Post by lsrood on Oct 3, 2008 5:54:54 GMT -6
Sounds like you came up with an positive decision for everyone. Good luck in the game and with your program.
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sbv
Sophomore Member
Posts: 171
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Post by sbv on Oct 3, 2008 7:37:07 GMT -6
Coach, I've got to agree with dcohio. To use his saying "nobody is necessary". In my opinion you have backed yourself into a corner by saying "miss 1 practice, out for the first quarter, two and you miss the game". The kid has to miss the game but you don't have to throw him off of the team because it didn't sound like a previously stated rule that you told the team about. My rule is that if you have 1 unexcused practice you can't start the next game (I usually try to keep them from playing at least a half but I don't back myself into a corner by telling them they miss a half, I just say you do not start). Then it is up to you to decide what unexcused means. If we have a kid that is sick, he needs to attend practice even if he wasn't at school. If not, it is unexcused. For family things I take it on a case by case basis if it is excused or not. A death in the family is excused in my book just like a child being born. I'm not a heartless SOB like dcohio, which is probably why I could never be the defensive coach that he is, but I keep in context the priorities I tell my team to keep: Faith, Family, Football/Academics, Everything else. Now, on day two, he probably could have been at practice. This is just how I look at things.
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Post by dubber on Oct 3, 2008 8:12:19 GMT -6
I know you have already made your decision, but I would have sit him for the game (per your rule), BUT NOT kicked him off the team. You said that 2 misses means "probably" pulling the kid's gear...... Sit him a game, tell him he has to earn his starting spot back and then you have accomplished two things: 1.) Not bending your rules (though perhaps in the future you need more wiggle room) 2.) The kid stays on the team (good for you, and especially him) Your solution still works, however......
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Post by liberalhater on Oct 3, 2008 8:18:50 GMT -6
Bill Parcells said it best. If football is not in your top 3 then we are going to have problems. that applies to coaches and players. If you apply that rule to your kids and to your colleagues? A lot of gray area is eliminated. Kids and coaches make decisions that tell where football is on their priority list. If football continually takes a back seat to other situation then I as a coach/HC have the right to find somebody who puts football higher on their priority list.
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mrry475
Freshmen Member
Vince Lombardi once said, ?A man can be as great as he wants to be. If you believe in yourself !!
Posts: 51
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Post by mrry475 on Oct 3, 2008 8:40:11 GMT -6
Coach
I was this kid my mother had it with me and sent me to Florida to live with my father who was some what like you are Rules with no outs it just made me worse.
If he had let her have the baby on her own and not been there for her then what you said about him turning his life around is wrong .
It is different when you are married and a little older my wife would be pissed if I left her to go to a football game when she had her first child.The people you talk about leaving for football has had several children it sounds like .I cant belive that anyone would do this when having there first child.
I would address the team tell them these are a little different circumstances and I agree let the Players Vote if he plays at all Then you make the decision on how long he sits . I also agree the kid that repped all week at practice should start . But to bench the kid all together is ridiculous .
Football is not always about winning it is about creating a discipline in someones life to make them a better person so they succeed in life a become responsible citizens
I owe everything to my High School coach he was firm but reasonable.
I went from selling drugs and fighting in Dayton Ohio to a college Graduate
Without some reason there is no telling where I would be now !
Think of the Kid and not your football team or your rules and do what you think is right .You obviously have doubts or you would not have posted so in the back of your mind you know what is right
DO IT !!!
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Post by PSS on Oct 3, 2008 8:46:49 GMT -6
SBV - lol. Not heartless (although there is a team debate on that exact topic)...I never said I didn't think he shouldn't have went home to be with the family. I believe he should have and I understand why he did. BUT...since he wasn't at practice (1 platoon team), and he missed defensive day...I have a hard time telling the kid who was at practice, who repped up at that position in practice that he cannot start on friday. To me that is not right either. and to whoever asked about a fellow staff member having a child and missing...yea I do have a problem with that. First of all...you're an adult, if you want to have a kid that's fine...you don't need to knock her up in November, December or January...do some planning. No different than a teacher who has to have a major surgery waiting until school starts to schedule it rather than be laid up in the summer. That's BS. I can understand missing a practice to have a kid, not 2 practices and definitely not a game. Matter of fact, that's how I got the DC job to begin with. My first year coaching in game 4-5 our DC's wife had one of their 38 kids...I don't know how many she's had but she was popping them out like a pez dispenser there for a while...he missed a game and I became the DC for a game. We played great defense that night, we had good halftime adjustments and apparently that was the beginning of the end for him as the DC. No different than a kid missing practice and #2 stepping up and doing the job better than you expected. That is exactly how I came to be the DC at that school. Although some may believe I am in the minority on this issue, a friend of mine and his wife just had a baby 2 weeks ago...she goes in labor on friday morning, finally pops the baby out around 4:30. In the delivery room her husband says "you alright honey?"..."ok, I've got to go bus leaves at 5:00" One of my former coaches coached in college after he graduated, his wife was induced the day before they left for their bowl game. Another friend of mine, his wife is pregnant right now, she's due any day...she's being induced on saturday (afternoon, they game plan until 2:00) so it doesn't interfere with football. It's not just me... Sorry, but my family will come before football. My youngest was born in late August, 6 weeks pre-mature. He spent 5 days in Neo Natal intensive care with a callapsed lung. I was there for the birth and missed 3 practices. I had previously lost one child. Some things are more important than football. To all you die hards out there, you need to take care of your family because no one else out there will and they are often the only ones who will stand by your side during the tough times. We talk about teaching ethics and morals to our athletes everyday yet some of us fail to live by those things we teach.
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Post by splitricky5 on Oct 3, 2008 8:50:48 GMT -6
SBV - lol. Not heartless (although there is a team debate on that exact topic)...I never said I didn't think he shouldn't have went home to be with the family. I believe he should have and I understand why he did. BUT...since he wasn't at practice (1 platoon team), and he missed defensive day...I have a hard time telling the kid who was at practice, who repped up at that position in practice that he cannot start on friday. To me that is not right either. and to whoever asked about a fellow staff member having a child and missing...yea I do have a problem with that. First of all...you're an adult, if you want to have a kid that's fine...you don't need to knock her up in November, December or January...do some planning. No different than a teacher who has to have a major surgery waiting until school starts to schedule it rather than be laid up in the summer. That's BS. I can understand missing a practice to have a kid, not 2 practices and definitely not a game. Matter of fact, that's how I got the DC job to begin with. My first year coaching in game 4-5 our DC's wife had one of their 38 kids...I don't know how many she's had but she was popping them out like a pez dispenser there for a while...he missed a game and I became the DC for a game. We played great defense that night, we had good halftime adjustments and apparently that was the beginning of the end for him as the DC. No different than a kid missing practice and #2 stepping up and doing the job better than you expected. That is exactly how I came to be the DC at that school. Although some may believe I am in the minority on this issue, a friend of mine and his wife just had a baby 2 weeks ago...she goes in labor on friday morning, finally pops the baby out around 4:30. In the delivery room her husband says "you alright honey?"..."ok, I've got to go bus leaves at 5:00" One of my former coaches coached in college after he graduated, his wife was induced the day before they left for their bowl game. Another friend of mine, his wife is pregnant right now, she's due any day...she's being induced on saturday (afternoon, they game plan until 2:00) so it doesn't interfere with football. It's not just me... My oldest daughter was born at 12:30 pm on a gameday and my wife said to me: "You aren't going to do anything here. Go coach."
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Post by thunder17 on Oct 3, 2008 9:55:57 GMT -6
Top 3. Family, football and faith. Family first. Would not coach on a staff that would put football before family. If we were having another child and my wife told me to go to practice then I would, but, I would not do it on my own. There are other coaches that can cover 1 practice.
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Post by fatkicker on Oct 3, 2008 10:04:59 GMT -6
glad to hear some of the recent responses....
putting football before your family is a mistake......
i don't really have the right to say though.....i've moved my family around 8 times in the last 11 years chasing the game.....i guess i've grown wiser......i won't put my family through it again.....
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Post by coachcastleman on Oct 3, 2008 10:20:48 GMT -6
My daughter (second child) was born on a Monday during the second week of playoffs. She had a birth defect and required surgery. I was gone all week and never thought twice about. I went to practice on Friday for a little and then the game on Saturday. I left the second the game was over. My daughter spent 10 days in the ICU. My HC was totally supportive and it was almost expected my the other coaches and the players that I would not be there. It goes back to the idea that football is a game, it is not life. I love the game and the players I coach, but they are secondary to my family. We need to keep it all in perspective.
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Post by splitricky5 on Oct 3, 2008 11:05:58 GMT -6
I hear what all of you are saying completely, and believe me, if my wife needed me or one of my kids needed me, I'm gone. But if there is no real reason for me to miss practice or a game, then I am not going to. Absolutely, you should have missed everything for a child in ICU. Of course.
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Post by jgordon1 on Oct 3, 2008 11:54:43 GMT -6
Missed my fathers wedding while I was a player trying to earn a starting position and a scholarship in college. me being a wise a$$ told him I'll just go the next one (it was his third). Got the starting position and the full schoalrship. still regret missing the wedding to this day. he has been married about 25 years now to the same wonderful woman
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