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Post by tothehouse on Aug 18, 2006 8:33:28 GMT -6
I know there has been chatter about different kinds of coaches on your staffs etc.
Do any of you have the "don't coach my guys" coach on your staff?
It seems like when I am instructing a certain position on our team that coach doesn't like when I correct "his players". I am the quasi DC. Our HC is the OC and the DC. Weird, but great, system we have. While the HC is coaching the O, I am basically the DC. This guy gets bent when I explain to his players where they are supposed to go. I don't understand it because I am the farthest away from an ego guy as there is. I am on his dudes because the defense needs it. His guys need to be in a certain spot to help the whole D. If they are not there then we aren't as good as we can be. This coach then says, when I call out his guys, "Coach, I'll take care of it". But, it is not taken care of at full speed.
Good guy, okay coach, huge ego, been with the program for a long time.
I talked with the HC about it and we have a plan. What are your thoughts?
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Post by brophy on Aug 18, 2006 8:40:18 GMT -6
Learn to enjoy being decapitated (cut off at the knees)...lol
You can have "those guys" who are either higher up on the food chain, or lower on the totem pole.
I've had it both ways.....I give up.
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Post by saintrad on Aug 18, 2006 8:46:56 GMT -6
had that last year with our old HC..he was you are DC but don't correct my linebackers...ahh thats a little difficult when i can only coordinate for the front 4 and the secondary and he has his LBers doing something that wasn't within the scheme (which he created)
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Post by khalfie on Aug 18, 2006 8:52:39 GMT -6
I hear ya...
But you are correcting the "wrong guys"... if the LB's are doing as told, its not them you need to talk to... the hardest thing for a kid to handle is when he is getting conflicting information from differing adults...
Its the HC you need to have the heart to heart with... if his scheming is unsound, someone has to tell him, or at least have a discussion about it, and hopefully the coaching staff can all get on the same page...
If not, its going to be a long season.
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Post by tothehouse on Aug 18, 2006 9:23:48 GMT -6
It is not so much scheming. It is doing your job, your technique. I know the job "his" guys need to do and I know the technique "his" guys need to do. Maybe I am being egotistica, but I think I could coach them harder. I think that it is a situation where my standards are higher I guess.
Sure "his" guys are going at it pretty good. I think there is a higher level. We'll work it out, but feelings will be hurt.
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Post by coachcb on Aug 18, 2006 9:32:33 GMT -6
Here's my 2 cents, tth- if you're the interim DC during practice than its your job to make sure all 11 of the kids are on the right page. Your or the HC may just need to explain to this guy that you're doing you're job. The only other way around it is to wait until after practice and then explain to the dude that something needs fixed. Then, the practice he may or may not fix the problem, either way you've just wasted a whole lot of time.
Personally, if I'm coaching a position and someone corrects a problem with that position- I'm grateful. I wish I would've caught it first, but at least the problems been fixed. It'd be nice if everyone else felt the same, but thats not the case.
I know where you're coming from though, I had the same kinds of issues a while back. I was working with the LBs and our DL wasn't closing with down blocks on counters and traps- our OL was getting a free release all day. Nobody corrected them and we were getting wailed on by the scout team. Between drills-I explained to the ends and tackles what they needed to do and why- really upset the DL coach. I explained to him that I was just trying to make the team better- he just told me to stay away from the DL. From there on out, I would point stuff out in private and kept setting the guy off, but it was the only way to get things done.
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Post by tothehouse on Aug 18, 2006 9:36:26 GMT -6
CB - That is kind of where I am. We have another coach on the staff that coached 5 or 6 years in the program in the early 90's. He came back last year and thought things would be the same as back then. Obviously things changed. He has been awesome about trying to learn the "new" stuff. In fact, just yesterday we both "got into it" about where one of his position players was supposed to line up and who to defend in a goaline defense situation. We argued, but then loved up on each after. We talked after and it worked out great.
With this other guy it would be quite different.
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Post by coachcb on Aug 18, 2006 10:45:32 GMT -6
Yeah, that never happened with this guy, he finished up the season pissed at the entire staff( everyone was pointing stuff out) It wasn't like it was situation where there was a "difference of opinion"- skills were not being taught. I'm not a football guru by any stretch of the imagination,I love coaching because it offers the opportunity to continue learning. I am always open and respectful when it comes to different opinions, but when fundamentals(footwork, striking, using your hands, reacting to blocks) aren't being taught, something needs to be done.
Just one of those tough situations, it sucks that you've got to deal with it.
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Post by fbdoc on Aug 18, 2006 15:41:22 GMT -6
The guy might just be insecure. Treat him like a little kid (in a positive way) by finding places where you can say "Great Job" to his kids, or "That's what I want to see!" and then add "Who'se Coaching those guys?!" If you're not too obvious he will feel kinda jacked that you are making a big display out how well HIS players are playing or how well HE has coached them. Use it to build a positive relationship with him so he will eventually feel more secure to take ideas, coaching, or criticism from you. It sounds like you already know that you have to check your ego at the door. You just need to help him figure it out for the sake of the team. Good Luck.
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Post by tog on Aug 18, 2006 15:55:06 GMT -6
i make a concerted effort to never say "my ol"
I cringe every time I hear a coach say "my __________POSITION__________"
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Post by tothehouse on Aug 18, 2006 19:39:58 GMT -6
Doc...he might be insecure, but he is also in his mid 50's and I am in my early 30's. Believe me, I don't mind telling him that it is BS what he is doing. Our HC and I work on him daily to make him see where "his" players are at fault.
Thanks for the great advice.
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Post by los on Aug 18, 2006 20:13:22 GMT -6
Tog, I had to say it a couple seasons ago! During a scrimmage our ace "hot shot" quarterback got sacked, got mad, and threw the football at the back of one of the linemen's head. I was standing behind the defense watching play and when I saw the boss was gonna let the kid slide, blurted out to him " If that sorry beepin, beep, beepin, beeper does that to one of "my" guys again I'm gonna come over there and kick his beepin {censored}!" Thats about the only time I've used this! lol Hmmm! You think thats why he hasn't asked me to come back and help this year???
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Post by phantom on Aug 18, 2006 22:35:20 GMT -6
i make a concerted effort to never say "my ol" I cringe every time I hear a coach say "my __________POSITION__________" I sometimes use the term "my" but only to the players, kind of like driil instructors use the term. I use it to let them understand that I take their performance personally. |
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Post by saintrad on Aug 18, 2006 23:02:27 GMT -6
house- find me an 8th grade history or English position and I could be the DL coach for ya!  |
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Post by carson101 on Aug 21, 2006 0:44:48 GMT -6
Well, that would just ruin the neighborhood, Saint...............LOL
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Post by bulldog on Aug 21, 2006 1:34:19 GMT -6
Tough situation. The guy is older, probably thinks he has seen it all, knows it all, has a big ego and is envious of your position. I think that if you try to establish your way of doing things (coaching up players who make mistakes and not letting things slide) - it is likely you will rile this guy up and he will battle you. Not good for any of you, nor the team.
I think this has to start with the HC. He has to step-up and establish your position within the defense and the staff, - and he has to re-iterate the coaching standards. He should have a staff meeting and touch on these points:
- TTH is the DC when I am coaching the O. You will defer to him on the field and raise any issues that arise after practice and away from the players.
- Our standard of coaching is to actively coach our positions each play. We don't let physical or mental mistakes go.
- If you notice a mistake by a player and the position coach is either coaching another player, or may not have seen the mistake, it is acceptable to correct the mistake. We are a united staff and we are all working to fulfill the goals of the team and the players are ALL 'OUR GUYS'.
- If you take offense to another coach giving your position players coaching points, the coach-up 'your guys'. Don't talk over other coaches or muddle their coaching points.
- A repeated mistake should be brought to the attention of the position coach so that he can work on it in individual time.
Then go get a beer as a staff and pomote your unity.
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Post by tog on Aug 21, 2006 5:55:13 GMT -6
i make a concerted effort to never say "my ol" I cringe every time I hear a coach say "my __________POSITION__________" I sometimes use the term "my" but only to the players, kind of like driil instructors use the term. I use it to let them understand that I take their performance personally. that is a little different i should have clarified it to say "in the office" they are all of our players |
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Post by lochness on Aug 21, 2006 8:17:35 GMT -6
I'm of two minds on this one.
I don't like a coach seeing something wrong with a player and not correcting it, no matter who that player has as his position coach. We're all out there to coach kids up...so let's coach em up!
On the other side, HOWEVER, I strongly feel that there is nothing worse than a kid getting mixed signals and an inconsistent message from the coaching staff. For example, we don't need our WR coach yelling at the QB every other play during pass skelleton if wehave our QB coach right there and he has his own way of dealing with things. The WR coach may not be aware that the QB is learning a new step or skill that has cause him to be inaccurate today. Now, if he starts yelling at him and trying to correct his throwing form, it may be contrary to what the QB has been working on earlier in practice with his position coach.
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Post by coachm on Aug 21, 2006 12:08:47 GMT -6
Good points by Lochness and Bulldog. The HC has to step in here IMO. Unfortunately, the older coach will probably not take to it too well and there's liable to be some friction in the air. Not good to have on staff not only for the coaches but the kids can feel it as well.
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