mc140
Sophomore Member
Posts: 207
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Post by mc140 on Jan 13, 2024 8:55:46 GMT -6
Sometimes game plans do not work or the opponent does something completely different you did not prepare for. How comfortable are you putting something in on the fly or going back to something you had previously done, but had not practiced recently?
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Post by agap on Jan 13, 2024 11:14:23 GMT -6
If we had done it at some point in a game or practice and we needed it to win a game, I would use it. If it’s something we’ve never done, no. At least for defense, if our base defense doesn’t have rules for any type of offense we’d see, we have issues.
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Post by jgordon1 on Jan 13, 2024 14:26:01 GMT -6
i would put something in that was related to what we are doing. many times we have used a previously installed blitz that we haven't practiced that week
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Post by tripsclosed on Jan 13, 2024 15:08:01 GMT -6
Sometimes game plans do not work or the opponent does something completely different you did not prepare for. How comfortable are you putting something in on the fly or going back to something you had previously done, but had not practiced recently? Defense, I would always carry some type of spot-drop, barebones Cover 3 and rep it at least a few times every week for this very reason, as a fall-back in case they show something you can't handle and/or haven't prepared for because you never saw it on film. Offense, that depends on your offensive scheme as far as run game. For example, if your IZ/OZ are built right, you should be able to handle most of what they throw at you, if not, maybe have some kind of simple Iso run as your fall-back. Mirrored double hitches, or fin-flat to one side and fin-slant to the other side for fall-back in pass game. When it comes to drawing up stuff in the dirt, I would avoid that as much as possible, would just depend on how badly you are outmatched in your fall-back stuff. See TCU-Clemson in 09 when TCU pulled out what is considered the first use of "Dash" action (Power Read, Inverted Veer, etc) at the P5 level, Clemson was drawing up stuff on the fly with the whiteboard to try to defend it... |
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Post by 44dlcoach on Jan 13, 2024 16:10:13 GMT -6
I don't do much, if any, making stuff up on the fly, unless we're playing against a "non-traditional" style of offense. If we're struggling early in the season against things we're going to see all year I'll just keep stubbornly calling our base stuff and challenging the kids to execute it or at the very least keep getting game film of our issues. Right or wrong, we have to get good at our base to have a good season, if we have to lose an early season game then we'll have to live with that.
As the season moves along I'm willing to call something that we did earlier in the season even if we haven't done that thing for a couple of weeks. If we don't execute it well I'm probably going back to the original game plan pretty quickly.
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Post by coachwoodall on Jan 13, 2024 16:39:02 GMT -6
Defensively there have a been a hand full of times that we 'drew it up in the dirt' on a Friday night. But it was usually something that was a part of the our overall structure.
For example when I was a DC and playing our rival, tight ball game in an end game scenario where we are up by less than 6. They call a time out for a crucial 3rd down. We are in our 'dime' package or prevent package and the ball is near midfield. Coverage isn't a problem dropping 8, but getting enough pressure to prevent the QB from having an easy Hail Mary attempt isn't a given.
HC is in my ear about not letting the QB have that easy throw, so I tell the MLB to wait a second after the snap and after the OL declares who/how they are blocking the front 3 to blitz grass and pressure the QB in his face. I told the NG to pick a side and just go that way and we had a call for the DEs to get wide and rush so he couldn't escape.
2 sacks later the game is over. Nothing mind blowing or totally outside of what we would do, just a "hey, go make a play".
I'm sure someone will come on with a time where making the Fake 23 blast with a backside George reverse saved the day though.
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Post by coachwoodall on Jan 13, 2024 16:41:20 GMT -6
I don't do much, if any, making stuff up on the fly, unless we're playing against a "non-traditional" style of offense. If we're struggling early in the season against things we're going to see all year I'll just keep stubbornly calling our base stuff and challenging the kids to execute it or at the very least keep getting game film of our issues. Right or wrong, we have to get good at our base to have a good season, if we have to lose an early season game then we'll have to live with that. As the season moves along I'm willing to call something that we did earlier in the season even if we haven't done that thing for a couple of weeks. If we don't execute it well I'm probably going back to the original game plan pretty quickly. Early on in my career I had a HC tell us that he wanted us to play our base defense as much as we could, because the worse you are the more you have to blitz. |
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Post by tripsclosed on Jan 13, 2024 16:58:28 GMT -6
Defensively there have a been a hand full of times that we 'drew it up in the dirt' on a Friday night. But it was usually something that was a part of the our overall structure. For example when I was a DC and playing our rival, tight ball game in an end game scenario where we are up by less than 6. They call a time out for a crucial 3rd down. We are in our 'dime' package or prevent package and the ball is near midfield. Coverage isn't a problem dropping 8, but getting enough pressure to prevent the QB from having an easy Hail Mary attempt isn't a given. HC is in my ear about not letting the QB have that easy throw, so I tell the MLB to wait a second after the snap and after the OL declares who/how they are blocking the front 3 to blitz grass and pressure the QB in his face. I told the NG to pick a side and just go that way and we had a call for the DEs to get wide and rush so he couldn't escape. 2 sacks later the game is over. Nothing mind blowing or totally outside of what we would do, just a "hey, go make a play". I'm sure someone will come on with a time where making the Fake 23 blast with a backside George reverse saved the day though. Was this from from a 3-3 or 3-4 look? |
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sbackes
Sophomore Member
Posts: 216
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Post by sbackes on Jan 13, 2024 17:09:27 GMT -6
We carry a lot offensively so we don’t do much drawing up in the dirt.
We are pretty likely to get to something that wasn’t on the weekly script though. Especially after half when we’ve had a chance to review it with the team.
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Post by coachwoodall on Jan 14, 2024 12:33:52 GMT -6
Defensively there have a been a hand full of times that we 'drew it up in the dirt' on a Friday night. But it was usually something that was a part of the our overall structure. For example when I was a DC and playing our rival, tight ball game in an end game scenario where we are up by less than 6. They call a time out for a crucial 3rd down. We are in our 'dime' package or prevent package and the ball is near midfield. Coverage isn't a problem dropping 8, but getting enough pressure to prevent the QB from having an easy Hail Mary attempt isn't a given. HC is in my ear about not letting the QB have that easy throw, so I tell the MLB to wait a second after the snap and after the OL declares who/how they are blocking the front 3 to blitz grass and pressure the QB in his face. I told the NG to pick a side and just go that way and we had a call for the DEs to get wide and rush so he couldn't escape. 2 sacks later the game is over. Nothing mind blowing or totally outside of what we would do, just a "hey, go make a play". I'm sure someone will come on with a time where making the Fake 23 blast with a backside George reverse saved the day though. Was this from from a 3-3 or 3-4 look? 34ish |
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Post by coachperk on Jan 17, 2024 9:44:38 GMT -6
This is a great example of why you should be teaching/running the same offense and defense from junior high on up (if your situation permits). By the time our kids get to varsity they have run just about every play in every situation, so....if we haven't emphasized a particular play or scheme that week, at least we are asking kids to do something that they have previous experience doing. We can recall or relate it to a previous situation. Not ideal, but at least you've got a shot.
Putting something in on the fly hasn't worked out well for us in the past.
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Post by coachdmyers on Jan 17, 2024 11:50:51 GMT -6
Depends. Some of my best play calls have been ones we drew in the dirt in a timeout but never actually practiced. We were in a playoff game and needed a two point conversion, and we took a timeout. I installed a reverse in the timeout, kids executed it flawlessly and we got the conversion.
Another scenario I can see doing is we need to make a halftime adjustment and go 2 back for some reason, but haven't done it (assuming we have the personnel to make that adjustment). We give the kid a set of rules and hope for the best. All other rules being the same, we should be okay.
But like, a pass concept we haven't practiced or the QB hasn't read, or a blocking concept that's brand new to the OL? Probably not.
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Post by fantom on Jan 17, 2024 12:39:22 GMT -6
There have been a lot of times when we've put things in during a game that we hadn't practiced that week but had run before. There was only one time that we ran something during a game that we hadn't run before.
We were in a playoff game against a league opponent that we'd played many times and had beaten during the regular season. They'd always run Wing-T but this night they came out in spread and threw the ball all over the place. On the sideline (We didn't platoon" we installed C. 2 Man. We told the defensive guys who weren't playing offense at the time the rules and they relayed it to the other guys when we went on defense. It worked.
I do have to point out that this wasn't COMPLETELY out of the blue. We'd installed it during spring and had it in a game plan or two during the season but hadn't run it. We had run some C. 0 and had practiced man techniques in-season plus we probably ran C. 2 Zone maybe 33% of the time during the season so that was easy for the safeties.
That's the only time I remember "drawing it up in the dirt".
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Post by groundchuck on Jan 17, 2024 13:09:27 GMT -6
If we worked on it before then yes. Rarely do I want to install something new on Friday night.
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Post by MICoach on Jan 18, 2024 10:41:08 GMT -6
I'd say I'm probably more comfortable doing this than I should be...
Nobody wants to have to do this, and you try not to because putting stuff in on the fly isn't the most reliable way to work...but there has certainly been times where one wrinkle we had was working really well and nothing else was so we had to expand on it a little.
One instance that jumps out to me... We were the underdog in a playoff game, against a team that did a little bit of everything - lots of personnel groupings, some wacky packages, and their OL dwarfed our DL. We are generally a 3 man front with the ability to put a hybrid OLB on the line for some even looks. We had put in a package with four DL that we expected to use a bit as a change of pace but it ended up being the only thing that we could stop them in. The "on the fly" aspect of it was that we had only prepared to run Cover 0 out of it, so at half we had to work through Cover 3 and also change the personnel to get our best 11 in.
Besides that, most "on the fly" stuff is just little adjustments, maybe using calls that already exist within our system but pairing them in a way we hadn't throughout the week.
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