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Post by brophy on Jul 11, 2007 15:45:30 GMT -6
NCAA: Oklahoma must forfeit 2005 season
OKLAHOMA CITY (AP) — The Oklahoma football program must forfeit its wins from the 2005 season and will lose two scholarships for the 2008-09 and 2009-10 school years.
The penalties, announced Wednesday by the NCAA, stem from a case involving two players, including the Sooners' starting quarterback, who were kicked off the team for being paid for work they had not performed at a Norman car dealership.
The NCAA said Wednesday morning it planned to announce its decision about possible sanctions against the Oklahoma football program, more fallout from a case that came to light last year when two players — including the Sooners' starting quarterback — were kicked off the team.
In an e-mail sent to media outlets, the NCAA said a 2 p.m. conference call with Miami athletics director Paul Dee, the acting chairman of the NCAA Committee on Infractions, was scheduled to discuss the case.
On Aug. 3 — the day before the Sooners began preseason practice — Oklahoma coach Bob Stoops dismissed quarterback Rhett Bomar and offensive lineman J.D. Quinn from the team amid allegations that the players had been paid for work they had not performed at a Norman car dealership.
The NCAA subsequently alleged that Oklahoma had failed to adequately monitor the employment of several athletes, including some football players who worked during the academic year. The NCAA said Oklahoma's "failure to monitor" led to the university not detecting NCAA rules violations.
FIND MORE STORIES IN: NCAA | Oklahoma | National Collegiate Athletic Association
The university has disputed that allegation, arguing that the NCAA should applaud, not penalize, its efforts to root out violations and noted that NCAA president Myles Brand told one news outlet that the university "acted with integrity in taking swift and decisive action" in the case.
Oklahoma has banned athletes from working at the car dealership until at least the 2008-09 academic year and has moved to prevent the athletes' supervisor at the dealership from being involved with the university's athletics program. Oklahoma also will reduce the number of football coaches who are allowed to recruit off campus this fall.
Both Bomar and Quinn lost a season of eligibility. Bomar has been ordered by the NCAA to pay back more than $7,400 in extra benefits to charity, while Quinn was told to pay back more than $8,100. Both players transferred to Division I-AA schools — Bomar to Sam Houston State and Quinn to Montana — where they can resume their careers this coming season.
The NCAA Committee on Infractions met with university officials including athletics director Joe Castiglione, Stoops, compliance officials, general counsel Joseph Harroz and director of football operations Merv Johnson on April 14 in Indianapolis.
Oklahoma officials also appeared before the committee in April 2006 following an investigation into hundreds of improper recruiting phone calls by former basketball coach Kelvin Sampson's staff.
Oklahoma escaped major sanctions in that case, as the NCAA Committee on Infractions found the university guilty of a "failure to monitor," a less severe ruling than "lack of institutional control," which had been recommended by the NCAA's enforcement staff.
The committee moved Oklahoma's self-imposed probation so it would begin in May 2006 and end in May 2008. The NCAA also issued a public reprimand and censure but otherwise accepted the university's self-imposed sanctions, which included reductions in scholarships, recruiting calls and trips and visits to the school by prospective recruits.
Copyright 2007 The Associated Press |
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Post by brophy on Jul 11, 2007 15:46:28 GMT -6
Honestly, I don't know what else Stoops & Co could've done here. They DID the right thing once they found out.
Knowing BEFORE HAND - is that truly realistic?
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Post by midlineqb on Jul 11, 2007 16:06:32 GMT -6
It is difficult to keep tabs on the business people and what they do. OU did what they had to do when they found out that the problem occurred. It is almost impossible to know before hand. I'm sure they tried to educate their players as to what they could accept and could not accept as far as employment goes. You always have some fools that want to have their cake and eat it too.
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Post by okpowerspread on Jul 11, 2007 17:12:21 GMT -6
Although I am from Oklahoma, I am not a huge OU fan and i feel like they did all they could in that circumstance. How many other programs would dismiss a starting QB and OL the day before practice starts? That was a class act and a gutsy (is that a word?) move. The university sanctioned themselves immediatly in those dismissals and removed a coach from off campus recruiting. A great example is Tressel at Ohio St. It took them forever to act on Clarrett and plus Troy Smith was suspended two seasons ago for some "rule violation." Stoops has never shied away from getting rid of a player. This is just another example of how basketball screws up everything.
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Post by coachturley on Jul 11, 2007 18:31:48 GMT -6
It is getting to the point where it is better (can't believe I am writing this) to not self report. The University of Colorado self-reported and look what happened to them. We have this go down with the University of Oklahoma today. And the NCAA can't touch USC because no will talk? OU will have to essentially forfeit the 2005 season due to that actions of two individuals. Two. How many other student-athletes, coaches, managers, staff members, etc. busted their butt during 05'? And like spread said, Coach Stoops stepped up and booted two starters that day before practice started. Am I just frustrated with this whole situation or what?  Coach T |
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Post by joetexas on Jul 11, 2007 18:44:29 GMT -6
In 1986 TCU turned themselves in when a star running back took money from a business and did not work. The punishment for TCU was $350,000 returned for revenue from TV, the loss of several shollys and a bowl ban. Mind you TCU was not already under NCAA probation, as OU is at this time. I wonder what would happen to the BCS if a potential conference champion were denied bowl eligibilty? It could mark the end of the NCAA's cashcow...The BSC.
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Post by coache67 on Jul 11, 2007 19:07:12 GMT -6
OK - I voted for way overboard and I am going to give you first hand experience as to why. Not saying it is right or wrong, just what is: I have personally been involved in summer employment at the DI college level and from my experience, this sort of thing happens way more than anyone (self)reports. I was a player at what could be considered a MidtoLower DI school and I had a terrible job my first year and very cushy jobs for the remainder of my tenure in school. I remember thinking to myself shortly after another similar incident while I was in school, "If this is the way it is here, I can't imagine what is happening at XYZ State (or Tech, or U etc). " Boosters will be boosters and they are boosters b/c they want to be close to the action, for whatever reason. I am sure that this guy, their supervisor, had it all figured out and this wasn't the first time he was involved in this sort of thing either, as BIG RED AUTOS (or whatever the dealership is, may as well be called BOOMER SOONER CARS) is/was the BIGGEST employer of OK student-athletes. I am sure a lot of the students were really washing cars, or driving them around the lot, OR PICKING UP CUSTOMERS, or WATCHING THE DOOR, or GREETING CUSTOMERS or whatever job they could get in regards to their status on their respective teams. If you read between the lines, they got in trouble for one of two reasons, one of these guys hooked up with a chick at the dealership and she said something when they dogged her or the guy who was clocked in during a scrimmage screwed the whole thing up. WHile I like to think it was the first, more than likely it was the latter. The question then becomes, whose fault was that (once again, not from my morality, but from the morality of BIG TIME DI College FOOTBALL). Stoops and CO were left with no choice and the ONLY reason it happened right before practice was because if they waited and it got out, they would have to forefeit the whole season. ANyone who thinks they found out the day before doubles, well, land . . . FLA . . . Call me  . Seriously, I personally feel it was over the line for two reasons (1) I feel that this IS a lack of institutional control as B-Ball had their own issues and (2) they let them keep their $. That is what makes me sick - the NCAA will punish everyone except the bag men, and why, b/c they like their little bowl traditions - instead of letting the CFB faithful have a playoff! I have got to stop here, sorry for the rant guys, but I can't stand the ncaa and their hypocrisy. |
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Post by coachd5085 on Jul 11, 2007 20:28:15 GMT -6
Well, it is against the rules.... and the NCAA can't touch the boosters, because it has no say so over them (directly) .... so they try to FORCE them to respect the rules by bringing the hammer down on their favorite teams. Not saying that is a great solution, just saying that is the reality of the situation
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Post by fbdoc on Jul 12, 2007 11:00:33 GMT -6
Probably overboard on this one. The school turned themselves in, the coach kicked the players off the team! Maybe a big financial penalty and the loss of the two player's scholarships. The rest seems like an attempt by the NCAA to grab some headlines.
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Post by airman on Jul 12, 2007 11:11:26 GMT -6
OU has a history of NCAA infractions. Heck look at the Barry Switzer years. he got fired cause his players thought they were above the law.
This history is what works against them. then you throw in basketball problems. The NCAA had to protect its image and come down hard.
I personally do not like boosters. I always think they are cheap people. they are trying to relive their college playing days for most of them.
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Post by phantom on Jul 12, 2007 11:28:29 GMT -6
OU has a history of NCAA infractions. Heck look at the Barry Switzer years. he got fired cause his players thought they were above the law. This history is what works against them. then you throw in basketball problems. The NCAA had to protect its image and come down hard. I personally do not like boosters. I always think they are cheap people. they are trying to relive their college playing days for most of them. To a college coach boosters have to be scary. You need their money, you have no control over them, and they don't always understand what they can and cannot do. Sometimes they don't care. I think that the NCAA did the right thing. It was harsh but it couls have been worse. They were eligibile for the death penalty. |
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Post by airman on Jul 12, 2007 13:55:06 GMT -6
OU has a history of NCAA infractions. Heck look at the Barry Switzer years. he got fired cause his players thought they were above the law. This history is what works against them. then you throw in basketball problems. The NCAA had to protect its image and come down hard. I personally do not like boosters. I always think they are cheap people. they are trying to relive their college playing days for most of them. To a college coach boosters have to be scary. You need their money, you have no control over them, and they don't always understand what they can and cannot do. Sometimes they don't care. I think that the NCAA did the right thing. It was harsh but it couls have been worse. They were eligibile for the death penalty. I heard the ncaa will never use the death penalty again because of what it has done to SMU. SMU has never recovered from the DP. The NCAA actually admitted they made a mistake. |
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bighit65
Junior Member
Make a statement without saying a word.
Posts: 397
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Post by bighit65 on Jul 12, 2007 17:56:44 GMT -6
This punishment was ridiculous but look at what got wiped away. A screw job at Oregon and a win in the Hoiday Bowl? I am a Sooner so I won't complain about the punishment too much for fear of looking biased.
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Post by coachd5085 on Jul 13, 2007 5:12:34 GMT -6
The solution to this is simple though...OU (or any other university or college) DON'T TAKE THE MONEY. DON'T have athletic boosters. DON'T treat those who donate 2 million any different than the guy who donates 20 bucks.
Of course, nobody would go for that....
As far as the punishment...I don't think it is overboard at all. Nobody really cares about the past, and the scholarship limitation isn't drastic enough to really cause much of a dent in their recruiting process.
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Post by joetexas on Jul 13, 2007 7:09:37 GMT -6
The downside to cheating is what exactly? You have a school that is already on probation and they cheat during that probation. The penalty for doing this is losing a couple of scholarships? I guess that institutional control thing does not apply. Me thinks that the NCAA has two sets of standards. One set for the vast majority of schools(TCU, SMU, etc...) and another for the big dogs(Alabama, USC, OU, etc...).
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rhair
Freshmen Member
Posts: 36
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Post by rhair on Jul 13, 2007 9:09:50 GMT -6
It almost seems that the NCAA is on a witch hunt when it come to recruiting violations and other violations. In my opinion this is going way overboard. Is the NCAA trying to pull a power trip and say to school, "This is what we can do to you if you break the rules." I am all for punishment but this is way over the top.
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Post by coachd5085 on Jul 13, 2007 11:03:05 GMT -6
For those who voted "overboard" how is this over the top? Stripping someone of past wins is meaningless--(much like the suspended sentence in criminal proceedings) and the scholarship limitations are pretty minute. 4 Schollies is detrimental, but hardly OVERBOARD
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Post by saintrad on Jul 13, 2007 16:10:43 GMT -6
For those who voted "overboard" how is this over the top? Stripping someone of past wins is meaningless--(much like the suspended sentence in criminal proceedings) and the scholarship limitations are pretty minute. 4 Schollies is detrimental, but hardly OVERBOARD i would have to agree with this one... the players, coaches, adminstration, and the University lost games from the record books, kept the Holiday Bowl trophy (and the money they received rom the pay out) and no one on their schedule got to add a 'W' to their win column.... Stoops has been dancing on the edge of infractions for a very long time and he got caught and cant whine to the refs to get his way out of this one (like he is always doing). 4 schollys is nothing to this program and will do nothing other than help them in the future recruiting by telling their blue chippers that they were "taking the high road and the big bad NCAA has it out for them". It's actually kind of ironic that t team named after the most famous claim jumpers (sooners) got caught finally. |
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Post by poweriguy on Jul 13, 2007 19:56:40 GMT -6
"The NCAA was SOOOO mad at Kentucky for violations, they put Chapman College on probation." - Jerry Tarkanian
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Post by airman on Jul 14, 2007 14:21:54 GMT -6
the problem is solved very easy. eliminate scholarships period. be like the IVY league and bring real students. god forbide we had real student athletes.
lets face it the pressure to win enhances the desire to cheat. it has happened through out history. look and former president nixion. he had the election won but he cheated, got caught and for that he had consequences.
look at the my confrence the big ten. northwestern graduates 88 percent of its players and they rarely are competitive. it is proof that brains and football are not a good combination. the lower your graduation rate, the better your football team.
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Post by lukethadrifter on Jul 14, 2007 19:53:52 GMT -6
If they are going to do this to OU, then when do they go after USC after what happened there? OU's biggest fear out of all of this will be the possibility of in the future losing bluechip recruits from Texas, which always seem to make up at least a 1/3 of their team, and sometimes more. Luke
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