yoda1
Sophomore Member
Posts: 216
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Post by yoda1 on Jan 21, 2018 14:32:34 GMT -6
Do any of you tell players to avoid certain sports programs because bad culture in those programs. Example spring sports that accept poor work ethic, kids being selfish, accept loosing etc... We want multi sport athletes, but at some point are you better off telling them to avoid bad programs?
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Post by blb on Jan 21, 2018 14:37:46 GMT -6
Do any of you tell players to avoid certain sports programs because bad culture in those programs. Example spring sports that accept poor work ethic, kids being selfish, accept loosing etc... We want multi sport athletes, but at some point are you better off telling them to avoid bad programs?
I know what your point is, but the answer is no.
Kids should go on as many rides as they can when in HS, they'll never get another chance.
If sports or other extra-curriculars are being mismanaged, that's up to administrators to deal with.
How would you feel if Baseball coach for example told one of your players not to play for you in Fall because he thinks there's "bad culture" in your program?
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Post by carookie on Jan 21, 2018 14:38:51 GMT -6
Do any of you tell players to avoid certain sports programs because bad culture in those programs. Example spring sports that accept poor work ethic, kids being selfish, accept loosing etc... We want multi sport athletes, but at some point are you better off telling them to avoid bad programs? Wow, I can't imagine a sport on campus being that bad that I would be willing to undercut a colleague in such a way. I know I wouldve met with the AD prior to it getting to this point to at least professionally voice my concerns about said program being on campus. I probably would even try to meet with the coach to offer my help (yeah I know it comes off as arrogant, but I can be like that). If you don't mind me asking what specifically do they do to allow kids to be selfish? Track is basically an individual sport, golf is too, and baseball is a team sport where one plays as an individual. Just wondering what specific actions dictate a 'kid being selfish'?
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Post by 33coach on Jan 21, 2018 14:42:33 GMT -6
Do any of you tell players to avoid certain sports programs because bad culture in those programs. Example spring sports that accept poor work ethic, kids being selfish, accept loosing etc... We want multi sport athletes, but at some point are you better off telling them to avoid bad programs? no. and doing so will only hurt you in the long run... kids talk, other coaches hear it, complain to the AD...you get the shaft for telling kids not to go out for other sports.
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Post by 19delta on Jan 21, 2018 14:53:40 GMT -6
Do any of you tell players to avoid certain sports programs because bad culture in those programs. Example spring sports that accept poor work ethic, kids being selfish, accept loosing etc... We want multi sport athletes, but at some point are you better off telling them to avoid bad programs? This is a great strategy for any coach who wants to make sure that they are despised by the other coaches in the building.
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Post by 33coach on Jan 21, 2018 15:01:25 GMT -6
Do any of you tell players to avoid certain sports programs because bad culture in those programs. Example spring sports that accept poor work ethic, kids being selfish, accept loosing etc... We want multi sport athletes, but at some point are you better off telling them to avoid bad programs? This is a great strategy for any coach who wants to make sure that they are despised by the other coaches in the building. and also ensures you will never get a good reference from that school when they fire you.... because they will fire you. ...nothing says "hire me" like "discourages children from playing other sports." on your record.
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Post by spos21ram on Jan 21, 2018 15:58:30 GMT -6
That would be a big NO.....you would be undermining so many people by doing so.
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Post by 50slantstrong on Jan 21, 2018 17:15:10 GMT -6
Long story short, no. We’ll never tell a kid not to participate in a sport or competitive activity.
If we can find out specifics of what negative things are being enabled in other programs, we’ll try to rail against it when we have our time with the kids but not mention the other sport specifically.
For example, our baseball team had a ditch day a few years ago and they posted a video of themselves drinking liquor and smoking at the beach during school hours. Our HC used this as an opportunity to preach about how digital footprint will follow you forever, college coaches will see it, etc.
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Post by s73 on Jan 21, 2018 17:20:44 GMT -6
Do any of you tell players to avoid certain sports programs because bad culture in those programs. Example spring sports that accept poor work ethic, kids being selfish, accept loosing etc... We want multi sport athletes, but at some point are you better off telling them to avoid bad programs? Absolutely no. Don't have to encourage kids to join but CANNOT tell them not to go out. Extremely unprofessional.
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Post by groundchuck on Jan 21, 2018 19:12:41 GMT -6
No. I would not do that. I have steered kids who were not happy playing baseball to track. But never told them not to play a sport if they want to.
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Post by 54695469 on Jan 21, 2018 20:58:33 GMT -6
Seriously, someone needs to show the coaches of those other sports how to change the culture within their program!
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Post by silkyice on Jan 21, 2018 22:38:11 GMT -6
Seriously, someone needs to show the coaches of those other sports how to change the culture within their program! it is spring for goodness sakes. Great time to “row the boat”.
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Post by mariner42 on Jan 21, 2018 23:34:02 GMT -6
I push kids towards our track team (that I am HC of) because I don't care for how baseball operates and how we have to basically retrain lacrosse players to practice hard, but I don't discourage. I'm not trying to build my program by tearing down others, I just want to offer a quality sporting experience and I know we do that.
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Post by wolverine55 on Jan 22, 2018 7:51:22 GMT -6
Not that the consensus hasn't been established, but I will share my thoughts as well. I played at a school where the basketball coach was notorious for steering his players away from football and we didn't have many multi-sport athletes. About 8 years after I graduated, I'm coaching at a school in the conference and my alma mater made a deep playoff run. Now, at this time, he did have a group of multi-sport athletes and four of his five projected basketball starters were also football players. I heard from several different teachers and coaches at my alma mater that he was visibly upset the Monday after a playoff win because it was also the first day of basketball practice and he would be without these four kids...
After having experienced it and seen it for myself, I could never do this to another coach no matter how bad I thought he or she was.
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Post by Defcord on Jan 22, 2018 8:05:27 GMT -6
I think if you have established clear expectations in your program that kids will live up to them. Hopefully, your kids would take those with them to the other sport and hold themselves to a higher standard. I think though that kids know how to navigate circumstances and find what's acceptable and adapt their behavior to those expectations. So when they are working with you, they will still meet your expectations and while in the other sport they will meet those expectations.
Kids are pretty smart. They do this same thing with their teachers throughout the day. If one teacher allows them to have their phone out and another doesn't, most of your kids will have their phone out in the first class but not in the second. They do this same thing with their parents as well. My son is nine and is an expert at this. He knows exactly what works with mom but not dad or dad but not mom.
And if for no other reason than others have stated you don't want to be "THAT GUY."
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Post by fshamrock on Jan 22, 2018 10:12:38 GMT -6
Seriously, someone needs to show the coaches of those other sports how to change the culture within their program! I'm loving it now because of the consistency, it was funny, then annoying, but dude took the criticism and kept charging through the breach, now it's double hilarious I would say get a bunch of copies of that book to mail out to coaches you as a joke, but that could get expensive
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Post by rosey65 on Jan 22, 2018 10:39:27 GMT -6
Do any of you tell players to avoid certain sports programs because bad culture in those programs. Example spring sports that accept poor work ethic, kids being selfish, accept loosing etc... We want multi sport athletes, but at some point are you better off telling them to avoid bad programs? I fully understand this situation!! As much as you'd like to say "no," you are much better off just being the bigger/better coach. Kids can see right thru BS, and will quickly understand how other programs are run. We have several programs here that are absolute trainwrecks. And while it might sem better to keep the kids away, actually the opposite tends to work better. The kids see how lack of discipline and accountability lead to failure in other programs, which simply strengthens the lessons we are trying to instill within our football program. And usually the kids dont last more than a season with the trainwrecks, anyways...even 16 yearolds get fed up with undisciplined programs and coaches
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pistola
Sophomore Member
Posts: 193
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Post by pistola on Jan 22, 2018 10:58:02 GMT -6
Seriously, someone needs to show the coaches of those other sports how to change the culture within their program! I'm loving it now because of the consistency, it was funny, then annoying, but dude took the criticism and kept charging through the breach, now it's double hilarious I would say get a bunch of copies of that book to mail out to coaches you as a joke, but that could get expensive It also helps he is changing his delivery a bit.. it seemed like he was just copy and pasting for a bit... I will give him credit.. he is consistent
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Post by ogre5530 on Jan 22, 2018 12:34:43 GMT -6
Seriously, someone needs to show the coaches of those other sports how to change the culture within their program! What's your main beef with this Coach??? I'm just curious because your account seems to exist only for trolling.
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Post by spos21ram on Jan 22, 2018 13:04:30 GMT -6
Seriously, someone needs to show the coaches of those other sports how to change the culture within their program! For discussion sake....saying a program has a bad culture is one person's opinion. Just because the OP thinks it's a bad situation doesn't mean it actually is especially if he's not at that sports practices everyday.
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Post by NC1974 on Jan 22, 2018 13:32:36 GMT -6
I agree that kids should be involved in as much as they want to in HS. But I can relate to the idea that some sports teams might have better cultures than others. This is one reason why I am intrigued by the idea of having an all athletes strength program like the ones Vanderbush and Silky run. You would obviously need the right guys in place, but I think this could help build the entire athletic programs culture, status, etc.
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Post by coachcb on Jan 22, 2018 15:35:18 GMT -6
I have been tempted to do so because Legion baseball is a parasite in this some areas of this state but I've always kept my trap shut.
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yoda1
Sophomore Member
Posts: 216
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Post by yoda1 on Jan 22, 2018 20:00:16 GMT -6
We have never told any kid not to do a sport we always encourage multi sports. The question was if any of you have been forced to do that because it was that bad?
Do any of your schools have a set of culture rules or statements that all programs must abide buy? We will promote the weight room Athletes that are late will have the following Etc....
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Post by 19delta on Jan 22, 2018 20:27:48 GMT -6
We have never told any kid not to do a sport we always encourage multi sports. The question was if any of you have been forced to do that because it was that bad? Do any of your schools have a set of culture rules or statements that all programs must abide buy? We will promote the weight room Athletes that are late will have the following Etc.... It's not your place to make that determination unless you are the AD or an administrator. Coach your team and let the other coaches coach theirs. If the kids pick up some bad habits from other sports, then your high standards and expectations should get the kids back on track really fast once your season starts. You can try and package this however you want. But, at the end of the day, the perception is going to be that you are running down other programs so you can keep the athletes for yourself, regardless of your (ill-conceived) intentions.
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Post by 19delta on Jan 22, 2018 20:29:17 GMT -6
I agree that kids should be involved in as much as they want to in HS. But I can relate to the idea that some sports teams might have better cultures than others. This is one reason why I am intrigued by the idea of having an all athletes strength program like the ones Vanderbush and Silky run. You would obviously need the right guys in place, but I think this could help build the entire athletic programs culture, status, etc. Unless that all-sports program is Crossfit.
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SconnieOC
Junior Member
Just here to learn the facemelter
Posts: 411
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Post by SconnieOC on Jan 22, 2018 21:02:27 GMT -6
Obviously the general feeling has been established but I'll throw my 2 cents...
At my HS, which was small, most guys played 2, if not 3 sports. Our Football and Bball programs were really successful (semi's in football, undefeated conference season in hoops) but our baseball program was a joke. We won a lot because of talent, but no where near where should have been for most of my career. Our senior year myself and a couple of other guys really took it upon ourselves to try and change the culture. Great story, we had practice the day before our first round playoff game, and our HC ended it early because, and I'm not $hitting you, because he had to go to an all you can eat shrimp and corn on the cob picnic.. I wish I was making this up.
The seniors took it upon ourselves to scramble enough balls and bats together to keep practice running, because the HC took all the gear under the guise of liability, and continued to go through our normal pre-game practice. The baseball team has been on a pretty good run since... There's more that goes into that, including better commitment, good talent, and eventually a new HC, but I like to think we had a hand in changing that culture a bit.
I think you hope that the values you instill in your guys during the summer and fall, can carry over to other sports and help them be successful, or at the very least, your guys stay at neutral and don't take any steps backwards.
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famar
Sophomore Member
Looking to learn as much as I can from this site and all of the coaches here.
Posts: 208
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Post by famar on Jan 22, 2018 21:21:59 GMT -6
Do any of you tell players to avoid certain sports programs because bad culture in those programs. Example spring sports that accept poor work ethic, kids being selfish, accept loosing etc... We want multi sport athletes, but at some point are you better off telling them to avoid bad programs? Dear God, NO. Like many of the other respondents have said, if your program is strong and has instilled a culture of hard work, the kids in your program that have bought in aren't going to automatically deprogram after the final whistle of football season and beome turds because (whatever other sport) isn't up to snuff in that regard. And as others have alluded to, this could turn back on you. Imagine that one of these other sports that you describe as having a bad culture strings together a couple of deep playoff runs while the football programs is mediocre for a few years, do you want that coach trying to convince your kids to give up football to concentrate on their sport year round? And do you want to face the prospect of when you inevitably have to move on, that your chances of getting a gig somewhere else are derailed by the whispers that you're a "program killer" for the other sports in the school?
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Post by coachcb on Jan 23, 2018 8:24:14 GMT -6
Here's the reality; other sports with poor cultures will eventually correct themselves. I'll expand upon my earlier statement. I coached in an area where the Legion baseball coaches wanted the kids specializing; they set up a "fall baseball league" and told kids that they'd better be playing year round. We had several very good football players quit to play fall baseball as they were fed b.s. about "going pro" and D1 scholarships.
One kid was a varsity starter as a sophomore and also a NATIONAL CHAMPION wrestler. He quit both because they Legion coaches had him believing that he was going to be drafted as a pitcher right out of H.S. Unfortunately, his parents fell right into it too. We tried to talk them out of it (without trashing baseball) but they were adamant.
Long story short, the kid specialized in baseball for three straight years and ended up with a full ride to an NAIA school. His shoulder and elbow were shredded from playing so much baseball and he lost his scholarship within the first year as he needed surgery.
I ran into him a few years later and he told me that quitting football and wrestling was a terrible mistake. The same story came out of other kids and parents, kids stopped participating in fall baseball. Many of them still competed in Legion ball but they quit specializing.
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Post by spos21ram on Jan 23, 2018 9:31:18 GMT -6
Here's the reality; other sports with poor cultures will eventually correct themselves. I'll expand upon my earlier statement. I coached in an area where the Legion baseball coaches wanted the kids specializing; they set up a "fall baseball league" and told kids that they'd better be playing year round. We had several very good football players quit to play fall baseball as they were fed b.s. about "going pro" and D1 scholarships. One kid was a varsity starter as a sophomore and also a NATIONAL CHAMPION wrestler. He quit both because they Legion coaches had him believing that he was going to be drafted as a pitcher right out of H.S. Unfortunately, his parents fell right into it too. We tried to talk them out of it (without trashing baseball) but they were adamant. Long story short, the kid specialized in baseball for three straight years and ended up with a full ride to an NAIA school. His shoulder and elbow were shredded from playing so much baseball and he lost his scholarship within the first year as he needed surgery. I ran into him a few years later and he told me that quitting football and wrestling was a terrible mistake. The same story came out of other kids and parents, kids stopped participating in fall baseball. Many of them still competed in Legion ball but they quit specializing. Legion baseball, aau basketball, spring select soccer, are different. Has no affiliation with your school. If that was the other program with a bad culture then I would absolutely talk to the kid about not playing a specific sport all year round. I am under the impression the OP is talking about other school sports.
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Post by silkyice on Jan 23, 2018 11:09:10 GMT -6
Seriously, someone needs to show the coaches of those other sports how to change the culture within their program! For discussion sake....saying a program has a bad culture is one person's opinion. Just because the OP thinks it's a bad situation doesn't mean it actually is especially if he's not at that sports practices everyday. Wrong. It is a proven fact that if you aren't "rowing the boat" and don't have a turnover chain (don't care if it is baseball, still should have a turnover chain), then your culture is abysmal.
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