|
|
Post by spillitnkillit on Dec 8, 2017 14:47:43 GMT -6
Not sure where to put this so I hope here is fine. Looking for advice on how people study playbooks, like the college ones etc. that are floating around. Do you try and find film and match up the concepts/plays? Or is it better to just go through and try to read it like a book and figure out the terminology etc.? Hope what I'm trying to ask makes sense, looking to dive into some this offseason
|
|
|
|
Post by **** on Dec 8, 2017 16:09:58 GMT -6
I'd read through the playbook and then watch the film. Try to identify what they're doing. You might be wrong on somethings and kids will mess up on tape (so you might not know what something was supposed to be) but IMO that'd be the good way to go about it. Other than just finding somebody that knows that system and talking with them. That would be the best way to do it.
|
|
|
|
Post by aceback76 on Dec 8, 2017 16:33:41 GMT -6
Not sure where to put this so I hope here is fine. Looking for advice on how people study playbooks, like the college ones etc. that are floating around. Do you try and find film and match up the concepts/plays? Or is it better to just go through and try to read it like a book and figure out the terminology etc.? Hope what I'm trying to ask makes sense, looking to dive into some this offseason FILM more important than playbooks! Diagrams on paper don't MOVE! |
|
|
|
Post by Defcord on Dec 8, 2017 17:18:10 GMT -6
Not sure where to put this so I hope here is fine. Looking for advice on how people study playbooks, like the college ones etc. that are floating around. Do you try and find film and match up the concepts/plays? Or is it better to just go through and try to read it like a book and figure out the terminology etc.? Hope what I'm trying to ask makes sense, looking to dive into some this offseason FILM more important than playbooks! Diagrams on paper don't MOVE! There’s value in having both. Know what they are trying to and how they are actually executing. I was watching some Harding University offense the other day on YouTube where they showed their roles then them executing it or not executing it. |
|
|
|
Post by aceback76 on Dec 8, 2017 17:22:49 GMT -6
FILM more important than playbooks! Diagrams on paper don't MOVE! There’s value in having both. Know what they are trying to and how they are actually executing. I was watching some Harding University offense the other day on YouTube where they showed their roles then them executing it or not executing it. Taking ONE play for example: The "Stretch" Outside Zone appears to be just about everybody's play. On PAPER it is always hitting outside the 3 Tech. In the game - it goes BEHIND the 3 tech 75% or more of the time (he "STRETCHES" beyond the RB's landmark)!! |
|
|
|
Post by Defcord on Dec 8, 2017 17:29:09 GMT -6
There’s value in having both. Know what they are trying to and how they are actually executing. I was watching some Harding University offense the other day on YouTube where they showed their roles then them executing it or not executing it. Taking ONE play for example: The "Stretch" Outside Zone appears to be just about everybody's play. On PAPER it is always hitting outside the 3 Tech. In the game - it goes BEHIND the 3 tech 75% or more of the time (he "STRETCHES" beyond the RB's landmark)!! I agree. |
|
|
|
Post by bobgoodman on Dec 9, 2017 12:57:28 GMT -6
I think your own imagination is better than watching film of some other team executing it. Look at the plays and think, could the players you're used to dealing with execute this, that, and the other? How would my opponent's players react? You see film of another team running it and having no problem handling a certain linebacker, but what makes you think that in your league that linebacker's going to wind up over here instead of there? Or that the OL you have next to your puller is going to make enough space for your puller not to trip over him? Or whether your player might do better taking 3 steps where the one on film took 2, starting on the other foot?
Also, there are playbooks and then there are documents with a lot more coaching info than a playbook might have, but people might still call it a "playbook".
Learning the terminology in a particular playbook is only useful if you're going to have a discussion with other coaches who might call the same things by the same name as that one. It can be a positive handicap in discussion with coaches who use those terms in contradictory ways.
|
|
|
|
Post by spillitnkillit on Dec 9, 2017 13:51:01 GMT -6
I think your own imagination is better than watching film of some other team executing it. Look at the plays and think, could the players you're used to dealing with execute this, that, and the other? How would my opponent's players react? You see film of another team running it and having no problem handling a certain linebacker, but what makes you think that in your league that linebacker's going to wind up over here instead of there? Or that the OL you have next to your puller is going to make enough space for your puller not to trip over him? Or whether your player might do better taking 3 steps where the one on film took 2, starting on the other foot? Also, there are playbooks and then there are documents with a lot more coaching info than a playbook might have, but people might still call it a "playbook". Learning the terminology in a particular playbook is only useful if you're going to have a discussion with other coaches who might call the same things by the same name as that one. It can be a positive handicap in discussion with coaches who use those terms in contradictory ways. Sorry should have specified, I spent a few years as an assistant but not on a staff currently. I may get back into coaching someday but I'm a free agent right now. So basically just looking at expanding my technical knowledge of the game and learning how other coaches studied the "famous" playbooks etc. when they were up and coming if that makes sense. |
|
|
|
Post by bobgoodman on Dec 9, 2017 18:09:44 GMT -6
I think your own imagination is better than watching film of some other team executing it. Look at the plays and think, could the players you're used to dealing with execute this, that, and the other? How would my opponent's players react? You see film of another team running it and having no problem handling a certain linebacker, but what makes you think that in your league that linebacker's going to wind up over here instead of there? Or that the OL you have next to your puller is going to make enough space for your puller not to trip over him? Or whether your player might do better taking 3 steps where the one on film took 2, starting on the other foot? Also, there are playbooks and then there are documents with a lot more coaching info than a playbook might have, but people might still call it a "playbook". Learning the terminology in a particular playbook is only useful if you're going to have a discussion with other coaches who might call the same things by the same name as that one. It can be a positive handicap in discussion with coaches who use those terms in contradictory ways. Sorry should have specified, I spent a few years as an assistant but not on a staff currently. I may get back into coaching someday but I'm a free agent right now. So basically just looking at expanding my technical knowledge of the game and learning how other coaches studied the "famous" playbooks etc. when they were up and coming if that makes sense. I've been there, and even then imagination figures for a lot. Some years ago I was thinking of a toss play that would go with the Wyatt wildcat, and I got out on grass and pantomimed for myself one of the moves to see if it made sense. Ergonomically it did, but then when I got back to diagramming it I realized it'd be an orphan play -- no way to make it look like other plays in a sensible series. I'm sure you could make similar discoveries with playbooks to figure out why a certain play that may seem like an obvious add isn't there. But there may also be times you'll look & wonder, why is this in there? And the author's been dead for years, so can't answer you. Your best hope then is to find someone who learned the system from him and installed it a few seasons. The answer may be, we'd run that only if this opponent lines up there or keys on this player -- you could look at years' worth of film & never see it, & the reason is that the other team never plays that way because they know that you could run this play. |
|
|
|
Post by coachd5085 on Dec 10, 2017 11:20:52 GMT -6
There’s value in having both. Know what they are trying to and how they are actually executing. I was watching some Harding University offense the other day on YouTube where they showed their roles then them executing it or not executing it. Taking ONE play for example: The "Stretch" Outside Zone appears to be just about everybody's play. On PAPER it is always hitting outside the 3 Tech. In the game - it goes BEHIND the 3 tech 75% or more of the time (he "STRETCHES" beyond the RB's landmark)!! But coach, without the corresponding playbook, someone with limited knowledge and looking to learn would probably not figure out the concept. They would just think that play was designed to be run inside the b gap from just watching film wouldn't they? |
|
|
|
Post by aceback76 on Dec 10, 2017 11:36:09 GMT -6
Taking ONE play for example: The "Stretch" Outside Zone appears to be just about everybody's play. On PAPER it is always hitting outside the 3 Tech. In the game - it goes BEHIND the 3 tech 75% or more of the time (he "STRETCHES" beyond the RB's landmark)!! But coach, without the corresponding playbook, someone with limited knowledge and looking to learn would probably not figure out the concept. They would just think that play was designed to be run inside the b gap from just watching film wouldn't they? Of course. WE have film AND playbooks. The PLAYERS learn best from FILM! We had an All State QB a few years ago who correctly observed that "things look TOTALLY different on the field than they do in the playbook"!!! He understood that football is played on GRASS, not on paper!!! Good film is hard to come by. There are hundreds of books with thousands of plays on Amazon!!! |
|
|
|
Post by Coach Vint on Dec 10, 2017 18:06:35 GMT -6
Each year I do a period of research and development. I am researching 4 things. 1.) New Schemes, 2.) Existing Scheme Improvement, 3.) Individual Skill Development, and 4.) what guys are doing on the other side of the ball.
I go to two to three clinics a year and watch guys who offer something we may want to add, tweak or adjust; speakers on the other side of the ball defending things we are doing, and guys who coach my position talking about fundamental skills. I try to visit at least one high school and one college staff each year as well. When guys come in to recruit I try to get them on the board for a couple of minutes to troubleshoot some issues we may have had.
I also will buy one book each spring and one DVD. I also use the Glazier Vault to find stuff that may be of interest, and I try to read a couple of articles from XandO labs.
The big deal is I don't want to get too caught up adding new stuff. I am looking for something that may give us an edge, or maybe something that will give us an answer when we struggle. I record bowl games of teams I am interested in studying and will watch the film to learn about some things they are doing. If it marries to something we do we might talk about it as a staff.
|
|
|
|
Post by coachstepp on Dec 10, 2017 21:27:30 GMT -6
There’s value in having both. Know what they are trying to and how they are actually executing. I was watching some Harding University offense the other day on YouTube where they showed their roles then them executing it or not executing it. Taking ONE play for example: The "Stretch" Outside Zone appears to be just about everybody's play. On PAPER it is always hitting outside the 3 Tech. In the game - it goes BEHIND the 3 tech 75% or more of the time (he "STRETCHES" beyond the RB's landmark)!! I agree with everything you just said, except one. While wide zone is my favorite play, I am finding that most others are not fans of the Gibbs' wide zone. They prefer inside zone and gap scheme runs. Their loss, right? Haha |
|
|
|
Post by aceback76 on Dec 11, 2017 8:06:00 GMT -6
Taking ONE play for example: The "Stretch" Outside Zone appears to be just about everybody's play. On PAPER it is always hitting outside the 3 Tech. In the game - it goes BEHIND the 3 tech 75% or more of the time (he "STRETCHES" beyond the RB's landmark)!! I agree with everything you just said, except one. While wide zone is my favorite play, I am finding that most others are not fans of the Gibbs' wide zone. They prefer inside zone and gap scheme runs. Their loss, right? Haha I really don't worry (nor really care) about what others do. I have run BOTH zones since 1982 (& will continue to run both), but the OZ gets better results EVERY year. Have to "dance with the one that brung us"! The OZ is run about 5 to 1 over the IZ on higher levels. The reason is that on the IZ they can squeeze you from both sides, but the OZ either creases the C gap or goes wide. |
|
