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Post by coachklee on Oct 24, 2017 18:14:58 GMT -6
After Friday nights, I help with my son's 11-12 youth team on Saturdays. A kid for the other team twisted his ankle and his coaches were tending to him so refs sent players to sidelines for water. I was talking to one of our players.... ref came over and said coach they have to take a knee and you cant coach during an injury. I looked confused and asked if that was really a rule? he said yes its a rule in the rule book. I laughed and turned to talk to the kid again. He threatened to flag me if I didn't stop. I hate the whole take a knee crap anyway. that guy is gonna feel the same whether i'm on knee or standing. We got yelled at by our parents in the stands last year (HS Varsity) because an opposing player got hurt and we didn't take a knee. She approached the HC and demanded that we take a knee when i kid gets hurt. We told her this aint peewee football and we don't take a knee. She flipped out. To make it worse they talked to the president of our school and he had to "address the issue" with the coaching staff. We / I coach our kids to NEVER take a knee if they see any movement by the kid on the ground because in HS football, he’ll likely get back up & finish the game. Our kids have even got to the point that anyone of our guys that doesn’t at least limp to the sideline is made fun of if they are able to go back in the game or play the following week!
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Post by bartimus58 on Oct 24, 2017 18:48:44 GMT -6
We have talked many times this season about the origins of the take a knee thing. I had never heard of the thing at any level of football until 6-7 years ago. Now kids want to take a knee for a kid with a {censored} calf cramp. This annoys me too. If a kid has anything below the chest injured, I'm not taking a knee. Maybe I'm just a heartless bastard.
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Post by bartimus58 on Oct 24, 2017 18:53:28 GMT -6
it is not just coaches who don't know the rules, sometimes it is the officials. A couple of years ago we lined up in an unbalanced formation with both tackles on the left and the TE next to the guard on the right. We got the first down but got flagged for illegal formation. I asked what was illegal about it and the guy said "Coach, you don't have enough linemen" I said "What are you talking about, we have 5 out there?" He then said "Number 4 can't line up at tackle." and stepped off the penalty yards. We've been called for not having enough on the LOS when we had a Slam/Trey (TE attached and two receivers off to the same side). Ref didn't count the TE and thought we had 10.
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Post by insidethestripes on Oct 24, 2017 20:05:42 GMT -6
I got 2 that were both with the officials 1- Last week we had a defensive holding penalty called on us. I ask the ref on who and what happened. He gives me the number and says "It wasn't actually holding, he rerouted the player on offense and that player fell. It wasn't PI because the ball wasn't in the air but that's illegal. I just didn't know what to actually call it" Apparently you cant reroute WR's any more in high school football. 2- Last year we were playing a team in league that likes to run a lot of RPO. Watching film I notice they have linemen 3+ yards down field when the QB will throw it. I point it out to the refs before the game and show them a couple of the plays. I was then told "Well coach the box actually goes to 3 yards on both sides of the LOS so that's not an ineligible WR down field." I then ask "So on a drop back pass the lineman can drive block a guy as long as he is within 3 yards of the LOS?" Response " No coach, don't be ridiculous." We won that game, and they never threw a flag for ineligible WR down field. I'm just reminded of it because we play them this Friday and they are still doing the same stuff. Maybe I don't understand the rule. 1. Ref is wrong. Should have been no penalty. Surprised he knew it's not PI without ball in the air. We never have a ref smart enough to know that. We get fuked on that all the time. 2. Box does go 3 yards past the LOS. They can legally drive a DL 3 yards downfield on every drop back pass. Sounds like the ref knew the rule but wasn't sure of himself. 1. Rerouting can be a foul under the NFHS code if it occurs when the receiver is no longer considered a potential blocker. It wouldn't be holding, but it would be illegal use of the hands. 2. The expanded neutral zone is 2 yards. At the HS level, officials don't get super technical on IDP, but we have a lot of pressure to do just that in NCAA ball.
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Post by insidethestripes on Oct 24, 2017 20:09:47 GMT -6
WHy do we have different rule sets for the different levels of football? Are other sports like that to. Never really thought about it It boils down to two things: (1) the quality of the athletes and (2) the capacity of the officials.
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Post by dubber on Oct 25, 2017 7:00:02 GMT -6
I got 2 that were both with the officials 1- Last week we had a defensive holding penalty called on us. I ask the ref on who and what happened. He gives me the number and says "It wasn't actually holding, he rerouted the player on offense and that player fell. It wasn't PI because the ball wasn't in the air but that's illegal. I just didn't know what to actually call it" Apparently you cant reroute WR's any more in high school football. 2- Last year we were playing a team in league that likes to run a lot of RPO. Watching film I notice they have linemen 3+ yards down field when the QB will throw it. I point it out to the refs before the game and show them a couple of the plays. I was then told "Well coach the box actually goes to 3 yards on both sides of the LOS so that's not an ineligible WR down field." I then ask "So on a drop back pass the lineman can drive block a guy as long as he is within 3 yards of the LOS?" Response " No coach, don't be ridiculous." We won that game, and they never threw a flag for ineligible WR down field. I'm just reminded of it because we play them this Friday and they are still doing the same stuff. Maybe I don't understand the rule. 1. Ref is wrong. Should have been no penalty. Surprised he knew it's not PI without ball in the air. We never have a ref smart enough to know that. We get fuked on that all the time. 2. Box does go 3 yards past the LOS. They can legally drive a DL 3 yards downfield on every drop back pass. Sounds like the ref knew the rule but wasn't sure of himself. This is why all of our RPO game is married with Zone....doubles up front, ball is gone before 2 yards of movement. If it is a case where we are pushing them beyond 2 yards before the ball is thrown, we have this really neat adjustment where we just run the ball
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Post by fshamrock on Oct 25, 2017 8:35:27 GMT -6
Last week, we had a player on Kickoff team called for holding while covering the kick. had that happen to me in a huge game they return a kickoff for a TD, flag comes out during the run, we get happy....ref steps up and makes the holding sign, then points our way. So I yell out 'hey don't you mean to point that way'...and he looks a me and shakes his head..."sir did you just call holding on the kicking team? how is that possible?" he won't look over anymore, knows he screwed up but too stubborn to admit it, so naturally the penalty is declined and the TD stood. crazy
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Post by fshamrock on Oct 25, 2017 8:38:31 GMT -6
Freshman game, we kick off to the bad guys, it's a low roller coming fast, goes through the deep man's hands and out the back of the end zone. So one of our coaches is screaming at the ref "he touched it, that's a safety! he touched it and it went out the back of the end zone" this guy was normally a pretty smart guy, and it's one of those things that doesn't happen all that often, so the the rest of us got all in on it too....and I'll be damned if the refs didn't come together to talk about it and give us the safety. Which was completely wrong...the guy who started it swears up and down that he knew the rule and was just trying to fool the ref....but we all know the truth
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Post by coachwoodall on Oct 25, 2017 8:43:10 GMT -6
Last week, we had a player on Kickoff team called for holding while covering the kick. had that happen to me in a huge game they return a kickoff for a TD, flag comes out during the run, we get happy....ref steps up and makes the holding sign, then points our way. So I yell out 'hey don't you mean to point that way'...and he looks a me and shakes his head..."sir did you just call holding on the kicking team? how is that possible?" he won't look over anymore, knows he screwed up but too stubborn to admit it, so naturally the penalty is declined and the TD stood. crazy why didn't they take the penalty on the kick off?
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Post by fshamrock on Oct 25, 2017 8:46:28 GMT -6
had that happen to me in a huge game they return a kickoff for a TD, flag comes out during the run, we get happy....ref steps up and makes the holding sign, then points our way. So I yell out 'hey don't you mean to point that way'...and he looks a me and shakes his head..."sir did you just call holding on the kicking team? how is that possible?" he won't look over anymore, knows he screwed up but too stubborn to admit it, so naturally the penalty is declined and the TD stood. crazy why didn't they take the penalty on the kick off? now that you say that i'm pretty sure that's what happened...we were furious..ended up losing and not getting into the playoffs, on the film you could clearly see our cover guy being held right around the ball and the ref throwing a flag right where it happened...we sent the film to the chapter....which accomplishes nothing because around here officials are like the illuminati..they look out for their own...but man it was bad
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Post by gators41 on Oct 25, 2017 8:52:08 GMT -6
Its too bad that there are a lot of really bad officials. For some of us our careers and family well being is on the line for some bone head to make a call that they dont even understand.
But if you meet them outside of football, it makes sense. A lot of these guys have no business being out there, but they just cant get enough people to fill all the roles.
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Post by coachwoodall on Oct 25, 2017 9:27:59 GMT -6
I've said it before and it bears repeating. It really is our fault. We, as coaches, have access to dozens of people every year that are at least interested in the game of football. If we all recruited 2 graduating players to become referees and only 1 stuck with it, then we'd have more than enough quality officials.
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