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Post by hsrose on Aug 6, 2007 8:43:36 GMT -6
Not sure if this fits here, but it didn't seem to fit in the weights or the speed section.
We will be starting our "conditioning" practices next week. These are 2-hrs each, no pads, but can use helmets and balls and bags. Our HC seems to be taking the approach that this will be pretty much running time to condition the players. The past two seasons we hit the running much harder during the summer than this summer. Several of the players have told me that they don't consider what they are doing in the summer workouts to be conditioning (cardio wise, weights are going very well) them at all.
What are your thoughts on cardio training? Build up over the summer, or hit it hard at the start of practice?
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Post by knight9299 on Aug 6, 2007 9:02:35 GMT -6
In a perfect world all of our players would work their tail off the entire off-season. Never go on vacation, do nothing but prepare for football. BUT that's not even close to a reality in the program I'm with now. So we're going to hit it hard. We've been doing so already. With a new HC and a no huddle offense, our conditioning intensity this year compared to last year is off the charts.
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Post by hsrose on Aug 6, 2007 9:13:18 GMT -6
See, that's the problem. We hit it hard the last two seasons, had great participation, and I feel that it worked very well. This season, the players really haven't been worked that hard (their opinion) and are facing 5 days of special teams and running. The following week we begin double-days.
I'm not disagreeing with what is happening, just wondering from a conditioning standpoint which is most effective. I'm more of a "work them pretty hard for a longer time" rather than a "we'll work them very hard for a week" but I have no basis for this opinion other than that is what we did the past 2 seasons.
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Post by gunslinger on Aug 6, 2007 9:56:39 GMT -6
I always liked to do three different types of conditioning.
We would start each practice with a 12-minute run and increase the required distance for each player as the season progressed.
Each group (and sometimes individuals) had their own goal that they had to meet during the 12 minutes.
Nothing fancy just "X" number of laps, X laps plus a sideline, X and a 1/2, etc.
Sometimes a "big boy" might be allowed to walk one or both end zones early in the year. However, we would gradually cut that out and increase the required distance as the year went along.
On game week we cut it to 6-minutes on Wed. and didn't do it at all on Thursday.
In the middle of practice we would do "Bags, Cones, and Ropes" for agility. Each coach at a station, a certain number of minutes per station, then rotate.
At the end of practice we would do a 4th Quarter drill. Sprints, Gassers, Kick coverage, perfect play, defensive pursuit...mix it up.
Add in some competition where each coach could grade the groups as they went through the agility drills. The winning team gets a reduced 4th quarter.
Any group that had all players meet or exceed their 12-minute run drill could earn a break...
Something different everyday to help keep them motivated.
Realize that I was at a small school with a high number of players that had to go both ways. Conditioning was at a premium.
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Post by fbdoc on Aug 6, 2007 9:59:00 GMT -6
In a "training" calendar, cardio is the first thing you do to help establish the base to maximize the training effect of the more football specific drills you do later on. If your players have missed out on doing cardio during the summer, you're going to still need to work them into football shape in the time that you have. Which is going to get the jobe done better? Having them do a 12 minute run or having them do sled work, gassers, up-downs, and the like in gradually increased intervals? If you have 150 guys trying out for your team I suppose you can start out with 100 gassers and just keep the ones who survive. If you're like us with about 30 guys in grades 9-12, some of whom have worked out all summer and others who are just getting back from the AP science seminar at Columbia University (Really!) then you'll have to "get" them into shape to play over the next 3 weeks - our first game! One thing we try to do is keep our conditioning drills as football specific as possible, in other words we don't do monkey rolls!
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Post by gunandrun on Aug 12, 2007 6:53:33 GMT -6
We also have 2 days of shorts and helmets.
Our best conditioning drill we do is the "michigan drill"
Strictly training the anearobic sytem
sprints range from 3yds to 60yds
we create 4 qtrs or groups of 25 sprints. Total time needed for spriniting is doubled and that give you the rest interval befor the next sprint (group takes 6 seconds to run the 40 they get 12 for rest etc.. One coach calls out the distance and moves foot or ball to initiate the sprint. Second coach is the run through point decelerate to the next five yard line and begin the rest interval. Everyone runs again if they do not sprint through. That coach calls out the distance and starts them back to the other coach.
Simple drill the faster they run the faster they are done.
We start with one quarter and work our way to 4 qtrs by the end of the first three weeks.
Kids really like the dividends They love being fresh when the other team is dragging.
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Post by coachorr on Aug 12, 2007 8:44:21 GMT -6
I would think about what types of things you might do in a game. First of all, how long does a play in football last? 5-7 seconds. Second of all, how many plays does a kid play in a game 30-70 depending on his rotations and whether you platoon or not.
I think a great way to condition is to incorporate football related drills into practice. For defense you could work on form tackling, alignment and pursuit, and agilities. For offense you could set up a circuit of cones (representing various defenses) and run perfect plays against the cones. So it would be huddle up, call the play, sprint to the line, snap the ball and sprint 7 to ten yards and then huddle up agian. Run the same play against a different front sprint five to seven and round the corner and come back against two more defenses.
Gunslinger, I like your adaptations for the big boys, that is a great idead. I was at a school where we would run a mile for every turnover. Fbdoc, I like your idea of 'increased intervals", that is a great idea. Gunandrun, your quarters idea seems really good, because it has that element of mental toughness to learn how to go hard four quarters.
Another great conditioner like the twelve minute run, is the indian run. If you have a small team, then you can do it with the whole team, if you have a large team then you can do it in groups. Set cones up at the four corners of the field, have the players take off jogging in their group in a single file line, once the line straightens out, then the player in the back has to sprint to the front, once he is to the front, then he jogs with the group and the next last player sprints to the front. This is great, because players have to work together as a team and they are interval training at the same time.
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Post by ajreaper on Aug 12, 2007 9:00:39 GMT -6
I agree with CoachOrr- conditioning should mimic as close as possible what players do in a game. Go hard for 4-5 seconds then rest for 25 or so. I see no value in season for a 12 minute run as it stresses the wrong energy system for football- there is little direct carry over to what a player expereinces on game day.
We condition our lineman by pairing them up and having them drive a wooden sled for 5 seconds then they are "resting" for 25 seconds or so and they repeat that cycle until they've pushed that sled for 6 minutes as a group (in 5 second increments). We started at 5 minutes and will go up 1 minute each week until we are at 12 minutes total (mid season). Our skill guys do something similar- hard for 5 seconds or so "rest" for 25 seconds or so. We also try to be very up tempo in practice to get a conditioning effect as well.
I think for it to be as effective as possible it should mimic what they do in a game.
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Post by coachorr on Aug 12, 2007 9:16:57 GMT -6
Aj, when I was a line coach, I found it to be very effective to use the sled as a conditioner. We were also able to work on different steps and blocks, pad level, and snap counts as well. Early on in the season we drove the sled for 5 seconds and by the end they would drive the sled for 10 seconds. One great thing about this drill is when we where getting ready to play a playoff game indoors we broguht the whole team around the sled and yelled and screamed (to mimic the increased noise level in the dome) and worked on listening to the snap count. I my mind the sled for conditioning was really a tremendous way to increase lineman conditioning. Moreover, it took them out of the running (which they don't do in a game) where they are always last and look like they are not working as hard as everyone else.
The steps we worked on were the following:
On (base block)
Fire (45 degree step to a quarter shade on the bag)
Reach (Whole man of the bag reach his outside pad)
Pull step at 3 and 9 o'clock (line up with your pads perpendicular to the sled pull step right at 3 o'clock left shoulder block and finish with hands down the line) "This is a tremendous drill for teaching lineman to GAP block in a wing-T system and/or to pick up blitzing backers when pulling."
I never did down blocks or trap blocks as the sled seems to go in a crazy direction when doing these "same shoulder" blocks.
Full blocking Sled work has to be done with helmets and shoulder pads. It is too punishing to do in just helmets.
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Post by bulldogoption on Aug 12, 2007 19:50:48 GMT -6
One thing we started doing this year was trying to teach special teams while conditioning. Set up cones for kick cover, punt cover, kick return etc, etc....Then we condition in game length special teams sprints. Teaches something at the same time as conditioning them. We don't like running just for running, we feel that kids are at least learning the basics of something as we condition.
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