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Post by carookie on Mar 23, 2016 11:44:18 GMT -6
Playing Cover 2 man under. A lot of teams use it, but no one does it every snap like some teams will in 7 on 7. The funny thing is I coached for a guy who was complete opposite. All we'd run in 7-on-7 was C3; our alleged base. Come season we would run far more 2 man under (at least twice as much).
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Post by 3rdandlong on Mar 23, 2016 11:49:20 GMT -6
Was once throwing against a team that went exclusively 2-man. They were flat out beating us running this coverage. We'd complete a couple meshes and other man beaters but that was about it.
The rule was that you couldn't run any empty sets and you couldn't run any draws. Oh well, we broke that rule just to prove a point. We motioned the back out and the LB chased him, leaving no one in the box. Our QB took the snap and ran right up the middle. We got penalized for it but that didn't stop me from looking at the opposing DC and yell "I know you wouldn't be running that $hit 7 on 7 defense on a Friday night.
I have to admit that it was not my most professional moment.
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Post by coachcotner on Mar 23, 2016 13:29:15 GMT -6
7 on 7 for learning assignments, spacing, timing good7 on 7 for recruiting and inflate visor heads, bad Exactly. Great tool especially early on in the process
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Post by 60zgo on Mar 23, 2016 13:37:49 GMT -6
Yes. They will play "0" and go double cover people. Well that's BS! Indeed.
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Post by agap on Mar 23, 2016 13:54:43 GMT -6
Playing Cover 2 man under. A lot of teams use it, but no one does it every snap like some teams will in 7 on 7. Maybe I'm in the minority as I happen to like C2 Man Under but I would want my Safeties to play some man coverage bc in season I may raise hell on a blitz so they'll have to cover at some point. I like it too, but do you run Cover 2 Man Under every snap during the season? If not, there's no point in using it every snap during a 7 on 7 league/tournament unless you're only goal is to win and not to get better at your defense.
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Post by silkyice on Mar 23, 2016 15:39:36 GMT -6
Press man also turns into muggings. You will sometimes have kids literally not be able to get off the LOS. Ripped shirts, tackled right there. Don't think I have ever seen a receiever not actually get out in a route in a real game, but it happens all the time in 7 on 7 and those db's and coaches just think they are the bomb when it happens.
Have also seen cover 2 with the LB's and corners at 10 and just waiting to collision with the safeties at 15. Your only choice is to throw short. With it being touch football, that means you get about 5 yards. You have three downs to get 15. Which is stupid by the way. So you have to complete about 6 short passes in a row just so u can get to the 10. It is just bs.
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Post by 60zgo on Mar 23, 2016 16:02:12 GMT -6
Press man also turns into muggings. You will sometimes have kids literally not be able to get off the LOS. Ripped shirts, tackled right there. Don't think I have ever seen a receiever not actually get out in a route in a real game, but it happens all the time in 7 on 7 and those db's and coaches just think they are the bomb when it happens. Have also seen cover 2 with the LB's and corners at 10 and just waiting to collision with the safeties at 15. Your only choice is to throw short. With it being touch football, that means you get about 5 yards. You have three downs to get 15. Which is stupid by the way. So you have to complete about 6 short passes in a row just so u can get to the 10. It is just bs. Those same DC's start screaming when you throw a screen or stalk block just to show them how stupid the whole thing is.
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Post by jg78 on Mar 23, 2016 16:52:08 GMT -6
I like doing 7 on 7 as a team. Part of the reason is because the focus is on getting better instead of winning. The other reason is (being a 3-4 team) we really need eight guys out there to do things exactly as we would do them in a game. When we are practicing, we can allow this for the sake of improvement. Against other teams, we can't and have to make some modifications.
Last year, we opened up with the best passing offense our league has ever seen. We did a lot of 7 on 7 to prepare for them, and it was helpful. Next year, we are dropping a class and will be playing a lot more run heavy, under center teams. The three best teams that we will play out of our region are I, Wing-T and Flexbone. It will suit me fine if we don't play a snap of 7 on 7 this summer.
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Post by carookie on Mar 23, 2016 17:27:15 GMT -6
Press man also turns into muggings. You will sometimes have kids literally not be able to get off the LOS. Ripped shirts, tackled right there. Don't think I have ever seen a receiever not actually get out in a route in a real game, but it happens all the time in 7 on 7 and those db's and coaches just think they are the bomb when it happens. It is just bs. Ive always felt that a fair number of the 7 on 7s are won by the team that simply pushes the envelope on the physicality the most and earliest. You know there is gonna be one team whose got their LBs and Safeties all jacked up to clean clocks and play just beyond what is accepted. In doing so they get a big jump on the opposition; and by the time the other team realizes it and tries to match their physicality, the refs (or whomever is in charge) starts to get it under control. But by then the physical team has gained a leg up. I felt the same about a lot of basketball games when I used to coach it.
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Post by 3rdandlong on Mar 23, 2016 17:55:47 GMT -6
The defense isn't the only culprit. Plenty of offenses love the TE delay in 7 on 7 and then there's my personal favorite, the RB that releases right up the middle through the a gap as if there is no such thing as an offensive line
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Post by jg78 on Mar 23, 2016 18:01:43 GMT -6
The defense isn't the only culprit. Plenty of offenses love the TE delay in 7 on 7 and then there's my personal favorite, the RB that releases right up the middle through the a gap as if there is no such thing as an offensive line Ha! Yeah. And also the QB who takes several steps up in the pocket and releases the ball right at the LOS.
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Post by 3rdandlong on Mar 23, 2016 18:05:32 GMT -6
The defense isn't the only culprit. Plenty of offenses love the TE delay in 7 on 7 and then there's my personal favorite, the RB that releases right up the middle through the a gap as if there is no such thing as an offensive line Ha! Yeah. And also the QB who takes several steps up in the pocket and releases the ball right at the LOS. Very true and then there's the QB that never takes a drop or the offense that releases 5 every single time. I like to have team managers stay by our QB with bags and hit them as they release the ball. Gives them some added pressure
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Post by 44dlcoach on Mar 23, 2016 18:21:34 GMT -6
Played against a team in a 7 on 7 tournament that fit the bill on both sides last year, super physical on defense and 5 in the route every time on O. Lots of RB wheels, etc. they won the tournament and let everybody know.
This will shock a lot of people, that was one of the softest teams in the league in the fall and they went something like 3-7. Only 1 of those defensive guys was actually a physical contact football player and they would hit that RB wheel about once a game and their QB would get hit about 15 times a game. And lots of teams and coaches were pissed off about the way they had conducted themselves at that tournament and made them pay in the fall.
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Post by groundchuck on Mar 23, 2016 18:26:03 GMT -6
We go to one tournament. We get three games and the kids get to gorge themselves at the college cafeteria. They have some fun hanging out together and compete.
We have 2-3 nights in the summer with a couple other teams. We take turns on offense and defense. If the other coach wants to blow a play dead or we want them to run the same play again we do that. It's like a glorified skelly. We have stopped to walk through and talk to our guys about routes. Sometimes....since both teams are seriously heavy running teams when we get to the 1 yard line we will just go back to the 40. I'm not sure what our record at 7on7 is, and it doesn't really matter.
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Post by 44dlcoach on Mar 23, 2016 18:29:41 GMT -6
Yeah we get together with another team and practice together 4 or 5 times in the summer, no score, just like you would in a practice except obviously no script of what the other guys are going to do. That is great work, I love doing that.
We do 1 tourney a year for the last 2 years. We've done ok but the 2 champions have combined for 3 or 4 wins over there last 2 football seasons so we take it for what it's worth.
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Post by silkyice on Mar 23, 2016 18:44:24 GMT -6
We go to one tournament. We get three games and the kids get to gorge themselves at the college cafeteria. They have some fun hanging out together and compete. We have 2-3 nights in the summer with a couple other teams. We take turns on offense and defense. If the other coach wants to blow a play dead or we want them to run the same play again we do that. It's like a glorified skelly. We have stopped to walk through and talk to our guys about routes. Sometimes....since both teams are seriously heavy running teams when we get to the 1 yard line we will just go back to the 40. I'm not sure what our record at 7on7 is, and it doesn't really matter. This is perfect.
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Post by dytmook on Mar 24, 2016 6:22:25 GMT -6
In a serious response we haven't done a tournament in at least 3 years. We do about 3-5 7 on 7's a summer. 1 is usually a 4 way with a few bigger schools so we like to see how we stack up against the big boys. Most of the time we just like to compete a little bit, maybe help out the other team see something specific if it's in our playbook if they need work, and stop to teach if assignments aren't handled properly. I want the ring at the end of the year not a BS trophy in July.
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Post by spreadattack on Mar 24, 2016 6:32:10 GMT -6
Fun stuff, and I'll take real football over 7 on 7 any day (and he's right about how 7 on 7 is in some parts of the country being like AAU basketball), but -- and this is a big but -- is he so sure we won't one day move to a world where what fills up stadiums will be a version of football that looks more like 7 on 7 than traditional football? I'm certainly not saying I hope so, but 7 on 7 is popular without any tradition whatsoever, and with the safety concerns, etc it doesn't seem implausible. (I'm not saying next year, but in like 25-30 years.)
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Post by silkyice on Mar 24, 2016 8:05:08 GMT -6
Fun stuff, and I'll take real football over 7 on 7 any day (and he's right about how 7 on 7 is in some parts of the country being like AAU basketball), but -- and this is a big but -- is he so sure we won't one day move to a world where what fills up stadiums will be a version of football that looks more like 7 on 7 than traditional football? I'm certainly not saying I hope so, but 7 on 7 is popular without any tradition whatsoever, and with the safety concerns, etc it doesn't seem implausible. (I'm not saying next year, but in like 25-30 years.) I really don't think so. I really don't. And if it does happen, there is no way it be as popular as the current NFL.
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Post by fantom on Mar 24, 2016 8:31:20 GMT -6
Fun stuff, and I'll take real football over 7 on 7 any day (and he's right about how 7 on 7 is in some parts of the country being like AAU basketball), but -- and this is a big but -- is he so sure we won't one day move to a world where what fills up stadiums will be a version of football that looks more like 7 on 7 than traditional football? I'm certainly not saying I hope so, but 7 on 7 is popular without any tradition whatsoever, and with the safety concerns, etc it doesn't seem implausible. (I'm not saying next year, but in like 25-30 years.) No. First, nobody goes to watch 7 on 7. Second, it's not really that popular with coaches. For every coach who absolutely love 7 on 7's there re probably 9 who consider them a necessary evil at best. The beauty of football is that a lot of different kinds of kids can play. Big guys who aren't natural run and jump can play real football but have no place in 7 on 7. To hell with it.
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Post by leighty on Mar 24, 2016 8:38:28 GMT -6
Was once throwing against a team that went exclusively 2-man. They were flat out beating us running this coverage. We'd complete a couple meshes and other man beaters but that was about it. The rule was that you couldn't run any empty sets and you couldn't run any draws. Oh well, we broke that rule just to prove a point. We motioned the back out and the LB chased him, leaving no one in the box. Our QB took the snap and ran right up the middle. We got penalized for it but that didn't stop me from looking at the opposing DC and yell "I know you wouldn't be running that $hit 7 on 7 defense on a Friday night. I have to admit that it was not my most professional moment. Experienced an almost identical scenario. Only difference was there was no rule against the empty formation. We come out in empty (which we actually ran), and the defense lines up in man under and doesn't have a defender within 15 yards of the center. After our quarterback ran for 25 yards, the other team's DC starts yapping and he and my head coach start barking at each other. Like you said, it was probably less than professional, but it got a point across and energized our kids.
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Post by silkyice on Mar 24, 2016 9:07:47 GMT -6
Was once throwing against a team that went exclusively 2-man. They were flat out beating us running this coverage. We'd complete a couple meshes and other man beaters but that was about it. The rule was that you couldn't run any empty sets and you couldn't run any draws. Oh well, we broke that rule just to prove a point. We motioned the back out and the LB chased him, leaving no one in the box. Our QB took the snap and ran right up the middle. We got penalized for it but that didn't stop me from looking at the opposing DC and yell "I know you wouldn't be running that $hit 7 on 7 defense on a Friday night. I have to admit that it was not my most professional moment. Experienced an almost identical scenario. Only difference was there was no rule against the empty formation. We come out in empty (which we actually ran), and the defense lines up in man under and doesn't have a defender within 15 yards of the center. After our quarterback ran for 25 yards, the other team's DC starts yapping and he and my head coach start barking at each other. Like you said, it was probably less than professional, but it got a point across and energized our kids. Considering this is the annual 7 on 7 thread, I haven't voiced my rule changes on how to help 7 on 7 in a whole year! LOL Just make running legal and bring out the chains so you only have to pick up 10 yards for a first down. Why not make it as close to real football as possible? I get no blocking and one-hand touch tackle for safety. But all other rules should be observed. Why not? Heck, even include kicking FG's and PAT's. Work those skill guys also and eliminate the unnatural going for it always inside the 10 and the never going for it or kicking outside the 10.
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Post by coachbdud on Mar 24, 2016 9:08:57 GMT -6
i do not love it but i really think 10-20 years from now you will see parts of the country have "7on7" as a team sport in the spring time
your whole league, each team has their own spring 7on7 team, kids play on it you play out your league schedule there is playoffs
some kids might even only play in spring 7on7 and not in the real season because theyre worried about CTE
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Post by 3rdandlong on Mar 24, 2016 9:12:59 GMT -6
i do not love it but i really think 10-20 years from now you will see parts of the country have "7on7" as a team sport in the spring time your whole league, each team has their own spring 7on7 team, kids play on it you play out your league schedule there is playoffs some kids might even only play in spring 7on7 and not in the real season because theyre worried about CTE I think you're right. And the day that happens, is the day I stop coaching.
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Post by silkyice on Mar 24, 2016 9:14:25 GMT -6
i do not love it but i really think 10-20 years from now you will see parts of the country have "7on7" as a team sport in the spring time your whole league, each team has their own spring 7on7 team, kids play on it you play out your league schedule there is playoffs some kids might even only play in spring 7on7 and not in the real season because theyre worried about CTE I think there is some truth to this, but not sure it will be in the Spring. Isn't this already occurring in the summer?
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Post by CoachMikeJudy on Mar 24, 2016 9:14:27 GMT -6
I used to have a problem with 7v7...that was before I REALLY believed in throwing the ball around.
We have a couple of strong old-school wing-t teams in our area. Their 7v7 teams suck, they run partly a junk-offense for the summer league.
Funny thing is, these teams basically only throw 3 step and waggle during the season...but wouldn't you know they are DAMN good at it. They throw backside post off waggle and hit that MF'er EVERY SINGLE TIME. Can't help but think that 7v7 has to help even a little for the run-oriented teams.
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Post by 3rdandlong on Mar 24, 2016 9:16:07 GMT -6
Experienced an almost identical scenario. Only difference was there was no rule against the empty formation. We come out in empty (which we actually ran), and the defense lines up in man under and doesn't have a defender within 15 yards of the center. After our quarterback ran for 25 yards, the other team's DC starts yapping and he and my head coach start barking at each other. Like you said, it was probably less than professional, but it got a point across and energized our kids. Considering this is the annual 7 on 7 thread, I haven't voiced my rule changes on how to help 7 on 7 in a whole year! LOL Just make running legal and bring out the chains so you only have to pick up 10 yards for a first down. Why not make it as close to real football as possible? I get no blocking and one-hand touch tackle for safety. But all other rules should be observed. Why not? Heck, even include kicking FG's and PAT's. Work those skill guys also and eliminate the unnatural going for it always inside the 10 and the never going for it or kicking outside the 10. That would be great, but most of the 7 on 7 games I see are on makeshift fields and there would be no way to add a goalpost to it. And to be perfectly honest, I'm going to defend some of these 7 on 7 tournaments for a bit. Those who do them right, put in a ton of work to organize them such as measuring fields, lining them and providing hashmarks as well as paying for officials, stopwatches, and all of the other stuff. This is particularly true for the actual high school football teams that organize them and I can respect that. It's the all-star tournaments that are only for "exposure" and fattening some pockets that drive me nuts.
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Post by 44dlcoach on Mar 24, 2016 9:18:06 GMT -6
Fun stuff, and I'll take real football over 7 on 7 any day (and he's right about how 7 on 7 is in some parts of the country being like AAU basketball), but -- and this is a big but -- is he so sure we won't one day move to a world where what fills up stadiums will be a version of football that looks more like 7 on 7 than traditional football? I'm certainly not saying I hope so, but 7 on 7 is popular without any tradition whatsoever, and with the safety concerns, etc it doesn't seem implausible. (I'm not saying next year, but in like 25-30 years.) The beauty of football is that a lot of different kinds of kids can play. Big guys who aren't natural run and jump can play real football but have no place in 7 on 7. To hell with it. Wish I could "like" this part of that post 1,000 times.
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Post by silkyice on Mar 24, 2016 9:40:19 GMT -6
with the safety concerns, etc it doesn't seem implausible. (I'm not saying next year, but in like 25-30 years.) I actually think that football will enjoy a re-birth in 25-30 years if it can hold on due actual understanding of the safety issues. I am not denying concussions are real or that CTE is real, but there is a hysteria about them right now. Hysteria passes over time and more importantly today's players will be 60 in 30 years which is a HUGE bonus. Here is why: concussions and CTE from football were at all-time high in the past. Define past however you want, recent past, 5 years ago, 10, 20, 30, 40, 50 years ago - I don't care. It was the past. Concussions and CTE are about to dramatically be better from this day forward. Really I would say since the last 2-3 years. First and main reason is true awareness. People actual follow concussion protocols now. Everyone knows about it. Better rules. Better techniques. Better helmets. Smarter and more aware players and coaches and doctors and trainers, etc. So in 30 years, the people that are currently playing will have even less CTE than the current 60 year olds, and I suspect we will start finding many natural links to CTE and find that tons of things contribute to it, not just football.
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jlab27
Freshmen Member
Posts: 19
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Post by jlab27 on Mar 24, 2016 10:08:18 GMT -6
i do not love it but i really think 10-20 years from now you will see parts of the country have "7on7" as a team sport in the spring time your whole league, each team has their own spring 7on7 team, kids play on it you play out your league schedule there is playoffs some kids might even only play in spring 7on7 and not in the real season because theyre worried about CTE In Florida, we now have the Airo 7v7 organization. This allows us to play "club" 7v7 against any other teams in our league. I believe there is 2 other 3rd party organizations in the state allowing teams to throw in the spring. It's essentially fall baseball for football.
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