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Post by DLine06 on Sept 11, 2005 0:04:46 GMT -6
Coaches, I know that there have been times where you had to get on a kid because he sold out his teammate by letting a defender getting a kill-shot on his QB, or RB... Maybe it was that your player wasn't getting the job done in the classroom.
Have you done something to a player and later on regretted it?
I had a friend from a different school who was on his Varsity football team. He was a backup and his position coach needed a DT. He rushed out there with everything ready and his coach snatched him back and waited a thousand one, a thousand two till another DT came in and went in for him. Due to his team was losing at the time, the player felt that he should keep his composure so that he wouldn't be a distraction for his team even though he felt that he was embarrassed in front of his teammates, his friends and the fans in the stands. Later on his coach apologized to him. His main reason for snatching him is that it was a goal line stand of 4th and inches and he wanted a bigger body (It's ironic because the opposing team scored anyway). The player said that he didn't want to talk right now because he wanted to be calm when he spoke to him. He also feels that it should have not mattered because his coach's D-Line is a group built on strength and great speed and that they have never been bigger than any opposing O-Lineman. They are taught to line up against 300+ pound kids and whip them. Keep this in mind that the player is 6 ft. 220.
This prompted me to start up a conversation about these kinds of situations. Also my friend wanted to know what's your opinion on the situation. He also requests for you to be truthful and keep in mind the pressure the coach was in.
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kakavian
Sophomore Member
Where's the ball, boy? Find the ball.
Posts: 175
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Post by kakavian on Sept 11, 2005 9:59:00 GMT -6
Yep- been there done that. I promised Jason Mixer back in '96 he would be the starter, and when he dropped his first two passes I pulled him. When his replacement didnt do any better, I didnt put Mixer back in, and let the replacement struggle out there.  Something I have regretted as Jason quit the team the next week not because he didnt want to play, but because He couldnt trust me to keep my word. |
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Post by phantom on Sept 11, 2005 19:44:27 GMT -6
Of course I've said and done things that I've regretted but, frankly, none of them resemble this situation. Tell your friend that this is no business for the thin-skinned.
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Post by PowerDown on Sept 12, 2005 5:49:49 GMT -6
The only knock i have on the coach is if he yelled I need a DT and your friend was johnny on the spot. If he wanted billy then he should have called for billy specifically in the first place. In the heat of the moment its tough for everybody, tell your friend not to take it to heart too much. It was one play and he may have showed the coaches in that moment how much he wanted to play which might translate into playing time down the road.
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Post by brophy on Sept 12, 2005 6:50:51 GMT -6
that's tough, but we all make mistakes.
Coach had a decision to make. That decision is not made soley on what is happening (who wants to play) in the past hour or two - his frame of reference is every block of practice for the past several weeks, every off-season attendance, previous game performances, etc...
When the chips are on the line, are you going to go with the "hot hand" or what has worked in the past?
Sometimes there are no "right" or "wrong" answers. Sometimes there is no right answer.
But, yeah, I, myself, have done things in the past I've regretted....but you "can't save them all" (can't appease every kid....some of that is part of growing up).
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Post by DLine06 on Sept 12, 2005 19:53:04 GMT -6
The only knock i have on the coach is if he yelled I need a DT and your friend was johnny on the spot. If he wanted billy then he should have called for billy specifically in the first place. In the heat of the moment its tough for everybody, tell your friend not to take it to heart too much. It was one play and he may have showed the coaches in that moment how much he wanted to play which might translate into playing time down the road. That's one good point. He was a johnny on the spot. His biggest thing also was the trust factor as well. His thought was to hold the position for one play and, he'll be put back on the bench. Personally I felt it was a combo. The coach should of specified a person and yet, the kid should of made sure it was what the coach wanted. There's a problem with society. Communication with interpretation. |
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Post by coacht7 on Jun 19, 2011 18:31:26 GMT -6
I was that kid who ran in threre once. I wasn't getting to play, so the situation came up and figured I had nothing to lose. By the next season i was a starter and a captain. Glad no one grabbed me and pulled me back.
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Post by 19delta on Jun 19, 2011 19:31:05 GMT -6
The only knock i have on the coach is if he yelled I need a DT and your friend was johnny on the spot. If he wanted billy then he should have called for billy specifically in the first place. In the heat of the moment its tough for everybody, tell your friend not to take it to heart too much. It was one play and he may have showed the coaches in that moment how much he wanted to play which might translate into playing time down the road. That's the first thing I thought...coach yells, "I need a guy in there", kid runs out there but coach basically says, "but not you". |
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Post by k on Jun 19, 2011 21:01:38 GMT -6
Does that situation not happen all the time to all coaches?
I say "I need a guard" or "I need a 3 tech" and almost always some little freshman will jump out of no where and say "I can play that."
I love the attitude but I'm not going to let some little freshmen go out and play against the 6'5" 300 pound D1 kid.... I'd rather him have hurt feelings than a hurt spine...
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Post by 19delta on Jun 19, 2011 21:19:33 GMT -6
Does that situation not happen all the time to all coaches? I say "I need a guard" or "I need a 3 tech" and almost always some little freshman will jump out of no where and say "I can play that." I love the attitude but I'm not going to let some little freshmen go out and play against the 6'5" 300 pound D1 kid.... I'd rather him have hurt feelings than a hurt spine... Agreed. But, if that is the case, isn't it incumbent upon the coach to have his sh1t together? I mean...doesn't the guy have a depth chart? |
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Post by k on Jun 19, 2011 21:30:01 GMT -6
I mean...doesn't the guy have a depth chart? For me the situation tends to come up only with scout team or (at the end of JV/Sophomore games) and no we don't have depth charts for other team's offense and defensive positions especially when you remove two offenses or defenses worth of players for our first and second team offenses. |
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Post by 19delta on Jun 19, 2011 21:32:23 GMT -6
I mean...doesn't the guy have a depth chart? For me the situation tends to come up only with scout team and no we don't have depth charts for other team's offense and defensive positions especially when you remove two offenses or defenses worth of players for our first and second team offenses. Scout team...yeah, I can see that. |
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GregH
Freshmen Member
Posts: 60
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Post by GregH on Jun 19, 2011 22:05:18 GMT -6
Can I describe another bad situation and ask how you would handle it? Thirteen or fourteen years ago we had a game suspended by lightning at half time. I asked our players if anyone was going to have a problem with finishing the game the next evening. Nobody raised their hand. Fifteen or twenty minutes before warming up for the game we did a head check for all special teams and realized a player who was on almost every special team was not there. The other players told me he was deer hunting.
This young man was a conscientious player, and we thought highly of him. I didn't know what to think, my first thought was that if he willingly missed a game to go deer hunting, I would have to remove him from the team.
Monday he told me he had hunted with his family in the morning and afternoon with plans to return in time for the team warmup. Just as he was getting ready to leave he shot a deer. This required some time to prepare the deer and take it to a station and show his tag, and etc. I'm not a deer hunter so I don't know what this entails. All of this meant he was going to be late and his mother told him to just spend the night and miss the game.
My thoughts were that he should have left before which time shooting a deer would make him late. I removed him from the team.
His mother wrote some letters to the school. My head principal asked me if he was normally a good kid. I explained that I thought very highly of the young man, but I did not think I could tolerate a player willingly missing a game.
Here is the problem. I still don't know if I made the right decision. I should add that the young man was a senior. What do you think?
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Post by 19delta on Jun 19, 2011 22:23:40 GMT -6
Can I describe another bad situation and ask how you would handle it? Thirteen or fourteen years ago we had a game suspended by lightning at half time. I asked our players if anyone was going to have a problem with finishing the game the next evening. Nobody raised their hand. Fifteen or twenty minutes before warming up for the game we did a head check for all special teams and realized a player who was on almost every special team was not there. The other players told me he was deer hunting. This young man was a conscientious player, and we thought highly of him. I didn't know what to think, my first thought was that if he willingly missed a game to go deer hunting, I would have to remove him from the team. Monday he told me he had hunted with his family in the morning and afternoon with plans to return in time for the team warmup. Just as he was getting ready to leave he shot a deer. This required some time to prepare the deer and take it to a station and show his tag, and etc. I'm not a deer hunter so I don't know what this entails. All of this meant he was going to be late and his mother told him to just spend the night and miss the game. My thoughts were that he should have left before which time shooting a deer would make him late. I removed him from the team. His mother wrote some letters to the school. My head principal asked me if he was normally a good kid. I explained that I thought very highly of the young man, but I did not think I could tolerate a player willingly missing a game. Here is the problem. I still don't know if I made the right decision. I should add that the young man was a senior. What do you think? Kids aren't always predictable...that's what makes them kids. If it was me, I probably wouldn't have kicked the kid off the team (regardless of whether he was a senior) but there would have certainly been a loss of playing time. While the kid can't be blamed for the scenario that required you to finish the game the next day, he certainly had an obligation to inform you that he might be unavailable. At the very least, you would have had 24 hours to move kids around and account for the possibility of him not being there. |
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coachriley
Junior Member
"Tough times don't last; Tough people do."
Posts: 406
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Post by coachriley on Jun 20, 2011 3:00:57 GMT -6
I ran into a similar situation as the player in the OP's post. I was a junior and had only moved up to back-up because the senior above me had missed practice all week. (I was only on the JV all year before this). I had practiced with the varsity in the faint hopes that I may get a chance to get on the field that field Friday night.
Well the guy I was backing up injured his knee and all my teammates knew I was the one to go in. The seniors around started pumping me up and getting me ready and my best friend on the team got me ready too and let me know this was my time. The starter had only been injured for about 10 seconds and I was standing next to our OL coach and told him I was ready to go in. I remember him looking at me, looking away and finding the senior that had missed practice all week.
Obviously I was a bit disappointed and angry at what happened and when that senior got injured I didn't jump to the coaches side like I had before. I still respect that coach and know that in the heat of the game, you make the best decision you can. But luckily I didn't quit and played my next year. So like everyone has said sometimes there is no right answer, just the best decision you can make.
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Post by fantom on Jun 20, 2011 8:59:59 GMT -6
Can I describe another bad situation and ask how you would handle it? Thirteen or fourteen years ago we had a game suspended by lightning at half time. I asked our players if anyone was going to have a problem with finishing the game the next evening. Nobody raised their hand. Fifteen or twenty minutes before warming up for the game we did a head check for all special teams and realized a player who was on almost every special team was not there. The other players told me he was deer hunting. This young man was a conscientious player, and we thought highly of him. I didn't know what to think, my first thought was that if he willingly missed a game to go deer hunting, I would have to remove him from the team. Monday he told me he had hunted with his family in the morning and afternoon with plans to return in time for the team warmup. Just as he was getting ready to leave he shot a deer. This required some time to prepare the deer and take it to a station and show his tag, and etc. I'm not a deer hunter so I don't know what this entails. All of this meant he was going to be late and his mother told him to just spend the night and miss the game. My thoughts were that he should have left before which time shooting a deer would make him late. I removed him from the team. His mother wrote some letters to the school. My head principal asked me if he was normally a good kid. I explained that I thought very highly of the young man, but I did not think I could tolerate a player willingly missing a game. Here is the problem. I still don't know if I made the right decision. I should add that the young man was a senior. What do you think? I wouldn't have thrown him off. There are equal arguments for doing so, though. You made a decision that you thought was best for the team. It's done. If think that you'd do it differently in the future that's all you can't do right now. |
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Post by ajreaper on Jun 20, 2011 12:29:44 GMT -6
Im the 1st situation that was the coach not having a plan- clearly no depth chart and given that it was a goal line defensive situation and the replacement criteria was "size" and not a specific player then its a fair bet whoever went in was not getting a ton of reps in practice prepping him for that situation. Unless there had been at least a couple of injuries during the game that impacted that position there is really no excuse for basically throwing someone out there and certainly it mattered little who got thrown out there.
In the 2nd scenario you had a situation where a player had earned your respect and I presume part of this was due to his commitment and dedication to the program and rather then use the situation as a teachable moment you essentially applied the death sentence and removed him from the team- I find it hard to justify that in any way shape or form given the facts as they were presented.
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osceola
Sophomore Member
Posts: 148
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Post by osceola on Jun 20, 2011 14:09:00 GMT -6
Had a kid who showed up every day and worked hard. Great kid in the classroom and was a great kid overall. His parents came to every game, and it was always a rul to get a kid in for at least one play during the game because this was the freshman level.
Get ino a game where we are getting our butts handed to us. We are down 20-0 and nothing going right. Header is down on the sidelines and is starting to chew our ass for such a poor performance. So the heat is on. I never got this kid in the game because between getting beat and getting chewed out, I didn't want to stick him in. So after getting our asses chewed for sucking as coaches, the next morning I got my ass chewed by his parents for not playing him. The kid deserved to play, and had gotten at least one series all year for me. Felt bad after it happened. I vowed from then on to make sure I got all those backups in during the first half in some sort of way so I wouldn't have to worry later.
Would like to say the kid ended up being much more of a contributor by the end of the year and I even started him last game because of an injury. Everything worked out fine, and I am no longer at the school so no thursday night ass chewings are coming my way this year I hope lol.
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Post by coachmoore42 on Jun 21, 2011 10:56:56 GMT -6
This wasn't during a game, so it wasn't as big of a deal at the time. That said, it was a similar situation that turned out differently to yours, but similar to Coach T's. Honestly, it probably would've been different (or never even happened) in a game.
We were doing offensive group and I had the OL at the time. Midway through the season, a 7th grade kid was absent so I asked for someone to step up and take the spot. None of the kids I wanted to step up had the fire to do it, so a small fiery kid decided he would take it. I thought to myself, fine that'll teach them to be lazy/scared/whatever. I didn't think about this during team and told the first O-line to get in there. He practiced with the first group, so he just went with them. It took me a few plays to realize he was in there, but that meant that he was getting the job done. Long story short, he started on the line that week, every game for the rest of the season, and every game in his 8th grade season.
Gotta love those genius coaching moves...
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Post by ajreaper on Jun 22, 2011 12:20:43 GMT -6
osceola, so the programs head coach was on your sideline during the game and in front of your kids chewing you out? Had that been being it would not have been an issue getting that player into the game in the 2nd half as I'd have not been there unless the HC left when I told him to get the heck off my sideline. That is completely unacceptable behavior on his part.
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osceola
Sophomore Member
Posts: 148
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Post by osceola on Jun 26, 2011 1:32:42 GMT -6
I am not there anymore. He was one of those who fired you every week. He was a great coach, just had no sense when it came to dealing with other coaches. He was one of those that the higher ups on staff didn't get much thrown there way, but he had no problem pulling the pants down of the freshman or middle school staff.
I got a varsity job now, so things are good.
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Post by coachcb on Jun 26, 2011 9:01:07 GMT -6
The coach had a call to make in the middle of a game. Those situatione are stressful and dont lend themselves to watching out for hurt feelings. The athlete wasn't verbally or physically accosted, he just wasn't put in the game. Ive been there as a player and as a coach.
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Post by blb on Jun 26, 2011 9:36:42 GMT -6
Does that situation not happen all the time to all coaches? I say "I need a guard" or "I need a 3 tech" and almost always some little freshman will jump out of no where and say "I can play that." I love the attitude but I'm not going to let some little freshmen go out and play against the 6'5" 300 pound D1 kid.... I'd rather him have hurt feelings than a hurt spine... Agreed. But, if that is the case, isn't it incumbent upon the coach to have his sh1t together? I mean...doesn't the guy have a depth chart? This. And when you make it out, do so with this kind of situation in mind - not who plays the last minute when the game has been decided. Also post it in locker room so kids know their roles beforehand. |
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