|
|
Post by tog on Apr 19, 2007 14:36:57 GMT -6
we run spread with these concepts built in
1. triple option
2. wing t
3. air raid
depending on the talent at hand we move more into one or the other
I never want to just "run my system" and try and force kids that are not real good at something to do it, just because that is all I know. I want to know it all and have that knowledge base as a toolbox to get the kids their best shot to make plays. The secret is building a system that is variable enough and streamlined enough to do this.
I asked a coach once, "what happens when you don't have a prototype TE" and he said, "we just won't be as good"
I thought "BULL"
Move him into a slot and motion him, get him off the line and chip with him, don't ask him to be a true TE, find ways to get your best kids (even if they aren't very good) into the best position to make plays possible.
thoughts?
|
|
|
|
Post by coachmoore42 on Apr 19, 2007 15:24:19 GMT -6
I agree with working with the talent on hand. You may have a system you want to run, but you better have a way within that system to take advantage of your athletes' special gifts. Put them in a position to make some plays. Don't handcuff yourself (and your players) by running the exact same stuff regardless of the personnel.
|
|
|
|
Post by brophy on Apr 19, 2007 15:27:45 GMT -6
some would call this the "art of being multiple". Same Genus, different species. We are a 42 team......our personnel will dictate if we are more of a zone team, blitz team, stunting team, etc.... Different way to utilize (philosophy) the same tool (scheme) I LOVE the comment about the TE, though.  Don't make round balls fit into square pegs |
|
|
|
Post by kboyd on Apr 19, 2007 15:38:43 GMT -6
I adapt to what we have - very rarely do I run the exact same O from year to year. Brophy nailed it with the multiple comment.
|
|
|
|
Post by jhanawa on Apr 19, 2007 15:46:57 GMT -6
Tog, word for word. Amen.
|
|
|
|
Post by groundchuck on Apr 19, 2007 15:57:11 GMT -6
WORD!
|
|
|
|
Post by coachcb on Apr 19, 2007 16:06:58 GMT -6
Gotta be adaptive in your offensive system. There are several teams in the state that just will not adapt to what they've got. One squad is stuck in the flexbone; whether they have the personnel for it or not. A few years back, they out weighed us by an easy 50 pounds a piece up front; HUGE, PHYSICAL OFFENSIVE LINE! But, they tried to veer, pull and trap with this wide bodies all season long; got nothing done on offense. They had a heckuva a WB/TB too; they probably could've done just as well running him from the I formation with the size of their line.
This is why the base of my offense is always easy stuff- screens and quick game. You can teach it to any group of kids and fit everything else in around iit.
|
|
|
|
Post by dubber on Apr 19, 2007 16:25:27 GMT -6
I believe in flexibility within an offensive scheme.
If I like wing-T, but my guys aren't the buck sweep types this year, then I run more jet. I don't sell out on everything and switch to shotgun zone read just because my wb/sb aren't power runners anymore.
If you run a scheme that isn't flexible to your personnel, you'd better make sure the well doesn't run dry. For example, I run the double tight power football because I got hardworking kids and mammoth OL. If all of a sudden my linemen aren't the mammoth type, I'm in trouble IF I can't adapt my scheme.
|
|
|
|
Post by fbdoc on Apr 19, 2007 16:27:26 GMT -6
Am I wrong, or do the spread teams (coaches) have a more flexible philosophy on this issue than the double wingers? The spread coach will say...
Don't have a TE? Put him in the slot.
QB can't throw the rock? Run Option.
The Double Wing coach will say ...
Run Power, Run Super Power, Run Power, Super Power, Iso, Power, Keeper, Trap, Power, Iso...
Am I wrong?
|
|
|
|
Post by jhanawa on Apr 19, 2007 18:25:32 GMT -6
I don't know, but DW guys might argue that the Iso, Trap and Keeper is their form of flexibility...LOL I'll go out on a limb and say this, spread guys generally are more diversified in their approach to offense. Why? IMO, its because the spread has many forms, all of which have evolved from other systems. You won't find many spread guys with only spread as their background, most are from WCO, flexbone, wing T, splitback veer, vertical stretch or power offense backgrounds that have morphed into spread guys. In my case, I played or coached in all of these, so I'm beyond help  ....LOL |
|
|
|
Post by brophy on Apr 19, 2007 18:42:20 GMT -6
Am I wrong, or do the spread teams (coaches) have a more flexible philosophy on this issue than the double wingers? Good God....you may as well have drawn cartoons of Muhammad Why did you mention the name that shall not be named? This thread will jump off the deep end in .....5......4.....3....2..... |
|
|
|
Post by gdf on Apr 19, 2007 18:44:10 GMT -6
I would argue that the DW is flexible enough to take advantage of whatever talent you have. For example, if you have a great throwing qb, you can still run your DW base, plus lots of rollouts, and throw more than a "traditional DW".
If you don't have big, powerful linemen, well, I would argue that the angles & double teams that you can get from the DW would help these guys be successful. If you have a line of studs, then you DW attack will be that much better.
If you have some great WR types you can usually use their talents at either a WB or TE.
Also, there are a number of different plays outside of the core DW that can be used to take advantage of the talent you have. I think that a good coach (in any system) can find ways to best utilize the talent within the system that they run. If they can't, then I would re-evaluate what I'm running.
|
|
|
|
Post by amikell on Apr 19, 2007 18:55:33 GMT -6
brophy, that may just be the funniest thing I have seen this week.
gotta adapt to what you have. that being said if I'm an option guy, i'm just gonna take my best athlete and put him at QB, but if the peg don't fit we need to run some trap and rocket, and some other wing T type stuff.
|
|
|
|
Post by dubber on Apr 19, 2007 19:41:31 GMT -6
Am I wrong, or do the spread teams (coaches) have a more flexible philosophy on this issue than the double wingers? The spread coach will say... Don't have a TE? Put him in the slot. QB can't throw the rock? Run Option. The Double Wing coach will say ... Run Power, Run Super Power, Run Power, Super Power, Iso, Power, Keeper, Trap, Power, Iso... Am I wrong? I would say DW doesn't need to adjust personnel to personnel.......if you want to run the DW, you will have kids to run it.......it is an equalizer offense, fitting the worst of personnel. Now, IMHO, it can smother the abilities of a great athlete, and it is hard to get people in space when you play in a phone booth. However, if it is you personal philosophy, you will have the kids to run it. All you have to have is kids that can listen and try hard. It may not be the best way to utilize your kids, but you'll never look at your team and say "Man, we just don't have the personnel to run the DW this year" In Don Markem's name I pray, Amen |
|
|
|
Post by saintrad on Apr 19, 2007 22:20:18 GMT -6
being a Jr High coach...we deal with and play with what we get every year. Schemes mean llittle to me since teaching the basics and teaching the terminlogy is more important.
|
|
|
|
Post by oldwarrior on Apr 20, 2007 7:18:43 GMT -6
IMO
the JH should be running whatever the high school is
|
|
|
|
Post by optionguy on Apr 20, 2007 9:06:06 GMT -6
IMO the JH should be running whatever the high school is When I coached JH/MS, we did run the HS system, and I was fortunate enough that the HS coached embraced the MS coaches as part of the program and we all discussed together what we should d based on talent and ability. BTW, the HS used a flexible/multi formation system. |
|
|
|
Post by tw on Apr 20, 2007 9:37:13 GMT -6
Great topic. I learned the hard way this past year. Tried to do what we did the previous year and we were horrible. We were, however, very multiple in our base structure and we built around the part of our offense that fit our kids midway through the year. We had a lot of success once we scrapped the bad stuff. To be successful, I believe you have to have a multiple system that you can structure around your kids. Tog is correct in his thinking.
|
|
|
|
Post by chiefscoach on Apr 20, 2007 9:51:03 GMT -6
I'm more of a defensive guy but I think you can adjust using whatever system it doesn't matter what you run. If you are a pro-set I guy then you can run that. If you don't have that typical TE then flex him or trade him often. Decide do I want an extra Tackle or an extra reciever. And then run plays that match your decision. You can pass out of the I you can have a power running game, you can run option, you can still have misdirection. And this doesn't just go for the I formation it goes for all formations and systems. I believe in the 4-3. "Well we just don't get those lineman" shoot, I played with a D-End that weighed 170 lbs, I've had one weigh 160 lbs. If your small stunt more, if your big plug more. I believe in order to build a program you have to try and keep the changes form year to year to a minimum and just be good at putting the kids in a position to succeed within your system. Just my thoughts.
|
|
....LOL 
