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Post by holmesbend on Jun 10, 2014 10:59:14 GMT -6
Here is the short version.
Coach #1- Almost died this winter & found out he had congestive heart failure. The rehab process is going well, but this year he will be out. Longtime supporter of the program (parapro). Had a son who played, but has since continuted to coach even though he graduated. Whether it's helping with the TE/OL or being the master 'linesmen' when painting the field; this is him. He was literally the jack of all trades that all staffs need.
Coach #2- Our athletic director. The school board is FINALLY giving him a much needed raise, which will be matching what he was getting paid from football. He coached our DL and was really our director of football opps if ever such a thing for HS. He will still be taking care of a lot of the dirty work that I don't want to mess with that is above and beyond his AD requirments.
Coach #3- Resigned on Friday. He was (and, might still stay on as this) our Strength guy, LB's and Special Teams. His son is going to be a senior. Essentially, he thinks they need a break (he coaches his son in football, baseball and the weightroom in school).
Coach #4- His son just graduated. He's been coaching for 23 years. He had been thinking about it for a few months apparently (without shedding that light onto me) & resigned yesterday (Monday). He was our RB coach/OC. Another part of the story, he just wasn't on board with some of the things I was wanting to do, so it's probably best we parted ways. No hard feelings.
So, that leaves me with myself and 3 others. The past 4 years we have been practicing the Freshmen separate of the Varsity. Flip flopping days. When the old guys were on offense, the young guys on defense...etc. etc...you know the drill.
Now what? We have about 330 boys in the school, and this year we will have 50-55 boys out 9-12 (40 +/- a couple who will be Freshmen and Sophomores).
Thanks for any and all insight (in particular, on how to still focus on both groups adequately w/out either of them being left out).
One thing I'm considering is for the freshmen not to start until school. Anybody else do that? If nothing else, those first three weeks will all be focused on the "older kids".
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Post by coach2013 on Jun 10, 2014 11:14:57 GMT -6
Been there and done that my friend. about 300 males also
Coach 1- offensive line and tightends- inside linebackers- head coach
Coach 2- assistant offensive line and tightends- outside linebackers- head jv coach
Coach 3- receivers and defensive backs- varsity dc
Coach 4- backfield assistant/defensive line coach/scout team defense- jv dc
We sent one coach to frosh away games and we all went to the home frosh games.
we had frosh coached by all of us from day one. they only practiced alone on Wednesdays.
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Post by coachorm on Jun 10, 2014 11:19:29 GMT -6
Coach, I don't see a problem other than a higher pupil to coach ratio. This is every year where I coach. We have myself, the HC, and two volunteer coaches. One of the volunteers is a construction worker and will sometimes be late cause he has to finish a project. Never know when this will happen. The other is only there on Tuesdays and Wednesdays. We usually have between 35-45 boys out 9-12. We just practice everyone together.
I agree it is harder to do when you go from a large number of coaches to a small number but its not impossible.
One thing we do is split the week up during season.
Monday - film, defense formation recognition, offense install wrinkles and cover opponent base defense, special teams heavy focue.
Tuesday - defense all day
Wednesday - offense all day
Thursday - walk-thru
Friday - play
Mondays occasionally will be a JV game. On those Mondays the JV still practices but we usually give them some time to eat something and time to go over things with them.
Hope this helps.
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Post by holmesbend on Jun 10, 2014 11:35:17 GMT -6
Been there and done that my friend. about 300 males also Coach 1- offensive line and tightends- inside linebackers- head coach Coach 2- assistant offensive line and tightends- outside linebackers- head jv coach Coach 3- receivers and defensive backs- varsity dc Coach 4- backfield assistant/defensive line coach/scout team defense- jv dc We sent one coach to frosh away games and we all went to the home frosh games. we had frosh coached by all of us from day one. they only practiced alone on Wednesdays. Love it. Perfect. This sounds exactly like what I was thinking. I just needed somebody to lay it out for me  . You said it about the freshmen. I want them to continue to be coached by us. Do you bring them in with the older guys or later? When they practice alone on wednesdays, how does things work out? |
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Post by holmesbend on Jun 10, 2014 11:38:16 GMT -6
Coach, I don't see a problem other than a higher pupil to coach ratio. This is every year where I coach. We have myself, the HC, and two volunteer coaches. One of the volunteers is a construction worker and will sometimes be late cause he has to finish a project. Never know when this will happen. The other is only there on Tuesdays and Wednesdays. We usually have between 35-45 boys out 9-12. We just practice everyone together. I agree it is harder to do when you go from a large number of coaches to a small number but its not impossible. One thing we do is split the week up during season. Monday - film, defense formation recognition, offense install wrinkles and cover opponent base defense, special teams heavy focue. Tuesday - defense all day Wednesday - offense all day Thursday - walk-thru Friday - play Mondays occasionally will be a JV game. On those Mondays the JV still practices but we usually give them some time to eat something and time to go over things with them. Hope this helps. Yep. The higher ratio is the concern and making sure they are all moving/repping like we have had going on the last few years. Any issues there? |
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Post by carookie on Jun 10, 2014 11:47:41 GMT -6
How many total players do you have in your program?
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Post by holmesbend on Jun 10, 2014 11:53:23 GMT -6
9-12 50-55
40+ of those this year will likely be all 9th/10th.
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Post by carookie on Jun 10, 2014 12:23:39 GMT -6
Im at a smaller school now (40-50 all told in the program) where we practice everyone together. Its doable, but I think there are advantages to having a separate practice for frosh/jv; particularly fundamental development. I think too often at the V level we focus on scheme as opposed to basics. If you have your 9th graders lose practice time for that their development could be stunted.
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Post by emptybackfield on Jun 10, 2014 12:31:58 GMT -6
Is your administration not going to let you fill those positions?
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Post by holmesbend on Jun 10, 2014 13:22:05 GMT -6
Is your administration not going to let you fill those positions? They are. Problem is. They are all teachers as well, well, 3 of the 4 are. Truth be told, I'm just having a heck of a time finding people. I'm going to give the three other guys a good bump in pay (take from what the other four were getting). I SHOULD end up with a total of 5 (iincluding myself). Possibly 6 of us total, too. But I'm planning for all possibilities with it being this late in the game. |
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Post by freezeoption on Jun 10, 2014 13:40:43 GMT -6
We coop with two other schools. One school was going to supply me with 2 coaches. One of the coaches quit and took a job somewhere else, I am hoping they can fill that teacher spot with a coach, but I am not planning on it. The other school gives us one coach, not a coach but he has done alright so far. I have a asst from my school. We will have the 7-12 practice together. Will split when we go team at the very end, but we can do indy, group, etc together. We will have about 40 to 50 out 7-12.
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Post by coach2013 on Jun 10, 2014 13:51:27 GMT -6
I actually have 5 coaches now for 52 kids and have to coach three teams with 5 coaches.
Still working it out.
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Post by emptybackfield on Jun 10, 2014 13:53:41 GMT -6
Is your administration not going to let you fill those positions? They are. Problem is. They are all teachers as well, well, 3 of the 4 are. Truth be told, I'm just having a heck of a time finding people. I'm going to give the three other guys a good bump in pay (take from what the other four were getting). I SHOULD end up with a total of 5 (iincluding myself). Possibly 6 of us total, too. But I'm planning for all possibilities with it being this late in the game. Well, that's nice you're able to at least divide the extra money how you see fit and reward those guys for their increased workload. In our district, the head coach doesn't have the freedom to do that. The school just takes the extra stipend money and commits it to other things. |
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Post by coachorm on Jun 10, 2014 16:13:59 GMT -6
Coach, I don't see a problem other than a higher pupil to coach ratio. This is every year where I coach. We have myself, the HC, and two volunteer coaches. One of the volunteers is a construction worker and will sometimes be late cause he has to finish a project. Never know when this will happen. The other is only there on Tuesdays and Wednesdays. We usually have between 35-45 boys out 9-12. We just practice everyone together. I agree it is harder to do when you go from a large number of coaches to a small number but its not impossible. One thing we do is split the week up during season. Monday - film, defense formation recognition, offense install wrinkles and cover opponent base defense, special teams heavy focue. Tuesday - defense all day Wednesday - offense all day Thursday - walk-thru Friday - play Mondays occasionally will be a JV game. On those Mondays the JV still practices but we usually give them some time to eat something and time to go over things with them. Hope this helps. Yep. The higher ratio is the concern and making sure they are all moving/repping like we have had going on the last few years. Any issues there? Yeah coach I am sure you will definitely lose some of the reps just because your groups have to be bigger now and you don't have as many eyes watching. However, what we have done is we really put a lot of focus on the fundamentals of the game. We still have halfline, team, skelly, etc... but we try to really make sure we work individual as much as we can. I think another thing we do well is on offense day when I am doing halfline and team stuff the DC works with the scout defense and really motivates them and coaches up their technique. I do the same for him on defense day. Mind you we still have to look at our position group as well but thats just the life of having a small staff. Definitely a tough situation but I feel you can still accomplish what you need with whats there.
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Post by holmesbend on Jun 11, 2014 7:48:28 GMT -6
They are. Problem is. They are all teachers as well, well, 3 of the 4 are. Truth be told, I'm just having a heck of a time finding people. I'm going to give the three other guys a good bump in pay (take from what the other four were getting). I SHOULD end up with a total of 5 (iincluding myself). Possibly 6 of us total, too. But I'm planning for all possibilities with it being this late in the game. Well, that's nice you're able to at least divide the extra money how you see fit and reward those guys for their increased workload. In our district, the head coach doesn't have the freedom to do that. The school just takes the extra stipend money and commits it to other things. Yeah, we are pretty fortunate when it comes to a lot of things for being so rural. It also helps being within an hour of the Louisville metro area here in KY, so we pay pretty well (if not, everybody would just make a short drive to places that do lol). Other than how talent/numbers cycle pretty drastically, it's a great place. |
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Post by IronmanFootball on Jun 11, 2014 16:59:36 GMT -6
Is your administration not going to let you fill those positions? They are. Problem is. They are all teachers as well, well, 3 of the 4 are. Truth be told, I'm just having a heck of a time finding people. I'm going to give the three other guys a good bump in pay (take from what the other four were getting). I SHOULD end up with a total of 5 (iincluding myself). Possibly 6 of us total, too. But I'm planning for all possibilities with it being this late in the game. Any former players hanging around attending the local college that you'd trust? I have one on my staff, he gets exponentially better every season. From a part-time GA to a full-time coach. He's going to have a lot of responsibility this season. I'm grooming him to take over the kicking game. Coaches RB/DL which is what he played for us 3 years ago. There's 1 kid left on the roster that he played with. |
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Post by IronmanFootball on Jun 11, 2014 17:01:19 GMT -6
I actually have 5 coaches now for 52 kids and have to coach three teams with 5 coaches. Still working it out. That sounds brutal. How many kids do you have at each level? We have 35 on varsity, if we could get a middle school team cleared we'd have 55-60 in the program. Just wondering how you fill 3 levels. |
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Post by macdiiddy on Jun 11, 2014 20:31:37 GMT -6
The one thing we do when we the frosh are with us, we make sure they only go against sophomores in live drills. Dont want to run off a kid, or get one hurt because a senior wanted to tee off on bambi.
Just be cognisant of players abilities when you have 14-18 year olds practicing together.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 12, 2014 7:46:01 GMT -6
I would really focus energy on finding some more help right now and then figuring out how to organize staff.
The former player idea above is good. Really search the area for possibilities. Even if they do not know a lot of football you can teach them enough to position coach, help run practice, etc if they are willing and loyal.
Any area coaches resign, get let go, or get caught up in transitions at other schools lately? They are excellent candidates also.
College students from the area?
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Post by holmesbend on Jun 14, 2014 21:02:51 GMT -6
I would really focus energy on finding some more help right now and then figuring out how to organize staff. The former player idea above is good. Really search the area for possibilities. Even if they do not know a lot of football you can teach them enough to position coach, help run practice, etc if they are willing and loyal. Any area coaches resign, get let go, or get caught up in transitions at other schools lately? They are excellent candidates also. College students from the area? There are a few hanging around here who are going to the area community college, the top choices in that area are all still playing college. Ha! About right. I THINK we are going to have a couple openings here within the next couple days in the building, and we are fortunate to have a sports minded principal. He didn't play football, but coached basketball, softball and golf...He also doubles up as our region chief of basketball officials, close to my age etc. You made great points and all things I'm going to look at. As far as the former coaches in the area, I am blessed to have my grandaddy coming over here in June and July...He was a HC in the state for 33 years...19 of that here at two local schools where he was able to win a couple of his state championships. He is 75 now, and isn't able to do as much, but he is going to do all he can (probably goes w/out saying that I lean on him a great deal as is for insight...but, this is the first time we will have been able to work side by side for any amount of time). ....I'm just worried it's going to be us four (myself included), and how to go about things come Aug-November if that is the case. |
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Post by holmesbend on Jun 14, 2014 21:09:14 GMT -6
Does anybody not have their freshmen come out until the start of school? Or at the least...2-3 weeks after the actual start date of practice?
That's one of the things I'm now considering. Our start date in KY is July 15 (opening week is that 3rd weekend of August). So, I'm thinking about not telling our frosh to come out until that 1st week of August (which happens to be the 1st week of school)....Divide and conquer a bit. I mean, it will give them almost 4 full weeks of practice before their first game, and also allowing us coaches to focus on our Varsity/10-12 guys (we will have around 50 9-12 this year & 27-30 will be 10th-12th).
Thoughts there??
I want to thank everybody for the feedback already. There are a ton more threads on here more interesting, so taking a few mins to shed some light on this issue really means a lot. Thanks guys.
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Post by coach2013 on Jun 15, 2014 3:43:27 GMT -6
We want the frosh with us from day one.
I think we retain more of them if they jump right into the big boy program.
Our frosh teams have been strong since we started doing things this way. They have no fear of other frosh teams, that much is clear.
The biggest drawback is that we sometimes have to find ways to occupy them when we are doing varsity things, but hey, you cant get enough tackling or sled work in for freshmen.
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Post by coach2013 on Jun 15, 2014 3:52:28 GMT -6
I actually have 5 coaches now for 52 kids and have to coach three teams with 5 coaches. Still working it out. That sounds brutal. How many kids do you have at each level? We have 35 on varsity, if we could get a middle school team cleared we'd have 55-60 in the program. Just wondering how you fill 3 levels. We swing varsity/jv kids. It is brutal. Its brutal on the coaches and the kids. I personally coach 3 games a week sometimes.
The frosh roster sometimes gets so thin that we have to make a couple of phone calls and get permission to play a soph or three down on the frosh level. We had one game last year where we had 12 freshmen and 4 sophs dressed for an away frosh game.
I was willing to cut the frosh program and mesh them into jv, but sometimes other schools have issues fielding JV and cancel games at the last minute, then our frosh suffer for it. Our admin also does not like the idea of cutting frosh.
What we usually have is under 20 frosh and around 15 varsity bodies, 20 jv bodies. Jv is just made up of 10th-11th graders that are not two way starters for varsity.
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Post by blb on Jun 15, 2014 6:18:23 GMT -6
Right now we have four coaches for six paid positions. 58 kids signed up 9-12.
Have not had a Freshman team (Varsity and JV only) since 2011 due to numbers.
Our two Varsity assistants are former youth coaches, basically "daddy coaches." Our head JV coach is MS teacher. Last year he talked his brother (former player) into assisting him but he's not coming back due to school and work.
We have an entire staff in district not coaching because pay is so low, they started families, took other jobs.
I have been fighting this fight for two years with administration. All I get is "You're right, stipends should be higher, but it's negotiated between BOE and union."
I have posted jobs (no teaching available) with our state association and in local newspaper, called head coach at D-II university in county to see if he had any former players interested.
I am NOT going to practice JVs with Varsity because they're not ready and not going to take preparation time away from Varsity.
I am not going to ask or delegate one of varsity assistants to go "down" because they were hired to coach Varsity, we need three Varsity coaches, and Sub-Varsity pays less.
So if we can't find somebody in next two months we'll have one JV coach with around 30 kids.
Maybe then administration will do something about situation. But I doubt it. |
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Post by coach2013 on Jun 15, 2014 6:56:21 GMT -6
I coached for a team that had one coach for JVS. Jv practice was lots of team and scrimmage after extensive blocking and tackling and conditioning. they worked hard to make football players out of chicken#$%^ but the varsity was quite successful every year with 4 coaches.
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Post by holmesbend on Jun 15, 2014 7:26:33 GMT -6
^^^^2013, I totally agree. We usually throw them right in with us (while seperate), and go with it. Old guys w/ offense, young on D..next day flip flop.
If these numbers don't change, though with our coaches, I'm thinking what BLB does.
We will have a freshman team, they'll be almost 50% of our roster (23-25 probably).
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Post by blb on Jun 15, 2014 7:50:41 GMT -6
BTW our first game is Thursday before Labor Day (school starts day after).
We do not let Freshmen (or anybody else) come out then. Tried it once, was not worth it at all.
Last year school in our section of state, enrollment 558, had 20-25 kids 9-12 attend camp in June. Looked like they'd have to drop Varsity.
Long story short (after replacing head coach) they had about 15 Varsity kids (11-12th graders) and like five Sophomores, 20 Freshmen come out. Don't know how many coaches.
When they played another school that had a Freshman team, Freshmen played by themselves and Sophomores played Varsity that week. When opponent had JV team, Sophomores combined with Freshmen to play, Varsity had to make do.
Varsity went 1-8, other than that haven't heard how it worked out for them.
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