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Post by coachcobbs on Feb 11, 2014 11:26:03 GMT -6
I have always herd what makes Bill Belichick so successful is his ability to coach his coaches. I am wondering what you guys do to coach your coaches or what your head coaches do to help you be more successful. I have a lot of younger JV coaches this year and am looking for ways to help bring them along. Thanks for your input.
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Post by shocktroop34 on Feb 11, 2014 13:09:35 GMT -6
One of the main things that I did was to have a conversation with the coaches individually. Usually in post season evaluations (but it could also happen in random conversation). I wanted to find out what they wanted to improve on. Give them ownership of their own improvement. Very similar to how we might operate with a player. After I was able to obtain that information, I would find resources to help them achieve that particular goal. I would always have my own input, but usually there was a mutual understanding from both parties.
If it was on the field (scheme, technique, etc.) or off the field (rapport building, positive communication, whatever), I made it my purpose to support that cause as long as it worked toward the improvement of the program. I always searched for articles, clinic notes, videos, books, or whatever I could find to assist.
With younger assistants, I would establish a few clear and measurable objectives and hold them accountable for it. This can be the difficult part and, in my opinion, a trait that separates a good HC from the pack. Communication of this aspect is very important. We all know that coaches have a certain level of ego. However, any good coach will accept the challenge and allow the HC to "help him" reach the goals that he indicated he would like to achieve. EVERY coach needs goals, or they and their coaching will get stale.
It is especially difficult when you have coaches that are older or have been coaching a lot longer. Younger HC's have to be very clear with their communication, "okay coach, these are the three things you want to work on? Anything else? Ok cool. Just so we're clear, if I see something, you trust my judgment and it's okay to mention something to you? Ok, cool." From a psychological standpoint, it puts a thought in the mind of the assistant that he's not above being approached about something. In some cases, it might even be advised to reveal a few things you (the HC) would like to work on to show your own willingness to improve. The "reciprocal relationship" for younger coaches can sometimes ease the tension. But it is vital for the younger HC to never loose his position of authority among the staff. On that basis, I speak from experience.
In short, it's difficult to coach guys (grown men) on things they don't want to be coached on. In some cases, you have to make some concessions or compromises without forfeiting the things you feel are vital. I would use the same format for younger guys. Have them reflect and search out the areas they want to improve in, give your own input, establish some measurable objectives, provide resources, implement some strategies, and help them get there.
Younger guys will need room to grow. Mistakes will happen. Just remember, regular communication on the objectives is the key.
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Post by fantom on Feb 11, 2014 13:18:58 GMT -6
I have always herd what makes Bill Belichick so successful is his ability to coach his coaches. I am wondering what you guys do to coach your coaches or what your head coaches do to help you be more successful. I have a lot of younger JV coaches this year and am looking for ways to help bring them along. Thanks for your input. I'm always surprised how many programs treat lower level teams as though they're autonomous programs. I think that one of the best thing that you can do is to make sure that the offensive and defensive schemes are the same program-wide (diluted for lower levels, of course) and coach up the lower level coaches on the schemes.
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Post by coachplaa on Feb 11, 2014 14:59:23 GMT -6
I totally agree with same scheme at all three levels. It takes hiring the right people that are loyal to the goals of the program. I've seen some football programs in our area that run totally different schemes at each level, and those are the programs that historically struggle every year.
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Post by coachplaa on Feb 11, 2014 15:00:43 GMT -6
I also think "coaching your coaches" is very key. I don't so much do that as much as I try to communicate my expectations as much as possible. Communication gets the staff pulling the rope in the same direction, and its the Head Coach's responsibility to keep those goals clear and understood by the entire staff.
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Post by coachphillip on Feb 11, 2014 15:07:20 GMT -6
Similar to what fantom said about programs that treat teams as autonomous entities, I've seen too many HC's treat each level's staff as an autonomous entity. If a HC has a problem with anything he sees, both he and his assistants need to be comfortable addressing it. On this board, we like using the phrase "You see it, you coach it." That's true for all your levels. So, if you're the varsity HC and your freshmen aren't tackling properly, it is your responsibility to approach your freshmen coaches and figure out what the heck is going on. You have to actually coach your coaches.
I guess what I'm saying is, the best thing a varsity HC can do to help his lower level staff is to clearly express his vested interest in the team and have a clear line of communication with them. I've seen too many varsity guys talk crap about the JV guys they're supposed to be helping and then getting mad when their junior LBs can't read, drop, run, or tackle.
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Post by coachbdud on Feb 11, 2014 15:22:07 GMT -6
I tried doing my own in house coaches clinic last spring
I was here all day... Made power points Showed drills Went through everything from how to teach it How to drill it Game planning and calling plays
But it was largely a waste Many guys think they know it all and don't want to change Or think this is how we used to do it so that's what is right
It's frustrating because we struggle to get coaches , but many of the ones we have I seriously question if we'd be better off without them
I'm almost ready to stagger offensive practice time so I am there for all our lower levels offensive practice time and I can run their drills and coach them
I think our biggest problem as a program is the lack of quality instruction in our lower levels... Typical too much team, not enough individuals ... Or If it's Indy time drills that are not aligned with what I teach
Overall I'm just highly frustrated Sorry Rant over
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souza12
Sophomore Member
Posts: 179
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Post by souza12 on Feb 12, 2014 0:45:15 GMT -6
I tried doing my own in house coaches clinic last spring I was here all day... Made power points Showed drills Went through everything from how to teach it How to drill it Game planning and calling plays But it was largely a waste Many guys think they know it all and don't want to change Or think this is how we used to do it so that's what is right It's frustrating because we struggle to get coaches , but many of the ones we have I seriously question if we'd be better off without them I'm almost ready to stagger offensive practice time so I am there for all our lower levels offensive practice time and I can run their drills and coach them I think our biggest problem as a program is the lack of quality instruction in our lower levels... Typical too much team, not enough individuals ... Or If it's Indy time drills that are not aligned with what I teach Overall I'm just highly frustrated Sorry Rant over Are varsity position coaches taking ownership of that position on the lower level?
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Post by coachcb on Feb 12, 2014 19:18:14 GMT -6
First and foremost, I explained to the guys I hired that I expected them to be professionals. I gave them a list of responsibilities and skills that needed to be taught. I broke down the skills for them, coached then up but it was on them after that. They were always free to ask questions and I was always ready to help but it's their responsibility to coach their position.
Each coach started out with those set responsibilities and I would add or take away from them as I saw fit. I stripped a QB coach of his responsibilities almost completely because he couldn't do the job. He ended up being our "hand-offs" coach because that was the only thing he didnt screw up. He was coached, he was taught the position, the drills and the cues but he refused to develop an eye for detail.
I had another guy that never played the game yet picked up so much, so fast that I made him the DC in my place. He was smart, cool headed and paid attention. He started out as my DL coach and ended up coordinating.
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Post by coachplaa on Feb 12, 2014 22:49:06 GMT -6
Attachment DeletedI give this to all coaches every year, and review it with my new coaches when I agree to bring them on. Its a good starting point.
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Post by mariner42 on Feb 13, 2014 0:56:25 GMT -6
I totally agree with same scheme at all three levels. It takes hiring the right people that are loyal to the goals of the program. I've seen some football programs in our area that run totally different schemes at each level, and those are the programs that historically struggle every year. I was new to this program this year and the then-JV DC somehow thought that it wasn't a big deal to not run the varsity's defense because he didn't agree with it. I was dumbfounded. The first thing I did when he was demoted and I was put into his position was to call the varsity DC and ask him to sit down with me so I can do as much as I can to create vertical continuity within the program. I like a lot of the suggestions that are made here, but I'll just throw out something in the other direction from my own experience: Some guys won't change no matter what you want. Some guys need to be cut loose for one reason or another and you can't shy away from doing so. Hopefully you get the change you need/want, but if you don't and you've made yourself clear about what's expected and what's at stake, cut 'em loose and move on. No one is above the program. You can find a way to do without a coach, you can't find a way to live with cancer. Just offering another perspective, I think shocktroop34 did a great job responding.
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Post by coachbdud on Feb 13, 2014 10:05:53 GMT -6
I totally agree with same scheme at all three levels. It takes hiring the right people that are loyal to the goals of the program. I've seen some football programs in our area that run totally different schemes at each level, and those are the programs that historically struggle every year. I was new to this program this year and the then-JV DC somehow thought that it wasn't a big deal to not run the varsity's defense because he didn't agree with it. I was dumbfounded. The first thing I did when he was demoted and I was put into his position was to call the varsity DC and ask him to sit down with me so I can do as much as I can to create vertical continuity within the program. I like a lot of the suggestions that are made here, but I'll just throw out something in the other direction from my own experience: Some guys won't change no matter what you want. Some guys need to be cut loose for one reason or another and you can't shy away from doing so. Hopefully you get the change you need/want, but if you don't and you've made yourself clear about what's expected and what's at stake, cut 'em loose and move on. No one is above the program. You can find a way to do without a coach, you can't find a way to live with cancer. Just offering another perspective, I think shocktroop34 did a great job responding. the biggest point you made was VERTICAL CONTINUITY seems the majority of our lower levels A. know more than us at the varsity level B. don't care about vertical continuity C. they are all chasing that elusive freshman/JV championship ring
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Post by coachphillip on Feb 13, 2014 10:09:00 GMT -6
You're right. Everyone's job in the program is to help the varsity succeed. Vertical continuity is huge. I coached a lot of juniors who were great at running toss ... Too bad we were a Triple team.
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Post by dhooper on Feb 13, 2014 10:24:59 GMT -6
dcohio Nice post you ever need a job look me up. I could sure use coaches like with that attitude.
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Post by dhooper on Feb 13, 2014 10:56:32 GMT -6
Coaches with your attitude guess I need to prove read before I submit
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hawk18
Freshmen Member
Posts: 76
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Post by hawk18 on Feb 13, 2014 12:33:49 GMT -6
I give this to all coaches every year, and review it with my new coaches when I agree to bring them on. Its a good starting point. Thanks for posting that info. coach. As usual, very helpful stuff.
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Post by irishdog on Feb 13, 2014 12:37:25 GMT -6
Actually, most of this topic can be avoided if the head coach does his due diligence during the interview process. A meaningful interview with a prospective assistant coach, or lower level coach will give him the impression that you consider the position important, and his place in the overall scheme of things will be viewed critically by you. If you're just trying to get the job filled, you'll end up getting jobbed by the filler.
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Post by fballcoachg on Feb 13, 2014 12:50:36 GMT -6
I just had this convo with the HC the other day at the clinic. He wants every defensive coach to know the defense like I know it. BUT the reality is, they don't want to know it like that. They are happy in their own world coaching their positions. If they wanted to know I would teach them but everytime I've tried, they say "How do we need the DE's to play? That's all I need to know." And there is nothing wrong with those guys, probably functions better with a few "cogs" as long as they work. I erased it but when I'm HC at Sister Catherine's Girls of the Poor I'm going to remember the "More on field responsibility, less off the field responsibility" philosophy. I think that would be huge, may create resentment from some of the other guys but if they aren't in to splitting up coaching responsibilities than that should be the trade off.
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Post by coachphillip on Feb 13, 2014 13:17:17 GMT -6
I never thought about that but it's 100% true. Nothing ticks me off more than spending all weekend breaking down film, drawing up scout cards, making our kids' scouting reports, setting up playlists for film study, drawing up schedules, etc. and then being asked to help with equipment, filling water bottles, etc. Meanwhile, slappy 1 and slappy 2 waltz in five minutes before practice. That is a great thing to keep in mind.
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Post by shocktroop34 on Feb 13, 2014 13:34:53 GMT -6
It's like the old saying goes, "everyone wants to harvest, but no one wants to plow."
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Post by coachphillip on Feb 13, 2014 13:46:46 GMT -6
My old OL coach used to say "Everybody wants to go to heaven but ain't nobody lining up to die."
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Post by shocktroop34 on Feb 13, 2014 14:04:20 GMT -6
I totally agree with same scheme at all three levels. It takes hiring the right people that are loyal to the goals of the program. I've seen some football programs in our area that run totally different schemes at each level, and those are the programs that historically struggle every year. I was new to this program this year and the then-JV DC somehow thought that it wasn't a big deal to not run the varsity's defense because he didn't agree with it. I was dumbfounded. The first thing I did when he was demoted and I was put into his position was to call the varsity DC and ask him to sit down with me so I can do as much as I can to create vertical continuity within the program. I like a lot of the suggestions that are made here, but I'll just throw out something in the other direction from my own experience: Some guys won't change no matter what you want. Some guys need to be cut loose for one reason or another and you can't shy away from doing so. Hopefully you get the change you need/want, but if you don't and you've made yourself clear about what's expected and what's at stake, cut 'em loose and move on. No one is above the program. You can find a way to do without a coach, you can't find a way to live with cancer. Just offering another perspective, I think shocktroop34 did a great job responding. I really like the phrase "vertical continuity." In education we call it vertical teaming. Same concept. I also appreciate that you brought up an uncomfortable part of coaching, which is knowing when it's time to cut someone loose. Without straying too much from the OP, I experienced a lack of continuity in my first couple years as HC. I was in a smaller community with very few quality coaches. In short, I had a program with little to no vertical continuity. When I took a new job, I promised myself that I would never allow that to happen again. It wasn't fair to the kids for me to bring them less than the best. I would tell the kids that often. When my staff looked like a skeleton crew, kids would ask if anyone else is coming in to help. I would assure them that when I found a person I felt was worthy of being around them, I would hire that person. I likened it to a divorced parent being very careful about bringing people they dated around their children. I have unfortunately fired numerous coaches over the years. Most of them were mutual agreements. They left knowing that they didn't fulfill the requirements that we discussed upon being hired. As I look back, it was rarely ever the younger coaches I let go (only one I can remember), but the older ones who simply couldn't adjust or conform to the expectations required.
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Post by fballcoachg on Feb 13, 2014 15:45:37 GMT -6
And there is nothing wrong with those guys, probably functions better with a few "cogs" as long as they work. I erased it but when I'm HC at Sister Catherine's Girls of the Poor I'm going to remember the "More on field responsibility, less off the field responsibility" philosophy. I think that would be huge, may create resentment from some of the other guys but if they aren't in to splitting up coaching responsibilities than that should be the trade off. To me it's just like teaching. I don't want to be a Principal or Superintendent. I'm happy being an assistant coach (math teacher). I don't want to be the department chair either. I don't care how it all works, I don't want to sit in all those meetings...heck, I need a full iphone battery to get through most teacher's meetings now. I'd need to plug my phone in for a curriculum meeting or a budgeting meeting. I'm happy being a cog in the wheel. I'm a good indian, I don't want to be the chief. What math am I teaching? What room am I teaching it in? That is really all I want/need to know. Shocktroop - I'd rather plow any day than harvest. Any country boys in here? Ever had the combine jam up and you have to crawl up in there and clear it? PHUK THAT. Put me on a tractor turning dirt all day everyday. But I know what you're saying. dhooper - where were you last winter? I was looking for a job. And don't worry about spelling. I teach maff, I don't reed gud anyways. Ha I'm in the country now, first time in my life (I thought BGSU was country before I got here) and I was trying to explain something to my students, I couldn't think of what the combine was called and dropped "you know what I'm talking about, the corn mower." These kids about died out here. That's what I'm saying as well, you can't run a good operation without some cats that just want to play their role. I think that's a big part of "coaching the coaches," someone else already said it but figure out where everyone fits. In theory I get why some would want everyone to be versed in the whole operation however in practice, doesn't quite work and isn't anywhere near necessary.
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Post by fballcoachg on Feb 13, 2014 20:24:33 GMT -6
Just a city boy trying to learn the way man!
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Post by coachbdud on Feb 13, 2014 21:25:23 GMT -6
You mean you country folk rip the corn out of the ground with the big testing event the NFL does for all college players going in to the draft ?
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Post by footballscout on Feb 13, 2014 21:54:49 GMT -6
Coaches coaching their coaches,
I'm the young guy on staff currently attempting to be coached up. The guy being coached up I like to think.
This weekend's assignment is studying our past seasons run game and breaking it down. What worked well, why did it, what didn't work well, why didn't it? Being assigned things like this to do defensively really helped me a lot, and now I'm being asked to do similar things with the offense. Really get the sense that the point of this run game assignment is to coach me up. Which I take on with excitement.
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Post by coachbdud on Feb 13, 2014 22:21:06 GMT -6
Coaches coaching their coaches, I'm the young guy on staff currently attempting to be coached up. The guy being coached up I like to think. This weekend's assignment is studying our past seasons run game and breaking it down. What worked well, why did it, what didn't work well, why didn't it? Being assigned things like this to do defensively really helped me a lot, and now I'm being asked to do similar things with the offense. Really get the sense that the point of this run game assignment is to coach me up. Which I take on with excitement. that's a great attitude to have come coach here you are hired
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Post by mholst40 on Feb 13, 2014 23:50:09 GMT -6
If the head coach of a program doesn't coach his coaches, it's doomed for failure.
I'd rather have loyal assistants willing to stick to the program and the process it takes to be successful than some hotshot who thinks he knows it all.
The number one thing we look for when hiring new coaches (besides a pulse) is how good they are at teaching. I'd rather take a solid teacher who knows nothing about football than a former good player who doesn't want to or isn't willing to learn how to teach.
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Post by fantom on Feb 14, 2014 9:17:42 GMT -6
One constant theme here is the question of young coaches making suggestions. Young coaches get frustrated because they don't think that their ideas are taken seriously. Older coaches get frustrated that young coaches come up with half-a$$ed ideas that come out of left field.
If you want to coach up young coaches I think that one thing that you can do is to listen to ideas from everybody. If an idea won't work, explain in detail why. Now the kid can either find a way to make his idea work or give it up. Either way he's learned something.
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Post by mholst40 on Feb 14, 2014 10:09:10 GMT -6
One constant theme here is the question of young coaches making suggestions. Young coaches get frustrated because they don't think that their ideas are taken seriously. Older coaches get frustrated that young coaches come up with half-a$$ed ideas that come out of left field. If you want to coach up young coaches I think that one thing that you can do is to listen to ideas from everybody. If an idea won't work, explain in detail why. Now the kid can either find a way to make his idea work or give it up. Either way he's learned something. We have a younger CB's coach. He's a former player, so he knows the system and knows the drills he did as a player. A little bit had changed since he played, but there is a lot of similarity. After going to Glazier last week he told me he wanted to try catch man in our defense with guys that were struggling in normal press. I asked him why, he told me and we had a lengthy conversation about the pros and cons, time concerns and so on. We left the conversation open ended and discussed going to work on catch man by ourselves out on the field sometime soon. I think (hope) this gave him some buy in because I listened to his ideas, gave him my opinion and didn't shut the door right away. If you're not at least listening to ideas and talking about pros and cons, how is a young coach supposed to grow? How are you going to grow?
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