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Post by wingtol on Jul 24, 2013 12:08:51 GMT -6
So we are at like DEFCON 5 this year numbers wise, 21 total. For the OL I have maybe 8 guys, 2 frosh one who has never played before and one who is like 150lb, rest of the team all skill type kids. So the thing that is keeping me up is how the he!! are we going to do any kind of team since we will have a very small (size and number wise) scout team.
So what I thought about doing and was wondering if anyone else has tried this is to maybe only have different levels of the defense out there. For example have a DL with players but garbage cans aligned for LB's as place holders for the rest of the D. Or vise versa. I am really grabbing at straws here on how to get any kind of look on scout D.
Thought about half line vs. half line but I don't think that is going to work with all the backside pulling we do in our wing-t.
So am I nuts? Sounds like some loon that has no clue? I don't know LOL just ready to go crazy over this!
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Post by fort on Jul 24, 2013 13:09:49 GMT -6
We had 21 last year (probably won't be much better this season) and ended with 19 (less at times with a couple of injuries) and it is a big challenge. Would love some new ideas, as well.
We tried: - Half-line - We're single wing... didn't work well. - Strategically remove defensive positions (depending on what we're working on). Inside stuff, we'd not have corners out there, or backside players on sweep, etc. Really the only way we got much meaningful work done. - Sometimes coaches may just have to grab a shield and step in (not ideal, but sometimes you have to do what you've got to do to get a look).
I thought about garbage cans, and I think they could be really helpful for us in OL group time, but I worry about putting them out there in team time. We're going to really work on our pullers tracking LBers, and static cans don't flow very well.
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Post by Chris Clement on Jul 24, 2013 13:26:50 GMT -6
I've had similar problems a lot. We had to eliminate non-essential positions on both sides, so guys like BSWR as well as BSCB, then put coaches at less essential spots on the side of the ball we weren't currently working on, and fill in gaps with whoever was left. It was actually easier in youth ball when it happened because you could ask a parent to play DL and just by standing there and being triple the size of the players it would approximate a good look, but it doesn't work so well with HS kids.
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Post by dubber on Jul 24, 2013 16:01:22 GMT -6
Get "the work" done in individuals and group work (inside run should be your best friend).
Work Team versus cones or air.
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Post by CoachHess on Jul 24, 2013 19:02:01 GMT -6
Had this problem last year, this year looking similar. We tried everything. Cones, trash cans, etc. Nothing seemed to work. We were very young and very small. Our biggest issue was the moral. The kids are so demoralized being so small and having so little numbers. If you have the staff, do like dubber says and do a whole lot of individual stuff. Rep the heck out of stuff on air. We too are wing-t, and will put a body or a bag at the key area. For example, your running the buck, need to have a bag for the PST to down block, PSG to log. Do the best you can and remember how important you are to those kids. Keep up the good fight, I feel for you.
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orion320
Sophomore Member
"Don't tell me about the labor just show me the baby!"
Posts: 211
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Post by orion320 on Jul 24, 2013 20:30:50 GMT -6
Get "the work" done in individuals and group work (inside run should be your best friend). Work Team versus cones or air. 100% correct. Stress fundamentals, fundamentals, fundamentals, and fundamentals again. You can try going half line but in my experience that has never adequately worked. Working on cones can work but you lose the aggressiveness. In my opinion you should get at least the inside 8 guys and not worry about WR's and Secondary since primarily run the ball.
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Post by coachweav88 on Jul 24, 2013 20:48:38 GMT -6
Had this problem last year, this year looking similar. We tried everything. Cones, trash cans, etc. Nothing seemed to work. We were very young and very small. Our biggest issue was the moral. The kids are so demoralized being so small and having so little numbers. If you have the staff, do like dubber says and do a whole lot of individual stuff. Rep the heck out of stuff on air. We too are wing-t, and will put a body or a bag at the key area. For example, your running the buck, need to have a bag for the PST to down block, PSG to log. Do the best you can and remember how important you are to those kids. Keep up the good fight, I feel for you. This is what Dave Cisar does at the youth level. He does a fit and freeze where the linemen get to their blocks and freeze ( coaches check for proper head placement and pad level). On 2nd whistle, they will sprint 10 yds. downfield. Backs just run the plays and finish through 10 yds. If you would like to get extra conditioning, you could have them go to 20 yds. Benefits of this vs. traditional scrimmaging Easier to see if play is done correctly more reps young guys can get reps by running multiple groups one after the other Lets face it, with really low numbers, your scout team really won't give you a look anyway. Get your contact in controlled Indy drills.
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Post by coachk98 on Jul 25, 2013 5:18:08 GMT -6
Work with the jv. We have set up varsity huddle on 1 hash jv huddle on the other, all remaing varsity and jv players make up the scout team. Total of 33 players needed.
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Post by CoachHess on Jul 25, 2013 5:50:52 GMT -6
Doubt I'll make it to 33 players, and from the sound of it, neither will wingtol
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Post by wingtol on Jul 25, 2013 5:52:48 GMT -6
Get "the work" done in individuals and group work (inside run should be your best friend). Work Team versus cones or air. Thanks for the input guys. We have basically been doing team in our summer work outs with just 7/8 on D and no secondary line an inside run I guess. Indy has been fine as well still doing all the drills we normally do to work on our blocking. I guess my real problem besides having only 21 guys is that we just don't have the physical size for a scout team. We may have 1-2 guys who can be on the line in scout and after that it's all skinny skill guys who I am afraid will not give us a look or get killed in the process. That's why I was thinking of the cans out there but I worry about having static objects in the middle of team offense.
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Post by 33coach on Jul 25, 2013 7:35:57 GMT -6
Buy trash cans. Use them for alignment
Sent from my ADR6410LVW using proboards
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Post by s73 on Jul 25, 2013 8:23:19 GMT -6
For us the following has been helpful:
Half Line O/D
Team: Run plays only v. front 7/8 (IMO this toughens up the 1st group as does half line b/c they know it's a run so your scout guys play a little tougher)
Team Pass v. front 7/8 and 1 DB (We work v. heavy blitz in this and have the 1 DB alternate between covering the primary or secondary receiver, may not be a full defense but at least we can see if our QB is making the correct reads).
Tons of Indy time and group time. This is what has helped us when numbers were an issue.
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Post by blb on Jul 25, 2013 8:32:41 GMT -6
In lieu if Half Line, do Inside Drill, then Outside Drill
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Post by coachphillip on Jul 25, 2013 14:32:29 GMT -6
Get "the work" done in individuals and group work (inside run should be your best friend). Work Team versus cones or air. Amen. Tons of fundamental work in Indy. Break up into sections as much as possible to retain numbers. Inside Run vs the Box. Perimeter Run vs DT, DE, LB, S, CB. Passing Concepts done against CB, S, LB if you mirror your routes. Team on air at the end of practice as conditioning. Start 50 yards out and have them finish each play with a score. Perfect play moves forward 5. Blown assignment and no progress. I went through some REALLY lean years (16 kids two years in a row). Make sure the kids you have get all the coaching you can possibly give and ensure they have an amazing experience. Or you better get used to the lean years. Good luck Coach.
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Post by CoachHess on Jul 25, 2013 21:58:31 GMT -6
Completed day two, final day, of high school registration/equipment pickup. 19 boys picked up equipment. Anyone got a helmet I can borrow? Mine is getting pretty worn from beating my head against the wall constantly.
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Post by coachjm on Jul 26, 2013 16:33:20 GMT -6
Last year we had 17 boys on our Varsity team, this year we currently have 21 planning to play and that attended camp this week. I actually love this number of kids, I feel we can coach them all and can find a role for all of them. We do have 6 Varsity coaches (mostly volunteers) so we end up having 1 on 3-4 instruction which is great. Here is what we feel is key.
Don't waste time in Practice, since every kid is getting nearly every rep at practice by having a quick tempo your team will be conditioned. We do a ton of film work in an effort to prevent too much banging we want the mental reps to occur through film we spend an hour everyday reviewing film. We currently have 8 lineman 5 ends, 6 RB, two QBs we run double wing so the pulling we do a lot of.
Offensively we start with plays on air to look at spacing After Indy drills we start adding parts We will work pulls without the frontside down blocks so we will work our pullers and backfield together We work Trapping with G, C, G, T, E and a FB the other guys are typically working on pass game We will do half line and work on Belly, Rocket and Trap When we go team we will go Full offense 1/2 a defense all plays in what direction for a period and the second period all plays go to the otherside as we switch the defense. When we do pass game we do a session with no defensive backs and focus on our protections. We focus on a skill at a time or a couple conflicting plays at a time and each period we are very specific to what we want to focus on and defenders are placed in those spots.
Defensively we start with tackling each day after indy we do an edge drill with two G an EMOLOS and backfied we play our DE/OLB/ILB and a secondary support then give different keys for the boys to react to. We do all allignment and blitz work vs trash cans. We use our offensive half line drill as our defensive half line drill We always play a coach at QB in order to get a better look as well as gives another body We use trash cans when working on fill drills We will do an inside run drill with LB/DT We run 7 on 7 everyday that includes run plays so that we have to take good read steps. The most exciting thing this year is we have 14 guys to do 7 on 7 last year we had to do 3 on 4 on just half the field.
Most special teams stuff we do with our JV team
Enjoy it, you will know your kids well and you will have ample time to instruct them at the key pieces of the game.
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Post by CoachHess on Jul 26, 2013 19:17:59 GMT -6
21 on varsity is one thing. 19 boys in the program is a whole nothing can of worms. We won't have enough to fill a jv team. Good practice ideas though. Nice having that many coaches for that few boys.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2013 19:27:24 GMT -6
why cant half line be guard, center, guard? and qb? why not just reinvent 7 on 7 for team. And work the different combinations.
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Post by jpdaley25 on Jul 26, 2013 19:57:57 GMT -6
Been there many times....half line stinks because it takes twice as much time...or more....but I would do a little of that just to get good on good. Rely on inside, perimeter, and skelly most of the time.
Turn a negative (low numbers) into a positive (more highly trained players).
Good luck!
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