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Post by passtowin8 on Aug 9, 2012 10:06:18 GMT -6
I am helping coach a jr. midget team because the head coach asked me to help out. The offensive coordinator of the team either refuses to or cant teach fundamentals. By that I mean each position coach takes their group and work basic fundamentals while incorporating their part of the plays. But all the offensive coordinator wants to do is do Team Offense for 40 minutes straight with only him and one other coach talking to the offensive players. I have already been yelled at for trying to help a kid with steps as a fullback(first year player). I really want to confront the HC and OC on this matter,but im not sure how to do it. Advice or suggestions greatly appreciated. Thanks!
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flingt
Junior Member
"We don't care how big or strong our opponents are as long as they're human.?
Posts: 311
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Post by flingt on Aug 9, 2012 11:06:33 GMT -6
Advice? Run like hell. I'd bet he doesn't want to teach fundamentals because he can't. Doing team is easy because it takes no planning and that is why I refuse to let my sons play youth football.
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Post by Chris Clement on Aug 9, 2012 11:33:27 GMT -6
How old is Jr midget where you live?
If the head coach asked you to come, you have some clout to talk to him, and you have a certain responsibility to the players to do so. Tactfully.
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Post by mahonz on Aug 9, 2012 11:46:57 GMT -6
Advice? Run like hell. I'd bet he doesn't want to teach fundamentals because he can't. Doing team is easy because it takes no planning and that is why I refuse to let my sons play youth football. This has to be the saddest post I have ever read on this forum. A coach purposely keeping his own kids away from a ton of fun because he’s so anal.  |
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Post by mahonz on Aug 9, 2012 12:00:04 GMT -6
I am helping coach a jr. midget team because the head coach asked me to help out. The offensive coordinator of the team either refuses to or cant teach fundamentals. By that I mean each position coach takes their group and work basic fundamentals while incorporating their part of the plays. But all the offensive coordinator wants to do is do Team Offense for 40 minutes straight with only him and one other coach talking to the offensive players. I have already been yelled at for trying to help a kid with steps as a fullback(first year player). I really want to confront the HC and OC on this matter,but im not sure how to do it. Advice or suggestions greatly appreciated. Thanks! Actually there is really nothing wrong with what he is doing as long has he tones down Team and amps up Indy’s after game one. He should allow you to step in and help with some of the details though. That is waht AC's do. Talk to him about this and insure him you are there to help and will instruct quickly. Nothing worse than one coach and one player holding up a drill for everyone. Teams reps…after some basic fundamental work is a good exercise for teaching the game. That is just as important when teaching young kids as the fundamentals. If you over work fundamentals without teaching them how they all fit together live then the kids can drift away on you. This is an OK plan during pre season to better prepare them for the mayhem as long as you are progressing safely. This is a better plan for a rookie team as long as they know the basics first. Then as you get past game one the practice sessions begin to reveres going heavy into fundamentals because now they get it…and back way off on Team. If he continues going Team for 40 minutes per well into the season then he is off base and needs to rethink his thinking. My thoughts...its a balancing act that your HC has to plan out. |
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Post by Chris Clement on Aug 9, 2012 12:24:02 GMT -6
All Team and no fundamental work? That doesn't sound like it makes any sense. Yes, young teams need team time to get used to the confusion of bodies, but if they don't know how to block it doesn't matter how well they know their assignments.
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Post by 19delta on Aug 9, 2012 12:25:42 GMT -6
I'm betting he is a spread coach...  |
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Post by mahonz on Aug 9, 2012 12:35:25 GMT -6
All Team and no fundamental work? That doesn't sound like it makes any sense. Yes, young teams need team time to get used to the confusion of bodies, but if they don't know how to block it doesn't matter how well they know their assignments. CC I read 40 minutes of team...so that leaves 80 minutes of something else...hopefully some fundementals are built in there We try to do 15 to 20 minutes of team daily. More in the pre season. But if a block of Indy time must run long then and with good reason...the Team block at the end shortens. I agree 40 minutes per is a lot of Team but its pre season and maybe they have no scrimmages set up or any Jamborees they will attend and need live reps in a bad way. We will see what the OP has to say. |
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Post by passtowin8 on Aug 9, 2012 13:53:15 GMT -6
The age group for this team ranges from 11-13 year olds. We also have one 10 from is playing up with us. We practisce four days a week in August from 6-8. Heres a rough script of practice. At 6 to 6:20 We warm up and stretch. water for 5. then do team Offense against a live defense from 640 to 7:20 Conditioning for the rest of practice. We are wing-t team with some spread. But the problem is the HC lets the OC does whatever he wants. My dad who is a 33 year coaching veteran(25 years as a HC for all levels of Pop warner) says Im wasting my time when the OC doesnt want to do indy time. But i dont give up for the kids who look up to me and ask questions all the time especially the new kids.
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Post by Chris Clement on Aug 9, 2012 15:40:47 GMT -6
Oh, well, I was reading it as 40 minutes of team O and 80 minutes of D and ST.
Oh dear god, I was right. You need an intervention.
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Post by utchuckd on Aug 9, 2012 16:37:10 GMT -6
Got yelled at for helping a kid? What do they let you do?
This does need to be hashed out. Be as diplomatic as you can and reach whatever agreement you are comfortable with, but I'd have a problem sticking around with people that don't let me coach. JMO.
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Post by 19delta on Aug 9, 2012 16:45:56 GMT -6
What kind of warmup are you guys doing? Are you doing 20 minutes of form running, calesthenics, and stretching or are you doing some football-specific stuff? If you guys are doing 20 minutes of form running, calesthenics, and stretching that is, IMO, way too much.
What we do for our warmup is football-specific stuff.
OL - Work pulling and trapping
QBs and Centers - snaps
Backs - handoff drill
DL - quick starts
LBs/DBs - Read steps and pass drops
We don't do form running, stretching, and calesthenics at all.
What do you guys do from 6:25 - 6:40?
40 minutes of Team O is not bad, especially if you have a lot of kids you need to get through. But, my question is, how do the kids know what they are supposed to do if they go directly to Team Offense? Does the OC have to coach up all 11 kids?
That really isn't a bad practice format if you are talking late in the season...I mean, if it is Week 7 and your kids still aren't stepping with the right foot, 20 minutes of indy time isn't going to make a difference.
But, early in the season, most of your time should be indy or small group (QBs, backs and TEs/TEs and OL/DL and LB/LB and DB...that sort of thing)
Are you guys any good? Lots of good athletes?
Thing is, in youth ball more so than at any other level, differences in talent are hugely pronounced. If the coaches you are working for are used to simply having the best athletes on the field, fast kid right, faster kid left, and big kid up the middle is probably pretty much all they know. If that is all you do because you are always loaded with athletes, you never have to learn how to develop players.
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Post by passtowin8 on Aug 9, 2012 22:08:32 GMT -6
We have 6-8 athletes and 24 kids. The HC and OC are used to having 10-15 athletes and 33 kids. Last year they had three offenses. Also bout 7 hard hitters
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flingt
Junior Member
"We don't care how big or strong our opponents are as long as they're human.?
Posts: 311
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Post by flingt on Aug 10, 2012 11:02:12 GMT -6
Advice? Run like hell. I'd bet he doesn't want to teach fundamentals because he can't. Doing team is easy because it takes no planning and that is why I refuse to let my sons play youth football. This has to be the saddest post I have ever read on this forum. A coach purposely keeping his own kids away from a ton of fun because he’s so anal. Your opinion, but I have seen too many youth coaches who don't bother to research what they are volunteering to coach, and to me that is a disservice to the kids. It has nothing to do with being anal it has to do with if you are going to do something, volunteer or not, do it right. Is that too much to ask? |
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Post by mahonz on Aug 10, 2012 12:56:01 GMT -6
This has to be the saddest post I have ever read on this forum. A coach purposely keeping his own kids away from a ton of fun because he’s so anal. Your opinion, but I have seen too many youth coaches who don't bother to research what they are volunteering to coach, and to me that is a disservice to the kids. It has nothing to do with being anal it has to do with if you are going to do something, volunteer or not, do it right. Is that too much to ask? …but the fun they could be having even if in your eyes its all wrong. It’s the game, the camaraderie, the unique team spirit that is only achieved on a football field. Im sure the NFL smurks at what you do….but their sons will still play for you. I coached Joe Collier's grandson for 5 years at the youth level and he was a Linebacker. Imagine having that guy pacing around your practice sessions. He never said a word about coaching football. Not one word but Im positive he was biting his tongue. I have coached many players whose fathers coached HS ball. Not a single one of them gave me any pointers…and trust me I could have used some. But they knew the deal and respected the situation. They didn’t want to be ‘that” parent that they so very much despise themselves….is my theory. I never asked. |
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flingt
Junior Member
"We don't care how big or strong our opponents are as long as they're human.?
Posts: 311
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Post by flingt on Aug 10, 2012 13:30:57 GMT -6
Your opinion, but I have seen too many youth coaches who don't bother to research what they are volunteering to coach, and to me that is a disservice to the kids. It has nothing to do with being anal it has to do with if you are going to do something, volunteer or not, do it right. Is that too much to ask? …but the fun they could be having even if in your eyes its all wrong. It’s the game, the camaraderie, the unique team spirit that is only achieved on a football field. Im sure the NFL smurks at what you do….but their sons will still play for you. I coached Joe Collier's grandson for 5 years at the youth level and he was a Linebacker. Imagine having that guy pacing around your practice sessions. He never said a word about coaching football. Not one word but Im positive he was biting his tongue. I have coached many players whose fathers coached HS ball. Not a single one of them gave me any pointers…and trust me I could have used some. But they knew the deal and respected the situation. They didn’t want to be ‘that” parent that they so very much despise themselves….is my theory. I never asked. Were I live I have heard too many stories from parents about how their kids hated their experience at the youth level. I did let my oldest play and after 2 years told me he was never playing again. The coaches DIDN'T make fun and that carried over to him not playing. He does play high school and you could never tell he didn't ever "hated" playing. My two youngest, I just can't take that chance. Different strokes for different folks, but based on the OP, I would not let me sons play for someone like that. I do appreciate your opinion. |
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Post by Chris Clement on Aug 10, 2012 14:38:18 GMT -6
you could never tell he didn't ever "hated" playing. What? Anyway, I played on the worst-coached youth team you could believe. It was an organization desperate for coaches, so they repurposed hockey coaches who knew how to deal with kids, but nothing about the game. I was the 13 year old OC by virtue of having skipped a grade and thus having HS "experience", and I was not very good, and my attempt at slapping together a D wasn't much better. But we had fun, and I bounced a pass of as many different facemasks as possible that season. You can have awful coaching and awful teams and still have fun. |
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kyle
Sophomore Member
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Post by kyle on Aug 10, 2012 14:54:16 GMT -6
I am helping coach a jr. midget team because the head coach asked me to help out. The offensive coordinator of the team either refuses to or cant teach fundamentals. By that I mean each position coach takes their group and work basic fundamentals while incorporating their part of the plays. But all the offensive coordinator wants to do is do Team Offense for 40 minutes straight with only him and one other coach talking to the offensive players. I have already been yelled at for trying to help a kid with steps as a fullback(first year player). I really want to confront the HC and OC on this matter,but im not sure how to do it. Advice or suggestions greatly appreciated. Thanks! How many plays do you have? During our installation we're not going to do much fundamental work. Our whole season will have roughly 1500 minutes of indy time though... yeah I'm that much of a nerd. I calculated that. |
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Post by blb on Aug 10, 2012 15:40:23 GMT -6
"Coaches" who spend most of the kids' time on Calisthenics, Scrimmaging, and conditioning usually don't know or care (too lazy to learn?) HOW to teach fundamentals.
Their kids who really like Football will learn how to survive, the others will learn Football is not fun at all and never play again.
Sometimes "coaches" are worst enemy when it comes to the health of the sport.
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Post by passtowin8 on Aug 10, 2012 16:42:11 GMT -6
We have 20-25 plays and also half the coaching staff doesnt know what their doing. Its sad to say the least. But i will keep pushing foward
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Post by rpetrie on Aug 13, 2012 19:54:23 GMT -6
If there are no INDY drills then those kids that aren't ready or comfortable with the game at full speed will not learn, improve or have the opportunity to succeed & enjoy the game. I am helping my son's 9YR OLD team until I start 2-a-days. We have had 6 practices and I've scripted everyone and we've done very little team-time.
1. 10min warmup
2. EDD's: I scripted 3-4 stations "Every Day Drills" on blocking fits, handoffs & form tackles. If there are 4 coaches we add a shiver/shed drill with "get-offs" on ball movement. Do those for 7-8 minutes rotations.
3. Group Work in a controlled 3v3 or 4v4 setting: 20-30 minutes
In this they learn how to identify gap responsibilities & utilize learned techniques from Indy
4. Team: go over alignments/assignments in a walk-through fashion...teaching over the last 30 minutes
Later we will cut down on each segment and include more live scrimmaging & 1/2 situations if another team is not available. We only have 17 kids so full scrimmages aren't always available.
Just my opinion, but you should speak your mind if you feel its not right.
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Post by passtowin8 on Aug 14, 2012 11:50:36 GMT -6
rpetire, im in same situation as you. I also coach HS ball, my freshman team starts tomorrow. So im splitting between the two teams with freshman comes first. I also just got the practice plan for the week, 3 days of offensivse days, 1 defensive day. The OC plans practice.....surprise surprise. Now im a offensive guy but i believe in youth football defense takes the cake.....because uf they cant score we cant lose
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Post by electrified on Mar 15, 2013 23:02:39 GMT -6
I can understand what your saying even tho you might not be saying all of your frustrations because i have argued about the. same subject with our head coach with his 20 plays all scrimmage fix as you go routine no real plan or fundamental individuals we have allot of talent but bad coaching i volunteer because my son plays and wants to stay worth his friends but im very frustrated with the way he coaches
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