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Post by jlenwood on Jun 16, 2012 8:54:30 GMT -6
Guys, the horse is out of the barn on this one. We can rant all we want, but the perception in the public eye is that football is dangerous because of the risk of concussion. This is no different than a discussion on gun violence. Some thug shoots another thug and the media decries gun violence when the vast majority of gun owners never do anything illegal.
I love football, coaching it, watching it and just being around it. But the reality is that I have 2 sons playing HS football right now and the risk of concussion damage (long term brain damage) is something I weigh every day as to allowing them to play. They both have had concussions before, (one is a QB and the other a receiver). And I am sure that if coaches on this board who have sons playing were asked, they would respond the same way.
As far as coaches saying that NFL players knew what they were getting into, and now they are crying about it. That is simply not the case. The NFL withheld information about the long term effects of concussions and in some instances they advised players about playing when they in fact knew that the player was in jeopardy of long term damage. Everyone knows that if you play a sport as violent as football the risk of injury is high, but if your thought is I can survive long term with joint damage, arthritis, back pain etc., that is a long way from thinking I am going to be incapacitated due to a mush brain.
Until a national coalition or organization like the NFHS, or state coaches association puts together an ARTICULATE and fact based response to the media frenzy on concussions, the long term prospects of football surviving are real. But as coaches, we absolutely can not go on TV, whether it be local or national, and be seen as a bunch of alpha male "your bell was rung get back in there" kind of people. Don't rant, don't call "old pro's bashing the sport" a bunch of ungrateful jerks and on and on.
As a profession we need to be better coaches, teach safe tackling methods, approach our practices differently just to name a few things. I look back on some of the things I did when I first started coaching and I cringe (bull in the ring). I know I sent kids back into action when I shouldn't have because I didn't know any better. Now I do. Will the risk of concussion ever go away, no. But the reality is it can be lessened by professional, educated coaches.
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Post by fantom on Jun 16, 2012 9:58:34 GMT -6
Ray Easterling (OL for the Falcons) recently committed suicide. He believed that his depression and other issues were linked to concussions. His salary topped out at $75,000. Adjusted for inflation, it's still more than I'll ever make, but not so much to make me call him a whiny rich boy. Now, I generally agree with what you are saying, but I am pretty sure what the NFL guys are saying is that the NFL knew about the risks and didn't inform anyone, kind of like the tobacco companies and cancer. The answer here is information. Inform parents, honestly and tell them how you will work your @$$ off to protect their kids. Fantom, has it right. We are the missionaries. Let's spread the truth. There are a lot of people who have depression and commit suicide. When I was a kid I use to work in my uncle's lawn mower, chainsaw shop. When we sold a chainsaw we always had to tell the guy buying it "the chain rotates and it is sharp, it can cut you." Is that the arguement here? They didn't know? Come on... Please tell me this is more than the "McDonald's coffee is hot" arguement. I'm not going to scroll back up but the one post makes a great point - the NFL guys are taking a lot more snaps than HS and NCAA football. There is a reason football is a once every 7 days game, the body needs time to heal. NOW - even though I catagorically disagree with the former NFL players saying "we didn't know" (which it complete BS). I do agree that the NFL is responsible and should pay someone something BECAUSE - all the studies, all the rule changes, etc, etc - are supposedly all in an effort to make the game safer. They say rule changes for safety, etc - but in the end, they are talking about making it an 18 game season which exposes those guys to more physical damage. The fact is the NFL doesn't give a chit so long as they make that money. They know they will NEVER run out of players. Which makes the players, no matter how good they are, expendable. Anyone who thinks any of this about anything other than money is crazy. I don't understand why the NFL doesn't go back to a 14 game season, and put the rules back to NCAA rules, including the clock rules. OK. I've said my piece on this topic. I'll STFU now. In Brian Billick's book he discussed why players hate Thursday games (they're just starting to feel good again after Sunday's game). Now the league is playing more Thursday games and trying to play 18 games. To me the suit is the NFL's chickens coming home to roost. For years we've been hearing of old players being denied medical benefits over health issues that were obviously game-related. Now the league has to pay attention.
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Post by mahonz on Jun 16, 2012 11:02:13 GMT -6
Can someone post some findings from studies that show football is not that dangerous? I have some great athletes in our school but they (or their Mama) are worried about getting hurt playing football.... Is this the reality? I remember reading Soccer has more head injuries, cheerleading and skateboarding has more broken bones...etc..etc... Coach ....if the Insurance Companies are not worried then should anyone else? www.sadlersports.com/blog/
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Post by mahonz on Jun 16, 2012 11:18:54 GMT -6
Until a national coalition or organization like the NFHS, or state coaches association puts together an ARTICULATE and fact based response to the media frenzy on concussions, the long term prospects of football surviving are real. Coach It seems to a simpleton like me...you all at the HS level have the power / platform / where-with-all to do just that. Strength in numbers. Here is the reality for me. I have been a part of the administration for a very large independent youth league for a while. About 6000 players in 17 orgs all under one roof. I compared 2009, ’10 and ’11 registration numbers as of June 10th to current registrations. The two largest orgs are down 25% right now. I cannot factor in the economy because that down turn already hit in ’09. I also called a few of the Headers at a few of our local HS's. Same issue already with their incoming Freshmen. I at least have the ability to look outside of my own locker room. The sky is already falling.
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Post by jlenwood on Jun 16, 2012 16:31:28 GMT -6
mahonz, I agree about the HS coaches taking on this issues. I also think you hit the bulls eye with your participation numbers. Football will go away, not legislatively, but by decreased participation at the youth level. When parents wont let their kids play Pop Warner or pee wee, guess what, we have lost those players to some other sport by the time they get to HS.
I don't see many HS players or parents getting out once they are at the varsity level. But I can see parents holding kids out of youth and junior high football. And around our neck of the woods, we don't see to many first time players once they hit High School.
My thought is, get out in front of this now. By getting the High School associations to put together a plan to address the issue. Also, start educating the youth coaches in safe tackling and so on. That way the parents see the progress being made to make the game safer for their kids, and maybe we hang on to the players at that level.
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Post by mrjvi on Jun 16, 2012 17:30:07 GMT -6
It's been mentioned before but Coach Hugh Wyatt's DVD safer and surer tackling is one of the best ones to use. My staff looks at it before each season. I'd like to get my parents to watch it at our next parent meeting. Could help.
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Post by John Knight on Jun 16, 2012 19:18:41 GMT -6
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Post by John Knight on Jun 17, 2012 5:34:27 GMT -6
I think it is kind of like telling young adults to abstain from sex. Easy to tell others what to do once you get yours!!
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Post by mahonz on Jun 17, 2012 11:32:58 GMT -6
mahonz, I agree about the HS coaches taking on this issues. I also think you hit the bulls eye with your participation numbers. Football will go away, not legislatively, but by decreased participation at the youth level. When parents wont let their kids play Pop Warner or pee wee, guess what, we have lost those players to some other sport by the time they get to HS. I don't see many HS players or parents getting out once they are at the varsity level. But I can see parents holding kids out of youth and junior high football. And around our neck of the woods, we don't see to many first time players once they hit High School. My thought is, get out in front of this now. By getting the High School associations to put together a plan to address the issue. Also, start educating the youth coaches in safe tackling and so on. That way the parents see the progress being made to make the game safer for their kids, and maybe we hang on to the players at that level. Coach Im certainly not trying to be a sad sac here either. Im just seeing some weird stuff happening around my City and its perfect storming on our sport. One of my very good friends chairs the second largest School District in my state. He’s worried. We now have the Jake Snakenberg Law as well that was pioneered by a former NFL player, which is a good thing yet I fear its step one of government getting involved. The youth orgs can only educate those veteran parents that currently play. We are at a loss on how to get to those rookie parents that do not participate. PW just made it worse by mandating something that already happens naturally. They simply pointed the finger at the game itself as being the problem and fully skirted the real issues. The average parent has NO CLUE about the real issues here. They only see long-term danger now. I personally believe there are 10’s of 1000’s of kids out there right now begging to play football but Mom and Dad say no…how about LAX. Since fall LAX is growing fast…and LAX is now the fastest growing youth sport overall, they are lost to our sport forever. Coaches…this is happening and the youth orgs have ZERO power. There are over 30K members right here….with power…and why Im yelling as loud as I can.
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Post by coachd5085 on Jun 17, 2012 13:30:49 GMT -6
Ya know - one of us ought to just build a web page, where we as coaches can post: # of players on our team # of first time concussions # of concussions for kids who have had previous concussions Have a seperate section for freshman vs 10-12 kids That would be pretty simple for someone to put together and for all of us to do. The problem though coach, and this is the point that many here seem to either purposefully ignore, or just don't realize, is that CONCUSSIONS ARE NOT THE SOLE ISSUE. In fact, much of the latest research/concern is that concussions are NOT EVEN THE MAJOR ISSUE. Years ago, the major worry was neck injury, because that was the most immediate and most noticeable. Current concern involves head trauma, particularly concussions, however research seems to be showing that repetitive sub-concussive blows to the head are as dangerous if not MORE dangerous than the one big hit. DC, you know that you and I are like brothers from a different mother but I disagree with the "its not living, its just dying slowly approach". When discussing head injuries, and future issues stemming from them, the concepts of living years with dementia or another brain diminished ailment doesn't seem like a good trade off for playing a sport that's void could easily be filled with multiple other options. I think the best approach is to differentiate between NFL and schoolboy ball, AND play the numbers game (showing that those talking out are a small percentage of those who play football). Compare it to flying and such.
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Post by NC1974 on Jun 17, 2012 20:08:55 GMT -6
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Post by coachdennis on Jun 18, 2012 15:41:51 GMT -6
With the old pros bashing football, I always think of old men swapping stories at the coffee shop. "Ohh, I was so daring and brave when I was young! No one should try to be as heroic and dangerous as I was!" The only difference is that these guys have a big public platform for their war stories. My view is that most of them are saying it as an attention grabber.
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Post by maximum on Jul 5, 2012 2:01:26 GMT -6
My only thing where I think the concussions are maybe, overhyped isn't a good word but, the articles about former players with serious post concussive issues are the guys who've had 10, 12, 20 concussions and when you have that many a lot are probably concussions on concussions and everything else. Or y'know, Jahvid Best gets his massive one and then gets a few on top of that and he's at risk for having problems down the line. But idk, I wonder how much of the concussion issues in former players are that the guys who've had 10+ concussions are pretty much never ok compared to the guys who've only really had a couple.
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