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Post by tvt50 on Dec 19, 2006 7:12:33 GMT -6
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Post by coachshs on Dec 19, 2006 9:56:01 GMT -6
What a crock of $*#@!
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Post by oguru on Dec 19, 2006 11:14:44 GMT -6
This is why you tell your players to hand the ball to the officials. He did draw some attention to himself, however not enough to draw a penalty.
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fad3d
Freshmen Member
Posts: 37
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Post by fad3d on Dec 19, 2006 12:11:46 GMT -6
Wow, the ref was reaching for the flag even before the kid tossed the ball to him. What a bastard
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Post by blb on Dec 19, 2006 12:18:53 GMT -6
We had a kid penalized for taunting while scoring in second game. I watched him run into the end zone and didn't see anything unsportsmanlike.
When I finally got the Linesman to give me an explanation (Back Judge made the call), he said the flag was because our RB had given the defender chasing him "a funny look."
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Post by wingt74 on Dec 19, 2006 12:31:09 GMT -6
Exact same events, but the TD moves the score from 28-0 to 35-0...is the flag justified?
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Post by tvt50 on Dec 19, 2006 12:42:20 GMT -6
The penalty did not cause them the game. It just made them have to go for 2 from the 18 yard line instead of the 3. People in the stands said that they did not have a good kicker and would have gone for 2 not matter what. The VHSL (VA High School League) has apologized for the call. This is the apology from the VHSL for the call.
VIRGINIA HIGH SCHOOL LEAGUE 1642 State Farm Boulevard
Charlottesville, Virginia 22911
phone: 434-977-8475 fax: 434-977-5943
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE Contact: Ken Tilley December 18, 2006
Charlottesville--In light of a controversial officiating call in the final minute of the Virginia High School League (VHSL) Division 1 State Football Championship Game between J. I. Burton and Riverheads High Schools, VHSL staff conducted a review of the events in question. School and game officials were contacted for input, and game tapes were reviewed by VHSL Assistant Director and State Football Rules Interpreter Tom Zimorski as well as several independent individuals with extensive officiating experience.
Following this thorough review, it is the opinion of VHSL staff -- as well as the officials association that was assigned the game and the official who made the call -- that the penalty for non-contact unsportsmanlike conduct for excessive celebration against J. I. Burton High School was incorrect in that the player's conduct did not rise to the level of an unsportsmanlike act for excessive celebration as defined in the National Federation of State High School Associations (NFHS) Football Rules Book.
While the outcome of any contest cannot be altered in cases involving the real or alleged failure of contest officials to interpret or apply game rules properly or to render correct decisions in matters of judgment, the VHSL acknowledges that sometimes errors do occur. The League staff, the officials association and the official himself deeply regret that an incorrect call was made in this particular case and, coming at such a crucial time in the contest, that it might have had a bearing on the outcome of the game.
"We apologize to all parties affected by this error," said VHSL Executive Director Ken Tilley. "This play situation will be a point of emphasis in football rules clinics next year, as will be the proper steps a crew should take in reviewing a coach's request for an explanation of a play call. Furthermore, the officials association is in the process of considering measures it will take in dealing with the crew in this game and plans to strengthen its local training relative to these situations.
"It's extremely important to learn from mistakes and take steps to avoid repeating them," Tilley added. "Our constant goal is to provide a quality officiating program that serves well our student athletes, and our efforts now and in the future will focus on that objective."
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Post by tvt50 on Dec 19, 2006 12:43:56 GMT -6
oguru, Come on man he justed scored the TD to pull within one in the state championship. Im sure your kids arent a bunch of robots that just hand the ball to the ref without lifting their arms, getting excited, or yelling.
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Post by pantherpride91 on Dec 19, 2006 13:04:07 GMT -6
Talk about a ref trying to take over a game. I have seen kids drop to their knees and point to the sky after basically spiking the ball and not have it called.
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Post by knighter on Dec 19, 2006 13:23:17 GMT -6
weak call, very weak
I would have gotten tossed had they called it on my team. My 15 yard penalty and subsequent ejection would have very easily have been warranted, as I am pretty sure you can't chokeslam an official and get away with it. (at least not in Iowa)
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Post by tvt50 on Dec 19, 2006 14:00:10 GMT -6
The police had to escort the refs off the field at a different exit than the one that they had entered the field on. A large group of Burton fans were waiting for the refs from where they had entered the field, so they took them off a different way. A few fans got arrested after the game for running onto the field and getting into the refs face. I think the refs thought that some of the fans were coaches and actually listened to them.
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50Murf
Sophomore Member
Posts: 212
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Post by 50Murf on Dec 19, 2006 15:13:23 GMT -6
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Post by phantom on Dec 19, 2006 15:29:44 GMT -6
Having a team lose a chance at a state championship on a call like that is a travesty.
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jman
Sophomore Member
Posts: 200
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Post by jman on Dec 19, 2006 15:47:40 GMT -6
Oooh...bad...how horrible is that! How does an official that bad get to officiate a state championship game! He should be fired forever!
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Post by epcoach99 on Dec 19, 2006 17:16:06 GMT -6
tvt50 said:
The penalty did not cause them the game. It just made them have to go for 2 from the 18 yard line instead of the 3. People in the stands said that they did not have a good kicker and would have gone for 2 not matter what.
I would rather go for 2 from the 3 any day over going for it from the 18! (I'm sure there is a stat somewhere to back me up there) So while no it didn't "cost" them the game it sure did put the advantage in the other teams favor.
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50Murf
Sophomore Member
Posts: 212
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Post by 50Murf on Dec 19, 2006 17:23:24 GMT -6
Amen to that! Going from the 3 yard line is a HELL of a lot easier than going from the 18 yard line. (I think the stat you are looking for epcoach99 is common sense ) Your 100% correct!
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Post by tvt50 on Dec 19, 2006 18:25:07 GMT -6
I was pulling for JI Burton, my family is from the same county and I went to college down there. Believe me I was ticked off about the call.
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Post by coachshs on Dec 19, 2006 21:25:00 GMT -6
The penalty did not cause them the game. It just made them have to go for 2 from the 18 yard line instead of the 3. People in the stands said that they did not have a good kicker and would have gone for 2 not matter what. The VHSL (VA High School League) has apologized for the call. This is the apology from the VHSL for the call. VIRGINIA HIGH SCHOOL LEAGUE 1642 State Farm Boulevard Charlottesville, Virginia 22911 phone: 434-977-8475 fax: 434-977-5943 FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE Contact: Ken Tilley December 18, 2006 Charlottesville--In light of a controversial officiating call in the final minute of the Virginia High School League (VHSL) Division 1 State Football Championship Game between J. I. Burton and Riverheads High Schools, VHSL staff conducted a review of the events in question. School and game officials were contacted for input, and game tapes were reviewed by VHSL Assistant Director and State Football Rules Interpreter Tom Zimorski as well as several independent individuals with extensive officiating experience. Following this thorough review, it is the opinion of VHSL staff -- as well as the officials association that was assigned the game and the official who made the call -- that the penalty for non-contact unsportsmanlike conduct for excessive celebration against J. I. Burton High School was incorrect in that the player's conduct did not rise to the level of an unsportsmanlike act for excessive celebration as defined in the National Federation of State High School Associations (NFHS) Football Rules Book. While the outcome of any contest cannot be altered in cases involving the real or alleged failure of contest officials to interpret or apply game rules properly or to render correct decisions in matters of judgment, the VHSL acknowledges that sometimes errors do occur. The League staff, the officials association and the official himself deeply regret that an incorrect call was made in this particular case and, coming at such a crucial time in the contest, that it might have had a bearing on the outcome of the game. "We apologize to all parties affected by this error," said VHSL Executive Director Ken Tilley. "This play situation will be a point of emphasis in football rules clinics next year, as will be the proper steps a crew should take in reviewing a coach's request for an explanation of a play call. Furthermore, the officials association is in the process of considering measures it will take in dealing with the crew in this game and plans to strengthen its local training relative to these situations. "It's extremely important to learn from mistakes and take steps to avoid repeating them," Tilley added. "Our constant goal is to provide a quality officiating program that serves well our student athletes, and our efforts now and in the future will focus on that objective." Your kidding right? 18 yard attempt versus a 3 yard attempt? I will let you go for 2 from the 18 all game long if you want!
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Post by airman on Dec 20, 2006 19:11:22 GMT -6
I agree with oguru. you hand the ball or set it down. you do not throw it in the face of the ref. kids need to learn control, he lacked control. the fault should be placed on the coach however for failing to teach their kid how to score properly.
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Post by phantom on Dec 20, 2006 20:46:32 GMT -6
Horse-hockey. The kid did nothing wrong.
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bhb
Junior Member
Posts: 259
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Post by bhb on Dec 20, 2006 20:55:12 GMT -6
the ref was reaching for his flag even before the kid politely tossed him the ball. Those refs should be ashamed of themselves.
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50Murf
Sophomore Member
Posts: 212
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Post by 50Murf on Dec 20, 2006 23:30:33 GMT -6
Airman - I respectfully disagree with your post. This kid did nothing wrong, and his coach did not do anything wrong either. How can you fault a kid (16-18 YOA) for showing emotion in a big game (State Championship) What did he do?? He TOSSED the ball to the referee...he did not spike it, dance with it, or any other BS with it...HE TOSSED it to the referee. The referee already had his mind made before the play was over. IMO - the referee needs the discipline - not the player. This referee should be suspended, and maybe even sit out for a year - he is a VERY BAD EXAMPLE of what a referee should be. I ask you this - how did this "excessive celebration" factor into the game? It did not factor at all - until the Referee blew the call, and IMO, cost this team the chance of winning a state championship. Pathetic!!
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Post by knighter on Dec 21, 2006 10:58:34 GMT -6
Airman-
I respectfully disagree as well. I want my kids to be excited when they doing something right. This is a game that is played with emotion. Where did this kid do something that was unsportsmanlike? The call was reviewed and deemed to be poor by the state association, why else would they have offered up an apology? This kid did not try to show anyone up, he did not draw attention to himself, he did not do anything that should have been deemed as inappropriate. Watch the video again, where is the unsportsmanlike act? He got excited that he scored a TD to give them a chance to win PERIOD. This was a horrible call.
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Post by tvt50 on Dec 21, 2006 13:10:59 GMT -6
It was a sweet playcall, a naked bootleg on the goaline by the QB. He put the ball on his hip and walked in. Then the ref threw the flag.
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Post by lochness on Dec 21, 2006 13:13:57 GMT -6
Someone might need to flag ME for some "excessive celebration" this weekend, know what I mean???
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Post by wildcat on Dec 22, 2006 8:30:50 GMT -6
I didn't like the "head nodding" thing and the arms out, but you can CLEARLY see that the kid was gesturing to fans who were standing behind the endzone. In fact, it appeared that he high-fived a couple of them! There was no attempt made to taunt the kids on the other team and it CLEARLY was spontaneous.
At worst, the official should have said something about "toning it down" to the kid and his coach...but to throw a flag in that situation...horrible!
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Post by coachcb on Dec 22, 2006 9:38:08 GMT -6
No matter what the score of the game was or might have been, a bad call is a bad call. Period. Especially when you're dealing with a judgement call like that.
Two years ago, we played a tight, high scoring game down to the absolute wire- the score was 42-34 and we punched it with 5 seconds left in the game. The opposing defense was all over our FB (OSV dive) even after he crossed the goal line and the whistle was blown dead. He dragged 2 kids to the back of the end zone and placed the ball on the ground. They flagged him for taunting because he wouldn't let up after the whistle was blown, even though he had two kids punching at the ball. 15 yard call and we had to go for two to tie the game up; didn't happen.
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Post by coachdawhip on Dec 22, 2006 10:26:10 GMT -6
In a game of this importance, you have to let the kids play
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Post by coachcb on Dec 22, 2006 10:41:19 GMT -6
I really liked the officials we had in our youth league this year; they were very committed to letting the kids play. We only had 1 problem with the officials; the guy was just being a a-hole. One of my DBs was flat out laying people out during the league title; perfect form tackling, head up, butt down, rocking people. He was hitting hard that game; audible pops everytime he hit someone. The official told me that he was going to flag and kick the kid out of the game if he didn't "lay off'. He said he was going to get the kid for a personal foul the next time he teed off on someone. At half time, I walked over to the commissioner (who had watched every tackle the kid made), told him what the official had said and got ourselves a replacement.
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Post by phantom on Dec 22, 2006 11:48:21 GMT -6
I've really come to hate the rule mainly because it's inconsistently enforced. During the past season there was a picture in the paper of our TB holding up the football like it was a drink that he was chugging. No flag (it was also an uncharacteristic act by a really humble kid who was embarrassed by the picture). In our last game he WAS flagged for throwing his arms in the air after scoring the game-clinching TD in the state championship. Hey, I hate the look-at-me crap as much as anybody and agree that it has no place in the game. There was already a rule in place to stop that stuff- Unsportsmanlike Conduct. If somebody does something that's over the line, penalize him. There's no need to remove honest emotion from the game, though.
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