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Post by Coach Bennett on Feb 26, 2012 11:47:40 GMT -6
I'm sort of gravitating to the opposite end of this spectrum. It actually drives me a little nuts to hear "one your football players ________." I'm all for talking to a player about their behavior or academic issues if a teacher brings it to me, but it bothers me when a colleague uses me as an extension of their discipline (or lack thereof). At the beginning of the season I make it perfectly clear what the scholastic/building standards are according to our board and high school policies. Let's say, for instance, a player gets in a fight during lunch. I'm not going to punish the kid for his behavior at lunch. Here's what should happen - he gets called to the dean, is given after school detention (or suspended). When he doesn't make practice on time because he's sitting detention, then my disciplinary actions kick in. This may sound like splitting hairs, but at some point the player needs to be responsible unto himself and deal with the organized chain of events that will ensue if he doesn't tow the line. If I have a problem with a student in class, I don't go looking through his schedule, find that he's in the chorus ensemble, and then go to the choral director and say "one of your ensemble kids, _________, is out of line in class. Can you please do something about this?" Although I may discuss this with the director as a means of trying to help the kid, I won't be asking him discipline him because of my inability to control my class. I don't agree with this at all. If a kid is having academic or behavior issues in class I want to know about it so that I can head it off before it becomes a real issue. To me, the teacher is doing us a favor. I don't understand why a coach wouldn't want that. Coach, I'm not saying I don't want to help the kid or that I won't take him aside, offer to help with grades, homelife, etc. I want to know about these things and good communication is key to a healthy school. What I'm saying is that I fundamentally don't believe that as a coach I should be an extension of the teacher's or school's discipline arm. Let's say Joey is being a total jerk in class. I want to know about it...maybe there's something going on at home or with his girlfriend or who knows. But I'm not going to limit his PT or participation b/c his history teacher says he's acting up in class. I would encourage the history teacher to take appropriate action (inclusive of talking to me about their concerns) to ensure the kid is a manageable student in class. If that ultimately takes a punishment from said teacher and the student therefore misses practice, that's on him. For me, to "help" a colleague with Joey b/c of his behaviors in history by disciplining through football is only enabling the teacher; how about they do their job and drop the hammer if need be? That's what I'd do.
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wvcoach
Junior Member
[F4:@coach_wellman]
Posts: 288
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Post by wvcoach on Feb 26, 2012 18:36:46 GMT -6
For many kids, participation in sports is the only thing that will keep them from going off the deep end.
I have a student in my English class that, to be honest, is primed to grow up a worthless punk. He's a major problem, but he's also the star of the school's basketball team. He eventually earned so many discipline reports and trips to the office that his status on the team was in jeopardy. He straightened up after that.
The football team is a school extracurricular activity. If the kids aren't abiding by school rules, they should not be allowed extracurricular opportunities. I do agree that the teacher needs to do his or her job and handle in-class discipline independently, but there are cases in which you can do everything in your power and that kid is still a terror.
If a kid gets in a fight at lunch, I'm DEFINITELY going to hand out some sort of discipline, most likely a hefty amount of gassers or bear crawls. If a kid were suspended from school, I would consider cutting his playing time somewhat. I'm not going to let a kid act like an a$$ in school and then get to enjoy a full football game.
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Post by Coach Bennett on Feb 27, 2012 7:19:06 GMT -6
If a kid gets in a fight at lunch, I'm DEFINITELY going to hand out some sort of discipline, most likely a hefty amount of gassers or bear crawls. If a kid were suspended from school, I would consider cutting his playing time somewhat. I'm not going to let a kid act like an a$$ in school and then get to enjoy a full football game. Coach, Here's what I'm saying...if a kid gets in a fight at school and is suspended, how can he make practice? If he can't make practice, then he can't play, right?
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wvcoach
Junior Member
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Post by wvcoach on Feb 27, 2012 8:58:49 GMT -6
If a kid gets in a fight at lunch, I'm DEFINITELY going to hand out some sort of discipline, most likely a hefty amount of gassers or bear crawls. If a kid were suspended from school, I would consider cutting his playing time somewhat. I'm not going to let a kid act like an a$$ in school and then get to enjoy a full football game. Coach, Here's what I'm saying...if a kid gets in a fight at school and is suspended, how can he make practice? If he can't make practice, then he can't play, right? You're exactly right there. I personally have no problem with that. Do you? This was our policy this past season, but the head coach wasn't very faithful to it.
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Post by blb on Feb 27, 2012 9:11:02 GMT -6
If a kid misses only one practice (even for school suspension), why would you not play him?
I can see not starting him especially if he missed Tuesday, Wednesday ("heavy" work days) or Thursday (day before), but what purpose is served by not dressing him at all, unless he's a repeat offender?
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Post by Coach Bennett on Feb 27, 2012 12:05:32 GMT -6
blb,
There's a million shades of gray here and how each particular situation falls into one's discipline policies for their respective programs is unique.
I agree with you, however, regarding the type of day missed by the player ("heavy" work days) and along the lines of the repeat offender scenario.
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Post by blb on Feb 27, 2012 12:54:04 GMT -6
I was a classroom teacher for 19 years. I'm tough on our kids and they find out in a hurry there are a lot of things (actually most) I will not compromise on.
I expect what they learn in our program - commitment, self-discipline, punctuality, respect for others, preparation, effort - to carry over into the classroom.
And I know it has because I've been told so by colleagues in almost all the schools I've coached in.
But - if a kid has a one-day suspension from school for something during the day and thus misses practice, it's not Football-related (unless it becomes habitual) and I don't feel the need to pile on other than demoting him on the depth chart, out of fairness to the young men who practiced at his positions in his absence if nothing else.
Now if a kid gets a three-day suspension and misses almost the whole practice week - then he can spend Friday night standing behind me in his civvies.
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wvcoach
Junior Member
[F4:@coach_wellman]
Posts: 288
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Post by wvcoach on Feb 27, 2012 13:51:16 GMT -6
In my case, a kid who has a one day suspension won't miss the entire game but instead sit out the first quarter or half. I should have clarified that.
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Post by coachcb on Feb 27, 2012 16:28:13 GMT -6
Here's the simple fact of the matter gentlemen; we have more influence over the kids as coaches than we do as teachers. Most of our guys have far more respect for me as a coach than they do for any of our teachers. So, why wouldn't I pull the coach-card in school and nail them for their grades and for being a PITA in their classes? I'm not doing it to be a dictator, I'm doing it because it'll make the kid better.
I expect more out of our players than I do of the rest of the student body. I could toss out some spiel about representing the team but that's not it. I have the ability to make them better young men so I'll do it.
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